i thought depression was time limited

I think the reason why it may come back again and again or occur for long duration for some people is that they haven't got to the core issues and tackled them, and haven't made necessary changes. They still have things blocking them, keep getting into similar repetitive negative unhelpful patterns. And, there are suppressed bottled up deep emotions /feelings still. We're not always conscious of things we do. We can do things that don't help us subconsciously, without much awareness. Our thoughts can make us feel negatively when they are automatic or impulsive. Dwelling on /focusing on negative stressful unpleasant things leads to more difficult feelings.

No i was saying you claim to know what others are able to do...without knowing them and I was saying you don't know that much about people here to where you can judge what they are 'able' to do.

Not everyone can overcome their depressive disorder just because some people can or have...that is my point if that is unclear not sure how else to explain but certainly am not trying to twist anything around that would be pointless.

Just irks me when people say 'well this person did this, or I did this so you can to' when maybe no I actually cannot do the thing they did.

No one said you are responsible for others way of thinking or choices they make, however still having depression, not being able to overcome it and things like that are not 'choices' to me being beaten down by symptoms even if I try to distract myself, excercise enough, eat well and all that stuff is not a choice.

I simply do not think it is that simple...lol I know core issues that contirubuted to mine such as being bullied yes I have addressed that, still see it as an unpleasant experience that has still contributed to my ongoing mental issues there is no way to adress that any further...it happened, made me feel like crap and contributed to mental issues....same for any other social/environmental factors that contributed...what more is there to address.

Also don't see why I should have to hope I will finally be 'cured' in order to be considered to have hope...as I have said I like to think I will be able to manage my depression and other issues a bit better, I just do not think I can realistically expect it to all entirely go away so I will spend my energy on more important things such as how to manage it now, if I can change anything in my life to improve the quality of it....dwelling on hoping I'll be cured seems like a waste of time and kind of impractical there are other long term ideas I care more about than a vauge concept of 'recovery' I can't recover from life if I am still living it.

^ this, that is sort of the point I have been trying to make more or less...admittidly it offended me some as I do get sick of the 'you're doing it wrong/not trying hard enough' implications.

they might be doing it wrong.

I mean some therapy focuses on "accepting" you are sick and you have life of taking pills ahead of you, no matter what. Some therapy teaches you to accept you cannot do nothing for yourself.

So yeah, some are doing it wrong. I would not blame them though, but rather whatever professionals are encouraging this learned helplessness in them.

Then people like me still get attacked for accepting they are 'sick' and might have to manage a condition for the rest of their life...I am not much into pills though the valium I have helps anxiety but I do not see what is so wrong about someone accepting they have a condition they may have to cope with/manage for the rest of life...that is the opinion I developed after realizing that focusing on 'recovering' or 'getting over it' was just putting too much pressure and stress on me causing me to bottle things up even more.....I have had mostly CBT talk therapy where they pretty much always encourgage recovering or full recovory as the final goal and it doesn't work for me.

I don't think i still have depression because I am 'doing it wrong' talk therapy hasn't helped, depression meds have not helped, moving to a busier area with bus transportation where i can get out of the house more and various things have not helped...I am not talking just swallowing a pill, but tried that to...doesn't work either. Try to live as healthy of a lifestyle as I can and that doesn't really get rid of the depression. Hence why that sort of assumptoin about doing it wrong or not trying hard enough can be offensive to people who have been trying, and trying and have finally accepted instead of having their head liable to explode at all times trying to 'recover' it might be better to manage and cope with symptoms, be proud if you make it through a day without it going to complete crap, one day at a time....rather than preassuring myself to constantly be positive or see things like I am looking through rose tinted glasses when its more like actually wearing doom tinted glasses and having all this self expectation to 'recover'/get over it I get through one day at a time.

I do not see having to cope with and manage depression rather than expecting to 'recover' as learned helplessness, I'd see learned helplessness is when I start to feeling like its impossible to cope with it or manage it in any way and buy into that which can happen when I am at my lowest however I am not always 'at my lowest'. The way I see it working on finding the best ways of managing and coping isn't giving up or 'continuing to look at things negatively' just a perspective that works better for me and some others better than the 'recovory' approach which works better for others but it really does depend on the person.

If that is doing it wrong or not trying hard enough wonderful, but its all I got...and as I say I am not dead yet so obviously I must be doing at least one thing right in life...but maybe that is just something i want to believe who knows.

Who has led you to believe there's no hope of recovering, overcoming depression.? Do you not think that maybe there are bottled up feelings that are making you still depressed or maybe there are things that are contributing to you staying stuck in depressive state that you haven't addressed/dealt with. I think whatever issues one may face in life it is up to the individual how they percieve and deal with that. You chose to follow the perspective that depression is due to faulty brain functioning, chemical imbalance, and that nothing you do can help overcome it, and you make choice to accept whatever drugs you were recommended by your doctor. I've made my own choices helpful or not and I know what factors have led to me getting depression, the underlying issues. I'm aware of negative unhelpful patterns that have remerged over yrs and suppressed internalised emotions.
Nowadays there's a lot about positive psychology and therapies are focused on challenging peoples thinking and behaviours. When I was referred by gp to mental health service I saw a CBT therapist and I attended diff groups/courses for people with mental health issues and there was always an emphasis on people's choices, how the way you think affects how you feel and its not what others say or do that matters its how you respond /deal with that. Cos people perceive and respond differently to things.

I have been in a lot of therapy and group therapy and I am in it again. I have never had a therapist take that approach with me. Some therapist go along with meds but I have never had one tell me there is nothing I can do besides that.

If you are referring to "radical acceptance" in DBT I don't think you understand the concept. You will have to enlighten me on what therapies take that approach.

No one has led me to believe that, I base my opinion that I am unlikely to entirely recover from my depressive disorder on my personal experience with having it and all the things that have factored into it and continue to factor into it...its not anything anyones told me. Its more I got frustrated trying as hard as I could to recover to no avail so now I cope with what I have as best I can don't beat myself up over when it gets to be too much and I have to go to the ER as if I 'let myself slip' or any of that crap...I look at things as positively as i can but truth be told my life is not very positive so that only gets me so far.

I do not think there is any subconcious bottled up feelings keeping me depressed, much of it is pretty out in the open now. Also so what if I just change my thinking to percieve all my negative life experiences as good things and be happy about it, should I be celebrating that at least I didn't die in the school lockdown that happened and it was someone else? Sorry its not as simple as just perceiving things different...how am I supposed to percieve bad things as anything other than that?

Also yes I choose to think depression is a mental disorder, therefore has to do some with problems in the brain...because based on my own research, experiences and learning that seems most likely. Makes more sense than blaming the symptoms of it on myself like I used to up until my first suicide attempt.

Also yeah I have tried drugs, the ones that don't help I quit taking...of course its up to me if I agree to try it or not, but its not like I just take whatever they feed me and hope for the best...there are some drugs I would certainly refuse. And yes thus far it seems I am unable to overcome it...doesn't mean I can not make improvements in life and find some enjoyment/satisfaction or whatever that will just be harder with the depression and other mental issues...but should I just lay down and die because I don't think I will entirely recover? Or does it make more sense to continue trying to live life, work on improvements where possible and get on with things.

I mean what do I have some moral obligation to 'recover' I don't think so. Also yes it does matter what other people say and do to someone, people are capable of hurting and even killing each other to write it off as 'the depressed person just needs to change their thinking and react differently' is ignorant and quite frankly cruel and victim blaming...I certainly don't want that kind of 'therapy'. I'd prefer the kind that validates what I struggle with, rather than the kind based on telling me everything I think, feel and perceive is wrong

Of course you don't have to recover. You can stay miserable for all I care. Your recover for yourself, not others. You don't have to spend so much energy defending why are you feeling bad. That is dwelling and it is unhelpful. It will not change how you feel.......... and even if you gain few crumbs sympathy.... what will that do for you?

I am pretty sure there are therapists who will take your hard earned money and validate you through and through. Will it make you happy? Better? Not sure.

I think you have your opinion, and nothing will changing at this point. Wish you the best. May you use what works for you and have strenght to ditch what doesn't work....

I'm done here.

I been told to take meds and drop out of Uni.

Friend has been told to take meds and forget about school, careeer.... and basically anything that is life.

I don't think anyone can know and prove for definite that depression is a mental illness due to a chemical imbalance. That is one perspective that people choose to follow without getting to the real underlying issues related to their depression.. Regardless of what circumstances we have, or what life throws at us, its always up to the individual how they percieve and respond/deal with things and that has effects. People have different beliefs, and deal with things differently that have different outcomes. Your view of not being able to recover, overcome depression, that is gonna remain for rest of your life cos your brain is not working properly,normally like others, doesn't come from you personally. People have influenced you to think that and you've followed it. You don't know /cant envisage how you will be in the long term future, that you will always be depressed forever.

Therapists/counsellors aren't there to fix your problems, to please people or make you better. They can listen, show some care, support. They like to challenge your way of thinking/feeling about things that aren't helpful-offer a different , alternative perspective cos their focus is on you, not other people or external life situations.people are often own worst enemies, have negative self limiting destructive thoughts and habits that create unecessary stress and illness that can be addressed. Its obv healthier more positive to have faith in yourself and hope that things can be better, you can overcome things if possible,than worrying, doubting or thinking pessimistically. Your the one in the driving seat of your life, in charge. Whilst depression can be debilitating and severely affect people's activities, people still have choices over how they think, and what they do, and change is inevitable

Do you know that it has been found that people with depression often have a very hard time envisioning their future to begin with? So there's that.

As for chemical imbalances . . . What about ADs causing mania for many with Bipolar? What about ADs helping many with depression? You can't discard that evidence. And I'll point out here that the OP stated she was diagnosed with BPII, not just depression.

It's not necessarily about getting rid of an illness, it's about learning how to cope, manage, and overcome certain obstacles. It's about getting it under control so that it impedes your life to the least extent possible.

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger . . . for the next time.

That's terrible. Who are these doctors? I hope you both yelled at them and told them they're idiots. I'd have reported them.

That's a pretty horrible therapist. Don't know where they were trained.

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No one whether depressed or not can forsee what the future will be like or be certain of how it will be for them.. The future doesn't exist. The past Is over yet Is still very much present in people's lives. People spend a lot of time either dwelling on what's happened already that's negative, they don't like, unpleasant, or worrying , fearing the future. The real life is in the here and now and it is worth making it count..making the most of it..we can only live fully purposefully in the now yet a lot of us aren't really present in the moment. We get too much distracted by things or lost in our minds.

If we should focus on now then how are we supposed to maintain hope that things will get better? This implies focus on a future.

It's not about forseeing a future, it's about constructing one. Envisioning one for oneself. People with depression often find that difficult to do.

No one knows what the future holds for anyone. We can visualise how it might look, how it could look, we can see it either bright or bleak,gloomy, dark or empty, nothing. Don't know what's coming around the corner at any time. We can't predict how things will be. We can make assumptions, generalisations, judgements and have expectations. The future will never exist in reality because we can only live in the present, in the here and now. We can make choices, have ideas, set goals, plan and change certain things that we want and need, taking positive healthy actions. Waiting passively for things to be better, wishing they would improve comparing ourselves to others isn't constructive. We can try to think more positively,have good ideas and plans but nothing is achievable without real helpful efforts, actions. Its no good ruminating about things that aren't important or that make us stressed and don't serve us well. Or worrying way ahead about the future. But that's what a lot of us do.. We're either going over stuff in our heads that have already happend that can't change or we're fearing, worrying about the future. We miss out on real living and on small, meaningful, beautiful things as a result. Whether depressed or not, people tend to focus more on negative aspects about themselves or others or situations, than positive ones, and it can be hard for anyone to make changes.

I think there are lots of factors that contribute to depression, I do not think it is as simple as a chemical imbalance, since even that simplifies too much, though I think it is more than likely brain chemistry plays a role in depressive disorders...of course it is not the only factor.

I have gotten into the 'real' underlying social/environmental factors of my depression and yeah as I have said addressing that doesn't decrease it any ...I don't have suppressed memories or anything. Also I disagree that everyone has the choice of how to respond/percieve or deal with something...its not like I chose to respond to trauma by developing PTSD, if I had any say in the matter I would have preferred to brush it off as a bad memory not the hell that is that disorder...the depression was bad enough and now I am supposed to somehow recover from depression and have a bunch of hope when I have PTSD on top if it which totally made all the therapy I had up to that point useless. So yeah if everyone could just choose how things effect them they wouldn't develop mental disorders, or endure the mental pain caused by things like bullying or abuse but if you really think people choose to be negatively effected by that stuff it's your problem...for me it would be unhealthy to believe that since then it just means I'd have to blame all my problems on myself which would be unfair to me.

Also would you stop telling me other people formed my opinion for me...that is simply not true if anything throughout my life before I got any diagnoses I had a lot of accusations of being told I was lazy, or not trying hard enough with things...after diagnoses following the suicide attempt and going to therapy yeah for a while I thought I was really improving and was through with the depression...then a girl I know gets killed at school in a lockdown and in the following weeks my parents where finalizing their divorce I end up with PTSD and I am supposed to just brush that off and be hopeful as ever...well I already tried that and burnt myself out trying to force myself through college and failing.

My experiences have influenced my opinion on this, it has nothing to do with other people...most people mental health people included are all about full on recovory to the point of even being too in your face about it when you're just really not in the place for it.

People don't want to respect where I am mentally and that maybe one can only take so much before they are burnt out and 'full recovery and a joyful life' just isn't something I'd have energy for anyways so be it, but that is where I am right now. Many people recover from many things, many people don't recover from everything and have to live with difficulties they don't choose or want to have.

Look I'm not gonna get into heated conflict with others who have different beliefs, feelings, understanding of things to me. I'm not saying I'm better or worse or right or wrong. I'm not blaming myself or anyone for difficulties, illness... I never accused anyone of choosing to be depressed or that its their fault. I def haven't had any bad negative intentions so if you think negatively about things I've said, dislike it, disagree that's your choice. Its up to you how you view your own issues and deal with them, not me or others. I'm just talking about individuals choices we have in how we deal with things can differ a lot and have different outcomes. Whatever circumstances we have, there's always choice in how we percieve and deal with things. We are the only ones responsible for how we think, feel and act in our lives. We're all different. There's no normality or perfection about anyone or anything. Your belief that depression is a mental illness related to chemical imbalance that can't be overcome didn't come from you personally..its one perspective that you've followed like some others have too. People do have influence over your beliefs. You didn't create, come up with the mental health labels you've identified with..major depressive disorder, PTSD..and whatever else. These labels cover up people's positive aspects and true self. I've suffered a lot of bullying and abuse and I didn't deal with that well...I internalised difficult feelings..which led to stress and depression, anxiety..I didn't want to suffer or choose to from others negative behaviours but I did.. And I'm not happy that I've had severe depression and that I've been close to suicide. But I can't change what's happened in past. I can unlearn, or change things now though.

Things are only as difficult as you make them. We can make things worse for ourselves than they really are. Or imagine things to be really bad but aren't in reality. A lot of time we spend criticising, blaming others and external things we don't have control over . We only have control over ourselves and own lives.

I hope you find what works for you best. That you will be able to get to a better place like others have. Let's end this conflict now. People have different beliefs, ideas, understanding and experiences of depression. I can't tell what's led to your issues, I don't know how you've dealt with them. I only know how things have been/are for me.

You keep contradicting yourself everywhere.

We have control over our beliefs, how we communicate those beliefs, and how we listen (or don't listen) and respond to the beliefs of others. That's kind of partially what this is all about.

You're really not getting the point. Straw men everywhere. Straw man - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Many people who aren't depressed focus on the positive and make positive changes. I see it happen all the time. Where did that negative view come from?