[dinosaurs]

i never feel like i belong anywhere. i try really hard and do the things i'm supposed to do to meet people and participate and get to know them. and i guess generally people are civil to me and sometimes they say they like me. but it just never works for me. it always feels like they're just tolerating me and i never feel liked and if i go quiet i'm never missed. i never feel understood. i feel like i'm just too different to fit in. i never feel like part of a group. i see people around me doing what i'm doing and they make friends and i just really don't understand how it happens for them but not me.

i usually give up because i don't belong and try moving to another group. but the same thing happens over and over. i know moving groups isn't the answer. i've done a lot of work on learning to like myself but it hasn't helped with this at all. i don't want advice on how to meet people or talk to people or anything like that. i just really have no idea how to belong.

[beauflow]

"always feels like they're just tolerating me and i never feel liked"
I feel this way alot even with my boyfriend- I feel like he is just "putting up with the crazy lady" but ya know if they really did not like you- they would not stick around- would you if you did not like them?

"if i go quiet i'm never missed."
Same here- I go years with out seeing old buds- and then I get messages like OMG i miss you and when/if i see them (few times a few years ago) they are so happy to see me.. I would not sell yourself short is what I am trying to say... I know the feeling and yes I have gone missing then reappear some people think whatever, other people wish I would not do it.

"i never feel understood"
Know this feeling oh so well- however in the end some how crazy things come together and a few do understand you-- or atleast the case with me. I can sware that my boyfriend does not understand at all (i.e. last week my exploding thing i get) and he actually does- he discribed it a bit of a different way but over all it is the same- he feels gravity is pulling everything to him, I feel like everything is flying at me; but we both feel like "exploding" at the time....
Perhaps it is just miscommnication with things-

Also how long are you spending with a "group"... it takes a bit to know people- some people are shy and are not as expressive as others (I am this way so it took a while like 4 or 5 years for me to accept that I had some friends).....

I hope that helps a little- but I know some one on here will be able to give you more clarity than I :-) I hope it comes soon

[beauflow]

Oh yeah- And still to this day- I will get the feeling that I do Not Belong in this era- or I do not belong on earth- due to some crazy moments of mine I feel like no one sees things the way I do... but ya know what- I am here and have to make due then right? *Smiles*

[danii24]

Originally Posted by dinosaurs

i never feel like i belong anywhere. i try really hard and do the things i'm supposed to do to meet people and participate and get to know them. and i guess generally people are civil to me and sometimes they say they like me. but it just never works for me. it always feels like they're just tolerating me and i never feel liked and if i go quiet i'm never missed. i never feel understood. i feel like i'm just too different to fit in. i never feel like part of a group. i see people around me doing what i'm doing and they make friends and i just really don't understand how it happens for them but not me.

i usually give up because i don't belong and try moving to another group. but the same thing happens over and over. i know moving groups isn't the answer. i've done a lot of work on learning to like myself but it hasn't helped with this at all. i don't want advice on how to meet people or talk to people or anything like that. i just really have no idea how to belong.

I feel the same like people tolerate me when im there but when im gone no1 misses me at all or would they even notice if i dnt turn up. I never feel i belong i do what you do go and do things because i feel its what im meant to do. I have tried too but it always makes me feel worse.

If i go to a friends party or that i feel bad because if i dnt go i dont feel normal for not going because its whet im meant to do and if i do go i feel like i dnt belong here. find it hard to mingle at these things and then when i leave i feel bad because no1 will notice im gone. or would people be saying god she was acting strange.

Im afraid of people and over senitive as well because of other things that have happened before. I have tried to get over it but i cant. dont o how to get over it because nothing works

This presentation by Brene Brown is one I often refer to when feeling disconnected is a problem:

[Perna]

When I look around, if everyone is doing approximately what I'm doing but getting a different result, then I realize my unhappiness has to lie in me and my perception.

I don't think other people can give us a sense of belonging; they're forging their own sense of belonging. What groups you join, people you try to befriend have to have some reference point inside yourself for them to matter to you. If they matter to you, then you will often matter to them. But looking at them for them to "pull you in" to what you perceive as "out there" can't work because each individual's task is the same and no one can do our task as well as their own.

I would think of a subject/project/interest you have and focus on that instead of on fitting in. For example, I use to read 5+ books a week, was really into reading, books, libraries, etc. So, I went to the Friends of the Library meeting that started. I didn't know a single person. However, somewhere in that meeting I talked to a woman who enjoyed me and was part of the organizing of the new Friends group. She had the "Treasurer" call me and ask me to become the group's Secretary! I was scared to death but made myself say "yes". From there I quickly made friends and belonged to that group. But, if necessary, I could have had to do it the "harder" way and volunteer for the job! The "result" probably would have been the same.

We have to express an interest AND respond to any interest coming back. If you do not "understand" why someone "likes" you, ask them! "Oh? What do you like about me?" We have to engage other people in order to become connected. Feelings can't just magically appear because we are in close quarters with another.

If you are at a group thing centered around "books" (or whatever) then you have to call up your own feeling sense of what books mean to you, and share that with another and get an in-kind response. That's how we get close to other people is by how we are like them or what we see of them that we like.

If you see other people planning a date/get-together, ask someone you think you would like to get to know better, if you can come along. They will probably turn to you with a surprised smile (how are others supposed to know you WANT to come if you don't share that information with them? They can't read your mind) and "pull you in".

But it is work getting one's self included; it often looks easy watching others do it but they probably have done it before! If you have not done it before, it is not going to be "second nature" to work at including yourself where you want to be included. Worrying about whether others "want" you is another way we don't honor/feel good about ourselves and is another form of mind reading (how do we know what they want unless we ask them).

There's nothing automatic or "easy" about being included; it can hurt because maybe they are a group that has been together a zillion years and does not accept newcomers but you cannot know that if you don't try to associate yourself with them! But their not accepting "you" is not something personal, they don't accept anyone so feeling "hurt" is like feeling hurt if you asked a woman on the street who looks like your mother if you could he be her child and she said "No"

[Set Me Free]

I don't know how old you are but I went through my entire teens and young adulthood with the exact same feelings and it felt horrible. With a little age comes wisdom and some sort of peace. Also, looking back, I saw that maybe my feelings were coming from me and projected to those around me and there were those who thought I didn't want to be around them. I realized this when my HS started this renuion page on facebook and some of us started talking privately. Don't worry about it too much if you can help it because it only intensifies the feelings of isolation. (if i could figure out how to insert a hug icon or any icon or that matter, I would)

[madisgram]

MPD-

1. Causes clinically significant distress and impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.

dinosaurs, i found this characteristic of your disorder. have you discussed this feeling of being left out socially with your T? perhaps he/she can help you feel more a part of a group.
i felt this way myself and i'm bipolar. always felt like i was odd man out. my therapy really helped me a lot with this feeling.
please know too we care about you a lot so here you're an important part of our circle of friends.

[Open Eyes]

Some very nice thoughts here dinosaurs.

I wish I had speakers so I could hear the video. It is still on my list of to do's.

Having friends is much like having a garden or even having pets. You have to take time and make an effort to engage others. And it isn't just about hanging around others or groups as you say. And people are usually drawn to other people who tend to either be strong and offer a sense of direction or lend themselves to service and support. It is something that you have to be willing to work at and it is a matter of building a balance with others on and individual basis within each group. And it also means that a person has to participate in having individual motivations that the group can benefit from.

And eventually when you have enough time around people and you finally make a decision to just be yourself. Making an investment of interest in the others individually without really expressing a dependancy takes time to achieve and maintain. And you have to learn to present a dependable nature about yourself.
Most people like people that they feel they can count on to always be supportive and nonintrusive or judgemental.

While I didn't get to hear the video presented here and how this woman discussed children, children often pick up skills within the family unit first. If a child grows up being ignored or constantly devalued by a parent or parents and even siblings the child eventually learns to devalue themselves and tend to isolate and carry a deep resentment and distrust in others throughout their lives. "We are what we know".

One of the constant things I noticed in children that I worked with is that they almost always were a reflection of their parents perceptions of them. For example,
"Suzie is not very athetic and tends to underachieve, she loves horses but will probably not be your best rider". Or there are parents that present "My daughter is good at everything and she is always the best." And even worse is a unspoken "My daughter has to be good at everything and be a winner for me to be happy". And now that I think of it there is yet another, "I have to constantly micromanage everthing about my child".

And therein lies the base for each and every person that walks the earth. "They are what they know". And that has nothing to do with how much overall education they have, it goes back to how they were programed when they were young. And what can change that is being exposed to some person in the process of growing up that teaches that child to have a sense of worth and drive and self value.

For each person that struggles with the mistakes they make or made in life there is often a root that they truely never realize exists. And that is very sad because a person can go through life blaming themselves and truely not understanding that many of their perceptions and short commings are simply not their fault.

So what really happens in a group? What really defines a group and the reason for its existance? If you really pay attention there is a common understanding within each group. It is mostly defined by the ability to service an unlying need that each person within the group needs that reaches back to when they were young.

As a matter of fact, look at PC. Look at the different forums that group different people together. Everyday click on the new member forum and read what each new person says. Each new person comes with a question and often an appology as well.

Now, slowly fan out to the different forums and read the threads and posts there too. Every different forum expresses a need, a question, and a desire for an answer and search and support. And then look at the most active forum of all. Sit outside the forums and watch the numbers of people viewing the forums.

The most active forum on this site is DEPRESSION. And for every person that visits that forum there is an equal number of people who avoid it, but secretly feel it.

The answer to your question is that you have to learn how to define yourself and be willing to look to your past and honestly see where there was a lack. And then you have to be willing to stop blaming yourself and begin a process of healing and acceptance and humbling and growth. And it will be a slow process and it must include a willingness to finally accept your past and understanding that you CAN learn to overcome it. But that has to start by understanding what you do not have or do not know yet.

Just because a person does not know something doesn't mean they can't learn. But a true self humbling has to take place in order to truely gain. And what that means is a willingness to honestly address the lack and instead of holding onto the anger and self defense and self blaming and self guilt and self criticism and even fear, the true desire to let go of anger and be willing to learn has to take place.

Are you perfect? No, your never going to be perfect, you are always going to be unique. But the one thing you are is HUMAN. And that gives you the right to spend the rest of your life learning how to ACCEPT THAT AND LEARN TO ACCEPT THAT IN OTHERS AS WELL. Are you going to make mistakes? Yes but that doesn't mean you can't learn from your mistakes. And what do other people really want? They just want to be accepted like you and truely feel that they can be themselves and not be injured or rejected. And there are countless ways people protect their inner insecurities. And learning how to get along with others is about learning how to not abandon yourself as well. Most people who isolate are often struggling with self abandonment and they are really not aware of it. "BECAUSE IT IS WHAT THEY KNOW"

One of the things that almost everyone loves is comedy and satire. Why? And what makes successful comedy or satire? And what makes a good novel? What makes good comedy, satire, and novel is the ability to relate various social (mostly family) interactions including various social failures and not only present it with a comical aspect but also with a subtle learning message that is presented in a noninvading manner. Most commedians and writers have had personal struggles that they can somehow translate into a presentation that allow other humans to address issues by lightening up or seeing a sense of human resolve and enlightenment. " I am not alone after all".

Open Eyes

[SoupDragon]

I have spent my life feeling different. I think I fall into 3 categories with others:

a) They think I am difficult
b) They think I am weird
c) They value the fact that I am a good listener

The 4th category is when I used to get drunk and then everyone loved to have me around as I was a complete idiot and up for anything.

I watched others, who were popular, funny and liked. I envied them and hated myself.

But over time I have become more accepting of myself - I can even enjoy my own company sometimes. I am better at superficial relationships these days, but I still know that generally I do not fit neatly into most social situations.

I guess the bottom line for me is that I could wish for all sorts of things in life, but I am who I am and I need to stop looking at the green grass on the other side of the fence and learn to love me for who I am.

[IceCreamKid]

Once I embraced my difference, I started noticing more people liked me; but liking differences also allowed me to appreciate other people's differences. A young woman told me once, "You're kind of weird. I like you." She didn't mean anything derogatory by that; she was just thinking aloud. Now I know a lot of people with widely varying interests. Embrace your wonderful self and people will notice your wonderfulness.

[Queen of Chaos]

I have horrendous problems making friends. Sometimes I feel like I know more people than anyone else but I'm not really comfortable with people getting to know me too well; for all the people I know, practically nobody really knows me.

My mother is anti-social and always has been. As children she'd always tell my siblings and me that other people didn't want to be bothered with us, other mothers didn't want us inviting their children to our house or us visiting other kids in their homes. My mother has always been an exceptionally pretty woman, my father was as handsome as a movie star, but Mother would always say things like our house wasn't nice like someone else's, our clothes weren't fancy, NOTHING was acceptable when it came to us interacting with others...and I've struggled with those old ideas my entire life, and I hate it!

Mother will soon be 90 - she's still a very attractive lady, she is in good health, her mind is sharp...but she has absolutely no use for anyone other than her own grown kids, not even our spouses, children and grandchildren.

All my life I've envied people who grew up in happy homes where friends, relatives, neighbors and classmates felt totally welcome...but overcoming things you've been told and lived with practically your entire life is not easy. It's a sad issue for me, too, dinosaurs. I love people so much but I honestly don't know how to relate to people and I'm uneasy getting close to people. I tend to keep people at a distance and it breaks my heart knowing it's my own fault.

[Open Eyes]

Queen of Chaos, you are a perfect example of learned perceptions. And I am very sorry that you had to experience that growing up.

You have not been a member of PC very long but you have very productive and supportive input. Your past has taught you to have a desire to understand and even help others but you have no real idea how to add to that by accepting others to be a part of you. But that is not your fault, it was instilled in you by your mother.

You now have the ability to stand back and look at your mother and even identify her short comings. And I am sure that those short comings were handed to her by her own parents or life situations growing up. You have a likeable quality because you can see where you were not nurtured in your past. In recognizing that you have compassion to reach out to others and offer them what you know you did not receive yourself, hense your admission of knowing many. Because you genuinely know how it feels to be handed a barrier that allows others to engage you. Your comfort zone is in the giving, you were never taught how to recieve. It is not your fault and it doesn't mean you are not worthy, you just don't know how to do it. It was not engaged or acceptable in your youth.

To be honest I can see much of that in myself, but it is very common. In fact as I look my own mother I see a woman who struggled with seeing what she didn't get, wondering if she had any real value, and yet wanting others to have a sense of value. And I have listened to her talk about how she was taught that she was not allowed to interact with the wealthy crowd that summered on the island her father bought and built up. So she was raised to question her self worth. And one thing she tried to teach her children is self worth. But, that is a talent or indication of a true gift Queen of Chaos. Because that kind of past can lead someone into different directions. One direction can be a complete distrust and even anger and isolation from others altogether. And it can also present an unbelievable pesimistic view of humanity as a whole. And it can also lead to an incredible social discomfort in which even a compliment is considered a threat or form of criticism. But if the direction is to give to others what you did not receive yourself, there is a true value and strength and good heart behind that.

The fact that you are aware of how the fundamentals to an all around healthy interaction with others was not presant in your past is a beginning. And the journey for most people is learning how to stop feeling as if they are never going to be worthy or have to carry shame or even anger for what they never had. It can be a social standing all unto itself that has nothing to do with any form of monetary success or power. And any gain in monetary success and power can never truely fill the void of that psychological lack of social standing that was never presented to begin with or nurtured.

And there is never going to be a magic pill that can fill that individual void. A medication can help us to maintain a chemical need that years of denial can perhaps cause an imbalance as we respond with the lack of a proper nurturing. But the real answer is receiving therapy and guidance to help each person learn how to accept and overcome the lack of proper building blocks that are essential to self acceptance and growth.

One of the things I struggle with is how so many people seem to evade the truth.
And there always seems to be an ever ending search for the truth. The reality is that in order to truely see it, or experence it, it has to be taught from the beginning. And it has to be taught along with a nurturing of developing individual self esteem and strength. Otherwise there is just too much internal doubt to even think that there is any real strength or capacity for truth. Because in order to be a truthful person and really stand by it, one has to have a strength in base or core from the beginning. Standing up and demanding the truth requires a great sense of internal strength that many people are never taught when they are growing up.

I was sent a painting on the search of Diogenes for the truth or the man who holds the truth. In that painting he is old and surrounded by many different people who have a wonder and questioning look on their faces. It is almost as if the painting is truely capturing the debate if truth even exists. The old man portrayed in the picture has such a determined expression on his face, almost an anger and yet a look of determination in his eyes.

It is an old painting of a different time but is very relivant even today. If I were to paint an answer to that painting, I would depict that very man realizing that what he really needed to do was stop, and face those around him and teach the truth. However that would not truely change the look of frustration and determination and even weariness on this mans face. But it is the only way to end the search, the truth has to be taught and presented and believed and defended for it to ever have enough power to be seen or found. For someone to truely have the truth, one has to be taught the truth and be willing to defend it.

But it also has to entail someone having the strength and will to be honest with themselves.
And most people are afraid of just that so they follow along and often cannot even recognize the real truth. As many are never truely nurtured properly, it is easier to live the lie than recognize or face the truth.

The painting is on my page, the Byzantine kindly sent it to me. You are welcome to view it if you like. Sorry that I don't know how to put it here.

Open Eyes

[gma45]

Thanks for this thread, I learn so much from all your posts! Thank you!

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by gma45

Thanks for this thread, I learn so much from all your posts! Thank you!

DITTO! This has SO MUCH great info, IT SHOULD BE A STICKY!

[sunsetsunrise]

(((( dino)))) I grapple with the same thing you describe. Its very painful for me. I wish I had a good insight. But I do not. I grapple with it myself. The pain of always feeling different. Of not fitting in. Usually when people talk in a group I feel like I am on the sidelines. Its always been this way.

[dinosaurs]

thanks everyone for your comments. i talked to t about this and he believes that the extent people feel like they belong is a measure of how much they trust those around them. and that i dont feel like i belong because i dont trust the people im with to accept all of me or not react negatively to aspects of me. i dont really want any further comments back from people but just wanted to share in case it helps someone else.