[mixedup_emotions]

I posted a couple of things about my T appointment today on the Abuse board....

But I figured this part was best shared here.

As you know, I've been keeping a journal of exchanges between me and my husband - and the thoughts and feelings that I've been going through - and sending T a status so we can discuss things during the session.....

As he was reading my notes on my husband, he said:

"Wow, he is clever. You see the pattern....The way he works you and then tries to slip something in. Then when it doesn't work, he goes back to working you again. It's all very calculated....I'm looking at it clinically as an insane person. I can't help but be fastinated by his pathology. I want you to have an appreciation of clinically how intricate he is."

Then, he said, "I told (husband's T) today.....(now that he is not being treated by him anymore)....Your husband's the only person I've ever thought about after having sessions with you that I can imagine him knocking on the door and having a gun."

I said, "Wow"....

"I told (husband's T), and he said, wow you haven't had that fantasy in a long time."

My T replied, "Nope, not in a long time."

I asked him how my husband's T reacted. He said, "He wasn't surprised."

OMG.....

[Amazonmom]

I didn't read your other post, so maybe I am missing something.

But WHAT THE HELL? Usually it's not a T's job to pathologize someone in your life unless they are trying to make the point that the person needs to get out of your life. I could see pointing out patterns so that you can best learn to deal with them, but it doesn't seem like that was your T's point. And the T is not supposed to share that sort of thing with another T unless they are seeking professional assistance in how to best help their client. AND they shouldn't be telling you about the conversation, either.

Did I totally miss what is going on? Or does your T need a lesson on professional behavior?

((((((((((((((((((((mixedup)))))))))))))))))))))))))

Wow, that strikes me as a TOTALLY INAPPROPRIATE thing for T to say to you (about the gun). I don't even know what to say!!!

Blah, I'm sorry the session sounds like it was so scary.

[chaotic13]

(((mixed-up)))

WTH is with your T... is he trying to scare you? IDK, at the moment I am imagining your T as one of those "professional" who entertains people at family gatherings with stories about all the freaks he has to work with.

[mixedup_emotions]

There was more to it than that...but I really appreciated his honesty. It's a complicated thing, because I know my husband's T because he's in my group T....and so is my T....

But now that my husband is not being treated anymore - he discontinued treatment voluntarily - my T was able to talk more freely to his T about things.

I don't believe that anything that he said was inappropriate.

[sunrise]

Originally Posted by mixedup_emotions

But now that my husband is not being treated anymore - he discontinued treatment voluntarily - my T was able to talk more freely to his T about things.

I don't understand that. Just because a person quits doesn't mean confidentiality can be broken, does it? Why can your T now talk more freely about your H to other people?

[deliquesce]

(((mixedup)))

i think i would have felt partly validated by my T saying something like that, if that is how i felt about my husband also. i didn't read it as inappropriate until i read the other responses here, and then i could see where they were coming from also.

i guess it depends on a lot more (your history in this relationship!) to be able to decide whether it was beneficial or not.

i guess the bigger question is - how do you feel about this now? do you agree that your H could be a serious threat, and if so, do you need us to help you make a plan to keep your safe? or did you kind of hear more the subtext of what was said - H is crazy - and find that that's what was being commuicated?

[chaotic13]

I'm with sunrise. When you discontinue therapy it doesn't mean your T is free to talk to people about you. At least I HOPE not or I'll say in therapy for EVER. I KNOW dispite the rules Ts talk to one another about clients. Luckily I think my T gets that if she has discussed my case with others, I DO NOT WANT TO THINK ABOUT OR HEAR ABOUT IT. This would set every ego state I have in freak out mode.

[deliquesce]

but ME's T didn't talk about an ex-client - i don't think ME's T ever saw her husband as a client?

maybe husband's ex-T did something wrong, but i don't think ME's T has done something unethical here?

[mixedup_emotions]

Thanks everyone....

My husband's T did not disclose anything to me about my husband's therapy. It was my T that had the feeling based on my sessions with him - and also from what he knew when we were seeing him as a marriage counselor. He did not do anything inappropriate.

Also, when we signed documents to seek treatment here, we agreed that they could talk to each other. They just chose not to in order to be objective when dealing with each of us individually, since it was a strange combination.

Nothing was said to me about my husband's therapy.

I am slowly starting to become more afraid for my life....I've added slide locks to all the doors so he can't come in when we're here (since he still has keys to the house). I will be picking up some mace to keep in various places of the house.

I am afraid for my daughter's life...even though he has never shown any indication that he would ever hurt her. But, the dynamic is different now with everything going on.

I am afraid to take that next step of getting a lawyer involved because I'm afraid that my husband will snap.

I don't know what to do.

[darkrunner]

((((((((((((Mixedup))))))))))))))

I'm sorry you are going through such a scary thing.
Could you go to the police get a PFA (Protection from Abuse) order for him? If you are really scared for your safety or your daughters - maybe you should leave for a while....do you have a relative's house you can go? Or maybe a battered woman's shelter? Just until things have settled down a little bit.
Sending stength and hugs....

[Sannah]

I see it sort of like a duty to warn? Why would he withhold info?

MUE, you know your husband well. Do you think that your T is correct about him?

[mixedup_emotions]

Many people have warned me over the years about my husband....and his behavior has become more and more erratic. I've always worked towards finding ways to getting him back to a more stable place, which usually involved things that were hurtful to me.

Now that I am working on distancing myself from him, I won't help him through his patterns - which was enabling him, I know.

To hear a professional use the word "insane"....and tell me the things he felt.....and realizing all of what I've been through....I am terrified of what my husband could do.

I don't think he'd get a gun. I do think that he is very capable of acting impulsively and doing something harmful to me. And that makes me even more afraid for our daughter.

I don't know how to keep her safe without doing things that could possibly send him over the edge. I used to feel very confident that he would never do anything to hurt her. I am now having doubts - but I'm unsure if that's a gut feeling or just taking in what other people are saying.

[Sannah]

Do you have a plan of any kind?

[mixedup_emotions]

Many people have warned me over the years about my husband....and his behavior has become more and more erratic. I've always worked towards finding ways to getting him back to a more stable place, which usually involved things that were hurtful to me.

Now that I am working on distancing myself from him, I won't help him through his patterns - which was enabling him, I know.

To hear a professional use the word "insane"....and tell me the things he felt.....and realizing all of what I've been through....I am terrified of what my husband could do.

I don't think he'd get a gun. I do think that he is very capable of acting impulsively and doing something harmful to me. And that makes me even more afraid for our daughter.

I don't know how to keep her safe without doing things that could possibly send him over the edge. I used to feel very confident that he would never do anything to hurt her. I am now having doubts - but I'm unsure if that's a gut feeling or just taking in what other people are saying.

[sunrise]

I've added slide locks to all the doors so he can't come in when we're here (since he still has keys to the house). I will be picking up some mace to keep in various places of the house.

Mixed_Up, my H had keys to the house for a long, long time after he moved out. At one point, the divorce proceedings became very contentious and something happened that made me not trust H worth a dime. So I called up a locksmith late one night, and a guy came out and changed all my locks on the spot. It really gave me a lot of peace of mind. Can you change your locks? If you do, I think that you should tell your H before he arrives at the door and finds his key does not work anymore. That might really set him off. You can find a non-contentious way to tell him. My H had 3 guns and I was very scared of them. When we still lived together we used to go out and about with him carrying his gun concealed sometimes (he had a permit). I asked him if he would tell me when he was carrying it because I wanted to know (basically not to walk in front of him with my back turned, I was that scared). But he refused and said I didn't need to know. He would carry it when he wanted and there was no reason to tell me. Freaked me out. My T did say to me at one point, "does he know you are seeing me? does he know my name?" so I know T was thinking about his own safety, and I am sure your T is worried about that too. Therapy can be a dangerous profession because of the clientele.

I am afraid to take that next step of getting a lawyer involved because I'm afraid that my husband will snap.

But you do have a lawyer, don't you, even if she's not involved in this particular issue? If not, please get a lawyer! Your H doesn't have to know that you have a lawyer, and the lawyer can advise on what to do next, offer options, etc. They have lots of experience with unstable spouses and how to handle situations like this both legally and otherwise (how to de-escalate situations). I think your fear about taking legal action to restrict access to your house (restraining order) is well-founded.

I do wish you were still in couples therapy with your H so you and your T could get a better read on all of this (keep your enemies close) and he could perhaps do some pre-emptory work and help assess risk.

I'd like to recommend a book I found very useful when going through this own intense phase in my own D. It's called, "The Gift of Fear: and other survival signals that protect us from violence", by Gavin De Becker:
http://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Gavi...2402964&sr=1-1

This book helps you assess your risk in situations like yours, and also has advice and statistics on the outcomes of various strategies to deal with these problems and people. The outcome of getting a restraining order is more often bad than good. More women suffer violence as a consequence of that action than are protected. This is a really good book. Please read it.

It is your safety that matters. You should have a safety plan--who to call, where to go, your L's home number, etc. Your T should be able to help you with that. I always kept a bag packed for me and my kids in the trunk of my car, as well as a set of computer back-up disks, address book, and an envelope of cash. I also had a post office box for private correspondence with my L and others. I also had binders of financial information I kept in my trunk, as these would be critical for access to money and in the divorce. If possible, assemble a binder of key financial and other information and give it to your L, if you haven't already.

Be safe!

[chaotic13]

Mixed up it sounds like a very scary situation. Do you has people to help you if you need it? A women's resource center or place you can go if the threat escalates. PFA orders seem so useless against anger. I hope you are safe.

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by mixedup_emotions

Thanks everyone....

My husband's T did not disclose anything to me about my husband's therapy. It was my T that had the feeling based on my sessions with him - and also from what he knew when we were seeing him as a marriage counselor. He did not do anything inappropriate.

Also, when we signed documents to seek treatment here, we agreed that they could talk to each other. They just chose not to in order to be objective when dealing with each of us individually, since it was a strange combination.

Nothing was said to me about my husband's therapy.

I am slowly starting to become more afraid for my life....I've added slide locks to all the doors so he can't come in when we're here (since he still has keys to the house). I will be picking up some mace to keep in various places of the house.

I am afraid for my daughter's life...even though he has never shown any indication that he would ever hurt her. But, the dynamic is different now with everything going on.

I am afraid to take that next step of getting a lawyer involved because I'm afraid that my husband will snap.

I don't know what to do.

You need to stay somewhere else before you do anything else. Why haven't you changed all the locks? It probably won't matter much anyway, because if he really wants in he'll break in, but still common sense says you don't need to have an open door policy to an abuser, and that's what a key is. What's stopping you from temporarily moving until you get something more solid figured out?

Secondly, are there any credible threats to your safety that you can get a restraining order and file charges against him (to get him locked up and removed from action)? I'm hoping you stay safe

[deliquesce]

sweetie, i would heavily encourage you to call up a DV hotline and ask them to help you out in this situation. because they deal with scary partners so commonly, they will have great ideas that you can implement straight away, and then also long term solutions.

you have taken some very good steps - getting slide locks, considering mace. they will be able to suggest further things that we may not consider (e.g., packing an emergency bag with passport, id, money, clothes, legal documents etc and maybe keeping this at a friend/relative's place). they will help you take little, manageable steps, and then maybe (when you are comfortable) bigger steps to protect you and your daughter.

i am glad you are taking this seriously. it does sound like it's a threat you should consider seriously - other ppl have noticed this behaviour, i do not think for a second that you are over reacting. stop forgiving him and trying to give him room. your daughter comes first. you shouldn't tolerate any ambivalence in that scenario, yeah?

also - thank you for being brave and sharing this scary situation with us. we want to help .