[growlithing]

So, I was reunited with my former T today after a few months due to being in treatment. The nature of my attachment to her is certainly different, but it actually feels more healthy than it was because I wasn't hanging on her every word. It was just a much more heavy session than what I'm used to with her because of the content in it. I still struggled to talk about my feelings and I think that it is a me issue since this is the second T where this is a problem.

I couldn't help but feel like she was a little bit jealous or upset or something over the fact that I bonded so tightly with LCM. She didn't say anything negative about it, it was just the look on her face and her tone of voice that made me feel that way. She said "it sounds like LCM is able to be there for you in ways I couldn't be". And I just feel like maybe she feels like she failed or something or maybe she feels slightly uncomfortable because now she isn't the only person I'm seeing when in the past, she was all I had and I clung to her very tightly.

Maybe it's just me assuming she feels that way based on really nothing substantial, but I couldn't help just feeling a little bad. I didn't want her to feel replaced because she wasn't replaced. LCM didn't replace her, she took on a different role. I did have some maternal feelings towards my old T, but they were not at all as intense as the ones I have for my current T because the reasons I had any maternal feelings for her at all was because the school would usually report to her if I was having issues. I felt like she was somewhat responsible and therefore, somewhat of a mother. But it wasn't even remotely in the same category of LCM.

I dunno. I was old T's first ever client and she had been with me for two years. I was her project in a way. I felt like I was her favorite client too even though she'd never EVER tell me. I didn't pick up on that today. She was just super low energy and seemed kinda sad. But I did tell her some really sad stuff. But she seemed sad even before that and even when I talked about LCM. Her tone of voice was quiet too and she wasn't as smiley as she used to be when she would come out in the lobby to greet me.

Maybe she was just having a bad day and hearing about the trauma she didn't know about that I've been working on wasn't very uplifting. Maybe she feels bad about me not telling her about this trauma after so long. She said "you waited a long time to talk about this". Maybe she doesn't believe me that this happened. She didn't say anything that would make me believe that she felt jealous or replaced. It felt like she was trying to set her feelings aside, but she has always had a really rotten poker face. She said she was happy that I had a relationship the way I do with LCM and that she was happy that she could tell that I love her without me even saying it. I just picked up on something I came out of it feeling kinda guilty and I need to stop speculating about her potential feelings before I speculate something really off the walls and hurtful.

[feralkittymom]

I suspect she's had a serious meeting with her supervisor, and has probably been told to be very careful not to do anything that would incite transference or instability because she's leaving so soon. I think she's going to be in neutral gear also to not compete with TT.

[growlithing]

Originally Posted by feralkittymom

I suspect she's had a serious meeting with her supervisor, and has probably been told to be very careful not to do anything that would incite transference or instability because she's leaving so soon. I think she's going to be in neutral gear also to not compete with TT.

That could very well be. Her supervisor was slightly concerned with the idea of me working with her when she is leaving so soon. But both of us wanted to do it

[Bill3]

I need to stop speculating about her potential feelings before I speculate something really off the walls and hurtful.

It is okay imo to think about interpersonal interactions and to make an effort to discern what significant other people are thinking.

I do not believe that you will inevitably come up with, and buy into, something off the walls and hurtful. I think that that line of thinking--that your efforts will inevitably be incorrect and hurtful--comes from your mother.

"it sounds like LCM is able to be there for you in ways I couldn't be". And I just feel like maybe she feels like she failed or something or maybe she feels slightly uncomfortable because now she isn't the only person I'm seeing when in the past, she was all I had and I clung to her very tightly.

Your reaction to what she said strikes me as quite plausible. It is a common pitfall for new Ts to take things personally that should not be taken personally.

I just picked up on something

It is often useful to develop hypotheses about what others might be thinking. These hypotheses can be acted upon but, on the other hand, often they can just be quietly stored in your mind, tested as the opportunity arises, and help develop your judgment and insight about others.

[growlithing]

Originally Posted by Bill3

It is okay imo to think about interpersonal interactions and to make an effort to discern what significant other people are thinking.

I do not believe that you will inevitably come up with, and buy into, something off the walls and hurtful. I think that that line of thinking--that your efforts will inevitably be incorrect and hurtful--comes from your mother.

Your reaction to what she said strikes me as quite plausible. It is a common pitfall for new Ts to take things personally that should not be taken personally.

It is often useful to develop hypotheses about what others might be thinking. These hypotheses can be acted upon but, on the other hand, often they can just be quietly stored in your mind, tested as the opportunity arises, and help develop your judgment and insight about others.

It is a problem though because I really need to be able to talk about my feelings with LCM with someone and she would be the one I would talk to because I'll be seeing her the most and I already feel connected with her. But I can't talk about how I have nightmares that are interrupted by LCM comforting me in my dreams or how badly I want to cry in LCM's arms like an injured baby and how difficult it is for me to come to terms with the fact that I'm never going to go back to seeing her 6 hours a day. My mind feels like I'm just on a break from being with her constantly and I find myself fantasizing about going to school and coming home and LCM is there to ask me how school went so fiercely that sometimes, I catch myself thinking that it'll be a reality someday. And it is very bizarre and painful and I feel like I have no one on earth to talk to. Yes, I have a bunch of Ts and some good friends, but I don't feel like anyone could understand without thinking I'm crazy(er) or getting jealous.

I also just can't get SI and sui off of my mind and I feel like I can't tell anyone about this because I don't want the school to find out and get upset, I don't want LCM to find out and get upset and stop working with me, and I don't want to go back to the hospital. I can't go back to the hospital because this time I know my parents will not financially support me anymore if I do. It's not like last time where I was just worried that they wouldn't. They flat out told me that if I "pull any more of this hospital crap" that they are done and "good luck on your own". And I know maybe that's just them trying to scare me into not getting treatment, but it's different this time.

My life is a complete mess even more so than before I went into treatment. I don't know where I'm going to live or how I'm going to fund it. I don't want to lose my bed. I can't stop thinking about the past. I don't think I can face the future because I honestly think I'm going to wind up homeless and LCM can't adopt me off the streets like I'd wish she would. I wake up in the middle of the night screaming and I wake up in the morning, pissed off that I didn't die in the night and I feel like I can't tell anyone about this because I'm supposed to be better. But I'm not and I sincerely hate myself.

[CantExplain]

I think that Madame T was jealous, but she always dismissed my claims. Of course, she was perfect in every way and could never be jealous of a mere patient.

[feralkittymom]

I think you need to tell these things to the trauma T. I know you don't feel any attachment to her, but the more you don't share with her, the slower your progress will be.

[Bill3]

I don't feel like anyone could understand without thinking I'm crazy(er) or getting jealous

There is always the option of telling T was you told us. That you sense that she feels left out or hurt--and if true you really want her to get past that because you still do need her and are relying on her. Do you think that this T can get past it and help out as you describe?

No mention of TT in your last post. Wouldn't TT logically have a role to play? Maybe you are "supposed to be better", but I doubt that TT expects you to be fully better 100% of the time so soon after being in the hospital.

[IndestructibleGirl]

Originally Posted by growlithing

My life is a complete mess even more so than before I went into treatment. I don't know where I'm going to live or how I'm going to fund it. I don't want to lose my bed. I can't stop thinking about the past. I don't think I can face the future because I honestly think I'm going to wind up homeless and LCM can't adopt me off the streets like I'd wish she would. I wake up in the middle of the night screaming and I wake up in the morning, pissed off that I didn't die in the night and I feel like I can't tell anyone about this because I'm supposed to be better. But I'm not and I sincerely hate myself.

You REALLY need to lay this out bluntly with somebody. I am not sure of the American social care system, but it sounds like right now you come into the category of 'vulnerable adult' and need a social worker or somebody similar to help you figure out the practicalities of finding secure shelter for a start. Does your uni have a pastoral care team or a student advice centre? They might be a place to start? They also might have an emergency fund for students in a tight financial spot.

A fear of homelessness (with good reason, like yours) is NOT going to help your other issues. You need a secure base where you can start to be able to relax. Hopefully between all these Ts, your friends, and your school a plan of some kind can be made that will allow you to be confident you have a home. But I think you are going to have to grit your teeth and push for help. Believe me - I know what it's like to have to keep busting your *** trying to sort out the mundane but crucial stuff when you feel like you have zero energy or interest, no more juice in the tank. But you really need to help yourself by pushing for the right help sorting out your accommodation issue.

I also think that once you take the steps and it is sorted, it might give you a much-needed confidence boost that you CAN take care of yourself (with appropriate help and support, like us all). Your brain is firing off on circuits making you fantasize about your LCM adopting you because your mother told you you weren't able to look after yourself. But (as I'm sure you know cognitively) that simply is not true, and it certainly doesn't have to be true in the future. I only know you through PC, but I can say with confidence you are a bright and articulate girl, and from what you have mentioned about your music you must be very gifted as a musician. You have so much to give, the world is at your feet and there are many options available to you. I'm going to stop there, because I don't want to bend your ear without invitation Hugs, because it's ****ing hard and grim as **** at times.

[A Red Panda]

Originally Posted by feralkittymom

I think you need to tell these things to the trauma T. I know you don't feel any attachment to her, but the more you don't share with her, the slower your progress will be.

I agree - I think your trauma T is the best option of who to talk to. Even if you don't feel comfort with them, they're the most qualified to work with you on these things. Possibly simply because you DON'T have a strong attachment to her. You won't be worried about her being jealous, and she won't think you're crazy. She'll view is as you finally starting to open up a bit more as that is exactly what you would be doing - which will be helpful when it comes to working with trauma.

[growlithing]

Originally Posted by IndestructibleGirl

You REALLY need to lay this out bluntly with somebody. I am not sure of the American social care system, but it sounds like right now you come into the category of 'vulnerable adult' and need a social worker or somebody similar to help you figure out the practicalities of finding secure shelter for a start. Does your uni have a pastoral care team or a student advice centre? They might be a place to start? They also might have an emergency fund for students in a tight financial spot.

A fear of homelessness (with good reason, like yours) is NOT going to help your other issues. You need a secure base where you can start to be able to relax. Hopefully between all these Ts, your friends, and your school a plan of some kind can be made that will allow you to be confident you have a home. But I think you are going to have to grit your teeth and push for help. Believe me - I know what it's like to have to keep busting your *** trying to sort out the mundane but crucial stuff when you feel like you have zero energy or interest, no more juice in the tank. But you really need to help yourself by pushing for the right help sorting out your accommodation issue.

I also think that once you take the steps and it is sorted, it might give you a much-needed confidence boost that you CAN take care of yourself (with appropriate help and support, like us all). Your brain is firing off on circuits making you fantasize about your LCM adopting you because your mother told you you weren't able to look after yourself. But (as I'm sure you know cognitively) that simply is not true, and it certainly doesn't have to be true in the future. I only know you through PC, but I can say with confidence you are a bright and articulate girl, and from what you have mentioned about your music you must be very gifted as a musician. You have so much to give, the world is at your feet and there are many options available to you. I'm going to stop there, because I don't want to bend your ear without invitation Hugs, because it's ****ing hard and grim as **** at times.

I doubt I fall under that category. People would probably just consider me some dumb kid that hasn't figured anything out yet. I also don't think I'm much more clueless than my friends at the same age. They just have parents that will help them 100% of the time without constantly threatening abandonment.

My school has nothing of that nature. I could try telling the assistant dean that I'm close to that I'm terrified that I'll be homeless by 2015 and see where I get with that.

[growlithing]

Originally Posted by Bill3

There is always the option of telling T was you told us. That you sense that she feels left out or hurt--and if true you really want her to get past that because you still do need her and are relying on her. Do you think that this T can get past it and help out as you describe?

No mention of TT in your last post. Wouldn't TT logically have a role to play? Maybe you are "supposed to be better", but I doubt that TT expects you to be fully better 100% of the time so soon after being in the hospital.

Yeah I think I will have to tell her that. I don't know if she can or not. She seemed to be at least aware that her feelings were interfering because it looked like she was sitting on them the whole time.

None of them expect me to be fully better. I'm just scared of an overreaction and then going to the hospital and then being homeless. But actually that might be the best solution if I do have to be homeless because the hospital I went to last wouldn't discharge me to the streets. Maybe it would be a different story if I didn't have insurance though.

I'm not sure of TT's role yet. I don't see her for over a week at this point anyway.

[IndestructibleGirl]

Originally Posted by growlithing

I doubt I fall under that category. People would probably just consider me some dumb kid that hasn't figured anything out yet. I also don't think I'm much more clueless than my friends at the same age. They just have parents that will help them 100% of the time without constantly threatening abandonment.

My school has nothing of that nature. I could try telling the assistant dean that I'm close to that I'm terrified that I'll be homeless by 2015 and see where I get with that.

Ok. We can agree to differ in opinions on it, but I'm fairly certain you would actually be classed as a vulnerable adult over here (in the UK). You are over 18 with no means of supporting yourself, possibly have no fixed abode, and have been inpatient in the mental healthcare system. These are the reasons for my thinking this way.

Also - and again I mean this in the kindest way possible- while I agree that your peers are also pretty clueless, to use your word, the way we all are at age 20 - I think that you are either living in a very privileged world or have a very unrealistic view of the world if you really hold the opinion that it is a norm for most parents to help and fix their adult child's problem 100%. Good parents do what they can to help and support adult children yes, sort it out 100% - no. Because often they can't, for a bunch of valid reasons. Then there are countless young adults who have useless parents and have to do it all from a very young age for themselves. I have many friends in this category. So while your friends may be helpless at 20 without mummy and daddy stepping in to fix all their problems, this is not usual in most of the world. We have to have to adjust to helping ourselves with whatever appropriate support we can access. That's simply part of growing up.

[growlithing]

Originally Posted by IndestructibleGirl

Ok. We can agree to differ in opinions on it, but I'm fairly certain you would actually be classed as a vulnerable adult over here (in the UK). You are over 18 with no means of supporting yourself, possibly have no fixed abode, and have been inpatient in the mental healthcare system. These are the reasons for my thinking this way.

Also - and again I mean this in the kindest way possible- while I agree that your peers are also pretty clueless, to use your word, the way we all are at age 20 - I think that you are either living in a very privileged world or have a very unrealistic view of the world if you really hold the opinion that it is a norm for most parents to help and fix their adult child's problem 100%. Good parents do what they can to help and support adult children yes, sort it out 100% - no. Because often they can't, for a bunch of valid reasons. Then there are countless young adults who have useless parents and have to do it all from a very young age for themselves. I have many friends in this category. So while your friends may be helpless at 20 without mummy and daddy stepping in to fix all their problems, this is not usual in most of the world. We have to have to adjust to helping ourselves with whatever appropriate support we can access. That's simply part of growing up.

I mean I know that lots of people do that. I just have no idea how or where in life I missed learning how to be an adult. I'm inclined to feel like lots of people have had worse situations than I did with even more abuse and lack of funds and lack of any parental involvement and they still figured out how to be functional human beings very young. I don't understand where I missed learning how to support myself. Is it just me being scared that I can't do it so I don't bother figuring it out? But then again I didn't even know where to start figuring things out. I just feel so clueless and stupid because I also have friends that are my age and completely financially independent and I have no idea where they learned to do that

[CantExplain]

They don't teach adulthood any more.

[growlithing]

Originally Posted by CantExplain

They don't teach adulthood any more.

But they must have learned it somewhere and I feel like such a total loser for being so clueless that I needed to text a friend asking what to write on job applications or how to even just ask the person working the front desk for an app when I've walked into places in person. And I feel even worse filling out the application because I literally have nothing to put down. Most people my age aren't THAT clueless and inexperienced.

I guess I was probably deprived of learning anything because my mother did everything for me and the only way I got to experience mastering my environment was in music. Thank god I experienced it somewhere though. Considering that my self image is completely unbelievably awful as it is, I can't imagine what it would be like if I literally didn't think I had anything of value to contribute.

I don't know. I'm scared and I feel like a total failure that is going to fulfill all of my mother's negative predictions. She told me that my roommates wouldn't want to live with me after they got to know me. She was right and I so badly needed to prove her wrong not for her but for myself. Just so I could look back on things she said about me that were hurtful and have a concrete that she was wrong but I couldn't do it and they left me as predicted. She also told me that I'll never be able to get a job or be a "contributing member of society" or find a man to love me and I'll end up homeless on somebody's couch or behind a dumpster and she's going to end up 100% right if something doesn't turn around soon and I don't even know where to begin fixing it. I just want to run to LCM and away from life. Everything is moving too fast.

[Bill3]

I have learned from personal experience that the most basic questions can be answered by Google search. Check this out for example:

https://www.google.com/search?q=how+do+i+obtain+a+job+application%3F&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&client=firefox-a

Consider developing the habit of asking Google before you ask anyone else.

the only way I got to experience mastering my environment was in music

Yes! You do have experience mastering your environment. You did it in music, despite being in a negative family environment. You can apply those skills.

What did your mother say about how successful you would be in becoming a good musician and/or getting into a good music school?

[growlycat]

As far as your roommate situation, your mom could have caused them to move out…who knows what she told them??? A self-fulfilling prophecy, I wouldn't use it as proof that you can't live with people.

My parents did not teach me much about how to be an adult. Some things I am still learning at 41. No need to beat up on yourself.

Your time is better spent thinking of solutions and exploring the options that you do have.

[growlycat]

ditto on the Google! Even about.com has an answer for anything!

[growlithing]

Guys I literally google absolutely every question I ever think of on top of asking anyone else for help. I stay up until like 2am just googling stuff that I want to know and don't.

She didn't say anything about me getting into a good music school beyond that if I didn't, she wouldn't pay for it. She thinks I'll never get a music job. I haven't yet so that isn't exactly helpful

[growlycat]

dudette, you are still in school and emerging from a lifetime of abuse. Not many students in general are financially independent. If you are in an elite school, which it sounds like you are, then you are surrounded by kids whose parents are opposite yours ("helicopter parents")

INdie girl had a good point that most of the world struggles a bit more than that. You are beating yourself up over a skewed viewpoint!

[growlycat]

"helicopter parents" meaning not yours, but your privileged peers

[Bill3]

Your mother never doubted your musical ability, she never said that you can't play well and/or never will play well? That surprises me. What is your thinking about how that happened, given that she criticized and micromanaged everything else in your life?

[scorpiosis37]

Originally Posted by growlithing

I don't understand where I missed learning how to support myself. Is it just me being scared that I can't do it so I don't bother figuring it out? But then again I didn't even know where to start figuring things out. I just feel so clueless and stupid because I also have friends that are my age and completely financially independent and I have no idea where they learned to do that

I don't think most of us learned how to be functional adults from any particular people or places-- we just had to stumble through it and figure it out on our own, as we went along. Of course, I didn't have a mom at all, so there wasn't anyone there to teach me anything at home and school certainly didn't teach things like how to balance a budget, how to do your taxes, how to manage a home/apartment, how to do maintainance on your car, etc. Unfortunately, when I was 18, you couldn't just google it all either! Now, when I come across something I don't know how to do, I google it, like the other poster suggested. But I think, in general, the fact that you feel unable to do these things is probably the biggest thing preventing you from doing them. You think you can't, so you don't try. It may take you 5 or 10 tries before you master a new skill, but if you try, you'll eventually figure it out. That's how I've managed to become a functional adult, despite not having had any parental guidance or being taught any valuable life skills. While you may happen to know some privileged kids with great parents, I think most of us really have had to fend for ourselves in these areas. If you have the mindset that someone "should have" taught you these things, it prevents you from just picking yourself up by the bootstraps and saying "I can figure this out." Sure, maybe these are skills we "should" be taught... but most of us aren't. Asking friends isn't always the best "go to" option because it can be a lot to put on them, if you're asking the same people on a somewhat regular basis. If they've had to do the work of figuring these things out for themselves, it can be frustrating for them to then take on the added responsibility of teaching you these skills-- especially when there are so many other resources available to you, if you simply look for them. For instance, if you need help with a job application, there are 1,000 examples online and, since you say you're at a University, there is also a career services office that will help you write a resume and fill out applications. Do you know about all of the services your University offers? Most Universities (like the one I teach at) have a department or program that will help a student with just about anything-- if the student takes the initiative to find the right department, show up, and ask. Of course, many students never take the time to look for these resources-- but they are there! College is one of those really great times in life when there are programs and resources to help you. Trust me, when you're out of college and you still haven't learned some of the basic life skills, it's so much harder because there are no longer these kinds of resources at your fingertips, for free or low-cost.

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by growlithing

I don't know. I'm scared and I feel like a total failure that is going to fulfill all of my mother's negative predictions. She told me that my roommates wouldn't want to live with me after they got to know me. She was right and I so badly needed to prove her wrong not for her but for myself. Just so I could look back on things she said about me that were hurtful and have a concrete that she was wrong but I couldn't do it and they left me as predicted. She also told me that I'll never be able to get a job or be a "contributing member of society" or find a man to love me and I'll end up homeless on somebody's couch or behind a dumpster and she's going to end up 100% right if something doesn't turn around soon and I don't even know where to begin fixing it. I just want to run to LCM and away from life. Everything is moving too fast.

That is not a supportive mother.