A Better Ending and More Understanding

I think the ethical therapist's obligation is to work for/in the client's best interest, rather than simply for the client. And while I know SD rejects that perspective, she also does not try to insist that the T change beliefs, only restrict behavior.

I think "the path of yes" means to be open to the present moment and all the opportunities that moment of interaction presents, rather than to predetermine what will or will not be acceptable.

I do completely and wholeheartedly reject the notion that a therapist knows what is in a client's best interest. I find the idea that a therapist might think they could know is so off putting I barely have words to describe my adverse reaction to it.

But I really don't find trying to change others, whether therapist or not, is that rewarding of an activity.

I don't get this argument unless you're saying Madame T made the request for her own personal benefit so he would be easier for her? I'm assuming she would only suggest it if she thought it would help, and for whatever reason it sounds like a big enough issue for her that she has not agreed to extra sessions to this point.

Cantexplain - I hope you get a better ending and more understanding too, because I'm sure a bad ending to such a long relationship is not good. But, I would be careful how you phrase it in the email if you want her to schedule you... that's just my gut feeling. If you tell her you're a "yes" person and the next time she hears from you it will be to schedule you're appointment, I fear that will not go over well. FYI, that would piss me the hell off.

Just to be clear: I don't think a T can know what is in a client's best interests. I do think that within the realm of professional knowledge, the T is obligated to assess and offer the best treatment possible. Of course, the client has free will and is not similarly obligated to agree (outside of narrow limits regarding commitment, in which case it falls to the judicial system to sort out.)

I see it as rather similar to offering the best legal advice, based on professional knowledge and judgment. The client is free to offer opinions, and to reject a course of action, but the attorney can choose to reject such opinions and is obligated to not follow suggestions which violate the law. I think in most professional fields practitioners answer to multiple constituencies and balancing the needs and requirements of all is what professional judgment is all about.

So what would you write?
(I wanted to reassure her that I wouldn't impose further on her time without paying her.)

Do you really think she's all about the money? LOL.

Well, I don't know what to write... maybe something like "Mr. T and I just finished our work together and we both agreed I was doing well and ready to try taking a stand on my own. I am doing well, which I feel is a huge success! and I'd like to continue exploring that for now. I think you will find I've learned quite a lot and was able to process quite a lot with Mr. T about our relationship. I'd still like the opportunity for a better termination with you since our years together meant a lot to me, and it has been weighing on me things weren't better."

I've sent off essentially what I wrote in my revision.

I just changed the last line to: I'll contact you in due course to make an appointment.

Re-reading her letter to me, there is a hint that she won't see me until I've got my act together, but that is a very odd position for her to take. More likely she was suggesting that we shouldn't continue until I'm better sorted. And I have no plans to "continue" at all.

I just want closure.

I think thats her point. Why didnt you understand what she said in her letter? By saying you want closure, it does sound like youre trying to impose your will on the situation. I think that by offering her payment, after she conceded payment for the asperger testing cancellation, you are trying to show her that she will dance to your tune, which is really insulting - which might be at the heart of the matter, and why she only wants to deal with it in the relationship. I have said some horrible things to my t - i just blame them on my mother! Seriously - its because horrible things were said to me, and its like they sit inside you waiting to come back up. Thats why ts get paid so much - they receive these horrible things from so many of us. But you cant just hit and run. Well - im glad you understood her letter.

CE - good luck with it. I see no need for you to grovel or submit.

Hi CE,

On the one hand, I think Madame T. was pretty tough on you when it comes to confronting you with attitudes and behaviors that she thinks are unhealthy and would like you to change. I would class her type of therapy as "tough love" therapy. I agree that sort of therapy might not be the right kind for you. It would not work for me either!

However, there's something about your reply that makes me uneasy. I'll try to put it in words if I can. . .

When I read your reply, here is how I interpret it:

Dear Madame T,

I found your reply very warm and encouraging. I felt really good about it, and it was just what I wanted. I know now that I would like a few termination sessions with you.

<Venerable T> says I need a different kind of therapist: one who will say "Yes" to my requests instead of "No." No offense, but you handled my therapy wrong. The only thing I can hope to get from you is a better ending and more understanding.

I don't want to take your advice to find out what my pattern is when it comes to relationships with strong women. I'm not ready yet. And working things out with you isn't possible.

Now that I've said what I need to, my next communication with you will be for a termination session.

Lots of love,
CE

Maybe I am taking it the wrong way, but your message feels passive agressive to me. You start out saying how much you liked her reply and that it made you feel really good! Then you tell her she handled your therapy wrong, and your other t agrees. You tell her you don't want to take her advice, that working things out with her is impossible, and that you will arrange for a termination session. Then you sign it "Lots of love." If I were the t, I would feel confused and wonder what the "message" is behind your actual message.

But I could be totally wrong. I hope you don't feel like I am finding fault because I relate to alot of your experiences in therapy and how you feel. I'm just saying how your message sounds to me.

PS - I dunno. Maybe what you said is OK, especially if you know for sure you want to terminate and be done with her.

I think what feels odd about the response is that it feels contradictory - as though one part of you is saying "I'm so glad you replied to me. It made me feel so great! I'd like a few termination sessions with you. I love you lots."

But another part is saying "You did me wrong. Even my other therapist thinks so. I'm not going to take your advice. I can't work things out with you. I just want to quit."

Could it be true that you feel two different ways? If so, I can relate to that also. . .It makes things hard.

This is my personal, visceral reaction. But her "power and authority especially powerful women" shtick makes me want to scream ..."baby doll, get over yourself."

Those words remind me of the posturing in that annoying "don't hate me because I'm beautiful" hair commercial from years back. Assuming psychotherapy is voluntary, a therapist is not an authority over anyone's life. They have no special power. They're people who learned a protocol in grad school.

I have no respect from the domination that comes from showboating--the person who talks the loudest, who patronizes, controls the narrative or purports to mind read. That's play acting, in my opinion. Those who draw their power from genuine competence aren't intimidating. A great leader even will recognize the intelligence and resources of those around them.

I believe that social hierarchies are all around in real life and many people are dazzled and intimidated by those who posture and domineer. I've seen this in most workplaces. The difficulty isn't a disorder in my opinion--it's merely being human. (At the ripe age of 60+ I've slowly conditioned myself to be less reactive to domineering people. I used to be extremely deferential.)

I had my own experience with a therapist who had to control, would never admit his mistakes. It took me a long time, but I eventually lost that mission to make-him-understand-me.

Peaches, i think youve hit on something. Ive had ts that were crazymaking. Whether it was because i couldnt be honest, or i didnt feel safe with them, i mean - whose "fault" it was - the point is, it wasnt a good match. And truth be told, the t was aware of it and wanted me to find someone else, but i was a total clingon. Or borderline. With this t, though, i educated myself til we could break thru my craziness. Eta - now he is supporting me thru the process of me dealing with my self-sabotage / evil introjects.

Yes, this is about what I want.

I'm still the patient. I don't have to be the sane one!

I'm telling her how I feel and what I want, with all their inconsistencies. That's what therapy is all about, right?

You could say, as Hankster and T have said, that I am trying to bend T to my will. I don't see it that way. I'm just asking for what I want. I'm not holding a gun to her head.

I've asked for an appointment.

Hi Can't Explain,

I apologize if my reply caused you to feel angry or defensive.

I wasn't talking about your sanity. I just pointed out that I picked up on contradictory feelings in your message. I wasn't saying that makes you crazy or wrong. Remember, I said I tend to do the same thing?

I just pointed out what felt to me like an internal conflict in the hope that it might lead you to more self-exploration and insight as to the confusing dynamics that have been going on in your relationship with Madame T.

Yes, I'm inconsistent.

From the email you posted--so is she in my opinion.

As I read it, she's professional and caring, provided you approach the throne to her specifications. Games frenemies play. Can see from just those few lines why you call her "Madam T."