Just typed an entire post, apparently touched some random key on my laptop, and now the whole thing is gone.

So here I go again.

I cried last night in therapy. It was only one tear that actually rolled down my cheek, but it was the first time I officially cried. As I was talking, my eyes were all watery and my voice was shaky-- it was one of those times in which if I had allowed it, I could have completely let myself go, but I wasn't ready to do that yet. However, I was definitely in cry mode, and at one point, a tear rolled down my cheek. And it felt alright.

I told him not to expect me to start bawling or anything. He said, "Maybe I will start bawling." I asked him why he said this and of course he said, "Why do you think I said that?" I honestly can't remember at this time what my answer was, but he ended up telling me, "Because I can feel everything that you feel."

This was the last session of 2x per week. I told him that one of my greatest difficulties of reducing to 1x per week is that I've never had the opportunity to have someone who can feel what I am experiencing. I told him how my husband has always been there for me-- always supportive, backs off when I need him to, gives good advice, pushes me when I need a push-- but I have always wanted that moment in which I can sense that he truly feels the pain or the sadness. I told him how he didn't even need to tell me that he feels my emotions-- I was glad he did, but I said that I can sense it in his face, in his actions.

I told him how I have no object constancy. How when he is not in front of me, he is gone. That I am pissed off at myself and at him for ever allowing me to come 2x per week, because now it hurts that much more.

He told me that he hates giving 'homework' but he was going to give me something to do to help me stay connected with him during the week. He told me to go through my McWilliams psychoanalysis book and pick out something in it that relates to what is going on with me-- bring it in next week so we can talk about that. (I had told him on Tuesday that reading the book helps me stay connected to him during the week-- because we both admire her work and it relates to me on both a professional and personal level).

He told me I can call him during the week at any time to give him a 'heads up' on what I found in the book. Or to call any time that I need him. I told him that it's hard for me to call, even though I want to all the time. That even if he gave me specific instructions to call him at a specific time, I would still have a hard time doing it. He said to remember that permission to call anytime was granted a long time ago, and it's alright.

We talked a lot about my SI-- all the reasons why it occurs, about the 1st time I ever did it.

I told him how the other day my husband said to me, "I wish you could love me all the time, not just when you want to." About how I didn't even argue with my husband because he is right-- how I cannot give myself fully and it saddens me so much. That at times, I am just not present. This is when I started to cry, or at least when my tear came out.

Similarly to Tuesday, I was not able to process this session. My husband and I met up with friends from school to celebrate finishing our week-long, 8 to 4 pm group therapy class. We did have a blast, but I was never able to process my session. I am curious as to how this is going to manifest itself during the week.

[lauren_helene]

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pinksoil said:

I am so happy for you Pink!! One tear is one tear...be proud!

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I told him not to expect me to start bawling or anything. He said, "Maybe I will start bawling." "Because I can feel everything that you feel."

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Can I hug your T please?

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He told me that he hates giving 'homework' but he was going to give me something to do to help me stay connected with him during the week.

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I like this part a lot. I really do.

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He told me I can call him during the week at any time to give him a 'heads up' on what I found in the book. Or to call any time that I need him. He said to remember that permission to call anytime was granted a long time ago, and it's alright.

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I can almost see his hand reaching out to you when you need it. You really benefited from the 2x per week. I'm proud of you!!

Pinksoil, Im pleased you feel more conected to T by reading. I often wonder what I could do that would help.

I'm not sure if you husbands wish that you could love him all the time is actually achievable. Living with someone isnt always "perfect" there are times I dont even like my husband and I'm sure he feels that way too. I always hold a deep level of respect for him but hope he is doing what he needs to do to take care of himself also so he isn't looking for me to "Love" him "all" the time.

I think it would be like little house on the parire if that was the case?? and little house on the Parie this AIN'T LOL

pinksoil...that is so wonderful.

haha, no Prarie here either. I just wish I could love normally... I don't know, I know it sounds funny but I'm always so empty. It interferes so much.

And I'm starting to get sad now. I have so much cleaning to do and I just want to lie down. The last couple of weeks have been good, knowing that after my Friday session, I only have to wait a couple of days til my Tuesday session. It would really help me get through the weekend. Now it's a whole week again. And I just need him.

I have been reading the book. I was reading different parts. Now I am starting from the very beginning.

[MissCharlotte]

Pinksoil,

That is awesome. I am jealous as I have not yet been able to cry. Even one tear is a beginning. You have a deep connection with your T and I hope you can find the right section in your book to help you remember that connection during the week ahead.

[SecretGarden]

Remind me of why you went to two and then back to one... was that therapeutically based. I know it is hard to go back to one time... and that time seems like a long time. I have switched many times... to various frequencies.

I just wanted to say that I know it seems so difficult but you are doing the work and you are progressing and percolating. I really appreciate the things you are experiencing with your T and the relationship that you have... You are both trying to connect... and though you wonder sometimes.... it appears that he has connected to you and gets you. And he is allowing whatever needs to come out.

The idea that he says he could cry for you is very powerful. It is to me. Really.

Keep plugging. I think the tears will come...

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SecretGarden said:
Remind me of why you went to two and then back to one... was that therapeutically based.

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Thank you for your wonderful words, Secret.

The reason that I'm going back to 1x per week is because the new semester is starting in school... The only days/times that he has available that fit my schedule are Tues. and Fri. at 5 PM... and I now have to take a class on Tuesday from 5:30 til 7 PM. So that only leaves Fridays.

[SecretGarden]

There seems to be something to me about having my alotted time... Thursdays at 8 a.m.. It is my spot. Diverting from that somehow puts me off kilter but not always.

Perhaps you can book extra sessions sometime... although the irregularity of that sometimes is unsettling (in ways different from how you are already unsettled.) Maybe you could deal with this sometime.

Sometimes knowing what you have works better than hoping for what is not there. Hopefully the semester will fly by for you. :-)

[sunrise]

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pinksoil said:
I told him how the other day my husband said to me, "I wish you could love me all the time, not just when you want to." About how I didn't even argue with my husband because he is right-- how I cannot give myself fully and it saddens me so much. That at times, I am just not present. This is when I started to cry, or at least when my tear came out.

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That's so powerful and sad, pinksoil. I would have cried too. ((((hugs))))

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I just wish I could love normally

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What does that even mean? Maybe you are doing OK and doing better every day. Maybe there is more than one way to love.

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He said, "Maybe I will start bawling."

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Ahhhhhhh.... What a T. My guy says he will cry with me too. But when I cry I can never look at him, so I don't know if he ever has. But that he says he will has always been very powerful for me, a sign of total empathy.

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But when I cry I can never look at him, so I don't know if he ever has.

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My T sits across from me. On the wall to the left there is a painting. At one point, I was telling him something important, and I was sort of crying, and realized that I was completely fixated on the painting. I shifted my gaze to T and said, "God, now I'm talking to a f***ing painting." lol. I was okay with him seeing me cry this way. I thought it was the most attractive cry I could manage, lol-- sad, meaningful, no snot, no mascara streaks. If I had really let go, I would probably would have felt like a complete idiot, which is why I didn't.

hey. crying IS hard. i try and remember Linehan... when she talked about feeling emotions. feeling them come and go like waves lapping on the shore. feeling them come and go without clinging to them and without pushing them away.

i haven't let rip in front of my therapist. i think... thats probably a good thing, actually. for me... letting rip kind of means clinging to them. holding onto the thought that keeps the emotion refiring.

i've only cried once in front of him. similarly to you, i think. no snot (thank god!). just water running down my face.

> I wish you could love me all the time, not just when you want to." About how I didn't even argue with my husband because he is right-- how I cannot give myself fully and it saddens me so much. That at times, I am just not present.

i think i get what you mean... but... i think you do love him all the time. it is just that sometimes one isn't fully present because of other stuff, like you said.

over time... it might get easier to behave in a loving way even when one doesn't feel very loving.

perhaps.

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but he ended up telling me, "Because I can feel everything that you feel."

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My take on this is a little different. I don't think that he meant that he feels what you feel when you feel it. I think your T meant that as a fellow human being he feels the same emotions common to all of us: sadness, sorrow, despair, joy, fear, love, anger, contentedness..... That he could relate to how you feel and so accepts it, tear and all.

It sounds like it was a very meaningful session for you pink and I'm happy for you!



ECHOES

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ECHOES said:
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but he ended up telling me, "Because I can feel everything that you feel."

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My take on this is a little different. I don't think that he meant that he feels what you feel when you feel it. I think your T meant that as a fellow human being he feels the same emotions common to all of us: sadness, sorrow, despair, joy, fear, love, anger, contentedness..... That he could relate to how you feel and so accepts it, tear and all.

It sounds like it was a very meaningful session for you pink and I'm happy for you!



ECHOES

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Thank you, Echoes. Actually, he did mean that he can feel what I'm feeling at that very moment. I know that based on conversation we had afterwards. I can see why you would have a different take on it though... but it was said in a very different context. Plus, that is the nature of the psychoanalytical relationship-- to be with your client in the here and now-- and to be able to feel with him/her at that moment, in the present. Not for them, but with them.

kind of like how you can think the same thought (by verbally communicating / speaking) you can feel the same feeling (by attending to emotional / postural / rate rythm and pitch of voice / facial expression) in an attuned / empathetic manner.

not numerically the same / the same token pain (i can't have the precise pain you are having in your leg right now)
but type-identical (feeling of pain or grief or sadness or whatever)

yes. exactly. one can relate to, truly identify with, but cannot feel another person's feelings because our feelings are personal and come from our own experiences. you can have the same experience as I and have the same emotional response, but since we are separate we are feeling separate feelings.

for example if we were both assaulted in exactly the same way at the same time in the same room by the same person...we would have separate experiences and while we might have the same emotional response of rage, your rage is your rage and mine is mine. You can only feel yours and I can only feel mine.

I am hard of hearing and growing up that way with no help is an issue with me. my analyst is not hard of hearing but she always pulls that into what we are talking about and will include how being hard of hearing adds a dimension to what we're talking about. She pauses and reflects for a minute or so and imagines what that would be like. She feels frustrated when we talk about it, like I feel or felt. but she isn't feeling my feeling, she is feeling her own feeling and her own frustration comes from her own personal experiences of frustration; calling on that, she can empathize with my plight and feelings.

separateness is an interesting thing to explore

ECHOES

There is a fine line, too, as a T, between feeling your client's pain with them, and making it too much of your pain. This is something that concerns me in my growth as a T. That's why I know how possible it is feel what someone else is feeling, in the moment. I have experienced it from both sides, as a client, and as a professional. I was talking to one of my professor's about 2 semesters ago, telling how when I experience empathy with a client, I am so there, that the emotional level becomes extremely strong. He reminded me that it is impossible to carry every client's pain around with you without getting completely burnt out. As a therapist, you walk a fine line between experiencing someone else's emotions with them, and making them your own. It is a beautiful process, but must be done with care for the safety of both the therapist and client.

If I tell a client, "I can feel everything that you feel," it does not mean that I am human and generally experience all of the same emotions that he/she does. It means, I can feel your pain/anger/sadness/excitement/whatever with you right at this very moment. And that's what my T was telling me. He didn't even have to. I can see it in his eyes, his expression, as I talk to him.

Thank you, pinksoil, for explaining it more so I could understand it better.

ECHOES

[Soidhonia]

Hello PS. I am happy to hear that you are progressing in therapy. I hope everything gets better for you in the future. Take care and good day. Soidhonia

> There is a fine line, too, as a T, between feeling your client's pain with them, and making it too much of your pain.

Yes, indeed there is.

I think that part of it is about being able to put those feelings away once one leaves the office. Basically... Emotion regulation. If a therapist doesn't have good emotion regulation then a therapist won't be able to sustain empathetic awareness of a clients negative emotions without burning out. This can lead to pulling back from clients (trying to change their negative emotion rather than just sitting with the client through them). This can lead to therapists not wanting to / not being able to work with clients who experience intensely negative emotions. This can lead to therapist burnout, yeah.

> ...it is impossible to carry every client's pain around with you without getting completely burnt out.

Yes indeed. In order to be able to be empathetically attuned to every client's pain one needs to be able to refocus on other things instead of carrying that pain around with you 24/7.

I don't think that there are many therapists in the world who have good emotion regulation skills. I probably bring out the 'worst' in them because my emotions are so intense. But in my experience the majority of therapists try and change me because they can't bear to sit with me in my pain / distress. Because... It brings up stuff for them and they can't switch off.