[unaluna]

Re: Do ends justify means for you? Well i am going to try accountability. I had a thought this morning that my apartment looks like no one cares about me. Cuz no one comes to visit, so no one sees the mess. But thats not exactly true. I know people care. I just wont let them in. So in t today, i told him i wanted him to hold me accountable for whatever i said i was going to do today. It doesnt even have to be the thing - its just that he will ask me. He said, "and you will be okay with that." I was like, i dont know how i will feel, but i guess we will see. I came home feeling hot dizzy and tired so i am lying down and not swimming yet, but i guess we'll see!

So far, accountability is stopping me from buying chocolate. We talked about it yesterday, and i seem to link accountability and caring. I was making the connection later to the book The Little Prince, "you are responsible for your rose." I didnt understand that AT ALL when i read it in high school. I had no understanding of any link between responsibility and love. My parents advice was always always so destructive to me in just so many ways. Im finally getting free of that. Too little too late but never too late as long as youre still breathing.

[Leah123]

I don't feel particularly accountable to my therapist, but accountability is critical to my success in therapy. In my case, what therapy does is help me be accountable to myself. I set my goals and having someone to check in with about them is one of the important ways I monitor my progress and improve my efforts.

[unaluna]

Another observation i had is that its like there is now always someone in the house who loves or cares about me. I said kind of like when on tv shows they go into the murderers house and theres the room with a wall covered with the victims pictures? Only not that creepy!! But i never felt cared for at home - maybe thats what my messy room growing up at home meant.

[stopdog]

Absolutely not. For me, it would be an untenable idea.
If it helps someone else, then good.

[amandalouise]

accountable to my therapist no, she cant be here with me 100 percent of the time . it is up to me to decide to follow my treatment plans or not, it is not up to my therapist what I can and cant do outside of therapy or during therapy. she can if she wishes say ok you dont want to follow my treatment plans so I guess we are done, but she isnt the one making the choices of why I do things in therapy or not and she doesnt hold me accountable if I do something that goes against what she believes. for example recently she made a suggestion and I said no to her, i would not do that. she then asked me to tell her my logic on that. I did and she said Id rather you did this my way and I said thanks for your opinion. she laughed and said bang (meaning she cant hold a gun to my head and force me, that only I can hold myself accountable for the choices that I make)

therapists can make treatment plans, rules and boundaries but only we can hold ourselves to those rules boundaries and treatment plans for our own need or want to be healthy.

[LonesomeTonight]

Originally Posted by hankster

So far, accountability is stopping me from buying chocolate. We talked about it yesterday, and i seem to link accountability and caring. I was making the connection later to the book The Little Prince, "you are responsible for your rose." I didnt understand that AT ALL when i read it in high school. I had no understanding of any link between responsibility and love. My parents advice was always always so destructive to me in just so many ways. Im finally getting free of that. Too little too late but never too late as long as youre still breathing.

I'm officially accountable to my T now because of a "self-care plan" and "safety plan" we set up in the past week instead of me going to an day program/intensive outpatient program that my p-doc recommended. I'm keeping a log of whether I do what's in the plan, like exercise 30 minutes, have no more than 2 alcoholic drinks, etc. (She wanted me to have achievable goals and not set myself up for failure). Plus I'm supposed to contact her if I have serious thoughts/desires

Possible trigger:

for self-harm or not wanting to exist anymore

. I thought she'd want me to report in more frequently, but sounds like at our weekly appointments is enough.

Just got back from taking a walk, so I guess the accountability thing is working so far! (Though I did end up having 3 drinks yesterday.)

[atisketatasket]

I avoid revealing myself as much as possible to them, so I'm not even sure how I could be accountable to them.

I mean, I'm accountable in terms of paying, being on time, stuff like that. But beyond that? Not sure. Being accountable would suggest they matter enough to me that I don't want to disappoint them, and I don't think that's the case. Maybe it should be. I dunno.

Hey, did you go swimming?

No, my T will not play that game.

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by atisketatasket

I avoid revealing myself as much as possible to them, so I'm not even sure how I could be accountable to them.

I mean, I'm accountable in terms of paying, being on time, stuff like that. But beyond that? Not sure. Being accountable would suggest they matter enough to me that I don't want to disappoint them, and I don't think that's the case. Maybe it should be. I dunno.

Hey, did you go swimming?

Swam tuesday, walked yesterday, gonna swim today.

I could not be accountable to my parents - they were crazy people, and they just werent interested! Like now you asking me if i went swimming - they would not have paid attention to me like that. My mother even told my first h that i used to come home from school and tell her about this boy or that, did she remember, and she would just say yes even if she didnt - and that now it was his turn, good bye and good luck! Kinda harsh.

I am surprised that i even would allow myself to make this deal. I think it has to do with my mother dying this summer, that i even have the freedom to do it. And its not really about being accountable to t - its about being accountable to myself. We both realize that. At this point, its just a way of opening up the dialogue. Before, yeah i was still being accountable to my mother. Dont have too much fun.

[guilloche]

Originally Posted by hankster

So far, accountability is stopping me from buying chocolate. We talked about it yesterday, and i seem to link accountability and caring.

Hmmm.... thanks for posting this. It actually relates to some of what I'm going through right now with T. I'd actually love to hear more from you, if you don't mind.

I have been struggling a lot of chocolate and sugar. I had actually lost a lot of weight and was doing great limiting sugar, but when I started with T (last year!) the stress and awfulness of therapy (for me!) plus some other life stresses, kicked me back into sugar mode. It's been a struggle since, and I've gained back all the weight (and probably more).

T keeps asking me, every single session, without fail, "how's the food? how's the chocolate?"

Last month, I actually started to improve a bit... but realized that his asking me causes me more stress, more attention, and makes it HARDER for me to stay on track. I don't want to talk about it with him. He's not a nutritionist, and it's not what I want to spend my therapy money/time on.

So, I started telling him, "it's fine, you asking me is making it harder, and I don't want to talk about it." But, he keeps asking and pushing

This last session, we went through this again, and he said something about accountability, that he thinks that I haven't talked about it enough (?) and that he thinks I need the accountability of him asking?

Ugh. I hate it. I bristle at it. I disagree. I worked it out, on my own, before I even met him. I know what I need to do, but some weeks, it is honestly not a priority (too much other crap, trying to avoid chocolate is not a high enough priority).

I guess I'm curious about how you're seeing accountability as caring? To me, it feels like nagging, stress, poking, checking up, the opposite of caring I hate it... I also had neglectful parents that did pretty much no parenting, teaching, or coaching - so I sort of wondered if that was part of it, that I'm not used to that sort of "involvement". But maybe for you, you guys had agreed that it was something you wanted to do? So the checking-in feels good? Whereas for me, I feel like he's imposing this goal on me, and while I want to work on it, as I said, some weeks it's not a priority. So, I end up feeling like I failed at something that I wasn't trying to do in the first place.

Thanks.

[brillskep]

I hold myself accountable but I wouldn't tolerate or find it helpful for my therapist to do that kind of thing. Quite on the contrary. I prefer to draw my own conclusions (generally in life and particularly so in therapy) and when I do the healthy thing, it's completely my choice. Then again, if I do something unhealthy, that's completely my choice as well, and while I accept responsibility when others are affected by my actions, I only answer to myself in personal matters. If my therapist tried to hold me accountable by checking what I did, it would ruin our therapeutic relationship for me and I would feel as if I were treated like a child, not an adult.

[ManOfConstantSorrow]

No but it certainly feels like it at times..

[LonesomeTonight]

I offered to be accountable as part of a deal, so I feel ok about it for now. However, if I don't follow through with what I say, I'm sort of unsure about being honest about it...which kind of defeats the purpose, I guess. Then again, if I'm not following the care part of the plan (but following the safety part) and am doing ok mentally, I don't see what difference it makes.

[PinkFlamingo99]

Yes, it helps me now. She's also a bit bossy at times about self-care/safety issues, which also helps me. I'm really not doing well and she's a clinical psych working out of a hospital psychiatric dept with ppl who are generally quite sick, so her approach is a bit more hands on. She's also free/covered by Canadian medicare.

I check off my meals I eat (i have a meal plan with a nutritionist in the hospital), if I take off my meds (psychiatric and others), and cleaning tasks that I check off. It really helps me because I have something to look at and also sometimes I do it just to show her I did. She also asks if I self harmed (I avoid it more bec I don't want to tell her), to see them to make sure they aren't infected, and urges me to go for stitches when it happens. She has also madee promise to go to my other medical appts like surgery follow up, and it's probably the only reason why I went. My self care is very very bad so it helps.

[ScarletPimpernel]

Yes. It's the main reason I stay in therapy. I haven't learned how to hold myself accountable. The main thing a T holds me accountable for is my SI.

[unaluna]

Yes to all! Im either self-sabotaging - no, wait - there is no "or" to that. I HAVE told my t in the past that i DONT want him to ask me, or i dont want to talk, about my overeating or unhealthy eating, and he has totally respected that.

It took me a long time to examine my eating habits and realize they came from deprivation - my parents poor background. And catholic school "sacrifice" - trying to please the nuns. But you see a fat person and you figure, heck she eats all the time. Well she doesnt eat healthfully all the time. I wasnt eating breakfast. I wasnt eating variety. I wasnt eating hot food. I wasnt eating home made food. I wasnt eating vegetables. I used to buy water! Not food.

Anyway. Honestly, i didnt want my mother to see me skinny. I didnt want her to see me still fat either. But if she had seen me skinny, she would have found a way to ruin it. I wish i had been able to say that years ago. I think t is about doing that. I just cant do it. Or dont do it. Big mouth coward!

Thanks for the input, everyone. I am just in week one of letting him ask me follow up, and i KNOW hes afraid to rock the boat! So am i! I just keep waiting for my mother to come back from the dead and slap me upside the head.

[ruh roh]

Hmmmm... I don't think my therapist would do this. I'm also not sure I would ask. I want to come up with a hankster simile, but I'm falling short. It's sort of like that episode from the Brady Bunch when Cindy froze in front of the camera, except the camera was focused on Eddie Munster looking for Spot who you do not want to find by accident. (How did I do with that?)

I'm glad you found a way to keep yourself accountable while also feeling cared about. That sounds like a good balance.

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by ruh roh

Hmmmm... I don't think my therapist would do this. I'm also not sure I would ask. I want to come up with a hankster simile, but I'm falling short. It's sort of like that episode from the Brady Bunch when Cindy froze in front of the camera, except the camera was focused on Eddie Munster looking for Spot who you do not want to find by accident. (How did I do with that?)

I'm glad you found a way to keep yourself accountable while also feeling cared about. That sounds like a good balance.

Youre funny! No the thing is - accountable equals cared about equals responsible for, is a brand new idea for me. Trying it on for size.

[BonnieJean]

I sometimes set up things to make me accountable but I don't think I could use t holding me accountable. I think it would get in the way of the therapeutic relationship for me. But I'm glad it is working out for you H!

[JustShakey]

I'm another one who bristles at being held accountable by anyone other than myself. I'm beginning to see it as as caring thing - people can hold each other accountable because they care about each other. Growing up though, I was held accountable for the benefit of others, not for myself, so my knee-jerk reaction tends to be 'what's in it for you? F- off.'

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[atisketatasket]

Not totally sure whether we're talking accountability to the therapist or accountability to oneself via the therapist? I mean, what's he going to do if you don't swim or you eat chocolate?

As I recall, there was a really nice Y in your town. Do you swim there? I loved their pool.

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[Cinnamon_Stick]

My T keeps me accountable for my bad thoughts. If I get to the point of acting on thoughts to hurt myself then I call her. I have called her and I know she cares.

I keep myself accountable for the other stuff I deal with in therapy. I think I am tougher on myself than my T is.

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by atisketatasket

Not totally sure whether we're talking accountability to the therapist or accountability to oneself via the therapist? I mean, what's he going to do if you don't swim or you eat chocolate?

As I recall, there was a really nice Y in your town. Do you swim there? I loved their pool.

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My apartment pool (outside) stays open after Labor Day and will open before Memorial Day if its warm i am thinking about a winter pool membership. Thanks for reminding me about the y.

You totally get what im saying hes going to help me figure out why im hurting myself, if thats what im doing.

[Favorite Jeans]

Interesting question Hankster! I'm trying to wrap my head around the idea of accountability to my T. On the whole, I don't feel accountable to her but sometimes when I'm struggling with a concrete issue (something very specific like paying bills, making a call I dread, or addressing something I've been procrastinating about...) I keep her updated as to my progress. I've never asked her to ask me about something but I do feel a certain satisfaction in telling her when I've been successful and when I haven't been successful she's never disapproving or disappointed. We're still okay even when I mess up. Which is a new experience for me.

[unaluna]

Originally Posted by Favorite Jeans

We're still okay even when I mess up. Which is a new experience for me.

There ya go. Instead of only being attached if you mess up and need the parent. If you do well, you obviously dont need them any more. Makes it hard to do well.