In Session Today: Part VI

Phew it sounds like he has been clear and will continue to be clear. I am glad there is not the setting up of the same situation as ex T or ex MC. I don't want T to hurt you in the thread of his stone comments just because he decides to shift something. Sounds like his open approach helps you out more.

LT - it's not your job to worry about the boundaries anyway. Email away...seriously. It's not some sign of health or strength to not email your therapist - especially when he hasn't told you to stop. Hell, my therapist actively discourages me from holding back on emailing, and I promise you that I email far more often than you do. I'm not unhealthily emotionally dependent on my T. I do NEED him. (GASP! Oh my! I have needs?! What an unhealthy person I am! /sarcasm)

In any case, you're not in therapy to work on being more closed off/disconnected/need people less (at least as far as I can tell). So, why exactly would one put effort into not reaching out to a T who has clearly said "email is OK!" ?? To prove what exactly?? That you don't need them? Bully for you and your not having needs then.

I didn't see judgement in the comments I saw... but some concern. Sometimes, things do change and can seem helpful but they do escalate sometimes and it can be not so good in the end, I'm speaking from experience but I also know that not every T is the same. I don't know your T, none of us do.... so if you are not too concerned about the boundaries changing or whatever, then that's fine. I just tell everyone to be cautious with anything in therapy now. I don't trust therapists much at all.... anything can go wrong with any of them.

That being said, posting here, invites comments you may not always like. I usually just ignore them. If it does bother you, then yes maybe not posting, at least not the details of sessions, is best for you right now. Again, I can't say what is or isn't. I think you are having a hard time with your T going away for a week and that's understandable but it's a week and I know that sounds harsh but it could be forever, like mine.... I'd love to be in your place right now If you chose to see the lady once, its not a commitment, and who knows, you may really like her? Try not to let the comments online get to you so much. At the end of the day only one of us actually knows your T and how things truly are with you and that is you.

I hope you are ok.

Posting here is not compulsory. I would imagine it quite common to stop posting once it stopped being useful.

also, it is just one person's opinion. i really liked your last session, LT. he is very clear with what he says and knows where you might double guess everything, and tries to head that off.

transference trigger, please no judgements

Did it feel good to say it? (No judgement here. Hope t was gentle)

At the time, I didn't feel what I'd hoped. I wasn't sure what I was feeling. There was lots of confusion then. Now, I feel good about it. Sheepishly proud of myself.

Not filtering myself is one of the things we are working on. This one is something that has been talked about many times. The desire to do it, the why the desire is there, the number of times I've wanted to do it.... ect. What I want from T when I do it, the fact that I can do it and T would be ok with it... the risk was low, yet it has taken me I'd say close to the 6 months mark (probably more) to actually do it.

She was her usual accepting self and responded with a warm, "I know". Which for those that don't remember, that is our worked out acceptable response.

First, I told T about my week. I had seen some family over the weekend, have been spending most of my time relaxing at home, since it's my last week of free time before starting my new job. Then I mentioned not remembering as much as usual about our previous session. He asked what that meant. I said normally I remember a lot of details, what exactly he said as well as transitions, how things fit together. This time I didn't.

He asked what we talked about that day. I responded that we discussed my behavior from the session before that one. We tried to understand why I act liked that. He also had asked about me being angry. He confirmed that we had talked about these things and said he doesn't think it's too bad to not remember everything.

Then he mentioned the part about being angry again. He said how I always say I'm not angry often. I replied that in session I'm not, but I am with other people. He told me that I had written in my notes on that session that I had been angry even if only for a short period. I agreed, but it wasn't about him and only very slightly. I also said that he always notices when I'm angry with him. He asked how and I said either I turn away from him or I directly tell him.

He asked why I'm not angry as often with him if it often happens outside of our sessions. I answered that it would mean I don't like him anymore. He was confused by that, he said he's sometimes angry with his children or wife too... he said I have a different opinion on anger than most people, that most think it's negative and destroys things, but not as extreme as me.

I also mentioned that people tend to get angry and leave if I express my own anger. He then went on about how maybe I'm trying to surpress anger in session since I'm scared he might leave and then it comes out as other emotions or crying. How that might be unconscious. I told him that I never feel angry in those moments and he said of course it's only a theory but it might be that way. But that he can't really tell what's going on inside me and that's a hard part of his job.

We talked about how I show my anger with other people. I said as a teenager I used to scream at my mom, then she'd yell back and then I'd go to my room, slam my door and listen to really loud music. Now I mostly just yell at people. I brought up an example from this weekend. I went to my parent's place to go walk their dog. They had just cleaned the apartment. I went to the bathroom and somehow some water got on the floor while I was washing my hands. My mom afterwards complained about the whole room being 'dirty' again already, even though it was just water. T laughed about it and went through how I responded to it with me (I actually didn't tell her I was bothered by her reaction, we discussed some alternatives of what you could do, like distraction or mindfulness).

T said how I had mentioned my French teacher in some of my notes and that I'm still angry with her. He then said how I had written about her saying I should 'talk to God'. He said that sentence made him laugh. I told him that phrase used to make me very angry. It's such a stupid sentence. Especially since I used to believe in God, but around that time I stopped since I was of the opinion that if there was a being that truly loves all humans, then it would not let anyone suffer the pain I was going through. T understood. He asked why I think she said that. I said I don't know and that it's the worst sentence I've heard all my life, I can't understand why anyone would say that. T said how I had written that I said I have nobody to talk to and she responded with that, so maybe she wanted to say that there's always somebody to talk to. I told him that it's still a bad response...

I then went on about other things she had done wrong. She'd often say how she didn't believe me. I mentioned a few different occasions where that happened. And that she didn't understand my way of thinking.

One example I used was one time where she asked me whether I talk to other people who are homosexual online, on a forum or similar. When I told her that I don't, she didn't understand, told me she'd do that and that anybody who's 'normal' would feel the same way as her. T then said how he had said something similar two years back (I was very surprised that he remembered), that he asked whether I sometimes go out to meet gay people. I told him that asking is always okay, but telling me my way of thinking is wrong is not, and that's also not what he does. He agreed with that.

He suggested that in such a situation you could just explain why you're not doing it, stand your ground. I replied that nowadays I would probably do that. But back then I was 12 years old and it was an awkward topic to discuss anyways, especially with a teacher. So it was kind of hard. He understood and also said that some of the things I used to discuss were very intimate and I was very young.

After going through all my examples of her making me angry, he asked whether I showed her my anger. I said that I stopped talking to her. He asked whether she might have been annoyed by that and I said that would've been the goal. How people who hurt me deserve to suffer.

I started to cry a lot. He immediately asked whether I'm thinking about something regarding that teacher. I nodded and he asked what it was. I said I was bothered by the fact that people didn't leave me alone. That they made decisions for me about who I would talk to, about what I would talk, who would know what I tell somebody. That I didn't feel it was okay for them to just decide over my head. He listened and said yes a lot. When I was done he said that this was in the past and not happening now. I nodded and started doing some deep breathing.

After some silence, I told him I'd like to look at him and he said 'then do it!' So I did and he smiled at me. I was happy about that.

I did some mindfulness, trying to concentrate on my breathing. T asked me whether I'm still having memories and I said no, how I'm just trying to focus on breathing. He asked me some questions regarding a book I'm still reading on that and said that we can always discuss if I have questions on it.

Then we slowly started to wrap up and said good bye.

That would terminate my liking the only T we get to hear a lot about on this forum! I think it is just because you regularly write very eloquently and in so much detail about your therapy, almost just as much about what he says/does as about yourself. You also don't tend to idealize him in your write ups the way quite a few people do about their Ts, which (the idealizing) probably deters negative posts. And you don't burst out in an aggressive and unfair manner when people criticize, so probably they feel more comfortable posting it. It gives plenty of room for comments of all kinds and I am sure your stories make people think about their therapy as well.

I can relate a lot to this. I also struggle to express and feel anger. I'm glad you seemed to get a good conversation out of this topic though. Sounds like a productive session

Aw, thanks, Xyn. I may keep posting about them some.

I guess I'm just particularly sensitive to certain kinds of feedback--less so about stuff involving my T as a person/therapist, more stuff about me, I think. Maybe I just need to ignore it more, if I don't find it helpful--use what T calls the LT filter (well, with "LT" replaced with my first name). I also know some people on here may get the sense they know everything that's going on with me and with my therapy history because I post so much, but I also wasn't even on here the first few years I was seeing ex-T or the first year of ex-MC. And it may *seem* like I'm emailing T excessively, but if I posted some of what I'd sent ex-T and ex-MC (I know I sometimes shared ex-MC correspondence but very rarely those with ex-T), it might seem like nothing. Even the tone I used corresponding with them is different than what I use with T--in talking about it Monday, I said I seemed almost submissive in my tone with them, but I'm not that way with T (well, maybe in the very beginning with him). Or if I had been writing up full, detailed sessions from, say, 4 years ago, they might have a very different image of what I'm like now compared to then. Or what my relationship with this T is like compared with ex-T.

OK, I'll stop rambling about this now!

i would practice using the LT filter as well. Trust in your relationship with your T.

LT

Everyone is sensitive to certain kinds of feedback, it's one of the drawbacks of a place like this and sharing so much. In real life, things people say to us, even in kindness can sometimes bother us more if it's a certain topic or certain way. It's human nature.

It doesn't matter what any of us think, 100 of us could be telling you to pull away and that it still seems a lot, 100 of us could be saying, no...its fine do whatever.... but the end of the day. YOU are the only one who can really decide your path. You know your limits, it may feel like less but it could still seem like a lot to others.... we can't really know how someone will feel or react to something, while T's are more understanding and tolerant due to their job, rather than friends or family might be about some things, they are still human and have limits but they are also capable of saying, ok we need to talk about this. It's too much etc

The thing is, I can't for the life of me understand why anyone would want or need that much contact or reassurance form anyone, T or not.... but it's because we are different people. Just like you and others may find it hard to understand why I love keeping people at bay and why I pefer things like movies and going to eat, alone rather than with someone. Why even if T said "lets hang out every day for a week" I'd say no. For me it makes sense because it's my comfort, it's my needs... so for you that reassurance or whatever is your comfort and needs. do whatever you feel is right for you, with caution but also don't be so terrified of whatever may happen, this relationship wont last forever and I urge you and everyone, to just make the most of it while it's here. Meaning, being in the moment as much as you can and trying not to panic so much about what may come. I'd have bet money on many things with my T... but leaving us all with 2 weeks notice... is not one of them. It's the hardest thing I've ever experienced and it's taught me that nothing is forever, nothing is predictable and you truly can't fully ever trust anyone. You just gotta live for today, for now.

So, you do you, take the online comments with a grain of salt. You wont like every one of them, hell you may hate this one, and that's fine... at the end of the day its your journey, your therapy, your life and it's about you. Give yourself a little credit at being the best version of you that there is... and knowing you can make the proper choices. All the best for whatever you choose

What do you get out of posting? I can see where writing these in depth reports for one's self might be useful - but why do you post them here? Why bother announcing you might stop posting your missives instead of just stopping if you really are not benefitting? I am not asking you to answer me, but are you being honest about what you do it for and the sorts of responses you hope to get?

LT, I don't share about the frequency of my outside contact with my T with anybody, not even my spouse, because I think other people would feel that it's excessive and say judgmental things. Actually, I feel ashamed because I think it's excessive most of the time. But my T is totally fine with it (or so she says!). She said that part of my "work" is learning to reach out and to trust that I can rely on people and also to believe that I'm worth asking for these things. So this back-and-forth battle with myself is actually therapy work, and I think she's pleased when I do reach out because it means the healthier side is winning. I have slowly become much more comfortable being vulnerable and asking for support from other people, so I guess she knows what she's talking about.

She also gently asks me sometimes what I feel from her when I contact her. Does she seem angry or annoyed? When she says she wants to be there for me, does she seem to mean it? I find that helpful, to examine what's actually happening between us, rather than what I fear is happening or will happen.

So I can totally relate to feeling sensitive about the emails. I don't think rugged self-reliance is always the best strategy if there are great costs there. Sometimes I use not reaching out as a way to punish myself for having needs, and that's not so good either.

Anyway, I selfishly hope you keep posting, but that's just because I like your posts and all the In Session posts. I hope for your sake you do whatever feels best to you.

Hi stopdog. I know you weren't asking me, but I thought I'd answer from my perspective. For me, what I get out of posting IST is a way to organize my thoughts around what I experienced in therapy. It's a way to record it, have a memory of it, and to sort out what was the important stuff in therapy minus the fluff. Yeah, I could do that in a journal, but I don't entirely trust my parents not to read it, so it is actually more anonymous for me to post it here. So why else do I post it here? While I haven't really gotten responses on mine, what I think I would like is if someone had a similar experience that they could share, or if someone thinks, hey that sounds messed up that shouldn't happen in T, it would give me a "Red flag". I think T is more understood here than with my friends so when my friends ask me about therapy I can tell them but they don't really get it. There's "something" about sharing it here on a forum for therapy with other people who have been there, done that, doing that, on that same journey that makes me feel not alone in the therapy journey. Otherwise it's a very lonely spot. My friends and my family just don't get it. Here, I have the opportunity for someone else to get it, to understand, to encourage me, to support me, to question if something seems weird. Etc. Good questions stopdog. Thanks for asking. Kit

How about we stop having these cyclical discussions about why LT posts, whether she should, whether she shouldn't and on and on? It's boring and makes the threads heavily weighted towards one poster and their therapy which is unbalanced and potentially unfair to others who posts. LT posts what she does and will stop if she doesn't want to post any more. Jeez, Groundhog Day hits PCploppsy.

But this thread is heavily slanted.

I used to post very detailed descriptions of my sessions. Maybe there was some of that wanting to be a "good student" thing - vanity. I'm not sure. I know part of it was wanting to have people that knew enough of what was going on that when I did have a question or needed support, I didn't have to feel like I had to go into this very long winded explanation of the situation (something that is common for me).

At times, it helped me feel like I had more of a community. I don't always know what to talk about or how to respond like say on the couch thread. The IST thread is something I could do, I know what is expected of me in this thread. I felt like it gave people that could not share so publicly a way to find someone that might be struggling with similar things and then we would talk through PM about some topic.

I stopped posting here for a few reasons-
1. the knowledge that this site is used in ways that technically violate the terms of agreement of the site and it is only luck if all of those violations get caught - while I have less of a problem sharing my experience with others that might be going throw the same thing, I have no fortitude to find out that I am being made fun of or being used as an example for something negative, especially since those things are often taken out of context.

2. not feeling safe here anymore, this place can at times be very welcoming and at other times be very condemning. I have maternal transference that while it has become less intense, it is still there. My therapy is not conventional, it is not completely unheard of either. I direct my therapy so this is what I want from it - my T has not pushed me in any direction other than to accept and support me as I move through it. She does have some boundaries - there are some No's. And no matter how detailed I wrote them, I felt many people did not fully understand the different layers of my therapy.

3. I started struggling with even writing them. After moving to 3x a week, there was a long stretch that they felt like too much work, too hard to do. Then they started blurring all together. If I didn't get to the right away, I struggled with remembering what happened on which day. Writing them takes a lot of time (for me) so sometimes, I just don't have that time to dedicate to it. Some might say I am going through the process that is described where things outside therapy become more important. I think for me really, things outside therapy is demanding that they be more important.

You can lead a horse to water but you cant make him drink.

I don't actually post in this thread much because I don't have time to write it all out and also I like to keep stuff private. But sometimes I think it would be nice to share what happened in session with someone other than T, like if it was a good session or I felt like I learned something, or if it was a bad session or I felt confused by something... I don't have people IRL I can talk about therapy with, I don't know anyone else who's done longterm therapy, just grief counseling and addiction counseling. So I enjoy reading about other people's sessions and I can see why it would be useful to write them out.

I never reported my therapy sessions here but when I was in therapy, frequently sent long, elaborate analyses to the Ts, a lot of them a few hours after the sessions or the next day. Back then, I mostly thought it was my way of processing things for myself plus a desire to be seen and understood more completely. I think these were certainly part of it, but the biggest part (that I only admitted to myself later) was that I used the long emails as a form of avoidance. I had important things to do (often writing) that I procrastinated and wrote the emails instead. There was also an element of wanting to impress, but the procrastination/avoidance/distraction from real life real important things was by far the top one reason. I did that with many other people as well, not just Ts, even used a forum in that way very much and to some extent this one as well. Don't know if anyone relates to this, just thought to share as one version.

I relate to this part. I was avoiding a lot of my life while with ex t 1. I was deeply grieving and as well going through a huge life change. It is like that is where my brain went to be safe. I found so much satisfaction in ending that connection and reinvolving myself with my actual life and the people in it. That's just me though.

No real time to reply at moment, but will say something later. In the meantime, to take things out of IST: LT's Thread