[Omers]

Welp, yesterday’s session was pretty aweful. T blew it in more ways than I ever thought possible in a single session even from my really bad T’s. He fell asleep. He monopolized the sssion. He ignored the needs I had expressed in email that he had acknowledged and agreed to in his reply and that he had set his office up for. He talked over me. He listed all the positive attributes I thought he saw in me and said he wished I could find a place where people saw these attributes. when I awkwardly attempted to own them by saying “besides here” he came back with the quick reply of “but you PAY me” (emphasis his). And, then at the very end of session when we had, as usual, run a bit over he said he needed to schedule out through July and strongly suggested every other week (which we had discussed as a looming option because of my financial situation) without any thought of how emotionally difficult it is for me to let go of that time with him even if I completely understand the why.
So...
Back to another exciting week of refreshing my email every minute and a half anxiously waiting a reply, wondering how he is going to respond to being challenged and directly confronted.

No session next week because it would have fallen on my anniversary and H has the day off for the first time since we’ve been married.
Pdoc the 17th... Pdoc the 17th... praying she has moved to in person sessions and that she can help or at least that things will go better with her... Pdoc the 17th.

[LostOnTheTrail]

Ouch, Omers. That sounds excruciatingly painful. I am so sorry you went through that.
I hope he responds well to your email. You have every right to be annoyed.

He fell asleep? I can't wrap my head around how that could even happen. I mean, I believe you and I am not doubting that it happened. It is
such an extreme manifestation of withdrawal. And accompanied by dropping down to every other week.. I would be in pain and fury. I wonder how he will attempt to recover his supposed deep compassion and relational approach...

[MissUdy]

Hugs Omers, that’s awful. Can’t believe he fell asleep that’s so ****ing rude! And all the other things too. The comment about you paying him would’ve made me pop. Hope the emails go ok. Have you ever shouted at your therapist? I can remember once or twice I screamed at mine on the phone (he had done something pretty mean to me) and I felt much better afterwards. I also felt guilty, but it was good to get it out.

[Omers]

Usually my T is pretty darn awesome. All of this is SO out of character for him. He was also dressed “funny” and I didn’t get a mulch update so I hope he has a really good d* reason. We have had “ruptures” twice before but I could tell I was over emotional for what had happened those times and he handled both well... but both could reasonably be written off as simple misunderstandings. These aren’t so easy to write off and I am upset but not triggered like I was for the two “ruptures”. He handles getting yelled at really well but the tone in the email was more of a calm angry... this email also implied the unprofessionalism of the interaction which is a line I have never crossed.
For those that have been following my adventures with T... I have mentioned before my struggles with the affirmations he has asked me to do. He pretty much got told to shove them where the sun doesn’t shine at this point. I tried them trusting him and trusting his honesty and he blew that one all to hell.
I called him out on a lot of his stuff and a lot of things he doesn’t get or hasn’t gotten. I suspect he will be thankful that this is an email and not in person so he has a chance to react to it before returning to a professional space and responding.
And yes, I challenged the authenticity of his relational approach AND how much he perceives that, perhaps quite inaccurately, as a personality trait outside the office as well.
He also got quoted against himself.

[LonesomeTonight]

Hugs, Omers, that sounded like a really awful session. Not to excuse him at all, but I wonder if your T is feeling ill? Or had taken some sort of medication (like an allergy med) that made him sleepy and sort of out of it? Because you said much was out of character, plus the falling asleep thing (and you're seeing him in person now, too, right?) I hope he responds soon and is very apologetic and understanding, perhaps offering up some sort of explanation? I'd be really bothered by the "You pay me" comment as well.

[ArtieTheSequal]

Hugs Omers, that sounds awful, I'm so sorry all of that happened.

Originally Posted by LonesomeTonight

Hugs, Omers, that sounded like a really awful session. Not to excuse him at all, but I wonder if your T is feeling ill? Or had taken some sort of medication (like an allergy med) that made him sleepy and sort of out of it? Because you said much was out of character, plus the falling asleep thing (and you're seeing him in person now, too, right?) I hope he responds soon and is very apologetic and understanding, perhaps offering up some sort of explanation? I'd be really bothered by the "You pay me" comment as well.

I am sure he will have a reason for falling asleep, but, for me, the relational damage done by his behaviour would be very difficult to navigate. He might be ill, on medication, be experiencing a personal crisis, be exhausted for all kinds of reasons not related to Omers. However, if he is so exhausted and compromised that he can not stay awake, he should have cancelled sessions and stayed home. It is a basic skill for a therapist to recognise when they are not present enough to work in a safe way. I think I am having a strong reaction to Omer's experience because my therapist has continued to work with me on occasions when she wasn't resourced enough and it has led to very difficult ruptures. Having said, that even she wouldn't fall asleep in sessions and she is an old boot with a dedicated relationship with whiskey ... It annoys me when therapist's can't hold us by protecting their own stuff.

[LonesomeTonight]

Originally Posted by comrademoomoo

I am sure he will have a reason for falling asleep, but, for me, the relational damage done by his behaviour would be very difficult to navigate. He might be ill, on medication, be experiencing a personal crisis, be exhausted for all kinds of reasons not related to Omers. However, if he is so exhausted and compromised that he can not stay awake, he should have cancelled sessions and stayed home. It is a basic skill for a therapist to recognise when they are not present enough to work in a safe way. I think I am having a strong reaction to Omer's experience because my therapist has continued to work with me on occasions when she wasn't resourced enough and it has led to very difficult ruptures. Having said, that even she wouldn't fall asleep in sessions and she is an old boot with a dedicated relationship with whiskey ... It annoys me when therapist's can't hold us by protecting their own stuff.

Oh, I completely agree with this. Like ex-MC probably should not have been seeing clients a few days after his wife died (he did take maybe a week off after that, but ex-T told me later that he should have taken more time). And I'm pretty sure *something* was going on with Dr. T last summer that he seemed unable to keep out of the room that really affected my therapy.


I'm not sure I could deal with a T falling asleep in session. I mean, I feel bad enough when Dr. T yawns on occasion (only seems to happen since we've been doing video sessions), even though I know that likely has nothing to do with me. I think a T would need to apologize really profusely to me and give an explanation if that happened.

[susannahsays]

Yikes. All I can say is he deserves to be challenged and confronted. What did you do when he fell asleep?

[childofchaos831]

Originally Posted by susannahsays

Yikes. All I can say is he deserves to be challenged and confronted. What did you do when he fell asleep?

Ya, we don't know how we would react in the moment if our T fell asleep in session... Like did you just wake them up? Or did they wake up on their on their own? And the "you pay me" comment is completely out of line, in our opinion. We have insecurities about that as it is... Like, would our T be saying all this stuff *if* we weren't paying her? That really needs an explanation and major apology. We don't know if we could go back after a comment like that, honestly...

[Omers]

Originally Posted by LonesomeTonight

Hugs, Omers, that sounded like a really awful session. Not to excuse him at all, but I wonder if your T is feeling ill? Or had taken some sort of medication (like an allergy med) that made him sleepy and sort of out of it? Because you said much was out of character, plus the falling asleep thing (and you're seeing him in person now, too, right?) I hope he responds soon and is very apologetic and understanding, perhaps offering up some sort of explanation? I'd be really bothered by the "You pay me" comment as well.

It is so very not like him and typically he will give me a heads up of anything that might influence our session... so we will see. He has been very understanding in past disagreements but they were not as personal or as accurate and accusational... the you pay me comment floored me!

[Omers]

Originally Posted by comrademoomoo

I am sure he will have a reason for falling asleep, but, for me, the relational damage done by his behaviour would be very difficult to navigate. He might be ill, on medication, be experiencing a personal crisis, be exhausted for all kinds of reasons not related to Omers. However, if he is so exhausted and compromised that he can not stay awake, he should have cancelled sessions and stayed home. It is a basic skill for a therapist to recognise when they are not present enough to work in a safe way. I think I am having a strong reaction to Omer's experience because my therapist has continued to work with me on occasions when she wasn't resourced enough and it has led to very difficult ruptures. Having said, that even she wouldn't fall asleep in sessions and she is an old boot with a dedicated relationship with whiskey ... It annoys me when therapist's can't hold us by protecting their own stuff.

He knows to tell me if something is off with him and then we pace the session accordingly.
Thanks for the dedicated relationship with whiskey comment, that gave me a good chuckle in comparison to his purist kind of being.

[Omers]

Originally Posted by susannahsays

Yikes. All I can say is he deserves to be challenged and confronted. What did you do when he fell asleep?

I stopped talking which woke him back up/brought him back to the room... at least momentarily.

[Omers]

Originally Posted by childofchaos831

Ya, we don't know how we would react in the moment if our T fell asleep in session... Like did you just wake them up? Or did they wake up on their on their own? And the "you pay me" comment is completely out of line, in our opinion. We have insecurities about that as it is... Like, would our T be saying all this stuff *if* we weren't paying her? That really needs an explanation and major apology. We don't know if we could go back after a comment like that, honestly...

It will be interesting to see where this goes. T and I had a very strong foundation that might be his saving grace should he handle the confrontation well. It is odd as he did very well doing some repairitive work with my inner protective part... when he wasn’t pissing me off.

[stopdog]

I am fairly certain I would have responded that I don't pay them to sleep

[Omers]

Stopdog, I know you don’t care but god, there are days when you bring me such joy! And a good chuckle.

[susannahsays]

Originally Posted by Omers

I stopped talking which woke him back up/brought him back to the room... at least momentarily.

Not to get into gender stereotypes, but was he "resting his eyes?" That's what my dad calls it when he falls asleep while in an upright or semi-upright position. He'll swear up and down that his eyes were just closed and he wasn't asleep, but the snoring gives him away. Apparently other men (to be specific, other dads) also exhibit this behavior in the wild. I don't think it's usually something they do at work, though.

Anyway, back to you... did he acknowledge what had happened? Did you? How very awkward.

[Omers]

My rather wild male H exhibits the eye resting behavior frequently as well as “stretching his back” should this occur in a non sitting position.

I did not call T out on it in session because typically if he does something out of character and I simply pause he will explain himself. And... I do not think well on my feet with T. I am debate/philosophy trained and can be very snappy with questions or retorts in some situations... often landing me in trouble. With T I find myself in a position of open mindedness and acceptance, at least to “try an idea on” as my usually snappy, defensive self does not leave space for self reflection or growth. So, in the company of those that have earned my trust I am often rather slow to react.
I have not gotten a response from him yet, but I had told him I was OK with fewer and more delayed replies several weeks ago as he was adjusting to video sessions, then as soon as he had that kind of down he started seeing some clients in person.
I can’t really see him ignoring my anger as he knows if left to my own devices I will snowball my emotions. He may too need time to step back from his emotion reaction to being called out before he can offer a thought out reply.

That sounds horrible. I am so sorry.

[childofchaos831]

Originally Posted by Omers

It will be interesting to see where this goes. T and I had a very strong foundation that might be his saving grace should he handle the confrontation well. It is odd as he did very well doing some repairitive work with my inner protective part... when he wasn’t pissing me off.

The foundation may well be what saves him.

We couldn't have stayed most likely... We'd have to have left... Crying would've been happening and just... no. Not when T made it happen.

You are handling this situation really well in our opinion. Anger is appropriate and expressing it by email most likely the best method.

[Omers]

Thank you.
Yes, when the tears started I turned and walked out. Historically his response to my crying has been an understandable one given his therapeutic approach but has not been the best for me. Until yesterday though he had never caused the tears.
His last client for today should have been done at 5 or 6 pm and it is after 7pm here now. I have not heard from him. It is possible that he has not checked email. I am trying to remind myself that the longer he takes to truly read and understand the email and do some self reflection, possibly some supervision, the better the probable outcome... but the drafting alternating between deep grief, insane anxiety and other ages reactions makes patience difficult.

[Omers]

OK so I know my T well enough to know that if he is going to attempt to repair this it will be a dialogue and he will want to know what I need for healing to occur in our relationship. If he owns up to it in a reasonable way what, if anything, would feel repairitive for you? I am struggling when this is usually pretty easy for me.

[NP_Complete]

Can you just ask him for a phone call? This seems like something that can't really wait for two whole weeks to find a resolution. Maybe if you talk to him you'll feel a little better about the situation.

[nottrustin]

Originally Posted by NP_Complete

Can you just ask him for a phone call? This seems like something that can't really wait for two whole weeks to find a resolution. Maybe if you talk to him you'll feel a little better about the situation.

I agree. When T handled a session badly a few months ago. I sent her a brief message about being upset with how the appointment went. She doesn't utilize emails with clients only text. She texted me back asking if we could talk on the phone. She agreed. We talked on the phone and were able to discuss where she had totally messed up and I was also misinterpreted other things. She thanked me for contacting her and not waiting until her next appointment. I suspect if we had handled it through texting, it could have gotten even messier because it is hard to really interpret what a person is saying through the screen.