Couch 221: Definitely Spam!

Virgil’s. They have a couple other flavors too.

I'm feeling generally unmotivated to work on any of my various projects this morning (writing, running, meal prep for healthy eating, working on a presentation I have to give at work in a few weeks, avoiding engagement in problem behaviours).

I think some of it has to do with the ongoing election stress, some of it is just general goal entropy (I started a few projects around the same time, and the newness/excitement is starting to wear off), and some of it has to do with the fact that T and I had a serious conversation yesterday about whether I should keep working with him.

I told him that I feel like I need to be working with someone who is more nurturing, that his hard-driving intellectual approach is too damn difficult. I brought up Kohut since that's who we were reading in my fellowship last week--"man can no more survive psychologically in a psychological milieu that does not respond empathetically to him, than he can survive physically in an atmosphere that contains no oxygen." I told him that therapy with him feels like I am gasping for air. I also told him that while I feel like his therapeutic approach may very well be wrong for me, I fear that I am too attached to leave.

And then he said something interesting. He said that all along in this therapy, he and I have had different aims--I want to be contained, soothed, comforted; he wants me to increase my capacity for reflection (particularly when emotionally activated), to engage less with problem behaviours, to end up in a healthy romantic relationship. In his mind, these aims are at cross-purposes, mutually exclusive. He said that be believes that a more nurturing therapy would be counter-helpful to me, that some kinds of therapy (e.g. empathy-based therapy as proposed by Kohut) is helpful for some people but not for people with BPD, that I have been in that kind of therapy before and it was ultimately unhelpful and paradoxically promoted engagement in problem behaviours (he's right about that last point). He said, "I absolutely care about you, and I am attached to you too. But I can't ethically engage in a treatment that is not going to benefit you. I can't feel safe with someone unless I know I am helping them, and giving you what you want would not be helpful to you."

He asked me to think about these points, so I sent him an email last night that took me like two hours to write. (It's a little long and a little, um, dramatic so I don't want to post it here but if anyone feels like reading it, PM me and I'll send it to you--I'd be interested to hear what people think) It was exhausting to write, and of course he won't respond to it so I have to wait until Monday to talk with him about it.

I dunno, I'm feeling low on self-control today anyhow so I may end up contacting him re: problem behaviours anyway (though we won't discuss the email--those calls are strictly about behavioural modification).

I know y'all think I should kick him to the curb. He can be an arrogant berk, and often leaves me to deal with my own emotions in a way that I find excruciatingly difficult. But the thing is, he *is* right about the fact that this therapy has improved my functioning more than any other therapy I've been in. My psychiatrist, who knows him well, thinks I should stick with him. Plus this dude is literally at the forefront of tx for ppl with BPD, like, regularly corresponds with Fonagy and Bateman and all those folks. So my attachment to him influences my decision, for sure, but there are actual objective reasons too.

Chihiro - i dont see your child. Does he? I feel like mine was often at the forefront and still is. That is to whom it is safe to show affection and it would be therapeutic, IMO.

Just my impression on reading your post. Also, if he is talking to fonagy, can i touch you?

How do you mean? You can't see her here in this post or ever?

Omg una hahahahaaaa you make me laugh

Also, unrelated, I love this poem and this that goes along with it

Actually, chihiro, I think your therapist is right. It seems it is a common problem, the client just wants love, the therapist wants the client to grow. Recipe for possible disaster. But then so is the therapist who just gives the client that love.

That said, I still think he’s way too controlling.

I feel like there can be a compromise there--some love, while also focusing on growing and helping the client to be independent. It doesn't have to be one or the other, which is what your T seems to think, Chihiro. And also what Dr. T seemed to think for a long time, but he's come around in some ways.

Agreed. For a dude who is confident he can treat BPD, he sure does seem to be engaging in a lot of black-and-white thinking here.

I think i see your child when you are in a relationship. The child is not safe then.

But i think maybe you protect the child around your parents and your t. YourSELF is strongish at work - i feel like im talking about myself. But yourSELF lacks the strength of an inner beloved child.

The poem sounds to me like an adult hiding a child.

For me, i could almost SEE myself as i was as a child with my t. My smile felt the same, i could feel my innocence glowing - sorry for the corn! We didnt get on so well together as adults.

Excellent point!

I never said there couldn't be a compromise (eta: just to be clear, I think there can and should be). It's possible you went in seeing therapy as a place for reassurance and nurturing and you and Dr. T both came around a bit in your views. When you guys have a rupture, it often seems to be because both of you slipped back towards your original views of the purpose of therapy.

But I do think his basic point is correct. Therapy as a love hack only is generally not good therapy. I can situations where it can help (e.g., say being a caretaker for a dying family member), but not for long-term work on mental health issues. Therapists shouldn't allow it, but some clearly do because it is easier.

I see her child--it's right there at the end of her name.

This seems so profound.

I was thinking the same thing!

You guys are sweet! This is the person who has been hanging around me the most lately, that child who NOW feels loved.

Since ive been going to the dentist lately, i keep thinking about the time i had a 12-yr molar pulled. My mother made the girl down the street go with me to walk me home, since they would be putting me under. The receptionist goes, thats not good enough, im gonna call your mother to come pick you up. I remember telling her, good luck, my mother's gonna get mad at you! She goes, good luck to your mother!

Then of course my mother shows up and slaps me upside the head and swears she never told me not to call.

While that kid still exists, who ALSO exists is the kid who got her scarf wrapped around her neck and her backpack boosted on her back and sometimes her hair ruffled as she walked out the door. A thousand times. So you CAN go home again, but its kinda like Kelsey Grammer in that Star Trek TNG episode where he is stuck in a loop. It takes a loop. Hey tshirt idea!

And one more time it becomes clear that I have absolutely no idea what you all do or why you do what you do around therapists. Or what exhankster is talking about ever.

Your reply honestly made me laugh. Thank you for being you SD.

Inner child needs to be seen!

Miss Penelope is running around the house howling. She is nervous, I think, because a storm appears to be brewing and it is incredibly windy outside right now. Stormy (my big black cat) is outside as usual, nothing phases him! And Rascal is sleeping. The older cats are no stranger to storms, but I guess Penny still is...

Bah, I’m struggling to get my NaNo words in today. I managed 760 but the daily goal is 1667 to stay on track to finish by the end of the month. Part of the problem is that I’m not quite sure what to do next plot-wise, and part of the problem is that today has been Very Distracting.

British couchies, what is an airing cupboard?

it's starting to rain, knew it was coming! gonna be a wild storm unless the wind slows down.

Only British by association, but it’s a heated closet (where the water heater is) also used to dry linens and clothes in.

Hmmm, I just realized if I put in some shelves I could have an airing cupboard.

my garage could be big one in the summer!

Dragged myself across the 1667 finish line but it wasn't pretty! I'll have to spend some time thinking about what the heck I want to happen before I pick it back up tomorrow.

I thought that when i got my first nice apartment, but the landlady told me it was a fire hazard to put anything in with the water heater. I was disappointed, there was a lot of space in there. But it was also pretty dusty.

They already have Larry the No. 10 Cat, they get the airing cupboards too?