Shame

I have a great amount of shame inside of me. I'm not even exactly clear about where it comes from, there is some childhood stuff. But this shame is so strong. It interferes with all my relationships (which I keep to a minimum), but is really a problem in therapy.
I have things that I cannot get myself to talk about, they make me feel too "icky". The problem is that these are issues that I have to work through, asap.
Just wondering if anyone can relate. How can you let go of the shame long enough to work on things that the shame is a result of?
I love my t, I trust her as much as I can anyone, I don't feel like this is a problem with our relationship. It is a problem within me.
I do try to write things down and let her read them, but I even get all squeamish when she is readling them, to herself.
I know ppl are going to say you just have to work through it and make yourself talk, but how do you do that???

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complic8d said:
The problem is that these are issues that I have to work through, asap.

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I'm wondering why you feel like you need to work through them asap? Maybe you're pushing yourself too much before you're ready?

I am slowly, slowly learning in therapy not to bite off more than I can chew. For me, there is an ebb and flow to it (to borrow someone's phrase from another post!!) . We talk about something hard, or shameful, or whatever for a session or two, and then we back off and talk about other things - usually what's happening in the room, like my feelings about the therapy relationship, or how I feel after the hard, shameful disclosures, etc. And then I feel secure again, and we can go back to the hard stuff for a bit.

(((((((((((((((((( complic8d))))))))))))))))) Be gentle with yourself.

Shame stems from a sense of inadequacy or guilt.

It could be you're feeling shame, when you are really feeling embarrassed about the topics. Or maybe that's all you "should" be sensing, as shame implies wrong doing, something from a guilty standpoint.

You mention childhood stuff. No child has such control of their life that they need to feel shame or guilt about. Childhood is about learning and growing up. If the child's environment requires doing "icky" stuff that they had no control over, then no shame, nor guilt, is assigned. Children are not capable of controlling adults, or even stronger peers.

I say all this so you can remove the shame that perhaps family dynamics has built into your viewpoint.
A good T won't be embarrassed, as they are not personally involved, and training and experience has afforded them the opportunity to hear most everything imaginable.

I know it's tough for you, but when you're ready you can do this. Don't push, as that might set you farther back in your therapy process. But if you wish to go forward, dispense with the shame. There is nothing there for you.

Shame sucks!! Seriously, it is my least favorite of all feelings. I don't mind guilt so much, it says that I have done a bad thing and need to make it right. Shame says to me I am bad person (and then I feel that nothing I can do will make it right). Still, it is just a feeling.

My suggestion is to try to remember that feelings not all powerful. We don't choose our feelings, but we can choose whether or not to let them dictate how we think about ourselves. We don't choose our feelings, but we can choose our thoughts and our actions and these can help us to feel differently in the future.

If you have a spiritual grounding, this can also be very helpful with shame. Reach out for support from someone who understands God's grace.

Hope some of this is helpful!
- FT

((complic8d))

I also hold a lot of shame inside of me... And I don't believe it's possible to just say that it's not yours to own and get rid of it. I think it requires working through. It seems to me that the good news here is that you are working through already. Noticing your difficulty sharing and noticing the shame is there are two huge steps.

I really and truly understand how hard it is to discuss things with T. My guess is that you didn't have too many people validate what you were feeling when you were younger. At least that was my case. I do the same things as you. I write T letters and I write poetry and I read these things to him sometimes. I also have finally worked my way up to discussing certain things and saying them out loud. Yikes, it is hard, hard work.

I know you don't want to hear this but just keep on doing what you are doing. Take risks in therapy when you feel able to. Also, speak to T about these feelings. Maybe you two can come up with some strategies together to make you feel more comfortable.

(((complic8d))))

I've been there. When I can't talk about something because of shame it has been helpful to say I can't or don't want to talk about some thing(s).

Usually T will ask why I don't want to talk about whatever it is that's on my mind. Then we can talk about the shame. And, surprise we're doing good therapy work without even talking about the taboo subject!

When we've done enough good therapy work around the shame I'm ready to talk about whatever it was that seemed so shameful as to necessitate silence.

Sometimes this all happens in one session: Can't talk, too much shame--talk about shame--actually talk about subject about which I'm feeling shame

And, sometimes it takes months, years, decades? (I haven't gotten to decades of T yet, but am getting close. I'll let you know when I find out just how long it takes. )

~doubtful

Thanks for the replies. Sometimes it helps to know that I'm not the only one who feels these things, helps me know that I can work on it with t. I'm just having a really hard time right now and am afraid of falling apart in session and then, time's up.
I guess I'm just afraid to open up, been burned in the past, hard to trust completely.
Thanks again for taking the time to share with me.

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complic8d said:
I have a great amount of shame inside of me. I'm not even exactly clear about where it comes from, there is some childhood stuff. But this shame is so strong. It interferes with all my relationships (which I keep to a minimum), but is really a problem in therapy.
I have things that I cannot get myself to talk about, they make me feel too "icky". The problem is that these are issues that I have to work through, asap.
Just wondering if anyone can relate. How can you let go of the shame long enough to work on things that the shame is a result of?
I love my t, I trust her as much as I can anyone, I don't feel like this is a problem with our relationship. It is a problem within me.
I do try to write things down and let her read them, but I even get all squeamish when she is readling them, to herself.
I know ppl are going to say you just have to work through it and make yourself talk, but how do you do that???

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I think you should talk to your therapist about why you can't talk. Tell her it makes you feel icky, and ask her for some advice. You can explain your dilemma without going into the details. See what she has to say.

I don't know if trying to get over shame "asap" is really workable, partially because I think patience is a key factor in working through it. The moments I've been least ashamed are the moments I am most accepting, honest, and gentle, and impatience with trying to "solve" whatever it is that's bothering you seems to be at odds with those values. My advice would be to try and listen to yourself and accept where you are, what you've done, and how you feel without trying to change it right away. Just hear yourself out like you would a good friend. THEN decide what you need to hear (from yourself) and what actions you need to take to improve your situation.

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You can explain your dilemma without going into the details.

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My comment to this is ... good luck with that.

I've been trying to ease my shame, guilt, and other feeling without having to say or hear the "icky" stuff for the past 8 months. I think my T go tired of my avoidance and kind of forced me to into it last week.

I am not through this process yet so I can't judge the effectiveness of this treatment approach. What I can share at this point is....well I don't think my perspective would be helpful at this moment.

Chaotic,

I am sorry to hear that your therapist's words have caused you such distress. I hope that you have shared how you feel about it with your t?

Not everyone will push for more. It does take maturity for a therapist to trust the process and the client to reveal what needs to be revealed when he or she is ready. Your T needs to know that your trust of him/her has been so affected.

-ft

complic8d ,
Don't let my previous post deter you. Over the past few days I've been trying of flip my perspective and see the value in the experience I just had. Maybe for me this process has to abrupt and tortuous in order for me to move forward.

But trust in yourself and move at your own pace. If its any consolation, you not alone.

(((complic8d)))

Shame is an interesting subject for me. Many months ago I was asking my T for reading material -- anything he thought might help in my healing. The next week he handed me an article on Shame. My first reaction was 'I don't have shame'. My second 'how can I get rid of it'. It took me some time to even digest *what* Shame is.

A few ideas from the article that helped -- Shame is a normal feeling, but it is not something we talk about much in this society. Other cultures deal with shame more openly, but western society almost acts like it doesn't exist.

The writer gave an example where he was buying a book, and was shortchanged by $1. He knew he was owed that dollar, but something made him pause before he asked for the $1, and that was shame. Even though he had not made a mistake, he was embarrassed to ask for what was rightfully his. The root of that might be issues of self-worth, and the ability to speak up for one's needs.

Since I don't think it is possible to 'get rid of shame', I started to think about why shame was there -- what was its purpose? I had been viewing Shame as this dark boogeyman in the corner, something that scared me and something I wanted to avoid. Then I asked: 'What purpose does Shame have in my life?'

I realized Shame was trying to protect me. It was trying to protect me from being hurt further. It was being a faithful guard, and I thanked it for always watching out for me. I then let it know that I appreciated his help (for me it was a man), and he can take a rest for a little while while I am talking with my T. It was gradual, but just being aware of my Shame and accepting its presence has been very healing.

So, how do you view your relationship with Shame? What does Shame look like? How could Shame be trying to help you? If you were to write a letter to your Shame, what would it say?

I personified my shame, and tried to make peace. It is an ongoing process of awareness, but the big turning point for me was when I acknowledged my Shame, and thanked it for trying to protect me.

Maybe if you don't feel comfortable talking about the issues you feel shame about...you could talk about Shame itself.


Owl

Spotted Owl,

That's an awesome story of victory! I don't suppose you still have the citation info on that article? Thanks for sharing that,
-FT

SpottedOwl ... wow

SpottedOwl, I love how you have personified Shame and made peace with him and recognized his value in your life. I think this is very healing.

I did kind of a similar thing with Depression in my life. When I realized and appreciated the value of my depression, that is actually had a functional purpose with value, it actually made it easier for me to heal and come to terms with those years I was depressed.

Sunrise,

I'm curious... Would you mind sharing what the role/value of the depression was for you? Was it to help you mourn a loss or was it something else? I like the idea of learning its value.

Thanks!
-FT

FT, sunrise, Chaotic13 -- thank you for the affirmations!

The article was from Feb. 1992 of the Atlantic Monthly. I made a copy before I handed it back to my T, and have passed it on to several people I know already.

Is this it?
Karen, Robert. "Shame," The Atlantic Monthly 269 (2), 40-70 (Feb 1992)

It appears like this is benchmark article that is referenced a lot. Unfortunately my library's electronic holdings for this publication only go back only as far as 1995.

That is the article.
I looked for it online briefly, but I'll try again. If I find a link, I'll let you know.

Thanks for the reference!