Relationship Confusion

I have several questions about relationships, friendships, and love and hoped that someone on PsychCentral would be able to help me understand them better. Earlier, I’ve asked similar questions on other forums and Q&A websites, but unfortunately it seemed as though I frustrated a large number of users in doing so, an experience I hope I don’t repeat here .

My confusion about these matters is likely due to the experiences I have had in my life and having been diagnosed with Asperger’s Syndrome, a disorder known for issues with socializing and relationships.

It’s all so confusing to me! Makes me want to pull my hair out trying to make sense of it all . When I told this to my former autism program coordinator, she said this is a normal issue with those with Asperger’s, and then she said the chess theories with all the algebraic notations I am reading about would make her want to pull her hair out.

I don’t really know how to word it all, since the questions I have seem to be in a circle, but I will do the best I can. Maybe I will ask a question and then explain why I am asking it and the confusion I have around it.

1.) What is the purpose of friendship?
All of my life I have had very few to almost no friends whatsoever, and the ones that I have had I’ve been told weren’t really friends to me. For a long time I have believed that love could only exist between a girlfriend/wife and myself and that if I wanted to have someone that cared about me, listened to me, and respected me, I needed that kind of relationship. If someone has such a relationship with another, what purpose then does friendship serve? My last girlfriend was unbelievable! She as basically the first person that ever did respect, love, and listen to me. Over our relationship I didn’t talk to or see much of anyone other than her. Why talk to or hang out with someone else when I was happiest with her? To me friendship seems like this bonus gift on the side that is totally unnecessary and serves no real purpose. Using an analogy, it is like with my computers, cars, and cameras. I have a 24” custom-built iMac with 3.06Ghz, 1024GB hard drive, and 8GB of RAM, and then I have a little HP laptop that barely functions; I have a Kodak Easyhare camera that doesn’t turn on and a Canon DSLR with a 100mm USM Macro Lens, an 18-55mm lens, a low-angle tripod, and a set of extension tubes; and then I have an awesome Chrysler convertible and a minivan. Am I making sense? I don’t see the purpose in having a relationship and a friend…?

2.) What does it mean when a woman says that she loves you but not like that?
To expand on the poorly-worded and complicated question above, in 2011 I became much closer to my best friend whom happens to be an Internet friend that I hung out with in Montana because I began telling her, as well as my counselor, about my past history of abuse and overall started to show more of myself after 5 years of hiding from her. It’s weird to me because she does basically everything that my last girlfriend did, but we’re not in a relationship, and throws my entire understanding of relationships out of whack. She has said that she “loves me but not like that” and I have no idea what that means? If it is not the relationship kind of love, then what it is? And is not this love of a lower caliber than the one I am talking about in relationships? What is the difference between the two?

3.) What makes someone want to have sex/marriage/relationship with one person and not another?
Seems like an unusual question to others here but it doesn’t make sense to me. When I was discussing this with my counselor, she said she has friends that she would say she loves but that she wouldn’t ever want to marry, and I think why not? How is that decision made? What stops marriage from happening in such a situation? (Not explaining this well!) While reading in a book called The Complete Guide to Asperger’s Syndrome, the author, Tony Attwood, described that those with Asperger’s look at prospective partners as job applicants with a specific description of what they want - I can understand that. I want a woman whom I can talk to and listens to me, that doesn’t insult and yell at me, respects what is important to me, and is overall kind and nice. What else is needed? Passion? Well what is ‘passion’? So, basically, what are the ingredients for marriage and those kinds of relationships? As I said, if a woman talks to and listens to me, is kind, and if she takes interests in my interests (my ex-girlfriend went on bug hunts with me!), I can’t see what else is needed.

4.) How do married, loving couples interact?
I was chatting with my best friend (whom is also my life guru) about marriages and relationships in the future and my concerns about them. One of the things I said to her was that I am afraid of having a relationship because I am worried that a woman would force me to do things I don’t want to do. There are a lot of things I want to do, for example, in my life, such as travel around the world to mostly Middle Eastern and Central Asian nations, build a huge collection of tarantulas, and build my dream office, or as close to it as I can afford to. I’m also concerned about being forced to have children (and to solve that I am debating having a vasectomy done to end that there because I don’t ever want a child) and to do sexual things I am uncomfortable doing. My best friend said that I would definitely be able to keep tarantulas and do what is important to me and that I won’t ever be forced into doing something sexual that I don’t want to do, but is that true? How do married couples interact like this? I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a marriage before. All the marriages I have been around, according to my best friend, were abusive, although they seem quite normal to me. In my own family there has likely been at least one murder, several attempted murders, and everything is a power struggle with one member trying to force the other through coercion, threats, violence, whatever into submission. I have no idea how a loving, married couple would interact with each other?

Advice?

I'll try my best to answer these questions.

What is the purpose of friendship? Well, lets say you are not in a relationship -- a "love" relationship. But you have this person that you enjoy spending time with. You go to the movies, you talk all the time, etc. You can tell this person your inner-most secrets without fear of having them disclosed. BUT - you wouldn't even THINK of having a sexual relationship with this person because it's not THAT kind of relationship. It's more like a "brother-sister" relationship. You love each other as friends! And you can count on each other in a crisis to be there when needed. And even IF you're in a relationship with someone you can STILL have this friend. There are things that you might NEVER tell your girlfriend, but you WOULD tell your best friend. i have a friend like that that I've known since I was 4 years old!

What does it mean when a woman says she loves you but not like "that?" It means that she loves you as a FRIEND, but not as a lover. She wouldn't want to marry you, but she wants to keep you as a friend.

What makes someone want to have sex, etc? You have to be physically ATTRACTED to someone before bedding them. And before you marry someone, you must be sure that you want to spend the rest of your LIFE with this person --- what stops that from happening? Perhaps it's a person's personal habits. Perhaps it's a person's temperament. It could be a number of things. Passion is just lust -- that cannot sustain a marriage. Listening to one another is good -- but FRIENDS do that and not all friends get married, so it has to be more than that. There has to be DEEP LOVE, and that comes with time -- and sometimes it doesn't come at all.

How do married couples interact? Hopefully with love, patience, and understanding. Obviously you came from some dysfunction! What you describe is NOT the norm! I'll grant you that most families now are step-families, which is unfortunate. But even at that, one would hope that the patience and understanding (and love) would be there. NO ONE should be forced to do anything (sexually) that they do not want to do. That is abuse. And if you DON'T want to have children, just make that clear to your potential mate in the beginning. No problem! Make sure you know your mate VERY WELL before getting married so there are no surprises afterwards. Discuss all issues beforehand. As a rule, couples interact with love and respect.

I hope I've answered your questions satisfactorily. I'm sure others will chime in. Take care & God bless. Hugs, Lee

Hmm…I have to admit that I have no idea what you’re talking about. I read over your post a few times, and it is like, “What?” Honestly, it’s like a foreign language to me

Argh!!! Sometimes I feel like I am not built for relationships and that I am better off alone . It’s like music and English classes in school! I have no idea how people can play an instrument because all I see is squiggly lines. And don’t even get me started on metaphors and Shakespeare. I have no idea how beating around bushes or how one can throw one stone and hit two birds simultaneously is at all applicable to my life. I don’t beat bushes and don’t throw stones at birds .

I don’t know what a brother-sister relationship is like? I will never see my sister again from all the abused I’ve endured from her. We last talked to each other a few years ago when she was removed from the house by the police.

You talk about inner-secrets - what’s the point in dating someone if you won’t tell them you’re most inner secrets? If anything it is reversed - I trust my ex-girlfriend WAY more than my best friend. And if I wanted to spend time with someone, why wouldn’t I do that with a girlfriend? To me it seems like friendship is totally unnecessary, because there is more love and trust associated with a girlfriend. When I was dating and I had a crisis, I sought out my girlfriend; I told her all my secrets and said nothing to my best friend then; and if I wanted to see a movie, I saw it with my girlfriend.

So she wants me as a friend? Then am I not simply bonus on the side that doesn’t really serve any purpose? If she had a boyfriend then what purpose would I serve? Moreover, she has more than one best friend - she has three, myself among them. So, again, it’s like I have no purpose. It’s like if I died what difference would that make? I’m easily replaceable it seems. She has other best friends and will have a boyfriend in the future. So, again, it’s like I am a bonus on the side, not really important, but it’s nice to have me as a friend. Yet she seems to have such a high opinion of me, sending me cards and poems from the United States, and she says she loves me, but it is like, “What?” She has said she will always be here for me and that I have a “special place in her heart”? As far as I can deduce it wouldn’t make the slightest difference if I was dead or not to her other than her feelings.

And what makes a woman declare a man as a “brother” or a “friend” and one as a boyfriend? Is there something wrong with me? You say physical attraction - so I am too ugly, and what does that mean for less attractive individuals?

And why wouldn’t deep love come? And wouldn’t deep love imply a stronger love?

It’s like an endless circle! My best friend says that human relationships are not quantifiable and that love isn’t logical. Is that true? If it's not logical, how does one process it?

esd[;’es[wn42i9j8237br4-09ubg87yr38uhuby874 Ahh! So confusing! Maybe I am not built for this…? I occasionally feel like I am better off alone .

Ok ~ "inner-most secrets" -- Let's say that in the past you were promiscuous -- you wouldn't want your girlfriend or your prospective mate to know that, would you? Or let's say that you're engaged -- and you cheated. You wouldn't want your fiancee' to know that would you?? NO. So you would tell your "best friend" to get it off your chest! Your best friend hopefully wouldn't tell anyone!!! A best friend usually knows you better than anyone else -- maybe even better than your girlfriend, cause they've probably known you longer! You can "dis" your best friend, and they won't get mad but your girlfriend will! LOL You can have a fight with your best friend and they'll ALWAYS forgive you -- but your girlfriend might not. Your best friend will ALWAYS be there for you, but your girlfriend might not. If you lost your best friend thru death -- it would DESTROY you. You CANNOT replace a best friend. But you can ALWAYS get another girlfriend. You might say that you can always get another best friend -- but not like the one you lost -- they are FOREVER. So it WOULD make a difference if something happened to you! It would hurt like @#@# to someone who considers you a best friend!!!

A brother-sister relationship is like no other. There is a deep bond there -- a "blood" connection. They know the "secrets" of the family and they are tied by that. Most often they know each others secrets too, and they share that. If they're close in age, they played together growing up. They share memories of their childhood. The brother if older was the champion of the sister! If younger, she undoubtedly helped take 'care' of him. It's a strong bond.

There is nothing wrong with a man if the woman sees him as a "brother." She cares for him -- she just isn't "in love" with him. There's nothing WRONG with that. That doesn't mean he's ugly!! He could be an Adonis -- she just doesn't feel that attraction to him. That happens -- perhaps she likes skinny, wimpy guys. Who knows??? It does NOT reflect on the guy at ALL. He could STILL draw 100 other women -- just not that particular girl. She just wants him as a 'friend.'

"Deep, stronger love" sometimes just doesn't come because of a number of things, as I pointed out. Perhaps personalities don't mix, sometimes it just plain doesn't happen for no apparent reason. Both parties might WANT it to happen, but it just doesn't. You can't MAKE love happen -- it's either there or it isn't. It's true that love isn't logical. You can't really explain it.

I don't think anyone is better off alone. It WILL happen to you. Just don't ANALYZE it so much. Just let things happen naturally, and it WILL happen. Give it time. Don't be in too much of a hurry cause you can't hurry these things along. It will come in time, I promise. Try not to worry about it, ok? God bless. Hugs, Lee

1) Friendships exist because in a perfect world, that one person that you love and is your companion would be all you need. But this is not a perfect world. Other people help our minds grow. Different people have different prespectives on life. If you're a man, having friends that are men gives you a group of people who understands what being a man is. And same for women, having women friends get being a woman.

Humans are pack animals. We're like wolves, however, wolves are much much better at being a pack than humans because we cause our own drama. But humans are programed to require other people not just to talk to but also we need touch. For example, if a baby is fed and cleaned and clothed, given regular check-ups and kept physically healthy it will still die. Why? Because baby's need love. They need to be cuddled and hugged and kissed. They need to be played with and talked to. Babies need love or they die. The same is true of adults. Loneliness over time has physical effects and can wear your body down just like disease.

So, in a relationship you need your spouse/girlfriend/boyfriend. But you need friends, too. Where do you think the idea of family comes from?

And it's hard to make friends. Also some people put their friends in front of their spouse, this is the wrong thing, too.

2) When someone loves you, but not in that way, it means they care about you as a person and think of you like a family member. They don't want anything bad to happen to you, and like having you in their life. However, they don't want to have a romantic relationship with you or a physical relationship with you.

3) This is complex. People choose for different reasons. Some for love. Some for money. Some for shallow reasons like looks or lifestyle. The best reason to marry someone is because you love them romantically, consider them your best friend, have the same values, and are on the same page about important things like finances/having kids/etc.

4) If a woman is forcing you to do anything you don't want to, then she's not the right person for you. There are women who don't want kids. There are women who love to travel. You have to find someone who holds the same values as you. The best thing is to be honest and up front about these things. Don't marry out of desperation. LIke I said, marry someone that you not only love romantically but also consider your best friend.

It isn't easy to find someone like that. But the alternative is an unhappy marriage and then divorce.

Responses!

Leed:

Interesting perspective there on the inner secrets - why wouldn’t I want my relationship partner to know those things? I’ve always thought of relationships as basically the only place where I could be authentically , open-book me without needing to hide information about who I am or my past.

A few of those things seem plausible, though. My best friend does know more about me than my ex-girlfriend (although that wasn’t the case when I was in a relationship), and it seems that my best friend has remained talking to me for far longer than anyone else has. Girlfriend only lasted about a year - best friend has lasted 5 years.

Wow - I never had a relationship like that with my sister. She was barred from being around me by the police and we both have done horrible things to each other that almost ended in jail for both of us. I’m the younger brother and wasn’t cared for at all. I will do everything it takes to never see her again. Ever. She is the devil. Even my mother won’t be around her without a body guard and the police had to be present at my dad’s funeral to keep everyone safe .

It’s just when I think about it she says that I am such an awesome person and then says she doesn’t love me like that and the two seem incompatible to me? . Apparently I’m not that great it seems! Most women don’t like me, either. It’s so hard. Sometimes it feels like what is the point? . Might as well just be alone because that always seems to be the inevitable outcome . Currently I spend about 98% of my time alone in my office . Quite a sad life…

lol! I love the eek in that comment about over-analyzing . How can you be so sure that it will happen? . It just constantly seems like whenever I do anything with anyone I am shunned, ostracized, rejected, and whatnot. I’m socially challenged. And it is like, “What the heck is wrong with me?” .

dark_heart_x:

I am male. However I do not have male friends. I don’t associate with men. Honestly, no offense to males here, but I have a significant trust issue with men. Nobody in my life is male. And I don’t have friends at all unless through PsychCentral and email. Other than the Internet I am almost always alone . Haven’t been successful meeting others near me.

“Loneliness over time has physical effects and can wear your body down just like disease.” I have dealt with this everyday since a child! .

“Where do you think the idea of family comes from?” I have no idea . I hate being around my family and in a few years will hopefully have nothing to do with anyone related to me again. My ideal family has always been a loving girlfriend - that’s it.

What does it feel like to love someone romantically, though? How do you know if it is a romantic love? I find understanding all of this so weird! When I was in high school the first person I asked on a date was my teacher! As horrible as it might sound, I really don’t understand this stuff. I don’t know what romantic love is. I don’t know what friendship love is. It’s all so confusing!

Leed said that best friends and romance are different? You’ve said them to be the same?

Generally speaking I have always believed I would end up alone. Ever since a child I believed that I was unlovable, and it is a frequent feeling now, too.

I do suffer from the ‘disease’ of loneliness, though. Spend most of the day talking to myself and typing. I haven’t had a hug in years…literally. Everything I do I do alone. Don’t have any friends or anyone close to me to be with .

I just wanted to say I get where you're coming from. what might help is getting to know more people, making more friends. I think the balance is in favor of men right now, in terms of numbers, ie there are more available women than men, so that helps.

meeting more people, whether thru clubs or classes or whatever, will take it out of the realm of the theoretical and just make everything more real. you'll get REAL, FEELING answers to your questions. also, if you have a secure relationship, like with your best friend or your T, I think you will be less likely to see other people as possible partners too soon or whatever and scare them off, which was my problem.

You say you're constantly shunned, etc. Are you possibly a little "clingy" Do you hold on a little too much to friends & girlfriends -- perhaps for fear that they will leave you??? It's a common problem -- so you aren't "weird" or anything. But if you DO hang on a little too much, you have to learn to let go, and give them space. Otherwise they WILL take off and stay away.

And alot of us avoid our families -- many of us come from very dysfunctional families and they're toxic and unhealthy to be around! So we stay away as much as possible for our own good! That's why we're here!!! Cause we got so screwed up as children and brought it with us as adults!

I think you DO know what friendship is -- you said that your best friend knows you better than anyone else. Obviously you SHARE yourself with this person, and this person must share themselves with YOU. That's what friendship is -- a sharing of each other; trusting each other and being there for each other. But there's no romance/sex/involved. It a common respect for each other.

I don't think you're as confused as you think you are. Like I said, just don't analyze things. LOL Hugs, Lee

I'm just going to say that Leed is wrong.

Your wife should be the one that you tell your inner most secrets. If you're cheating on her, then she shouldn't be your wife.... You should indeed be honest if you were promiscuous. What if that promiscutity resulted in STDs or a child? That is something a wife needs to know.

A girlfriend may not always be there for you when a friend would. That's a sign that girl is wrong for you and shouldn't be your girlfriend or become your wife. But the girlfriend that becomes a wife should be 100% above all other people your best friend. "Bros before hoes" is only for those type of girls who won't be there for you and that you dump. This is where people are mixed up in our society. The idea that "friends will always be there but that girlfriend won't," is High School mentality. Yes, in junior high, high school, and even into college, that is a good rule of thumb. But as you become an adult you want an adult relationship with real meaning. Not fly by night. A marriage is so that two people support each other, uphold each other, defend each other, strengthen each other, etc. It isn't some casual relationship just for sex.

Society has become so messed up in this area. Divorce rates are so high because we see spouses as disposable. People marry for superficial reasons. They don't want to put in the work. Their wife gains 20 pounds and can't lose it, so she's not sexy enough and they run off with someone younger and skinnier. Her husband lost all his hair and has a beer gut, so she drops him to go with someone else. Men and women in the media treat each other like enemies and then people in life start doing it, too. It's horrible!

Friends are the people who come an go. Not your spouse. Friends are the people that disappear. You might find a "lifelong" friend, but that is very rare. Do you know the secret of those couples that last 60 years? They know friends come and go, but their marriage comes first. Marriage is work. True love is not a fairy tale. True love is waking up every morning and loving someone even if you're pissed off at them.

My dad is of the older generation. I can tell you that the day he was married he said to his friends, "I'm married now, it was nice knowing you guys." I am 100% serious. And they weren't mad. They understood. That's how it was. Your wife and kids came first, not your friends. Today it is backwards. Like my dad always said, and he was right, friends are nice. It's nice to go to a ball game or dinner or bowling league or whatever. But you go home to your family. They are what is important.

My mom was very social. She had a life long friend. She died so it was true. But did she ever go against my dad or disrespect him to hang out with her friend? No. Just like my dad said. It was nice for her to go skiing for a day or to go to an art showing or whatever fun thing with her friend. But at the end of the day, my dad was the person she came home to and he was her best friend. She was his best friend. And to this day 20 years later he misses her for that.

That's real marriage and that's what I would say the majority of marriages miss these days.

PS

Romantic love is you take the way you feel about your best friend in the world, and want to share your life, hopes, dreams, hurts, sorrows, fears, joys, triumphs, failures, goals, anger, peace, with them forever as well as a physical relationship. Describing how that feels is near impossible.