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#1
Feb 05, 2014, 03:24 PM
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Hi,
I’m new here and really in need of some advice/support/solutions to a depressing situation my (adult) siblings and I are currently going through with our parents. My mom wants more out of life, but isn’t telling my dad for fear he’ll think himself a failure. My dad is content–or he says he is–and under the impression that my mom is too. But, we all know she isn’t. I was with them both recently and heard her say (while my dad was in the room) that she didn’t want to move out of the (bad, and now desolate) neighborhood we grew up in, where they are homeowners. In the next breath, (while my dad was out of the room) she tells me that she would love to move some place else and have a nice (i.e., better) home but, she doesn’t really want to tell my dad that because, she doesn’t want him to think he’s a failure.   Some background: Growing up, my dad worked outside the home (self-employed/drywall business), while my mom stayed at home (stay at home wife/mom). This continued even after my siblings and I became adults, and all but one of us moved out. My mom is a very sweet, reserved woman (and more often than not submissive to my father, usually going along with what he says, thinks or feels). She doesn’t drive or have a license to drive, so in addition to finances she’s always been dependent on my dad for transportation just to get around to complete everyday errands. My dad is a complex, overbearing individual. He is very much a black-and-white thinker, often times trying to convince others to see things his way instead of accepting a difference in thought/opinion. He has a tendency to blame others for his problems and easily puts up a defensive wall, cutting family members off and out of his (and my moms) life for reasons that seem trivial. He can also be pretty closed-minded to change and new ideas that are different than his own. But overall, he’s my dad and I love him. He’s always been the “breadwinner”/ sole provider/leader of the family, supporting 5 children and a wife while remaining true to his values of being self-employed. Growing up, we lived humbly and well, even though we were technically “poor”. So, I understand the difficulty and confliction my mom is feeling. The Situation/Problem: My parents are both approaching 60 this year. They have no retirement or savings that I know of, and neither are working or looking for jobs. With my mom, I understand because she can’t really see that well. She’s currently going through a long and drawn out process (no health insurance) of having cataracts removed from her eyes. Not to mention, she hasn’t worked in over 30 years because she was at home, raising 5 kids! My dad has had high blood pressure for years, but isn’t disabled in any way. He insists that he makes enough (from contract jobs) to pay their bills, but my mom recently told me he hasn’t worked in months, and the only income they actually have is the cash my sister gives her to babysit my niece, which is only about a hundred dollars a week! That barely covers their bills, I’m sure. I know they have nothing to spend on nice things that my mom might want. I say “my mom”, because she told me recently that my dad only thinks money should be spent on paying bills. Not on things that they/she might want. And again, he told me he’s “content” and has all that he wants. Meanwhile, my mom has been hiding money from him (putting away a few dollars here and there from babysitting) just so she can save up and be able to buy herself something nice. My dad also believes that he could never earn enough money to cover all of their medical expenses (trips to the doctor/surgeries/medications, etc.). So, in order to have their healthcare covered by the county, he has to make under $20,000 a year. Lastly, my parent’s home (the one I grew up in) is falling into ruin, and my dad doesn’t seem to care, much less help. My mom wants and tries to keep a nice organized home, but can only do so much on her own. I’ve offered to help her and my sister has too, but she doesn’t really want us to. She’s embarrassed and ashamed of her home–even for her own adult children to come over and visit. Things don't work around the house, but my dad is doing nothing to fix them. My mom doesn’t have the skills/knowledge to fix them, but my dad does. He has worked in the drywall/carpentry business all his adult life and knows how to fix most things around a house. She’s talked to him about it and asked him to do certain things multiple times (over the course of months, sometimes years)–and they even purchased the tools necessary for him to fix stuff–but he continuously puts things off. Their range oven stopped working a while ago. Instead of fixing it, he bought a small electric oven to sit on the counter. Their car recently stopped working. Instead of fixing it or taking it to get fixed, he asks family members (mostly my siblings and I) to borrow their cars. There’s a leak in the kitchen sink. A bucket was put underneath. The ceiling light is out in the bathroom. A lamp is in there. The list goes on… Venting: In a lot of ways, I feel like my dad is in fact "failing" my mom! He is doing the least amount possible to scrape by! None of us want to tell him this though. My brother got into a huge argument with him (about something else), and ended up telling my dad to get a job and fix up his house. That was the last time they spoke. So, my sisters and I don’t want find ourselves in the same boat. We worry he might take what we say the wrong way (as he often does) even if we have a much more cordial and caring delivery than my brother had. We’ve never talked about difficult subjects/situations growing up, in our family. If there was a difficult situation, my dad always did most of the talking. Everyone else listened. It was either that, or the subject wasn’t talked about at all (like my dad’s parents passing on several years ago). So, it’s very hard–even as an adult–to just simply start this conversation. We can laugh and joke around with each other easily, but if there’s a serious conversation to be had, with dad…we’d rather not. I know it makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about it! I wish I could tell him: Go get a job, or find some steady contract work so you can better provide for and support mom (who has very much been dependent on you for the past 37 years). OR BETTER YET… be okay with mom finding something part-time, if she can, to help out (once her vision is restored)! Fix up and take better care of your home (or just sell it and move to a better neighborhood, you can rent a small apartment!) because, mom isn’t at all happy with you all’s current living conditions. Take your car to get fixed, if you’re not going to fix it right now. You need a vehicle to get around! To go to the grocery store, doctor’s offices, Laundromat! My sister (who has just moved out and finally starting to live her life) shouldn’t have to take moms clothes to the laundry to wash them. And, she shouldn’t have to take off work or make other arrangements, so you can borrow her car to take mom back and forth to the doctor. None of us should. This is saddening to us all! But, I can’t. I worry he will take offense and cut me off. Or worse, shut down and become really depressed. My sister and I already believe that’s something is going on with him. I think he may be depressed. How can your house be falling apart and you don’t “see” it, you don’t care enough to do anything about it??? Either way, my siblings and I–and I don’t know what my parent’s have talked about with each other about their situations but, probably my mom too–are at a complete lost. Bottom-line: My siblings and I all want more/better for our parents than they seem to want for themselves (happiness/a better home in a safe neighborhood/steady income). It’s frustrating and really sad, that even going to visit them feels depressing. They aren’t doing anything to help themselves. My mom isn’t telling my dad what she truly feels, and my dad doesn’t even seem aware of what’s going on around him, like he may be in denial, or depressed, or maybe suffering some type of mental illness. I can give some more examples of what makes me think this, but I’ve already wrote a book. If you read this far, thank you! Please help! Advice? Solutions? Support? |
 Anonymous100108, spoiledprince
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#2
Feb 06, 2014, 02:14 PM
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I'm so sorry you are going through this! And, I am impressed that you care so deeply for your parents but I think if you don't open the lines of communication with them, things will only deteriorate further. Are there social services in your area that might help with the home repairs? Maybe a local church? I don't have much advice, so I hope others here will respond and be able to help. Hugs and good luck!
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 30somethingINFJ
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#3
Feb 06, 2014, 02:22 PM
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(((hugs))) I don't know what to say that could help you, but I wanted to let you know I read your post and hope things work out with your family situation.
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| 30somethingINFJ
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#4
Feb 06, 2014, 03:19 PM
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It does sound like something is wrong with your father, like he's had a drastic personality change. I'm assuming that he used to take care of things around the house and has suddenly stopped.
Could you have a conversation with your mother, one that she wouldn't repeat to your father? She may have some ideas about what's wrong with him. Could you contact his doctor or arrange for him to see someone? Is it possible that he has some sort of injury that prevents him from working, but he doesn't want to admit it to anyone? What you and your siblings can do may be limited if your parents aren't interested in sorting out their own situation. They are who they are. You can't make your father get more work or make your mother more assertive, no matter how much better their lives would be  It's really a shame that your mother won't let you come over and help fix the place up. |
| 30somethingINFJ
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#5
Feb 06, 2014, 03:33 PM
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#6
Feb 06, 2014, 03:55 PM
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Yes, he used to better take care of things, but he was always slow-moving about it and often times procrastinating. Now, he's really procrastinating! I could talk to my mom without her relaying the conversation to my dad. Problem is, my dad is always around. They don't really leave home, so calling would be difficult, as I couldn't be sure that he's not in the next room listening in. And obviously, visiting her, he would be there. I don't believe my dad would ever see a therapist. He's...I don't know. I just know he wouldn't. I don't think he has any injuries that prevent him from working. You're absolutely right, in that my parents are who they are and there is a limitation to what my siblings and I, as their children, can do to help them. I just wish it didn't sting this much and make us feel so sad. |
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#7
Feb 06, 2014, 07:00 PM
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So what if your father gets mad. What's the worse thing that could happen. Silent treatment? Argument? He is a silent tyrant and controls each of you and your mother, unknowingly I'm sure, has enabled this his whole life to keep peace. 60 isn't that old. His disinterest in a home falling down around him is indicative of helplessness. Be it depression, stubbornness, what have you. He doesn't possess the power you give him. He may be scared to death but who would he vocalize that to? He's old school. I'm the man and I run things. Period. As mentioned above, does he go to the doctor regularly? Would talking to his doctor produce results if he confronted him? Does he have brothers or male friends who have any influence over him? If you would stop enabling him, and I mean this with no judgment, and not be available to drive them to appointments and such, might he then repair the car? If he was abusive you would then have the luxury of using the area of aging agency to intervene. In the interim, I would go to my mother's home, embrace her and tell her nothing on earth would be embarrassing about her, and help her. It may shame your father to act. Might not. But you would be helping her. Ideally, the family would stop tip toeing around this man and say what needs to be said. Easier said than done but it looks unavoidable down the road. Do they go to church? I'm thinking your father would behave in the presence of a pastor or any other authority figure.Your father may not go to therapy but it would do wonders for your mother to discuss this, especially someone local who knows what's available agency wise. It would get her out, socialize her and give her hope and a new perspective on her condition. And may even empower her to address these issues with your father who she continues to protect and shield from reality. These are just some thoughts. I grew up with a father just like that. I ignored him and took care of my mother. I'll betcha if she moved to an apartment he'd follow. There is housing for low income folks that is rather nice. It would be encouraging if she had that option.
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| 30somethingINFJ
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#8
Feb 07, 2014, 12:30 AM
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"Helplessness"...interesting! My sister suggested to go over on the weekends and help him fix up stuff around the house. Maybe then, he'll wake up. I think my parents should sell and move. The neighborhood is depressing. He goes to the doctor for his high blood pressure. Not sure how often. I have a feeling no doctor would/could produce results, no matter who contacted him or her. If confronted, he’d probably freak out on the doctor for meddling in his business. Out of 3 brothers, he only really talks to 1. But, he has no influence over my dad. He's younger and in a similar position (living in the same house, it’s 2 flat building), except my uncle works and has a running vehicle to get around (which he allows my dad to borrow, sometimes he even drives him around). I thought the same about not being available to drive my parents around (and did this very recently), but to no avail. Unless they really have to go somewhere, they just stay at home. If no one is available to drive them around or lend their car, they take public transportation. My dad says it’s too cold for him to fix the car outside (no garage, and it has been an extraordinarily rough winter so far), and he didn’t want to risk getting sick. But, it was months ago when he told me that he had all the parts to fix the car, and that he would in fact fix it. But, he didn’t, and I know there were at least a couple warm-ish days where he could have. You’re right. We do tend to hold back from saying what’s really on our minds to him. Nobody wants to confront him about any thing, and we can all be pretty passive-aggressive. What’s the worst that can happen? I don’t know. I feel like he would take offense and try and throw it back on us. That it’s somehow our fault his situation is the way it is. The worst that can happen…him not admitting he’s lazy, or deeply hurt/depressed about something(s), continuing to hold it inside and not changing or doing anything to change, but instead getting progressively worse and my mom continuing to “go along to get along”. They don’t attend church. My dad pretty much was “the church”, growing up. He wasn’t a pastor or anything related to a church, just read the Bible obsessively, on his own, and taught us about it. He would behave in the presence of a pastor or any other authority figure, but mostly likely would completely dismiss their words if they weren’t in line with his beliefs. Or, argue their thought/opinion as wrong, and his right. I would like to see my mom–and the entire family actually–in some form of therapy. She has no one to talk to except us, and my dad. No friends or family, except one sister who she hasn’t seen or spoken to in many years. She has told me about her desires to go back to school. But, in her voice I could tell she thinks it’s far “too late” for her, even though I assured her she can still do it, and that there are many past her age who indeed go to college everyday. It would be very hard to ignore my father and tend to my mom. Not saying you were suggesting this. But, the thought does seem easier–and possibly more beneficial–than talking to my dad about his neglectful ways and possible underlying deeper issues that may have brought them on. If she moved on her own, he would follow. I never see her doing that though. I think “being completely alone” is my dad's worst fear, and yet, he continues to push and drive family members away just being himself. I have a feeling he would try and talk my mom out of going to therapy, or back to school for that matter. |
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#9
Feb 07, 2014, 02:32 AM
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Just a thought here. Maybe your dad figures he has worked as the family breadwinner that he needs a break. After you mom has her eye surgery, could she get at least a part time job? That might decrease some of the pressure.
__________________
Nobody |
| 30somethingINFJ
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#10
Feb 07, 2014, 09:45 AM
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#11
Feb 07, 2014, 11:19 AM
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Again it boils down to your dad's control. If that doesn't change, nothing will. Someone has to step up and tell him he's out of control and take over and not be afraid to do it. As long as he doesn't put his hands on anyone it doesn't matter how he feels. He never cared about what he said. You could even take your mom and have her stay with you for a while. A girl's visit and see if her absence motivates him.
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| 30somethingINFJ
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#12
Feb 07, 2014, 12:12 PM
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I appreciate your advice, thank you. I'm dreading going forward because, I know I have to be the person. The one to confront him, to look out for and encourage my mom. It really, really sucks having to be "a parent" to your own parents! 
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#13
Feb 09, 2014, 12:04 PM
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I would *definitely* talk to your father's doctor. There are a lot of conditions that could be causing your father's apathy. The doctor would hopefully know how to phrase things. He's not going to say 'Oh, your daughter told me that you don't fix the house up.'
I don't think that you need to confront your father or that it will actually have much effect if you do. I would only insert myself in that situation if my mother asked me specifically to help convince my father to let her get a job or move or fix the light in the kitchen. I guess I am just thinking of personal experiences where these kinds of interventions have backfired. In one situation like that, we did organize a work day, where the whole family gathered to fix up the place. The husband tolerated it and seemed pleased by the results. I hope you have good results also if you do something similar. |
| 30somethingINFJ
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#14
Feb 10, 2014, 12:49 PM
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Thanks for sharing your experiences with this, and your advice. I can see it backfiring, anything I do really has that potential to. But, I feel like if I don't insert myself, nothing will change. My mom won't speak up, and my dad will continue to think everything is "fine". Their situation will continue to worsen, and my siblings and I will continue to feel bad. I will try talking to my mom first to get more information. She would know more of what's been going on with him, and would also have his doctor's information. |
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#15
Mar 01, 2014, 01:49 PM
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UPDATE:
So, things have gotten a little worse since I last posted. My mom called me, and my siblings, saying (that my dad told her to call, and that) they need to borrow money to pay some bills. I ended up telling her that I couldn't lend the money. Not sure what my siblings said but, none of us are really in the position to lend anyone money. I called back to talk to my dad because, at this point I'm super frustrated. I felt like he's asking us for money but he's not doing anything (that we know of) to support himself and mom, for a steady income. I have a right to step in and ask at this point, "well, what's going on", right??? So, I did. I called him up and asked what was going on. If he was looking for work or, had something lined up? And, as expected, he got on the defense, and put almost everything off on my mom. "Mom said this, and Mom said that". He said that she didn't want to be at home alone and wanted him to find something that he could do at home to make money. So, he's been "studying the lottery" for the last 5 years and plans to work a home-based lottery "business". But, they need money to pay their bills NOW and for the next 6 months...6 MONTHS!!! He assured me that he's still doing contractor jobs on the side, and would pay us back with money from that. Still he has nothing lined up that he could tell me about during our 4 hour conversation, so I'm left to believe all he has is what he makes from the lottery. He knew that I wasn't sold on the idea of the lottery, and told me that he felt insulted that I don't trust his judgement, as far as risks and business go, since he's been in business for himself all my 30-something yrs. that I've known him and I've yet to see him fail. He was certain – even though I never said a word about it – that I thought he'd fail. I tried suggesting – a couple times – that he could find something part-time, so he's not gone all day from mom and they could at least have something steady coming in, while he's doing the lottery thing. And he gave me all kinds of excuses as to why a job wouldn't work. And he asked me, who would hire him with his heart condition and blah, blah, blah... He said he felt insulted. That we shouldn't have to know "all his business" because, if he needed a loan from us, he wouldn't ask us "all our business" (what the money was for, our financial & work plans, etc.), he would just give us the money if he had it to give. I told him to try and see it from our point of view. We're your kids. We know you're not working or trying to do anything job-wise to support yourself, but you're asking US for money to pay your bills?!? You have to be doing SOMETHING to help yourself first, and we don't see that. His response was that he doesn't want to ask us for money, but my mom thought it was a good idea. HUH? WHAT?! I told him, Mom told me, personally, that she didn't want to call and ask us for money, but YOU (Dad) thought it was perfectly fine. So, who's telling tales?! My dad says it was all moms idea, and she says it was his. I told him there is a lot of miscommunication going on. Mom tells me one thing. And, you say another. And then, he goes off on a tangent about my mom being an orphan and that she feels embarrassed talking about this money situation to her kids so she holds some things back from us that she'd otherwise tell him. I feel like he’s not telling the whole truth, and putting things off on my mom so he can avoid taking responsibility. Because of course, he’s never wrong. I don't know what else to say here...SIGH Oh, I also talked to him about the house and how things are falling apart. That is where he and my mom are actually on the same page. I offered to help him fix the house (and the car) but, he – like my mom – doesn't want me to help them fix up the place. He said things aren't up to snuff right now because him and my mom were working on things together around the house until she started having trouble with her eyes. When she gets better, he said they'd resume their projects together. And, he didn't think it a good idea to work on the car alone either because, he’d have to jack the car up and get under it to fix it. He'd asked my uncle for help with that, but they had a few scheduling conflicts that prevented it from getting done. I told him several times that I worried about them and that I – as well as my siblings –want them to be well, and happy, and have all that they want in life. He assured me he that he and mom weren’t miserable, like I think they are. He told me that he was indeed happy with his life. That he may not be living how I want him to live and that's why I'm upset. While that's true, I still have a hard time believing him. He told me that unless my mom and uncle want to move, he is fine staying in that house for the rest of his days. Then, I had to get off the phone. But, when we got back on he told me he talked to my mom, and she told him that she would want to move and get another building. So, he says that is a plan for them. So, I guess something good came of the conversation (my mom telling him how she really feels)...it was an extremely hard conversation...I cried several times and thought I heard him choke up a couple times too. Problem is, still, he’s not interested in working outside home and insistent on borrowing money right now from me, and my siblings. He repeatedly told me about setbacks and contractor jobs that he had planned that fell through. I told him that I understand that but, what are you going to do now and going forward? He assured me that he is still doing contract jobs and would pay us back with money from that. Not lottery money. He wants me to trust and have faith in him, but I don’t know… I feel like giving him any money would help my parents financially, but in the long run, it wouldn’t really help them. I’m at a lost, again. |
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