[WrkNPrgress]

How often do you sense your SO talking down to you, being rude, or dismissive? I feel like I'm noticing it more and more- but maybe I'm being to overreactive? I don't know.

MY SO and I are in couple counseling and it's been very good for us. I initiated the process because our fights were getting verbally abusive. My SO is very reactive, and highly expressive - i.e. she yells and escalates quickly. I didn't think I was a yelling person. I would like to think I'm rational, patient and try to be understanding but it had reached a point where I would explode pretty quickly.

I could feel becoming someone I didn't like.

I have my own therapist and we talk about my codependency issues affecting things. I can be passive aggressive. That doesn't help but I'm getting better at seeing, stating and taking care of my own needs. I want my partner to do the same.

My partner has made progress in recognizing the 'red zone' when it happens and we are able to de-escalate our fights quicker now. Sometimes we can cut them off at the pass. So that's good, but I have some lingering doubts and fears.

But.... I often hear her insulting me some small way, almost daily. Especially when she's tired or stressed (which is often.) She acts irritated, annoyed, etc. I get "the attitude". It can often feel like it's from out of nowhere.

In writing this, I realize she is being passive aggressive. She questions what I'm doing instead of asking for what she needs. She does this with an insulting condescending tone. For example, the other day she was waiting for me to finish what I was doing to start a movie. I was also waiting for her to finish what she was doing. We both were waiting for the other. Simple mistake, but instead of just asking if I was ready, she got irritated, accused me of avoiding our time and asked, "I guess you didn't really want to watch the movie?" — putting me on the defensive. She also implied that what I was doing was meaningless and wrong (I was reading online articles on my computer.)

In the grocery store, When I reach for (item X), she asks "What are you doing? I thought we are getting (item Y!)" Again, in a condescending and not really asking- but insulting tone. So much that I feel embarrassed and wrong- over a stupid grocery item.

Her catch phrases are, "What is wrong with you?" and "What are you doing?"

I call these 'micro-bullies' That's what it feels like. They're hard to recount accurately here— and that's what's crazy making. They're small brief comments, usually made in way that assumes I'm making some mistake instead of asking for clarification or making a request. They're too small to point out in the moment, and ten minutes later she'll forget all about them and pretend as if nothing is wrong.

Meanwhile- I'm left feeling small and defensive.

I'm not sure how to bring this up in counseling without 'rail-roading' her because she's often in denial that this happens or is a thing. I guess I'll need to just say what I'm feeling but.. ugh I don't want another fight.

[Bill3]

They're too small to point out in the moment

They may be small in length but they are quite consequential for you.

[hvert]

I don't think they are too small to point out in the moment. It's the kind of thing that the other person may not even be aware of while they are doing it, because it's such a pattern. I have found, as a giver and receiver of this kind of communication, that it's much better to point it out immediately and consistently.

[Mid-Life-Larry]

Hi Wrkn, It sounds like you are trying to make sense of your SO's behavior. Let me describe mine: Believe it or not, I know the EXACT tone you describe and those condescending comments like the back of my hand. I've been living with them for over 20 years (we are finally getting help recently).
My wife talks like your SO... and I think it has to do with her childhood: She has an overbearing and controlling mother. Her childhood was without compliments or positive re-enforcement. Even to this day (we are almost 50), her mom plays serious head-games by discounting her daughters emotions and feelings. -- it's very sad. It took me a long time, but I can easily see how my wife's upbringing shaped her today.

I'm glad you guys are seeing a therapist now, before going further.
Good luck with it and hope you get what you want/need!!!

[maidenvoyage1]

This is a VERY DIFFICULT road....the best thing to do when the triggers are hit and the fighting starts, when she starts to devalue, DISENGAGE!! She cannot fight with anyone if there's no one there to fight with. Hand her a mirror, tell her to drop the smoking gun, and have a long talk with the reflection in this shiny little window thing, while you LEAVE THE ROOM (this can be INCREDIBLY difficult to train yourself to do, and will probably make her very angry the first few times she's handed the mirror, but...) and go find a place to sit down and decompress. She will come to you when she's cooled off, even if it takes a few days. Always know she'll cool off. Went through 2 years of this recently, and if I'd only known what BPD was, I could have likely saved the relationship BEFORE it was lost. At least we've salvaged a friendship out of it, and I'm trying to help him find himself as best I can. This is NOT an easy one....staying with someone who devalues you on a daily basis, is crushing; even to the most hardened hearts.

[lizardlady]

WrkNPrgress, the thing to remember is that passive-aggressive behavior is at it's core aggressive behavior. I was married to a master of passive-aggressive behavior. It wears a person down, which is the whole point. Things are not "too small" if they hurt you.

You asked how to address the problem in couples counseling. What if you mentioned that you'd noticed a trend in the way you communicate and ask if it can be discussed?

[Jan1212]

My whole family "practices" passive aggressiveness, even me and I feel extremely guilty afterwards, you're right, sometimes it just comes out, my sister does it all the time, and she knows what it is and accuses my mom of doing it. After "realizing" what I was doing, I'm more aware of the whole situation and arguments. Idk if what I'm doing is ideal, but I change the subject and say "I feel _." Or if it's real bad, I go to another room, or drive to the store. I feel resentful of people and get hurt easily, I am sensitive, so I get defensive. It's ok to disagree but passive aggressiveness is way up there

[WrkNPrgress]

Thanks everyone. I wrote this on a bad day. :/

I am trying to be more aware of my own feelings, speaking up when it happens while also not getting hooked by it all. I can say that my partner is more aware and open to reflection since we've been in counseling but when she's having a bad day— it doesn't seem like anything can stop that train.

She no longer asks "WHAT is wrong with you?" (I told her a couple of times, "nothing is wrong with me, and I don't want to hear that question anymore!" She has relented) but she will still default to some form of questioning/emphasizing what I'm doing wrong instead of just stating what she wants or what she is irritated by.

The hard part of course, is that I know she loves me. She is reading some books on mindfulness, trying to get her own anger and self-loathing issues in control. We are getting better overall.

I think the trick for, me again, is not getting sucked in and/or going there myself when it happens.

It's like we patched a big hole in the roof but there are still small drips seeping through. The little leaks are no less important but can be that much harder to track down the source.

[maidenvoyage1]

My ex used to always say, (still does at times, and we've been done for 7 months) "I'm wary of you, I don't know what you're up to". It's like, 'okay then, WHY ARE YOU EVEN HERE??' I have no ulterior motives, if I want something from him, I'll just out with it. But he turns everything around on me (or used to, I'm wise to it now) by saying that one phrase...which would make me believe everything was MY fault, that I was the one of which HE should be wary...when it was always the other way around; his tactic just worked. Key word: WORKED (past tense) Now, when he says this, I just say, 'well, there's the door if you're so wary...use it'. He never does.

[I'm Worth It]

Originally Posted by WrkNPrgress

How often do you sense your SO talking down to you, being rude, or dismissive? I feel like I'm noticing it more and more- but maybe I'm being to overreactive? I don't know.

MY SO and I are in couple counseling and it's been very good for us. I initiated the process because our fights were getting verbally abusive. My SO is very reactive, and highly expressive - i.e. she yells and escalates quickly. I didn't think I was a yelling person. I would like to think I'm rational, patient and try to be understanding but it had reached a point where I would explode pretty quickly.

I could feel becoming someone I didn't like.

I have my own therapist and we talk about my codependency issues affecting things. I can be passive aggressive. That doesn't help but I'm getting better at seeing, stating and taking care of my own needs. I want my partner to do the same.

My partner has made progress in recognizing the 'red zone' when it happens and we are able to de-escalate our fights quicker now. Sometimes we can cut them off at the pass. So that's good, but I have some lingering doubts and fears.

But.... I often hear her insulting me some small way, almost daily. Especially when she's tired or stressed (which is often.) She acts irritated, annoyed, etc. I get "the attitude". It can often feel like it's from out of nowhere.

In writing this, I realize she is being passive aggressive. She questions what I'm doing instead of asking for what she needs. She does this with an insulting condescending tone. For example, the other day she was waiting for me to finish what I was doing to start a movie. I was also waiting for her to finish what she was doing. We both were waiting for the other. Simple mistake, but instead of just asking if I was ready, she got irritated, accused me of avoiding our time and asked, "I guess you didn't really want to watch the movie?" — putting me on the defensive. She also implied that what I was doing was meaningless and wrong (I was reading online articles on my computer.)

In the grocery store, When I reach for (item X), she asks "What are you doing? I thought we are getting (item Y!)" Again, in a condescending and not really asking- but insulting tone. So much that I feel embarrassed and wrong- over a stupid grocery item.

Her catch phrases are, "What is wrong with you?" and "What are you doing?"

I call these 'micro-bullies' That's what it feels like. They're hard to recount accurately here— and that's what's crazy making. They're small brief comments, usually made in way that assumes I'm making some mistake instead of asking for clarification or making a request. They're too small to point out in the moment, and ten minutes later she'll forget all about them and pretend as if nothing is wrong.

Meanwhile- I'm left feeling small and defensive.

I'm not sure how to bring this up in counseling without 'rail-roading' her because she's often in denial that this happens or is a thing. I guess I'll need to just say what I'm feeling but.. ugh I don't want another fight.

It's counseling, you don't have to be afraid to say how you are feeling there. And, it may be a good opportunity for the counselor to observe first-hand how she relates to you when "provoked". . . And, before you leave the session you explain to your girlfriend that whatever has been said during the session, stays in the session and that when you are heading home and get home, that the discussion does not continue. You leave it at the counselor's office.

[divine1966]

This is old thread. From January. OP hasn't been on this thread for 7 months.

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