I'm worried about myself, my boyfriend, and my relationship. I'm not quite sure how I should understand all this. Not only that, but my boyfriend is not like anyone I've known well before.

My boyfriend is extremely quiet, and I first assumed this relationship would be not good for me. He didn't show any interest in knowing my family, showed very little in knowing my friends, and he had great difficulty showing me that he was interested in knowing me. We carried along initially by our similar personality and interests. We did have good conversations, felt very at ease around each other, and I liked his good moral values, hardworking nature, and what seemed to be strong empathy. However, his quietness around me and slow return of messages had me worried.

I eventually learned from the people who knew him, and also his family, that he was intensely quiet and kind of rude. He acted much better with me, and I was told that he definitely loved me, and that he never acted this way with anyone else before. Obviously I was touched and many of my fears decreased. I felt very happy for proof that what I thought I saw wasn't just a fantasy. He even told me a few times himself that he felt this way.

However, he still acts very aloof much of the time except for when we're alone and hanging out together. My worries occasionally flair up to a point that I think he really doesn't love me. For example, he leaves a lot on my shoulders, and I often have to ask for help from him. I usually take care of everything from bills to shopping to cleaning. He does honestly help out sometimes, but it worries me that I have to complain first. At least he pays his part for things. Sometimes I do most of the paying because I always tend to do that. I'm the type who likes to make things easier on people. He definitely isn't your "typical" boyfriend, though. He doesn't buy random gifts of affection or do anything kind of cheesy to express his love. I don't mind. I very occasionally do those things, though.

I don't really mind all of this. I've complained to him, and had a few deep, emotional talks where I admitted that I sometimes don't think he cares about me. He's usually very saddened by this and we talk it all out. He has a good, logical way of not assuming too much and not just saying he does care and I have to believe him. He's really good at hearing me out, but he has a great amount of difficulty knowing what to say and gets frustrated with himself.

After our talks, he usually does make noticeable changes in helping me out more.

One way he shows affection is cuddling up with me pretty much daily. That's his only way, really, of showing affection daily. Sometimes we'll have a good conversation when we're alone and make a lot of jokes.

He spends a lot of time alone. He'll lock himself away for hours, which I always thought was okay. Sometimes I get lonely knowing he's in the same building as me (we live together) but I don't get to see him. I can knock on his door and talk a bit, but usually he spends most of the day alone. If I want to go to a concert or something, he always says no when I ask if he wants to come along. He doesn't like crowds, but I feel a bit bad he doesn't go with me. At least he tends to go with me to some places like malls, even if he really doesn't like it.

How would other people see this relationship? I'd just like some perspective. He's definitely very quiet and doesn't show a lot of love, except for cuddling. Sometimes he acts outright uncaring about me when we're out in public. He won't say a word and act a bit rude, even a bit passive aggressive. It's gets some pent-up feelings of unhappiness from me.

[divine1966]

I am sorry fir you struggle

. I have read your post twice trying to understand why are you with this man. Honestly I can't find one attractive appealing thing about him. It sounds like living with a bad roommate.

Can you make a list of pro and con living with this guy? And see if you have any pros. I couldn't find any

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Thanks, Divine. I'm really glad the problem isn't in my head. My boyfriend acts confused as to why there's a problem!

I guess part of it is probably loneliness. I have a very hard time connecting with others and usually don't have friends. I've been that way since I was a child.

I guess another part is because my parents were very abusive towards each other, and I thought since I and my boyfriend didn't fight, we must have a great relationship.

I do remember once when we were hanging around his friend, let's call him "A," A was watching how Matt and I interacted and just didn't seem too pleased. At one point he muttered out loud, "****ing miracle," and was telling Matt he should be helping me with this or that or to "be a gentleman." It made me a bit sad to see that. His friend has actually been in a serious relationship for a lot longer than us and always seemed to care about his girlfriend way more than my boyfriend cares about me.

How should a relationship be? I thought this was just normal after almost 2 years together.

If we do break up, I will miss the friendly banter and good times.

After thinking about it, the hardest part would be telling him I want to break up. He'll be so sad. I never want to put someone I love through that. But I will if I have to.

[QTNurse]

I feel heartbroken for you. My story is similar. It looks like you have an Extreme Narcissist on your hands.

I just recently wrote an email to an author of a book out of desperation. If you want to know you are not by yourself. Grab a seat, get comfortable. Let me take you on my recent journey...

I believe that when you first start a relationship you should first be "friends". I fell in love with my "friend". I knew him externally since 2006. I finally mustered up the courage to have an intimate relationship with this person this July 08, 2015. I am an extrovert and he is an introvert. He labels me as a narcissist and put blame on me for the ending of our relationship. I have been accused of being controlling and jealous. I suppose one is jealous when they are trying to gain approval from their partner all the time. I can't just start there, I need to give you more "meat and potatoes".

We started dating shortly after he had a gathering at his house of coworkers. Yes, we worked together. I know it is not favorable to date someone you work with because when there is conflict, it is felt all over. We started dating about 3 weeks later. I felt that we handled it well though. We flirted quite a bit. We worked as nurses and was working in the same unit. We could sit near each other and send flirty texts to one another. I admit I was the aggressor and he was shy like. He didn't initiate much. I had this fake facade of myself that I wanted people to see me as a "man manipulator," a "flirt," "a player," "dominatrix"..., etc. I never let anyone know that I desired to find true love. I was hiding behind this fake exterior. So this is the person he thought he knew. Already at the start of the relationship I was crying and sobbing. He told me that he couldn't trust me. It was then that I was driven to prove myself to him. I always had a crush on "Bert". He was so beautiful and sexy to me. I just knew that once I was with him, that when I gave myself to him, I would be complete with my search. I knew he was the one for me. I would be totally honest, loyal, and faithful to him. I am making this decision with my whole being. And I knew that I had to win him over. I had to show him that this person he thought he knew was not the real me.

I had to make my move on him a few month before we started dating because I had heard that he had recently walked a nurse to her car. I thought he was not emotionally available. That was my chance to let him know I was in love with his being. I was in love with my "friend". Things took off and I didn't hold back. And now I am heart broken today. Wondering what happened to my "friend"?

I told him about a poem I read:
somewhere i have never travelled, gladly beyond
E. E. Cummings

He is not into poetry so I know he wouldn't understand that he unpeeled me pedal by pedal. He opened me up to love. It was an amazing eye opening experience for me. I felt alive at the beginning. But then I began to lose myself. I began to notice that I was not "loving" myself as much.

Why did I try to date my "friend"? Why did I lose him? What happened to our trust? What happened to our communication?

We started dating and it was awesome. I felt close to him. I knew he had issues with trust. He hasn't had many long termed relationships. I've heard stories of past relationships that didn't work out. There was one I knew he would have married when he was about 20 years old. He went away to work out of state, and she was to come meet him but she began seeing someone else. They later had an affair while she was married. But they still didn't work out after a few attempts. He lost his dad to suicide. I don't know all the particulars but I knew I wasn't dealing with a stable person. I emailed one of his sisters and she said she was sorry he hurt me and told me that there is a reason why his is almost 50 and not married.

Even though I have told you little of his history, I can't understand what happened to our friendship. We were friends first. I understand that our relationship is lost but why are people so insensitive?

I am 45 and he just made 49 July 31. He has never been married. I was married for 7 years and divorced now for 10 years. He has no children. I have 2 boys. I have one living with me at 14 years old and a 21 year old away at college about to graduate.

I have just recently be dumped by a boyfriend that I have dated for a year. I have been knowing this person as a friend since 2006. I was in fantasy with this person. I thought I knew this person. I admit I had issues of competition and jealously. He lives 40 minutes away. I would travel to see him often. I would spend the night. I was in school and I would sacrifice my studies for him. I sacrificed my household chores, I would buy him things, I would write letters, give him cards, and I even got his name tattooed on my hip. I had been accused of narcissism. I would truly accept it if I truly felt that way. I wasn't love bombing him, I was loving him with all that made me a woman. I was praying to GOD for his help. My latest taboo was to get pastoral care and read tarot cards for guidance.

He had problems with how I acted at work. I was told many times that he felt I didn't want him to talk to his coworkers at work. Our relationship was a "friendship" with benefits. I understand now that we weren't dating. If we were officially dating then he would have respected "personal space" at work. When he had free time at work, he didn't reach out to me. He'd rather talk with others at work (females). Really? He lived 40 minutes away and we finally got a chance to see each other at work to give a little attention when time allowed us to. We work every Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. So I looked forward to seeing him. As we dated, I felt so isolated and abandoned when we worked. Then it became a big deal to him because I mentioned it and when I mentioned it, it became a big conflict. Then I just felt that they more I said something, the more it irritated him. Then it was like he avoided me more. Then I felt that with him working being the only male nurse, he liked being needed by others. He made a comment one day probably by accident that he found a conversation with "someone else" he was conversing with more interesting. I felt that! So then it became a big deal that he focused on that I wouldn't let him talk to his coworkers at work. If you make it a big deal, then maybe it is a big deal. I then developed a problem with it and he complained about it all the time. There was a big trust issue. He would communicate with this ex girlfriend that he was in love with that he almost married. He would talk to her while seeing me. I felt the threat because I feel that she had a hold on him. I contacted her on Facebook and questioned her involvement with him. Of course she knows the hold she has on him. She was at that time engaged to be married, and now married. But it was that one time before work we were sitting in my car before work and his phone rang, it was her! He silenced it! I wondered why? If I had nothing to worry about, why did he silence the call? His comeback was because he didn't want to have to answer for it. He never wanted to answer for anything.

Another big thing that led to our "breakup" was he sleep schedule. He would alway complain that he doesn't get enough sleep. He takes medication to sleep. I understand that he needed to sleep when he felt sleep coming on. But many times I felt that he took medication to escape. I would be in limbo every morning waiting to hear from him. I needed to know what mood he was going to be in. I felt that he would wake up one morning and end things with me. I was putting all my emotional self into this relationship and I knew he didn't feel the same way about me. I was walking on eggshells. Then because I didn't honor his sleep schedule, then he said I began to "treat him like a child". I wouldn't let him go to sleep when he wanted. The morning he broke up with me it was that he woke up in a funky mood. He first said that he wanted to get up and get out of the house, then he said he wanted to go back to sleep. I asked if he was okay and I started prying. I wanted to know if he was in a bad mood because of me. He said no. I replayed this day over and over in my head because I should've let him sleep. We would still be together. But would that necessarily be a good thing? He always had this thing with putting his phone on do not disturb when he didn't want to talk. He talked to me when he wanted. He never really listened to my feelings. I cared so much about his feelings and his trust issues that I didn't not socialize as much and I didn't want to get "caught" talking to the opposite sex. I let him track me on "Find Friends" and "Life 360" on our phones. He would track me but rarely let me track him. I felt that I was doing everything to gain his trust. I love him! That's what you do right? I lost myself in all this. I stopped loving myself. I loved this "whatever relationship" more! I started getting verbally abused with being called narcissist, being manipulative, controlling, and exhibiting morbid jealousy.

Back to that day he broke up with me; the day I began to grieve. That day he went to sleep after giving me mixed emotional messages. I felt that I needed to show my support being his girlfriend. I really didn't want him to be sulking over there thinking that I didn't care. I could have let him go to sleep and deal with things himself. I should not have tried to help. I became annoying to him. I called him. I thought he was just saying he was sleeping to avoid me, so I gave it a little time. I tried to call back and his phone when straight to voicemail. I felt unable to help him and be there for him. I began with leaving not so favorable voicemails. It was then he went into is shell. He talked to me later and was just fed up with everything. There are no specifics for the breakup. He just labels the reason being my narcissistic and controlling attitude. I admit I wasn't perfect. He has googled and diagnosed me. I have taken narcissistic quizzes for him. I have watched many youtube videos he has emailed me. I was taking my criticism like a champ! I was emotional and passionate and I fell in love hard. I picked this man to love for the rest of my life. I'm hard on myself because now feel like I have wasted time. I know it takes 2 to have a relationship with but when you find love, you try hard to nourish it. I knew he had never had love like me before. I wanted to show him that he was worth it. That same day, I told him that I was heading to his house. I told him that I wanted use to talk face to face. If he didn't feel anything, then we could go our separate ways. He was against me going because he wanted to go into his shell. I told him I was on my way and he said, "See you when you get here".

I didn't call on my 40 minute route. I just pulled up to his house. I texted I was there, and he usually raises the garage door but it didn't go up but I didn't think anything of it. I got out of my car all hopeful of us communicating in person. I rang the doorbell. I waited. I knocked on the door. I listened closely because I thought the doorbell wasn't ringing inside his house. Then I heard the doorbell was ringing. I could hear it outside the door. I stood there. I reached for my phone and saw my messages were a different color which told me he blocked my texts. I went to call and my calls went straight to voicemail. I felt the choke around my neck. He had already unfriended me on Facebook. I don't know why being unfriended hurts. Then after we conversed on Facebook messenger he has since blocked me there too! Then I blasted everything on Facebook when he closed communication off from me. I wanted to reach out to anyone who would listen. I didn't care if we shared the same friends in our circle. That truly bothered him that I "blasted" him in front of our mutual friends. He didn't want people to know how he was when in an intimate relationship. Then I started emailing him by regular, so that is how we have been conversing. Just last week, I've sent him balloons, flowers, and begged for his forgiveness. I was willing to sell my soul to the devil to get him back.

Then I started reaching out to therapist and receiving pastoral counseling. I told "B" that I am receiving therapy as he suggests but he is finding out that narcissism is not my diagnosis. He tells me I need to find another therapist! I guess I have to find the therapist that labels me a narcissist! (I'm laughing) I exhibit codependency and a love addict experiencing emotional manipulation by a man not wanting to admit that he is the true narcissist. I was the friend trying to become more than a friend. I am being punished with abandonment and the more I give him attention by being apart, I am still feeding his ego. I'm having a hard time losing the friendship. It has been since July14th I've been settling for any form of communication I can get from him. He says we need to continue to communicate by email until he is ready to talk on the phone. I know that what we have is not a healthy form of communication. It like I am there for him but I'm getting nothing.

I have been in a fake relationship for a year. Keep in mind that I have been having a crush on this guy for 10 years. Now I realized that I was in a relationship with a friend. Now I am accepting that I wasn't in a true relationship and I am having a hard time losing someone I called a friend for so many years. I am having a hard time losing everything; mostly the friendship.

Hi QTNurse. I was very sad to read your story. Although our situations are different, I recognize that feeling of unrequited love that I feel. It sounds like you've been through a lot of emotional turmoil. I really hope, if you haven't already, that you post your story in the forums so you can get support for it like I am. I don't want your story to get hidden away here.

My boyfriend and I are pretty young and live together. Sadly, moving in together didn't help anything. I've known him for maybe 3 years now.

Thanks so much for sharing. No matter what I do, I just have to accept that my boyfriend won't show any real love for me. He also has talked to girls while ignoring me, but it happened so rarely that I wrote it off. I guess these guys aren't any good for us, huh?

I hope you can continue to talk it out and get some support. I know it's really hard when you loved someone and dedicated so much time to someone who didn't care. It makes me feel like I'm worth less than before, but I'll fight those feelings and realize that I deserved to be with someone who loved me! I hope you surround yourself with people who care about you, and I hope you have close friends whose shoulders you can cry on.

I find that it's sad you had a crush on him for so, so long when it should've been on someone who loved and respected you.

Just remember, which is what I remember, is that there are so many people out there that aren't right for you, so if you run across just one of them, it's always best to move on and not look back. I know it'll be really, really hard, though.

I hope we can both learn to be ourselves again without someone dragging us down.

I don't think being alone will be all that bad. I think my self-esteem will eventually go up again, and I do miss going out and enjoying myself. I used to have so many hobbies that I set to the wayside because I was fighting sadness all the time. What happened to the good ol', cheerful me?

Oh yeah, it's great you're in therapy. I wouldn't believe the guy who led you on and ignored you. I'd say to trust your own instincts about what is the problem you need to discuss with a therapist. If you have a good one who you feel comfortable with and believe is not biased, let them do any diagnosing, but do remember to tell them what you feel is wrong. I'm starting therapy at a new place soon, too. I think it'll do a great amount of good.

[Talthybius]

This person sounds similar to me, in a way.

If he is like me than just taking this track through life's course is the one most comfortable. Maybe he doesn't get enough happiness out of challenges, unusual things, new experiences, to make all this worth the effort and energy and disruption that it causes.
Thoughts don't pop into your mind as often, and when they do, they seem filtered and when they aren't, it all seems too much to bother with.
Call it lazy, call it selfish, call it narcissistic. That's just interpretation.

Then, unless he becomes conscious of it and calls it a bad trait he has to work on, he won't come up with ideas for activities, or plans, or take initiative.

I don't understand why someone is saying you mention no good reasons for being with him. You say you have nice conversations, that he cuddles, that you have similar values, similar personalities, makes you feel comfortable, hardworking nature, strong empathy. And there's probably more as this is a topic on what you have problems with.

Sounds like consciously, he tries to adjust his behavior for you, but in the end deep inside he is the same person and he can't consciously change his subconscious. We don't get to pick our personalities and even the idea we get to pick our decisions is tentative.

What can be done? Is there really no improvement in his behavior and stagnation in the relationship?

I suspect that you dumping him will come as a surprise to him, will hurt him more than you suspect, and may worsen his 'problem'.
But maybe I am projecting too much of myself on him. Not that his life is any of your responsibility.

Maybe he takes you for granted and is truly a narcissistic.

Hi Talthybius. Yes, you do sound a lot like him.

I know what you mean about me having actually said good things about my relationship. It's just that whenever I've talked to people in the past about my relationship, except maybe once, I'm told that it's not a good relationship and that I should leave. I'd like to think I'm a reasonable person, and everyone telling me one thing tends to change the way I see things. Well, I also don't trust myself to know how a relationship should be since I have so little experience.

I hope you keep in mind that although what I said strikes close to home for you, it automatically doesn't rule out the pain and sadness I've felt in this relationship. I've done so much for him and he doesn't seem to notice. It's understandable I feel unloved sometimes, no? I'm willing to accept that it has to do with the way he is, but I have to learn to "put up with it." No one asked me to date him, to be blunt. Like any relationship, I'm in it of my own volition. I do very much love him and don't want to hurt him by breaking up with him, but obviously any breakup is always painful. If I'm unhappy, I should leave, for his sake and my own.

Thanks so much for your input, however. It's good to get two sides of this. I hope I'm not making a mistake, but I am genuinely happy that someone said that he hasn't been that bad of a guy. I'd love to think he loves me back and that we could work through this. But he really is a different sort of person. People who know him know this about him. My boyfriend's simply my boyfriend. He's not insensitive, and I've seen him cry more than once when I told him I was unhappy about things. Of course, we worked things out. I wonder sometimes if my complaints are too hard on both him and me. I do believe breaking up with him would take a huge toll. I'd let his family and his best friend know, in a kindly way, that's it's not working out and that I want them to be there for him after the breakup.

I guess I'll think on it a bit more. I feel overstretched. One side of me says he's a great, loving guy, one side says he's taking advantage of me and will probably cheat on me down the line, causing a great heartbreak.

[divine1966]

Honestly life is too short to be unhappy. I personally wouldn't want to live like this and no, it's not normal after 2 years. Wasting young years having a man who wouldn't go places or help around and spend days behind close doors isn't happy existence for me. I am married and much older than you but I wouldn't want to live like this. But It doesn't matter what other people say. Listen to your guts.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Talthybius]

Originally Posted by Breezy~Day

Hi Talthybius. Yes, you do sound a lot like him.

Maybe you read my posts before I deleted them. Otherwise, I am just assuming we are similar, in a way. You ask for insights, so I thought maybe it would be helpful for me to explain why I am a little like him.

It's just that whenever I've talked to people in the past about my relationship, except maybe once, I'm told that it's not a good relationship and that I should leave.

People only say this because they don't think it's a good relationship for them. Everyone is different. A couple can do all kinds of things with each other each week, both of them taking equal initiative, and it may all be shallow and acting out a routine. People play out their relationships as they think they ought to be played, without them actually feeling anything and basing their relationship off that.

What matters is what you want. Now you post here and express doubts and talk about having talked about this with him. So I assume this is not just you responding to what others think and say, but how you feel.
Obviously, to be in a relationship with such a person, you need to get some enjoyment out of making him engage more, not just frustration. If you don't, he is not the right person for you. If you need constant confirmation of his feelings, you may also not be the right person for him.

Now I assume there is actually something going on in his mind, rather than just nothingness. I assume, the more boring he is outward, the more complex he is inside his mind.

I'd like to think I'm a reasonable person, and everyone telling me one thing tends to change the way I see things. Well, I also don't trust myself to know how a relationship should be since I have so little experience.

I've done so much for him and he doesn't seem to notice. It's understandable I feel unloved sometimes, no? I'm willing to accept that it has to do with the way he is, but I have to learn to "put up with it."

He doesn't understand or he doesn't let you know? Can you figure this out about him? I understand, more work for you, rather than him, to do to keep this relationship deep and meaningful and he just sits back and let's it happen, while you are frustrated and hurt.

I do very much love him and don't want to hurt him by breaking up with him, but obviously any breakup is always painful. If I'm unhappy, I should leave, for his sake and my own.

Sure, if you are dissatisfied, let him know, and if it won't work, you should leave him. Breaking up and hurting him are two sides of the same coin. You have all the rights to stop giving love to him, but the way you phrase this makes it sound as though you think you can break up without hurting him.

But you also put this very sternly; you know breaking up will hurt him, but you aren't sure he loves you (enough)? If you know one to be true, you know the other to be true, right?

I wonder sometimes if my complaints are too hard on both him and me.

If they are what you feel, how 'unreasonable' it may be, you should voice your complaints. Feelings are real. It doesn't matter if they are justified or not.
Holding back your true feelings until you can't take it anymore, that is the wrong way to go by.

I do believe breaking up with him would take a huge toll. I'd let his family and his best friend know, in a kindly way, that's it's not working out and that I want them to be there for him after the breakup.

Obviously, this odd quirk of him will make it difficult for him to maintain any relationship and probably also hurts him in other aspects of his life. You can at least tell him what his big mistake is and that he has to work on himself, figure out how he can be both himself and change this aspect of his, both for the sake of his professional, social and romantic life. Then he has to face that challenge.

I guess I'll think on it a bit more. I feel overstretched. One side of me says he's a great, loving guy, one side says he's taking advantage of me and will probably cheat on me down the line, causing a great heartbreak.

I understand when you say he is taking advantage of you in the sense that he is leeching off your energy, but not contributing as much to your life. I don't understand the cheating part. Is there any rational grounds for this fear? I mean, if he locks himself up in his room and takes no initiative, how will he suddenly end up in someone else's bed?

You say you have known him for 3 years. That should have been enough time to figure things out about him and to make him change/adjust a bit.
Especially when it comes to financial matters, you should have been able to figure out if he is consciously making you pay for things or if he really doesn't have the drive to actively make sure he doesn't pay too little. I can see how he can have a blind spot for all these things, and you just get sick of asking him.

As for going to concerts, how sure are you he really doesn't like it? Even as a little child of age 6, my father had to push me to do activities. He'd force me to go and I'd try because I didn't want to. For example, he made me play ping pong with other kids and some young people teaching. Then when my father came to pick me up, he'd asked the girls organizing it if I had enjoyed myself. And they told me father 'yes, he had fun'.
But then next time, I'd cry again if I had to go because I didn't want to.

I can see this tendency continue in adult life. I have to push myself to go on activities. Are you sure he really has a terrible time? Are you sure he doesn't need you to push him even more and that secretly, he'd enjoy that, though he won't admit it and it may take too much energy from you on the long term?

[kamikazebaby]

I'm sorry to say it, but this isn't a relationship. You can do much better, and you deserve better. A relationship should have both partners contributing more or less equally. This guy is neglectful at the very least and just skating by with the tiny sliver you will accept from him. Very one-sided deal here. I'd leave someone like this in a hot minute. More, I would never have given him a chance to begin with. Don't sell yourself so very short or think so little of yourself that you'd settle for something like this. Good luck, and I hope you are able to move on and find someone better, someone who will actually make a decent effort for you.

[Bill3]

He gives no evidence, I gather, of changing his policy of self-isolation behind closed doors.

Is the self-isolation of your partner what you want in your life for the indefinite future?

I talked everything out with him, like how I felt, the things that have been upsetting me, my worry about our relationship, how he seems to act rude sometimes, all his time alone, and how his changes to make things better haven't really cut it for me. I talked about all this since I didn't want to just break up without talking about it again, more seriously this time, and giving us a chance to make changes or agree on something if possible.

He said he understood why I felt the way I did, and we agreed to talk first if something's bothering us before just getting angry about it. He said that has been trying to be a good boyfriend, but I still keep getting mad at him. He said his been stressed by my nagging, but didn't want to say anything since he tends not to complain.

He has been trying more to help me out and take care of things. I'm trying to learn to talk about what's upsetting me early rather than later. I've been asking him why he seems angry when we go out, and he said it's because he doesn't like crowds and being around a lot of people.

I do realize I have been nagging him a lot lately. I've been upset about other things and have been more angry than usual. He didn't understand and was worried.

I also had a long conversation about my own problems and why I wasn't sure he loved me, and my past. It went well.

He said he wants to spend more time with me, but surprisingly, I always seem busy. I let him now that I keep myself busy because I know he'll be doing something else without me all day. So, we've been spending a lot more time together since we talked. Hopefully it'll turn out that it was a big misunderstanding. I understand him wanting time alone, still. I just hope we'll continue to spend more time together.

He said I need to make him more aware if he needs to help out with something. It is true that when I ask, he does help. It's just that I don't like asking for help, and when he didn't automatically help with things, I was upset. He did bring up examples of times he did help, and apologized for the times he didn't.

He has shown strong loyalty to me. He did admit, when we were talking, that he's bad at showing his feelings and does care a lot.

He does want to work things out. I can't change his personality, like Talthybius has said. He does have a personality that's hard to explain. He's very quiet except for when he loves the topic, and will talk about it for a long time. He told me he doesn't think too much about things going on outside his thoughts, like Talthybius correctly guessed. He won't tend to think about the less important things like laundry or cleaning very often like most people. He does take initiative on things out of nowhere on occasion, but tends to stay in the same routine. He also tends to have long-lasting, strong interests that consume part of his life for a while. I always liked some of these things about him, so maybe he just isn't "perfect" and I have to put up with the annoying details to get the full person.

I'll give him another chance.

[healingme4me]

Well, hopefully his actions speak louder than his words. Change is a slow process. Is he looking into ways to shape his behavior from friends to romantic partner?
How to treat a woman types of literature? How to navigate the long term future to keep the embers burning?

"Interrogate your hidden assumptions."-Cornel West

[Talthybius]

He does sound like an Asperger's type of person. Does that trouble him in other parts of his life? Friends, education, job? Him being in his room, doing his 'thing', whatever it is since you didn't mention it, it is likely a coping mechanism. A way to protect himself or to not have to deal with the outside words on their, not his, terms.

You talk about 'nagging', 'complaining', 'stressful' and other words. I always imagined I would one day have a GF that would enjoy the challenge of getting me engaged in things. Maybe this is a very unrealistic expectation of an Asperger-type person of a GF and this is not something you can provide. If this frustrates you to no end, you may have a very hard time long-term. Because it sounds like this is a personality trait he has and you will have to keep doing this, hopefully in a progressive way, as long as the relationship lasts to make sure he keeps improving and does not revert. That's how I imagine things, at least.

It is true. You can break up with him and find someone who does know how to naturally maintain a romantic relationship, keep it balanced and engaging from both sides.

[Bill3]

I do realize I have been nagging him a lot lately.

He said I need to make him more aware if he needs to help out with something.

It's just that I don't like asking for help,

It seems that he sees you as in charge. He sees it as your responsibility to decide who does what and to ask him to do X if you decide you want him to do X.

So you must ask him, but you don't like to ask and if you ask "too much" you are nagging.

So it seems that everything is on you: to decide, to ask, but not to ask "too much".

It sounds like you are not intrigued or engaged by the task of drawing him out.

I wonder if responsibilities could be divided in an adult manner. For example, maybe it could be his responsible to (say) do the dishes every night, period. That would be one of his jobs, he is expected to do it, and he is in the wrong if he doesn't do it faithfully, every day, period, without being asked.

Hey, great advice everyone.

healingme4me, thanks, I also believe actions speak louder than words, so I'll be keeping an eye on it. It's what had me worried so early on, since his words said he loved me and cares greatly, but his actions seemed to vary. He'd do something loving than something uncaring. I was confused for a long while until I learned that it's how he is. About changing how he treats others, I'm not sure if he notices a problem. He's generally a nice person, if just a little odd, around others. It's when he's upset that he acts rude. So, most people seem to take two sides: they're either drawn to him for his uniqueness or act and feel superior to him. Funny, I realize that's how people are with me. Maybe him and I are more alike than I thought. Well, I have talked to him about what I believe is the right way to act around others without specifically saying he has a problem. I have a strong feeling that he would get defensive if I said he had social difficulties.

Talthybius, I never really saw him that way until you mentioned it. I did wonder about how he acts similar to those with Aspergers syndrome once or twice, but didn't dwell on it. I know that without a diagnosis, I can't say he has it, but I do know that his family seems very likely to not take him to get diagnosed. They're very accepting of who his is, which is great, but they'd probably overlook ever diagnosing him if he had it. It would explain his very odd interests as a child and how his empathy "changes" just depending on whether he's keeping any focus on me or not. Well, he may not have it, but his traits do bring it to mind.

I can see that being the reason why he keeps in his room. I didn't think of that, but he doesn't tend to show his emotions until they're bursting.

When I first got with him, there are so few people I meet who act like him that I saw him in the same light as everyone else, and in that way he came off kind of rude for reasons previously mentioned, like how he didn't like to ask questions, talk about himself, or get emotional. He occasionally did show very strong sensitivity, so I felt that there was a possibility that he wasn't a jerk but just acted different than everyone else and was probably very sweet. So, I gave him the chance to be himself and I did have to coax him a lot to talk more and also talk about himself.

Well, despite how he seems to "not care" sometimes, like having to ask for help with things that most people would automatically help with, or being a little more leader-like, I'm thinking it's a small price to pay for someone who's a genuinely good person who loves me and will be there for me. His family has insisted that he loves me, probably because they know how he is and might be worried that I might not. They all also understand he's always been "different" since he was little.

I guess why I've taken a complete 180 on whether to stay with him or not is because I was confused and lost and worried I was with someone who didn't love me. But, talking about it with him, and reading over the replies here again, and especially the realization that he may be on the AS spectrum or have a similar personality, my fears decreased substantially.

But still, I have to wait and see. I also would hate to break up with him. I do love him and wish to stay together. I'm not sure how well I'd handle breaking up, but I've handled tough situations before, so we'll see.

Bill3, it sounds like you're right. He does seem to wait for me to make decisions on a lot of things.

Well, I didn't mention it, but I do like bringing him out of his shell and learning more about him. It's been some of my best memories with him. Like learning he loves animals, has artistic tastes despite giving the impression that he doesn't care about it, really does like to tag along with me because he likes my company although he doesn't like to go out, likes nature, etc. The hard part is general, day-to-day chores, or feeling I'm loved by him when he spent so much time alone. Sorry if you meant something else by intrigued or engaged by the task of drawing him out. Do you mean out of his room? Speaking of that, I did feel upset that I had to bring him out of it myself, since I thought this meant he didn't want to spend time with me. But it was good to learn that wasn't the case.

I mentioned in another post that I worried he might cheat on me if we stayed together, if he actually doesn't love me. It may have been strange to mention, but it's because it seems to be what commonly happens when someone doesn't love someone else but stays with them anyway for various reasons.

I figure that when it comes to him locking away in his room, although I've been asking him to spend more time with me, and it's working out good, I try to be as nice as I can about letting him have his alone time. It might be that he needs the time alone to feel comfortable.

[divine1966]

I would personally refrain from labeling people unless they are officially diagnosed. Not every bad partner has ASD or NPD or BPD etc unless you get official diagnosis it might be better to just stick to his behavior. If he refuses to do anything unless you ask to then both of you make chores list and split responsibilities, put it on a fridge and stick to it, this is not 1950s when women did household chores and men worked

Also everyone needs alone time but with the amount of time he wants to be alone it's better to maybe live alone. No need to live together as roommates

Personally I think life is too short to be unhappy.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bill3]

With regard to his time alone: Everyone can use time alone. However, to me the question is whether you can be actually happy with the amount of time he spends alone. If you can, then there is no problem with regard to his alone time. But if the time alone is excessive from your perspective, then there is an issue to discuss and work through. In my opinion you don't have to accept basically living alone simply because that is what he finds comfortable. He might SAY he wants time with you, but his actions may be telling a different story.

I guess what I meant by drawing out is that right now it sounds like you have to ask him over and over to spend time with you and to help out. Is that what you want in a relationship? Even if that is what he wants, it does not have to be what you want.

With regard to chores: Just because he might want you to be in charge, and to ask him every day to do X, does not mean that is automatically an appropriate arrangement. Is that what you want long-term: Asking, cajoling, pleading, maybe even begging him to do X? I suspect that over time it will all get tiresome and perhaps you will just come to do X yourself. And Y, and Z...

[jimmy rich]

[quote=Breezy~Day;5223155]

My boyfriend is extremely quiet, and I first assumed this relationship would be not good for me. He didn't show any interest in knowing my family, showed very little in knowing my friends, and he had great difficulty showing me that he was interested in knowing me. We carried along initially by our similar personality and interests. We did have good conversations, felt very at ease around each other, and I liked his good moral values, hardworking nature, and what seemed to be strong empathy. However, his quietness around me and slow return of messages had me worried.

Based on what I learned at therapy, I'd say that he had a troubled childhood and developed certain (quiet) coping skills to survive. This might be about Aspergers but I would never allow some "disorder" to ruin my happiness. Life is too short for that!

I eventually learned from the people who knew him, and also his family, that he was intensely quiet and kind of rude.

Yes, "quiet" folks are often holding in anger, sorrow and other negative feeling which will pop out as rudeness or stoic silence. He may be carrying deep, painful feelings and memories from a toxic childhood unless it can all be blamed on Aspergers.

He acted much better with me, and I was told that he definitely loved me, and that he never acted this way with anyone else before. Obviously I was touched and many of my fears decreased. I felt very happy for proof that what I thought I saw wasn't just a fantasy. He even told me a few times himself that he felt this way.

Troubled folks can develop quite a range of "skills" to hide and manage their inner daemons which often fools other folks.

However, he still acts very aloof much of the time except for when we're alone and hanging out together.

Before therapy and self-esteem training, being "aloof" was my main coping skill and many others thought I was just being "cool"! It's a cover-up for inner pain!

My worries occasionally flair up to a point that I think he really doesn't love me. For example, he leaves a lot on my shoulders, and I often have to ask for help from him. I usually take care of everything from bills to shopping to cleaning. He does honestly help out sometimes, but it worries me that I have to complain first.

Those are all Codependency patterns in which both partners are carrying deep needs and wounds from a bad childhood and hoping the other partner will take care of them or their common responsibilities.

At least he pays his part for things. Sometimes I do most of the paying because I always tend to do that. I'm the type who likes to make things easier on people.

Yes, those are all Codependency characteristics (google it) but there is a way to overcome that.

He definitely isn't your "typical" boyfriend, though. He doesn't buy random gifts of affection or do anything kind of cheesy to express his love. I don't mind. I very occasionally do those things, though.

I'd say he is your "typical" Codependent.

I don't really mind all of this. I've complained to him, and had a few deep, emotional talks where I admitted that I sometimes don't think he cares about me.

Codependents are actually not able to "care" about others until they get over their codependency or selfishness. They can "act" like they care but it's just not in them unless they find some healing.

He's usually very saddened by this and we talk it all out. He has a good, logical way of not assuming too much and not just saying he does care and I have to believe him. He's really good at hearing me out, but he has a great amount of difficulty knowing what to say and gets frustrated with himself.

Many "quiet" folks have trouble saying what they think and feel because they do not have the words or vocabulary to express their feelings. When I first entered sharing meetings, I had nothing to say and it took a while to find and use the words to adequately express my self. I often worked with a thesaurus to find words and expressions for my feelings!

After our talks, he usually does make noticeable changes in helping me out more.

Which shows you that he knows the difference! I was able to "change" my act for a short time but always went back to my bad behavior later on.

One way he shows affection is cuddling up with me pretty much daily. That's his only way, really, of showing affection daily. Sometimes we'll have a good conversation when we're alone and make a lot of jokes.

Codependents generally have a very narrow range of loving behaviors which may seem adequate to their partners - for a little while.

He spends a lot of time alone. He'll lock himself away for hours, which I always thought was okay. Sometimes I get lonely knowing he's in the same building as me (we live together) but I don't get to see him. I can knock on his door and talk a bit, but usually he spends most of the day alone. If I want to go to a concert or something, he always says no when I ask if he wants to come along. He doesn't like crowds, but I feel a bit bad he doesn't go with me. At least he tends to go with me to some places like malls, even if he really doesn't like it.

I was and still am a "loner". I was often "hurt" by others so I decided, long ago, to be safe by avoiding others even though I often NEED others. My fear and resentments keep me from enjoying and feeling safe with anyone but my late wife.

How would other people see this relationship? I'd just like some perspective.

I see it as Codependent and packed with potential danger as his bottled up and unhealed inner pain and RAGE could emerge at any time and do serious damages. IMO, both of your are somewhat like time bombs that could explode at anytime you are triggered.

He's definitely very quiet and doesn't show a lot of love, except for cuddling. Sometimes he acts outright uncaring about me when we're out in public. He won't say a word and act a bit rude, even a bit passive aggressive. It's gets some pent-up feelings of unhappiness from me.

Passive-aggressive patterns can definitely trigger your bottled up feelings and have you both saying and doing terrible things. His silence and uncaring is just the tip of the iceberg as is much of your own behavior so, IMO, counseling and/or therapy - perhaps a CODA meeting (google it) can help to solve the hidden, yet dangerous, problems in your relationship.

Thanks, Divine. I'm really glad the problem isn't in my head. My boyfriend acts confused as to why there's a problem!

Codependents simply cannot HONESTLY look at what is going on inside of them selves and will stay firmly entrenched in DENIAL unless they go for help.

I guess part of it is probably loneliness. I have a very hard time connecting with others and usually don't have friends. I've been that way since I was a child.

Same with me - thanks to very toxic parents/parenting!

I guess another part is because my parents were very abusive towards each other, and I thought since I and my boyfriend didn't fight, we must have a great relationship.

LOL, that is codependent thinking. If it's not VIOLENT, it must be OK!

I do remember once when we were hanging around his friend, let's call him "A," A was watching how Matt and I interacted and just didn't seem too pleased. At one point he muttered out loud, "****ing miracle," and was telling Matt he should be helping me with this or that or to "be a gentleman." It made me a bit sad to see that. His friend has actually been in a serious relationship for a lot longer than us and always seemed to care about his girlfriend way more than my boyfriend cares about me.

Others can often see the failings and faults in a couple but the couple cannot see it due to codependent DENIAL. It's a blindness brought on by many factors such as: fear, false hope, emotional damage, desperate needs and a lot more.

How should a relationship be? I thought this was just normal after almost 2 years together.

Codependents will accept almost anything as "normal" that others plainly see as TOXIC!

If we do break up, I will miss the friendly banter and good times.

After thinking about it, the hardest part would be telling him I want to break up. He'll be so sad. I never want to put someone I love through that. But I will if I have to.

I'd seek some help to see if the relationship can be fixed.

My boyfriend and I are pretty young and live together. Sadly, moving in together didn't help anything. I've known him for maybe 3 years now.

Codependents will do anything to fix a relationship (moving in, marriage, have kids, trial separation, open marriage, BOOZE) but rarely find the correct solutions by going into some kind of therapy.

No matter what I do, I just have to accept that my boyfriend won't show any real love for me. He also has talked to girls while ignoring me, but it happened so rarely that I wrote it off. I guess these guys aren't any good for us, huh?

It's not that they "aren't any good", it's that both of you are the victims of inadequate parental training which FAILED to adequately prepare both of you for a loving and respectful relationship. It's Codependency at it's worst!

I know it's really hard when you loved someone and dedicated so much time to someone who didn't care. It makes me feel like I'm worth less than before, but I'll fight those feelings and realize that I deserved to be with someone who loved me! I find that it's sad you had a crush on him for so, so long when it should've been on someone who loved and respected you.

This is almost the perfect definition of Codependency = They fall in love (need) and stick with someone who CANNOT love them back!

I hope we can both learn to be ourselves again without someone dragging us down.

Only if and when you overcome your own conditioning to be codependent or you will most likely find another unloving Codependent to drag you down again.

What happened to the good ol', cheerful me?

I'd say that early childhood conditioning to be codependent finally overwhelmed you.

Well, I also don't trust myself to know how a relationship should be since I have so little experience.

In therapy and a few relationship books, I learned what a good relationship is supposed to be and that put an end to my 1st horrible marriage since I could no longer stay in a toxic marriage after learning what a good one is.

I've done so much for him and he doesn't seem to notice.

Codependents are often caught in situations where they knock them selves out to please others (People Pleasing) who don't "notice". It's a sick pattern that began in early childhood with trying to please our indifferent or DRUNKEN parents and then us Codependents spend the rest of our lives trying to please and get the approval of other Codependents who simply CANNOT notice or approve of us!

It's understandable I feel unloved sometimes, no?

It's an automatic and acceptable feeling from childhood that we sometimes CRAVE! Feeling "unloved" is NORMAL for Codependents!

I'm willing to accept that it has to do with the way he is,

And the "way he is" can be changed if he really wants to do it!

If I'm unhappy, I should leave, for his sake and my own.

That's why I left cause I sure wasn't going to "put up with it" once I could see how a loving marriage can be.

Of course, we worked things out.

I worked things out with my Ex over and over but none of it ever lasted and the same ugly patterns of behavior emerged again and again since neither of us knew how to make our marriage work nor how to undo the toxic codependency both of us were carrying. It's like a disease or plague that takes a lot of work or dumb luck to over come. I did my part but she couldn't be bothered to do her part!

I guess I'll think on it a bit more. I feel overstretched. One side of me says he's a great, loving guy, one side says he's taking advantage of me and will probably cheat on me down the line, causing a great heartbreak.

After you do a little work on undoing your Codependency, you will see right through all of those "excuses & reasons" to stay with him because you will know that, unless he gets some help, he definitely will hurt you more and more and more!

I talked everything out with him, like how I felt, the things that have been upsetting me, my worry about our relationship, how he seems to act rude sometimes, all his time alone, and how his changes to make things better haven't really cut it for me. I talked about all this since I didn't want to just break up without talking about it again, more seriously this time, and giving us a chance to make changes or agree on something if possible. I'll give him another chance.

I liked all that you wrote in that post about talking things out and coming to some understandings and agreements BUT........
In my experience, unless the underlying trauma, unhappiness and fears are exposed and resolved, none of your agreements or understandings will last very long and the old, unsatisfactory behaviors will re-emerge because the inner stuff has not been HEALED. It might be helpful to blame his "behaviors" on Asperger or some other "disorder" but, eventually the underlying cause for his and your unsatisfactory behavior will need to be addressed or there will never be true happiness for either of you.
My late wife and I worked very hard to deal with our underlying Codependency and had a very happy, loving and FUN life together for 26 years and would still be enjoying it if she had not died of illness. IMO, dealing with underlying issues is the whole thing but most of society just tells us to ignore that stuff! That's called DENIAL!
Please do not see this as a silly, hysterical or completely unfounded comment from me. I lived through a Codependent childhood and 1st marriage and learned a lot about how to make a relationship work well in my last marriage (she passed away) so what I am offering comes from my own experiences and not from books or abstract theories.
good luck

Hi jimmy rich. Excuse my language, but jeezes krist, you might be right!! I know now to not jump to conclusions based on what you said: after all, it's advice, not a sentence, but a lot of what you said rang true with me. I once worried I might have codependency, and the way I acted as a child lined up with the symptoms almost perfectly, but I eventually forgot about it. Yes, I'm a big people pleaser and every chance will go out of my way to be "nice." I can be also strangely mean and callous, out of nowhere. It'll happen when I feel very much out of control. I always need to feel in control of myself to feel safe.

Yeah, my parents were both abusive. My mother neglectful, my father emotionally, physically, and sometimes sexually abusive. Thankfully, codependency might have saved me in my early years with them since I used my kindness and hard work ethic to escape somehow and end up in a better spot than my sisters, who ended up having many more trials to fight through. People have said how amazing it was that I'm doing so okay nowadays.

Oh yeah, did I mention that one of my parents died of cancer?

My father was the "king" and I took the "understanding" route and went along with what he wanted, whereas my sisters tried troubled attempts at rebellion.

My parents separated almost continuously. The abuse I faced when I was alone with my father is even now almost too much to bear the thought of. Yeah, it was bad.

It'd make perfect sense that I'm codependent. I've noticed that I have seemed to be less "caring" over time, even though I think my true nature is a caring person, and it's been troubling me.

My boyfriend had issues as a child that his parents, although very loving and "stable," failed to provide him with. He didn't talk much, and everyone accepted that as normal, which I can't blame them for.

Yes, he's had a history of childhood anger. He explained that he'd get uncontrollably angry for no reason, and then later in life the anger just gradually disappeared.

To be honest, your post gave me a lot of hope. I feel like, yes, maybe I can feel better. Maybe I don't have to be miserable.

I mean, look at me. I'm not caring enough about my boyfriend. Although I do a ton for him, it's very difficult to put myself in his shoes. Not just my boyfriends, but everyone's. I feel so out of touch with everyone.

Maybe I could start with some good-rated books on codependency. I'm seeing a therapist in about a week. Maybe, if the time is right, I'll bring it up with her.

My biggest question has maybe been answered: what does my boyfriend get from living with me? He's not very interested in sex, he's usually okay money-wise, he doesn't quite treat me as a friend. Maybe he just wants someone to be there for him or something? It could be a deep-rooted, complex issue.