[venusss]

So I am a little fanatic, I am snarky and cynical. I am sometimes "too much", cannot talk to "ordinary people" because I overuse big words, talk about hybrid wars all the time. I get gleeful over deaths of people even (people I consider terrorists, but still). I like to act tough, but I sometimes just cannot. I drink too much, I am sometimes obnoxious and not all of my choices are ethical. I am not a lady (though I do sometimes faint like 19th century heroines and wear uncomfortable shoes... so what the eff you want?) I can love people in theory and from distance, but I am not friendly with everybody... and I don't even pretend to like some people.

Many people do tell me I am not likeable. I get weird looks sometimes. I know people do talk behind my back.

But... is it worth trying to be nice? Can't I just be good, without being necesarily nicety nicey nice?

I am working on the bad parts of my character that bother me... but do I have to break myself to fit in the expectations of what "good" person is? I do consider myself good, behind the facade. I just think some things... do not matter. Do my obnoxious parts undo the good parts? Or is being lovable and lovely overrated?

[torodaciero]

screw "them".. you don't need 'em.

Yes, it is good that you work on the parts that bother you. And you may need to at least pretend to be a nice person in professional life. But in your personal life? hell, I know enough people who would like a character like yours. You just need to meet the right people. They are probably like you, but your anger/not-nice-est goes in the same direction, so you might stick together. There might be other people like you that are contradictory to you, so you will get in a fight with them (just try to ignore them and never meet them again)..

And people talk behind your back: I got news for you.. that happens to literally everybody. You are just in a luxury position to know when, why and what they talk about you.. you might aswell use it in your advantage.

I don't know you personally, but it is never too late to change the things you don't like.. and there are always people to find that can become great friends (or maybe more).. you just may have to look in other corners of the world than you are used to.

You seem fine with who you are and that is everyone's goal. I'm a pretty nice person all things considered and I don't like everyone.....it's more common for me to not like a person than it is for me to like them. I don't go out of my way to be an azz to them, but they probably usually know I dislike their traits. That doesn't make me not nice.

It's only important to be lovable if it's important to you. I can not assign importance to something for you. If you don't care about being lovable, then don't care. If you do, then you do.

Very few people in this world are unlovable. For every highly flawed person, there is an equally flawed person who will love them just as they are.

[unaluna]

You ask questions similar to simone de beauvoir. You carve your own path in life.

If this is something that you think about frequently, than change. If it is something you can live with, then live with it.

I am a biotch. Always have been, always will be. Bipolar meds included. But, I am also a very kind, empathetic person. Just one with a big mouth.

[JDDJ]

but do I have to break myself to fit in the expectations of what "good" person is?

"We must not allow other people's limited perceptions to define us." Virginia Satir

You ask what you must decide.

[~Christina]

Venus.....you have never been unkind to me. Your advice has always helps me.

You have a huge heart for what your compassionate about. Not everyone has the capacity to do so.

Should you fit in a mold of a unrealistic person? no , just no.

If there is something you don't care for about yourself sure work on that if you want, but only if it bothers you.

I'm not everyone's cup of tea I'm mouthy, I virtually have no patience for stupidity or people that are clueless about a topic yet want to argue with me. I'm always telling my husband he is much nicer than me and it's so true!

I don't have to like everyone and not everyone needs to like me.

I would rather be me than try to be anyone else.

Lovable has many meanings.

( non hug )

[Trippin2.0]

I want to hug you so badly right now, lucky for you I'm on the other side of the world.


No, definitely just no. Don't try to change anything that you don't deem a problem.

[KarenSue]

Personally, I prefer bluntly honest people. I may not like what they say, but if it is the truth, I know I am respected. That is important to me.

You aren't unloveable, Venuss, but you ARE intense, and that intensity may be too much for some people and may tend to keep people at arm's length. If you are okay with that, just keep being true to yourself. I'm not sure it is about being "nice" or "good"; you've always struck me as a profoundly "good" individual and you always seem nice enough - blunt, but not mean.

[venusss]

Thanks for the input.

If this is something that you think about frequently, than change. If it is something you can live with, then live with it.

Well... just from time to time. Had bit overwhelming time last Sunday (not bad... just emotional) and me gleeing over somebody's death (he was evil terrorist, but....) lead to wondering what kind of person I am.

I'm not everyone's cup of tea I'm mouthy, I virtually have no patience for stupidity or people that are clueless about a topic yet want to argue with me. I'm always telling my husband he is much nicer than me and it's so true!

my grandmother was a lovely person who got along with everybody. Than people asked her to deal with people nobody wanted to deal with... so not sure I would want a repution of being so nice, when I think of it.

(she did not mind though. Not sure how she did it).

You aren't unloveable, Venuss, but you ARE intense, and that intensity may be too much for some people and may tend to keep people at arm's length. If you are okay with that, just keep being true to yourself. I'm not sure it is about being "nice" or "good"; you've always struck me as a profoundly "good" individual and you always seem nice enough - blunt, but not mean.

Thanks.

I just sometimes wish I came off more put together and less off fanatic with weird sense of humor... especially since I need to get people on my side and want favors and things from them... but at times I cannot help it.

[Rainstoppedplay]

You are never boring Venus

[Fuzzybear]

You aren't boring I've been called unloveable and not "endearing" by a few people, who were in fact flawed people as everyone is, and not people I find in the slightest bit interesting (or likeable or loveable). I didn't kick them to the curb as they deserved, as mostly I was a child... Keep on being your authentic self

Btw papa bear is much nicer than I am

Do you have a personality disorder?

[venusss]

Originally Posted by ValentinaVVV

Do you have a personality disorder?

Not that I know of... why?

I am not saying you have low self-esteem. But I read and post sometimes on the PD boards.

And I think that a lot of people with PDs worry about whether or not they are likeable or lovable.

Also,I am intense too. And I am on meds for bipolar and I think it mellows me out. I know you don't want meds and I respect that.

[avlady]

Yes meds saved me when i was at my worst like when i also got shots and was put in seclusion. i know that will never happen again as i told myself so. i have to be careful with some of the workers that work on psych wards as they themselves seem to me to not be doing the right thing.

[venusss]

Originally Posted by ValentinaVVV

I am not saying you have low self-esteem. But I read and post sometimes on the PD boards.

And I think that a lot of people with PDs worry about whether or not they are likeable or lovable.

Also,I am intense too. And I am on meds for bipolar and I think it mellows me out. I know you don't want meds and I respect that.

I used to have low self-esteem, but I don't think so anymore. I mean... I can speak in public, go approach random people and I don't really spend that much time thinking about how I look or if I am worthy (well... I do but in different way).

I accepted I am not gonna be liked by everybody and I don't even want to. I mean, if people I consider horrible people like me... there is soemthing wrong.

This was more of a result of one intense Sunday where several of my strange traits managed to come at once.

Yeah, I really see no reason to be on meds. It's not like meds would make me... I don't even know what I aim to. I guess just be bit... more at peace possibly. But I don't want to lose that drive. And I feel sometimes anger is appropriate reaction, as long as use it constructively. I don't have any actual symptoms that bother me that could be treated medically.

[venusss]

Originally Posted by avlady

Yes meds saved me when i was at my worst like when i also got shots and was put in seclusion. i know that will never happen again as i told myself so. i have to be careful with some of the workers that work on psych wards as they themselves seem to me to not be doing the right thing.

Glad you got saved.

I don't need to save life though. It's not in danger.

[venusss]

Also, I don't really worry about being boring. I may be on the other end of the specter, hah.

[sabby]

Just a thought here....

I found out through my life experiences that I used to hold people away at arms distance and that it wasn't because I was wanting to be nasty and mean, it really was because I couldn't/wouldn't let them in too close so I wouldn't get hurt. I felt that if I could keep them away, even if it meant by being angry, mean, nasty, whatever negative way I could be, then I was taking care of myself.

Luckily for me, I found out what I was doing and why. It took me years to discover it all and even to this day I sometimes have to step back and regroup to find myself again.

Could some of this be true for you venusss? Are you trying to hold people back from you that you don't want too close to you by being negative and not nice?

I realized I could be nice and still keep them at arms length if need be. Being nice didn't mean that I was giving myself away or opening myself up to ridicule. It simply meant that I was being nice and they can take it or leave it, just as I could with them.

[venusss]

Sabby, I have quite a few close friends who know a lot about me. I even admitted to them I am sorta crazy (one of them came with hypothesis it's an "artist thing").

My not being "nicety nice" is really not about holding people back at this point. I can draw the line.

It just comes from within. Being angry is not reaction of not wanting to get hurt... it's reaction that *happens*. I am a cynical person because... events of recent months made me cynical. I am protecting myself, but not in the way of "being too afraid of being hurt by people".

I am not directing my anger or cynicism to my friends. In fact I am the one who brings christmas cookies and tries to make people get along. I can be nice to people in my network...

But these people can accept me the way I am somehow. Even if I have dark side, which is not pretended. In fact, I try to pretend to be "nicer" than I am at times. Smiley and ladylike...

Thanks for your input though. I wish I could share more details, but I don't feel safe oversharing in public space.

I actually used to be a girl who'd put up barbed wire and walls to see who can bet past...

I guess lately some of the inner darkness just emerged. Some dark thoughts I wish that weren't there. But maybe it is okay. Maybe I don't have to be the regular version of nice, sweet little ladylike woman...

I think you can be whoever you are with friends...they have proven that they WANT to be around you...

But we do have to exist in a society...as my mom says, "no man is an island". If you want relationships, then yes it requires a certain amount of effort and it has to be positive and not negative.

So it depends, I guess.

As for your statement of "I am unlovable"...well, I don't know you so I can't dispute it, but everyone has redeeming features, so I think it's a little bit of a harsh criticism of yourself.

[sabby]

((((((((( venusss )))))))))

Thanks for explaining things to me.

I guess it doesn't really matter what the reason is for putting up a wall and not being nicey nicey. I get it.

It doesn't surprise me that you feel as you do considering what you and your countrymen and women live through. Living in Eastern Europe has it's own unique issues and since you seem to be very interested and concerned about your political and social issues, I certainly can understand how you could feel angry and it just pops up or lingers day to day.

I think the fact that you are aware of it, that you know you are having some dark thoughts as you say, is half the battle. I for one don't believe that you are unlovable in any way shape or form. All of us have redeeming qualities and all of us deserve love and compassion. Whether or not we feel we get that is another story.

[divine1966]

Well it depends where are you behaving the way you described? I wouldn't last at my job if I was outwardly angry or nasty otherwise. I would kind of have to be nice if let's say it was not natural for me. I am blunt. Nothing wrong with being blunt imo. Not the same as being visibly angry though. We do have to adjust sometimes if we want to function well