[Open Eyes]

For a little over a year now my older sister moved my parents to her home. My parents are 93 and my father is turning 91 on the 17th.

My sister has been mean to me and it's gotten to the point where even though I would like to see my parents I can't without her right there HOVERING. I struggle with PTSD and my sister's behaviors can trigger me badly so I avoid engaging because I get triggered so badly.

Last time I called and spoke to my father was on father's day and he asked me "when am I going to see you?". I came so close to telling him the truth but ended up just saying, "Dad, please let me just wish you happy father's day and know that I miss you and I do love you". So, I want to at least call him to wish him happy birthday, would love to see him but I just can't be around my sister. I just don't know what to say to him when he asks me "when will I see you?". The whole Idea is to add to his day be it any holiday, and I honestly wish I could just be honest with him but the feeling I have been encouraged to feel, what comes through in me is "that's making it about me". It's been very hard to WANT to see and visit with my parents yet avoid doing so because of how my sister behaves when I do. Sigh, if I could have a way of posting a video showing how she can be I know other members would KNOW what I mean.

So, can't come up with an answer that I can give that's the truth but doesn't blow up in my face with my sister calling me and lecturing me. My parents can't drive or be independent and basically are trapped with her hovering over them.

[wolfgaze]

Originally Posted by Open Eyes

So, can't come up with an answer that I can give that's the truth but doesn't blow up in my face with my sister calling me and lecturing me. My parents can't drive or be independent and basically are trapped with her hovering over them.

Your sister is not the boss of you. Stand up for yourself and confront your sister about her behavior towards you. Do you want this current dynamic to persist for all the remaining years of your parents lives? Have to take some form of action to directly address it...

[Open Eyes]

I have stood up to her and she always finds a way to shut me down or crank up the drama in ways that actually traumatizes me and takes me by surprise. Yet, she can also be VERY condescending and I have gotten where I simply can't stand to even hear her voice much less be in her presence. She is and always has been a very controlling person. I used to be able to work around that, but not since I developed PTSD and she has gotten "mean" and bossy and as I mentioned condescending. I manage to keep myself together in front of her, but afterwards I can get severely triggered and can end up struggling with bad chills for days, especially at night they can get so bad they wake me up.

[divine1966]

What do you mean by hovering?

[Open Eyes]

The last time I went to my sister's to see my parents the entire time I sat and visited with them my sister paced back and forth through the room. Then she finally came in to the middle and declared that her road was going to be blocked off and it would not be safe for my vehicle to be where I parked it. This was a lie as her road was not going to be blocked off and my vehicle was not in any danger. My parents reacted with "Don't send her/take her away" they looked like two children upset. Every time I call she answers and insists "keep it short" and as I talk to them on the phone I can hear her in the back ground saying she needs to use the phone, LIE because her and her husband both have cell phones so she doesn't actually need to use the phone. Each time my parents actually react where they feel rushed or bad in some way.

It was way different when I got to be "alone" with them before she had them move in with her.

The last time I got to visit with my Mom "alone" is when she fell at my sister's and broke her wrist and ended up in a rehabilitation facility, my mom was SO HAPPY to see me because we were always so close. My mother would constantly say to me "she is jealous of you" and I honestly felt uncomfortable when she said that. One day I could not drive there but I called and it was nice because my mother would answer the phone and I could talk to her directly without having to deal with my sister. I had a nice conversation with her and my sister figured out when I was seeing my mother and began calling in an effort to shorten the visit. One time I was talking to my mother and my sister got all upset because she could not get through and then I got a call from her telling me that my mother was all upset and she accused me of talking about things I NEVER talked about. Then my sister took my mother out of that facility and never told me. I ended up talking to another woman who sounded like my mother but did not know me and it frightened me thinking my mother must be worse and suddenly did not remember me. Two weeks went by and the whole time I had not realized the person I was calling was not my mother and that my sister moved her without even telling me. So mean she can be.

[divine1966]

You were talking to a stranger for two weeks without realizing it’s not your mother???? How is it possible?

[amandalouise]

I take it that your sister is your parents guardian and caretaker now? if so theres not much you can do unless you go to court and show how being at your sisters is harming your parents and the court appointing you as your parents care takers. other wise you will probably have to find a way to visit with your parents while following the rules that your sister sets down, there may be reasons that you are not in on that is causing your sister to limit your contact. another suggestion is sit down with your sister and a lawyer, maybe some of the problems can be fixed in a way that you be legally awarded visitation with your parents. whether that visitation is supervised or not would be up to the courts

[divine1966]

I can’t help but notice that the last time you spoke to your father was Father’s Day. June? It’s almost December now.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by amandalouise

I take it that your sister is your parents guardian and caretaker now? if so theres not much you can do unless you go to court and show how being at your sisters is harming your parents and the court appointing you as your parents care takers. other wise you will probably have to find a way to visit with your parents while following the rules that your sister sets down, there may be reasons that you are not in on that is causing your sister to limit your contact. another suggestion is sit down with your sister and a lawyer, maybe some of the problems can be fixed in a way that you be legally awarded visitation with your parents. whether that visitation is supervised or not would be up to the courts

Just having your parents reside with you does not necessarily mean you are their legal guardian. That takes a legal action by the courts. The OP did not say that was done. She said her sister "moved her parents to her house". You are assuming things which can be dangerous. You may be correctly assuming, I do not know - but it is better to ask for clarification before assuming something in order to come to a conclusion of "nothing can be done" - this type of response is just as disruptive to a person at times as a misdiagnosis is. Why? Because it is hard enough to ask for help. To then be told "nope, nothing can be done" is akin to saying "deal with it" to the person who is in or close to crisis stage - words that I know from personal experience can hurt very badly

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Open Eyes,

I am sorry to hear you are going through this. It sounds as if your parents truly care for you. You said your mom believes your sister to be jealous. Why would she think that and why would your sister be jealous? How was it your parents came to be with your sister? Is there any reason (other than her own opinions) she would be able to keep you from them?

There are a lot of different ways this could go depending on the answers to those questions, so I will hold off any advice til I know further. I really do hope things get better for you bc it sounds painfully hard. My heart goes out to you.
❤

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by Crypts_Of_The_Mind

Just having your parents reside with you does not necessarily mean you are their legal guardian. That takes a legal action by the courts. The OP did not say that was done. She said her sister "moved her parents to her house". You are assuming things which can be dangerous. You may be correctly assuming, I do not know - but it is better to ask for clarification before assuming something in order to come to a conclusion of "nothing can be done" - this type of response is just as disruptive to a person at times as a misdiagnosis is. Why? Because it is hard enough to ask for help. To then be told "nope, nothing can be done" is akin to saying "deal with it" to the person who is in or close to crisis stage - words that I know from personal experience can hurt very badly

yes I know that, thats why it was a question. people dont need to go to court to me their parents guardians/ caretakers anymore. it can be a situation where the parents understand they can not live alone and chose their oldest child or choose which child is more able to help take care of them. my wifes parents can not live on their own. their doctor asked then to fill out papers of which of their children were going to be responsible for making their decisions , who the doctors need to contact first, ... years ago they chose my wife for her mothers representative and my wife's brother for my wife's fathers representative. doing things this way is called advanced directives. my wife and I also have signed advance directives that names two family members to be in control should either one of us become unable to make our own decisions , the first on our advance directives is each other and I have chosen a relative.

thats what I meant when I asked....

I take it your sister is your parents guardians and caretakers?

rereading the posts in this thread its the sister the hospital called to take the mother, (evidence no one told open eyes his mother had been released.) sisnter decides who visits parents, who calls parents and how long the visits and calls are)

my suggestions about the court process was a way to get this changed. if the parents cant live on their own then the parents have to live with someone (open eyes or sister) by going to court open eyes can show why he / she doesnt agree with the sister and instead of sister or parents the court will decide what is best for the parents. it was a suggestion since open eyes is not happy with the present arrangements and according to the posts the sister has all the control. this is a way for open eyes to take his/ her control back. actually apply for visitation actually gain the parents residing with him/her/ them/

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by amandalouise

yes I know that, thats why it was a question. people dont need to go to court to me their parents guardians/ caretakers anymore. it can be a situation where the parents understand they can not live alone and chose their oldest child or choose which child is more able to help take care of them. my wifes parents can not live on their own. their doctor asked then to fill out papers of which of their children were going to be responsible for making their decisions , who the doctors need to contact first, ... years ago they chose my wife for her mothers representative and my wife's brother for my wife's fathers representative. doing things this way is called advanced directives. my wife and I also have signed advance directives that names two family members to be in control should either one of us become unable to make our own decisions , the first on our advance directives is each other and I have chosen a relative.

thats what I meant when I asked....

I take it your sister is your parents guardians and caretakers?

rereading the posts in this thread its the sister the hospital called to take the mother, (evidence no one told open eyes his mother had been released.) sisnter decides who visits parents, who calls parents and how long the visits and calls are)

my suggestions about the court process was a way to get this changed. if the parents cant live on their own then the parents have to live with someone (open eyes or sister) by going to court open eyes can show why he / she doesnt agree with the sister and instead of sister or parents the court will decide what is best for the parents. it was a suggestion since open eyes is not happy with the present arrangements and according to the posts the sister has all the control. this is a way for open eyes to take his/ her control back. actually apply for visitation actually gain the parents residing with him/her/ them/

What you just said is a lot more positive sounding than what you previously said. Previously you said "I take it your sister is your parents guardian and caretaker now? if so, there's not much you can do...". And that was how you started off. Now in this response - you are in fact giving positive feedback without saying "not much you can do" (the words that can hurt).

I will say this though - the guardianship you are speaking of is medical guardianship and if only signed off by a doctor can be challenged at any time in the courts, as you stated. Guardianship in general though includes more than just medical supervision, and if Open Eyes sister I so monitoring who they talk to n for how long that would seem to go beyond medical care to me.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Open Eyes, you were always very supportive as well as very informative in past - which provided me with a lot of help. If it would be easier to pm, feel free to do so. I really would like to help if I can. *hugs* ❤

[scorpiosis37]

Could you invite your parents to lunch? Or a movie? Are they well enough to go on an outing with you? You can try to do something with them outside of your sister's house. If they aren't well enough for that, I would probably just suck it up and deal with your sister in order to spend time with your parents. They are old and you could never see them again, and your parents could pass thinking you don't want to see them. Putting up with some **** from your sister might be worth it just to see them.

[Sunflower123]

Originally Posted by scorpiosis37

Could you invite your parents to lunch? Or a movie? Are they well enough to go on an outing with you? You can try to do something with them outside of your sister's house. If they aren't well enough for that, I would probably just suck it up and deal with your sister in order to spend time with your parents. They are old and you could never see them again, and your parents could pass thinking you don't want to see them. Putting up with some **** from your sister might be worth it just to see them.

I agree with this. Do you have a therapist who could help you come up with a strategy for dealing with your sister without being triggered so you can see your parents?

[Open Eyes]

Thanks for the different suggestions and efforts to be supportive. I tried to post yesterday, but my post began to turn into a novel as I began to feel like I was asking a question and not giving enough history. But, it's not necessarily a bad thing that I spent so much time on that post because in my own review while doing that I saw some things important for ME to see.

My sister has been a huge challenge to me in that there were things about her that maybe I was unknowingly in denial about. I WANTED to love her and be close with her and have a sense of "safety" with her. Because I wanted that I did not see some of the red flags where the way she felt about me was "different". I did not see the flaws in her that others saw where they felt uncomfortable around her. My mom would say to me "she is jealous of you" and "jealous of how close my mom and I were". I did not see it, probably because recognizing that would not fit in with the way I wanted to see her where I put her in a place where I loved her and trusted her.

I would probably just suck it up and deal with your sister in order to spend time with your parents. They are old and you could never see them again, and your parents could pass thinking you don't want to see them. Putting up with some **** from your sister might be worth it just to see them.

I have tried to do this. But it got to the point where her behaviors began to traumatize me. For a while just hearing her voice would severely trigger me and I began having flashbacks. It actually took me a few years to figure out how she was the source of the triggers that would bring on these flashbacks.

The other day my older brother sent me videos of his grandson and grand daughter. His grandson is just a year old and just at the stage of learning to walk and take a few steps. The older one is a girl who is about 2 1/2 or close to three. In watching that video the mother would encourage this little boy to take steps towards her and when he took a few steps you can hear the mother with a high pitched voice praising him. What I could also see is the older daughter watching and every now and then she would run to the mother hoping to get some praise and in the video the mother never once acknowledged her with praise. What was interesting about that video is that the camera is focused on the two children so you don't get to see the mother but just get to focus on the two children. The baby boy was a happy little one and cute and not in any way in any position to have an awareness of how his getting that attention was actually taking away from his older sister getting that praise and attention.

My mom would always talk about how cute I was, that I was so sweet and friendly with personality and so outgoing and she looks at me so lovingly. She said to me, "your sister was not like that and always jealous of you for that".

What I have come to realize about my sister who is four years older than me is that her jealousy is simply because I existed, and she she ALWAYS hated my brother. In fact she used to threaten me that if I was nice to him and played with him that she would be angry and mean to me and not play with me. While I did not see this, I did feel it and I just did not understand what it was and went on just wanting to see her in a loving trusting way.

What I have slowly been realizing is that when we put someone in a mental place in our mind, when we put them in a place of love and trust and that person feels different and isn't what you believed in your mind, it can be TRAUMATIC when that person begins to act towards you in a very negative toxic way.

I have written about my sister several times since I joined and recently someone said to me in a thread, "you have talked about this before and if you look at your past posts you will see it". I repeated things I was experiencing so much because I was struggling on a very deep level when it came to her toxic behaviors that did not fit with the way I had placed her in my mind. So basically, it was a form of confusion and disbelief.

Over the years my sister always had the holidays at her home, Martha Stewart style. I liked how she decorated her home and always did a good job. What I did not see about that is how she was constantly pulling both my parents towards her in an OWNERSHIP way. Yet, on a subconscious level "I felt it". Does that make sense? I really struggled with that one myself for a really LONG TIME.

This is a very hard time of year for me. This is the anniversary of when I got so overwhelmed by all the damage my neighbor's dog did to all my horses and ponies where my little farm turned into a mini vet hospital where I was addressing so many injuries and sad endings for 4 months until I got so physically and mentally and emotionally exhausted that I had a post traumatic breakdown. The body can only handle being in hypervigilance for so long without any breaks or rest until the person breaks. I did talk about wanting to die because I just got to a point where I could not seem to get up one more day and function, I also had been experiencing night terrors and was not getting any true rest and sleep. I ended up in a psych ward literally BEGGING for rest and grief counseling. Everything I uttered were clear red flags of "trauma patient", but I did NOT get rest and grief counseling. My sister took over too and she never hugged me or sat with me in a caring way. I was abandoned in this lock up place with no rest and sense of safety and I was surrounded by people that actually frightened me too. Actually everything that was done with me was NOT what should be done with a trauma patient. My sister would not even let my parents come visit me and my mother would have NEVER let me be in that place and she would have understood the gravity of all that I had lost and how completely devastated I was. I could not get warm and constantly struggled with the chills. My room was so cold and that made the chills even worse. I was given medication that just made me ill and they got mad at me when I complained and continued to beg for rest, I was SO EXHAUSTED. And my sister came in and basically was mean to me "you better get with the program or you will lose your farm, your family, everything!". That is NOT something you EVER say to a trauma patient. My family was encouraged to stay away too and I was abandoned and treated like I was a bad girl for experiencing a post traumatic breakdown.

I tried to think about sucking it up and visiting my parents at my sister's house. They were SO HAPPY to see me and I had to work VERY HARD at focusing on talking about things with them that would keep me in the now. When I was there having a nice visit my sister paced back and forth and for the very first time in my life I finally saw what it was over my shoulder that was a negative presence that goes all the way back for me. Then she walked into the middle of the conversation and told me that I better leave because my vehicle was not safe where I parked it and her street was going to be closed down. This was a complete LIE, and my parents reacted with "Oh no, please don't take her away". Seeing them so upset I felt compelled to step up and smooth that out and say "Oh that's not happening, I do really have to go anyway". I guess I should have just sat there and stayed quiet and let them get angry at my sister's behavior. Sigh...can't go back and redo that. I really just did not want to see them upset so I basically threw myself under the bus on that one. And as I left my sister was right behind me, again I finally identified something I had not realized that was always there from the beginning only I did not understand it. She followed me to the door and out the door and expressed her displeasure about me just stopping by without an appointment. And I shook my head and said, "this was not some kind of pre-planned visit, I was doing a job very near here". After that I had a lot of flashbacks and struggled for several days. But what I hate more than that is struggling for several nights waking up with the shivers and how I have to do a ritual of using a hair dryer that I keep next to my bed and blowing hot air on myself in and effort to get the shivers to stop.

When you ask me divine, "how come so long" when I talk about the last time I have seen my parents, the reason for that is because of what I end up going through after I do see them. I also end up getting phone calls from my sister that are condescending and negative. She has accused me of saying things I never said, of doing things I never did and it gotten very clear how much she doesn't want me around my parents. If my mother knew how I was being treated that my sister found my mother's private notebook where she recorded things she did for me to help me, which was mostly to get me back on my feet after a major health issues including almost dying, that my sister decided to stand in judgement and be mean to me and shame me for whatever my mother and father did for me that was NEVER any of her business, my mother would be LIVID.

I was visiting my mother one time when she just happened to experience a stroke. It frightened me and I took steps to get her to the ER. My sister came into that ER in a rage at me and BLAMED the stroke on me. She was so mean and loud the entire staff and people in the waiting room were staring. I already was struggling with PTSD, her behavior towards me TRAUMATIZED ME that day.

I am not looking to take my parents away from my sister. I am not really sure WHAT is legally right when it comes to what my sister can and cannot do. However, in a recent conversation she had with my older brother she talked about having my father declared incompetent and asked if he would agree to her taking over complete conservatorship of their money and EVERYTHING. My brother's reply was that he would prefer a third party do that. Then my sister wrote him back telling him my father was fine and was calling all the shots. What that pretty much means is that my sister has decided that she has more control if she goes along with "saying" my father is fine and calling all the shots. This way when her septic tank broke she can say my father gave her money towards fixing it where that would not be allowed if he was deemed incompetent. I did talk to my lawyer and she told me that taking money from them for her own expenses is not allowed.

While writing this I have tried to call my father three times to wish him happy birthday and I only get the answering machine. My sister made a BIG DEAL about if I want to call my parents to do so in the Morning. I plan on calling about every half hour. I MAY not even get to talk to him so in that may not need to even think about what to say when he asks me when he will get to see me.

[seesaw]

I am so sorry you are going through this. Your sister sounds like a very controlling, frankly, ill, person, who has to make everyone around her miserable so she can be happy. Her treatment of your parents sounds like it borders on abuse or neglect, to me.

Honestly, if it were my parents asking me why I didn't visit more often, I would be honest and say that it's because of your sister. I would tell them that her behavior upsets you and causes you a lot of grief, and that it's not that you don't want to visit them, but it's hard for you to be put in a situation where you cannot even have a conversation with them.

Is there any way you can ask your sister to just let you visit your parents alone?

Or is there anyway you can invite just your parents to your place for brunch on a regular basis? That way you have a regular visit with them that she's not involved in? That's really the only solution I see because your sister is clearly not going to change.

Also, is there anyway to enlist your brother in aiding you? How does he view your sister's behavior?

And I totally know how it feels to have family turn on you when you have to be hospitalized for mental illness. Mine gave me the same "Get with the program and get well" treatment when I broke down. Which is just not how it works with PTSD and depression. You don't just get over it with a few days in the hospital. My dad thought my PTSD and depression were like addiction, and that he could "sober me up" from it...OMG, don't even get me started on how well that went.

I hope something happens to help change this situation for you, Open Eyes. I am only in contact with one family member, my mother, because of all the abuse and toxicity of my other family members...you have two parents you care for and losing that would be very sad.

Seesaw

[Open Eyes]

Well, I FINALLY got an answer and my sister picked up and began her BS of control. She said the helpers don't pick up the phone and then she begins her crap about telling me how to talk to my father. I responded with how I made it a point to call in the morning as she said that is the best time to call. I stood up to her (as some suggested here) and her reply was A LOUD "F You, F You" and she hung up on me. I managed to get in that I will get in my car and come there and after she yelled F you twice and hung up she must have decided she did not want me coming there and called back and handed the phone to my father.

YES, SHE IS MEAN, if she doesn't get HER WAY she yells F you and hangs up. SEE WHAT I AM DEALING WITH? Is it understood what "hovering" means now?

I had a nice conversation with my father, I told him I love him and I do miss him. Near the end he said, why don't you stop by some time. I said, "Dad, I am not welcome to do so, sorry" and it pretty much went over his head. I guess DENIAL is a comfort when one gets old like that.

I find myself wishing I had a recording how I was treated I could post so members could hear it for themselves, I would have to make sure to put a huge trigger warning on it.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

I agree with seesaw. I think you should let your parents know what's going on - it sounds as if they still have enough presence of mind to handle that knowledge - and see if your brother will be of any help to you.

Sounds like your sister is very embittered and like seesaw said, possibly ill herself. I definitely do not think she should have anything to do with handling your parents money - and if she does try to sway the courts in this direction or starts using it for personal reasons - I would put a stop to it by letting her behaviors and requesting a psych eval be done on her.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by Open Eyes

Well, I FINALLY got an answer and my sister picked up and began her BS of control. She said the helpers don't pick up the phone and then she begins her crap about telling me how to talk to my father. I responded with how I made it a point to call in the morning as she said that is the best time to call. I stood up to her (as some suggested here) and her reply was A LOUD "F You, F You" and she hung up on me. I managed to get in that I will get in my car and come there and after she yelled F you twice and hung up she must have decided she did not want me coming there and called back and handed the phone to my father.

YES, SHE IS MEAN, if she doesn't get HER WAY she yells F you and hangs up. SEE WHAT I AM DEALING WITH? Is it understood what "hovering" means now?

I had a nice conversation with my father, I told him I love him and I do miss him. Near the end he said, why don't you stop by some time. I said, "Dad, I am not welcome to do so, sorry" and it pretty much went over his head. I guess DENIAL is a comfort when one gets old like that.

I find myself wishing I had a recording how I was treated I could post so members could hear it for themselves, I would have to make sure to put a huge trigger warning on it.

I'm so sorry your sister treated you like this *hugs*

I am glad you got to have a pleasant conversation with your Dad at least though. Are you ok now?

[Open Eyes]

I feel very triggered and upset right now.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Is there anything you can do for relaxation? Diaphragm breathing? Visualization? Muscle Relaxation? Music?

[Open Eyes]

I am triggered, crying and exhausted and I also am in physical pain across my chest and down my arms so I think I am going to go lay down and put the TV on.

Thanks for listening and being supportive. I get lonely with this challenge.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Ok - please take care n be good to yourself ❤

[healingme4me]

((((OE))))

So sorry to read that you're in a triggered state. I read through the thread before posting. Your OP started with wondering how to tell your parents about not visiting more. And you did it! You told your dad that it's because you aren't welcome there.

It's a weight off, though this distraught after effect. Your sister doesn't sound like a very nice person. Your brother seems tuned in where he told her there was no way she was taking control legally speaking of their finances when she asked him about declaring your dad incompetent.
At least you have your brother for some understanding especially in a more historical context.