[NoIdeaWhatToDo]

I need somewhere to say what I'm genuinely feeling, and I unfortunately can't say it to my husband.

He has a new job opportunity in another state. He is miserable at his current job. We've had this discussion many times before, and he knows that our kids and I don't want to move anywhere. We have established roots and relationships where we are - we've lived here 9 years since he moved us here for his current job. Somehow, in that time, he has managed to make next to no connections to our community. When we talk about what we would be leaving behind, for him it's doing one activity that he likes here, but similar options would be available most places. He doesn't have any friends here, apparently. When we go out and socialize, it's apparently with 'my friends'. Which is hysterical, because I only have a couple of deep friendships and am basically a complete introvert, while he's a complete extrovert.

We know no one where he wants to move to. He knows one person well who would work in his office. He would be doing a different job than he has now, and one that involves several major tasks - one which he will likely enjoy and two which will likely make him incredibly bored, irritable, frustrated, etc. Because he wants to get out of where he is now, he only sees the positives. Because I want to stay here, I can only see the negatives. And, objectively speaking, there's really only ONE positive, which is that he will get to be in a different, shiny, new job away from where he is now.

Anyhow, I'm incredibly upset over all this, particularly because we've had the discussion multiple times, every time coming to the agreement that we're not uprooting our family to move for greener grass for him. And what he says to me now is that he just wants the decision to be made - if the possibility isn't there, he can shut it off and not look at it. But he wants to explore it if it's a possibility for our family.

Which SOUNDS reasonable, except the possibility has ALREADY been discussed and closed many times. Which tells me that this discussion will NEVER end until he gets what he's after, but he will continue to couch every discussion in these terms that make him feel like he's not being selfish and prioritizing his wants over the rest of us. (Ex., he keeps saying we're his number one priority, he knows how rooted we are in the community, he knows how important it is to us to stay here, our family is most important to him, he wants us to decide together, etc.)

If all that is true, though, this discussion would not keep happening. And I'm exhausted - which I think is part of how he subconsciously works (I KNOW it's not intentional). Whenever he wants something that I don't, we discuss it to death until I just can't actually keep having the same damn conversation anymore, and we do whatever he wants in the first place. But somehow, he ends up feeling like we came to the decision together.

So now, we're back at this major discussion, with him wanting the one thing that will make the rest of us unhappy, and any option that keeps us where we have our lives already destined to make him unhappy. So I don't know how to tell him (again or in a different way) that if he really prioritizes us, he'll stop looking at greener grass for himself and figure out how to broaden his experience of happiness so that it can include more than just his work...

[NoIdeaWhatToDo]

I guess I'll just keep adding here as I need to get stuff out...

So I realized yesterday, that if we move, we will miss our opportunity to complete our testing for our black belts in our martial art. We do this as a family, and there have been times I've wanted to give it up altogether because of my mental health struggles. He's convinced me time and again to stick with it. But for much of the time we've done it, I have wavered between feeling like it's an activity I do because it's important to him and feeling like it's something that is important and rewarding to me.

This year, however, he's been gone more than normal, I've been stable mental-health-wise, and I've really worked hard after several injuries over the years to develop myself in this art form. I was ready to test for my black belt this month, but my husband really wants to get our black belts together. Since he's been gone, he's not ready to test. Our Master knows that my husband really wants to do the black belt test at the same time. Both my husband and our Master have had conversations with me about that (and it's obvious they've had that conversation together without me), and the decision to test isn't up to me - our Master has the final word on that. I could tell when he told me we would wait that he wanted to explain to me why he was waiting and gauge my reaction.

My problem is that I KNOW it's personally important to my husband that we do this together - and objectively that's a lovely sentiment. But now I realize that we may not get to do it at all because of him, and I'm spiraling into this feeling that I've had all along, which is that this is some sort of weird novelty that our family does it together, but really, it's all about my husband. I don't get to reach the goal that I've worked for, because it's contingent on him being able to reach that goal. My value there is dependent on him. My achievement doesn't count without him.

It's infuriating, demoralizing, and completely representative of how I feel about our life together - I'm here to support him and join in when he wants company or when he wants to feel like we're a united family unit. But I'm secondary and always will be. And he will always present it in the way that's palatable to him (and how I think he genuinely thinks of/feels about it) - which is that it's about togetherness. But does that mean that if we're not together, it doesn't count? That things only count/matter if he's there or if they count/matter to him?

[Trippin2.0]

Idk what to say, just wanted you to know that I am paying attention and I care.

Sounds like a very lonely one sided marriage

I'm listening as well. I am not clear about something though. Will the Master not test you alone? He's just not going to test you because of something your husband said to him? That ticks me off. I assume that you pay this Master?

[ArchieAus]

Its unfortunate you feel you can't discuss this with your partner on equal terms. It seems you feel any discussion would be manipulated by him to reinforce what he wants . To justify the outcome he seeks . No one can really comment on that with any confidence of understanding the dynamic between yourself and your partner . But there's many people in this world that are very skilled at manipulating a discussion in such a way to get what they want .
Seems a few tangibles there though . Your partner is unhappy/miserable in his current employment . That's not something to be dismissed and could be very detrimental long term . Your very unhappy at the prospect of having to uproot your life and move to a new location . That's also something that could cause you to be miserable in the future . That led onto you mentioning that you feel you have been/are being manipulated in other areas . Is there no way of an amicably compromise , where you lay your feelings on the table and work together for a solution ? that is not just cut and dried "stay in the job or leave town "

[~Christina]

Wow just wow ....

Your plate is overflowing with discussions that seem to go in circles. Leaning towards his favor, even tho you have said “ no I do not want to move. “

From your thread it does seem very one sided. Can he not look in your area for a new job? Testing for the black belt ? I would proceed with it regardless of him wanting to do it with you, you obviously have worked long and hard to get to where you are mentally and physically.

Do you have a Therapist ? to help you sort through your feelings ? Would he consider couples counseling? I think that might be helpful to your situation.

I hope you can find a solution or at least a starting point.

[eskielover]

Wow, I am such an independent woman that what I always accomplished was on my own especially when I work for something. In my independence I would just tell my H I'm prepared to do the black belt & I need to do it now whether you are prepared or not. You do it when you are ready, I need to do it when I'm ready.

But I have to admit, I will be finslly getting my divorce this year. I got fed up & left him 10 years ago after being married 33 years & moved across the country to a farm I bought in a town where I knew no one & now I have the best friends I ever had in my life. Sometimes when we chase dreams it doesnt turn out good....sometimes it does. I left where I had lived all 54 years of my life with no regret. I doubt I could leave here & not feel horrible. I NOW understand what it is to have roots. Sounds like your marriage has some dysfunction involved on both parts....maybe a good marriage counselor might help yiu both learn a more functional way of dealing with each other within your marriage.

[NoIdeaWhatToDo]

Thanks for the replies, everyone - and for all the ideas.

I was in counseling for 3 years with a great therapist. We haven't talked in a long time, mainly because I haven't felt like I had anything significant to discuss with her. Towards the end of my therapy with her, my husband came with me - it was not a great experience. He was clearly uncomfortable (even though he had offered to come multiple times). He was very closed, and I am certain it's because he doesn't know how to be open and vulnerable with people. I'm the only person he has that he can be truly open with, and even that is hard won sometimes. It's too much for me to be his only confidante, but he doesn't make deep friendships with people in general.

I did tell him a week ago that we needed to see a counselor together. He agreed to go (reluctantly, but I'll take what I can get). I put a call in to someone on Monday, but she hasn't gotten back to me. I don't want to go to my therapist, because I don't feel that's very fair to my husband. I would rather see someone neutral that doesn't have a lot of one-sided history.

As for the black belt issue, right now it's immaterial about whether I want to test without him or not. I'm too late to start on this round, and if we move it would likely be before the next round. I think my husband would have been hurt but supportive if I told him I wanted to test whether he was ready or not - but at the time of discussion, this wasn't on the table and waiting 6 months didn't seem like a big deal. Our Master would likely have let me test if I objected to his reasoning, but it would feel very strange to do so - in general he is the one who lets us know if he feels we're ready to test. It would feel very strange in an art form that prizes humility in its practitioners, particularly with regard to the judgment of those higher in rank, to ask or demand more.

I'm not spiraling as much yesterday or today. We talked a little more, and decided he would apply for the temporary post to this job. That would give him 4 months there to see what he thinks. In the meantime, before that placement would start (if he gets it - that's not certain), we have a long list of things that need to be done around our home if we we're going to sell it. Those things are also on the list of just needing to get done in general, so even if we don't move, I'll be happy they're done. I'm focusing my energy there right now, which is helping me. I always feel better if I'm doing something productive, rather than feeling like everything is just happening around/to me.

I also had an interesting conversation with my older brother today about this. He's moved several times (granted, he's single and has no kids, which makes a lot of difference). The thing he said that really stuck with me was that even though the moves were uncomfortable, the only thing he ever regretted (in hindsight) was not doing it sooner. They were all great chances for growth, and they helped him professionally by keeping him moving rather than being stagnant. That is one thing that is certain - if we stay, my husband will certainly be stagnant professionally. And, he is genuinely terrified that he's not qualified/skilled enough to do what he should be doing in his position. I hate that for him, and I want more for him, particularly when more is possible.

For me, I know that I'm just terrified in general of change. It took me a lot (including going through a 10-year depression) to get to where I am today. My fear is that without a strong community of support around me, I'll end up there again. My husband is afraid of that, too - he's not insensible to what I would be leaving behind. He said tonight that he would absolutely hate himself if we moved and I ended up back in that state.

I guess I just don't know what will happen, and I know from my history and from my work in therapy that trying to control things that are unknown and not entirely within my control alone are a recipe for mental unrest. The more open I make myself to this as a possibility, the less freaked out I am. I'm still terrified, but I'm no longer sobbing uncontrollably about it. I'm calm and rational, and I feel better able to face this decision with some degree of pragmatism, rather than just all of my immediate emotional reactions.

That's another of my challenges. In the heat of my immediate reactions, it honestly can feel like my world is ending. I don't feel that way today, and I'm not sure of myself - whether time just helps me to see through my knee-jerk reactions, or whether familiarity with the idea and exhaustion with the emotional tax of it all moves me closer to reconciliation as a pathway out of the mental upheaval.

[~Christina]

I’m glad you have been able to talk with your husband more.

I agree a neutral Couples Therapist is the best way to go. Glad he is willing to go.

* hugs*

[eskielover]

You have grown a lot & experienced a lot since those 10 years of depression. If you were capable of getting into the community where yiu are now, you have the skills to do it in the new location. You are older, wiser, & have more experience now then yiuvdid then to draw from.

Yes, neutral therapy can be good but there is something to be said about going to someone who only needs to learn the other half of the picture instead of the whole thing.