[Sadley]

Hi, long story short I've had depression for most of my life and I am a 23 year old male. I'm sorry for burdening anyone with this but I don't have anyone to talk to because I don't want to talk to my family because they just don't understand, and I've already told my therapist most everything and well that brings me to my problem. I've been seeing a therapist for about 3 months now and I feel like I've made no progress whatsoever. Well actually I feel more depressed after every time I go. I feel suicidal sometimes right after I visit and I don't know if I might lose it one day.

He is a joking-around type trying to always get me to laugh, which is understandable, but I don't think he really "gets" me. He doesn't seem to understand just how depressed I am and I don't feel that he knows what kind of treatment I really need.

After quite a few visits, he proposed that we purchase this self-help depression book, but its like, if I could help myself then I wouldn't be going to a therapist? I don't understand. So I did it anyway because I'm desperate to find a way to feel better even slightly, and yesterday was just horrible. I had a really low mood yesterday and I went in there and I just felt like I could barely speak, and I feel so sad and hopeless. The homework beforehand was to read chapter 1, so I did. In this session though, he read a couple passages from the chapter aloud and talked a little tiny bit about what he thought about it. Then he wanted me to talk about it, but I didn't have anything to say. I never know what to say, I really don't agree with this author and I don't find anything useful or helpful about this book. I said I don't have anything to say about it, and then my therapist just closes his book and says he won't make me do something I don't want to do, and we literally just sat there for 45 minutes doing nothing. I'm sorry but this is total ********, is this not? I am so confused.

I realize that this isn't even enough information for anyone to really help me but I am just so desperate... I don't know what to do anymore... I have such a hard time finding the right people in the medical field such as psychologists and psychiatrists. I've had already 3 really negatively impacting experiences that made me want to kill myself even more. I don't know if I can take much more of this.

[lindammarie]

Hello, Sadly.

I'm glad you're here. It's a good place to talk to others and to glean ideas about how to "help yourself" (even if that means helping your therapist )

I have suffered from depression since I was a teenager (I am 60 now) -- and I can't imagine I would have known how to handle myself with a therapist in my 20s. At that point, I was trying to hide the fact that I ever got depressed... So you're ahead of me.

I saw my first counselor when I was in my 30s. He told me his depressed wife had to undergo shock treatments & then said he could no longer counsel me. I went elsewhere... With that therapist, I started listened to his problems to the point that one visit he did not even charge me for.

I've had the "lets work through a book" therapist, the "you just need to know what the Bible says" therapist, the "my husband hates him" therapist AND some good ones along the way.

Having said that, maybe you have some options open to you. If you don't "click" with your therapist maybe you can meet with another?

Just try to be honest. And write things down before you go to a session. That may take some pressure off.

I'm so sorry you are suffering. Maybe talking with some of us will give you the support you need...

[browneyed tx girl]

Sadley, you are NOT alone in this! And Lindammarie said it ALL and put it very very well! I have battled depression and associated illnesses since I was 7 years old (knocking on 40). At that time doctors just wanted to give me a pill to make me sleep and turn me into a Zombie that my family could deal with. As I got older and started seeking T or C I had my share of these experiences too. I would like to share some things and know I am going to fail to put it well. It is from my experiences and I truly hope it can help you. In this case it sounds like your T is trying to make you comfortable and lighten your mood with his humor. However, ill timed the humor maybe. The book thing... well perhaps it was a hope that it would help you open up or start a line of communication he can follow. What I am about to say is much easier said then done when dealing what you are dealing with, but it really helped me: You are going to have to take control of your sessions and stand up and say that this type of treatment is not working! If you need to sit down and make a list of the things the T is trying and how you feel about it, then do it. Also make an outline of your needs, wants and expectations for the T. Ask if he can fulfill them and if not, no harm, no foul, but you have to find someone willing to work with you on a level comfortable for you and that you feel is beneficial to you! He may not understand how to reach you and is just as frustrated as you are, hoping to find the right thing to say or the right way to help you. The best outcome is that you and him can find a way to work together or you find a new T who can help in a way that you respond to. Depression robs us of our control and courage! It is a huge leap for someone who feels so low, I know. Just don't give up! If this one thing turns out successful perhaps you will feel better about taking control of other things in your life. Once I realized I do have some control and what I feel, say or think matters, it was became easier and less scary. Here if you need to talk. As you can see I have way too much to say!

[Sadley]

Thanks for replying. I read what you said and I know that I am not alone in depression but I still can't help but feel totally alone. My therapist makes me want to call and stop my sessions and never say goodbye. He says he wants at least one additional session if I do decide to quit so that I can tell him what he did "wrong". But I don't believe in right or wrong, or anything else, I just don't think this is helping me at all.

I have a real problem making decisions, so I don't know what to do, if I should just call the receptionist and tell her I'm not going anymore, or if I should really go back. I don't think I can go back. Oh yeah, well on Thursday whenever it was so quiet for a long time he finally asked me what I was thinking about, and I said, "that this is just not going to work" and I don't even remember what he said after that but the impression I got was he really didn't care. He just wants to joke around and he can't see what I really need I don't think.

I just want to give up. There is nothing in life that gives me pleasure, no joy in my life at all. I think I'm too far gone to even go along with these "self-help" books, they require you to have hope as a precursor and write down in exercises what steps you can take to help yourself, but for me I would just write down, "there is nothing that can help me", and "I didn't find any key ideas in this chapter that were useful" because truthfully they weren't useful because I have no will to live, no self-control, no motivation at all.

I know that he is trying to get me to open up and talk and whatnot, but I feel like no matter what I say, he still won't really understand me. And I don't have any needs, wants, or expectations of my therapist because I don't want anything from this world, I just want to die. I hate everything and I just can't function or live.

I feel totally not-in-control of anything. I feel like everything that will happen will happen regardless of anything we think we might be trying to change or do different.

[Sadley]

To Sam2, (I was unable to send a PM to you because it requires me to have 5 posts first, sorry)

Thanks for replying. It always saddens me to see/hear about older folks who have suffered for so long. I'm truly sorry for you. I haven't tried to kill myself yet, but I don't think it would be an attempt, if I were to do it, I would make sure that I would be dead.

I've been honest and truthful the whole time to my therapist, as I am with everyone I talk to. I don't like lying or hiding. Still, I agree with you, there are some doors that you hope you never have to open.

I told my therapist my whole life story pretty much, and he still wants me to talk more. I just can't I don't know what to say. I don't really care about anything, don't really want anything. And that is another problem. Therapists look at therapy like any other business. They have a client (me) and they expect that client to have expectations and wants and goals, but all of these are things I just don't have. I'm only there because I don't know what else to do with myself and I either want to get better or find a way to end it. I guess some people just can't understand that.

My therapist doesn't really "get" me, and he tries to make me laugh and stuff, which I don't have anything against it, but it just isn't going to work on me. I think I am too far gone, you know? Because you can't clean this slate, once it is there it is always there it seems.

I don't think it is necessarily about finding a "good" therapist, I think it is just that the way people communicate to each other is like they are talking past each other and not to each other. It is really just impossible to truly understand another person simply because, we aren't them.

[montanan4ever]

Oh dear. First of all, WELCOME. We're in hell together right now, so at least we are not alone. I'm a depression veteran, unfortunately. Lots of other issues, too. I've been in therapy for twenty years straight and counting.

It's so hard to feel not heard and not understood by a therapist. I empathize hugely. The one I had before my current one (the one I've been with for 20 years and counting) was a clueless user of tools, which is what your description of your therapist sounds like to me. The ONLY good thing he did was to give me an excellent referral.

What really counts in therapy is the strength of the relationship. When you don't have that, the tools don't work.

You are NOT too far gone, my friend. Please keep posting. Would you possibly considering sharing what you have written here with your therapist? Maybe that might help him know what's happening inside your head and give him a clue that what he's doing is not being useful.

I am also a psych student with a lot of pastoral counseling experience, and from that corner of my brain, (which remember is ONLY my opinion, NOT professional advice or anything like that) I'm saying, "Boy, this therapist sounds like he didn't make it out of sophomore year of college." If I were in your shoes I'd be confronting him about his lousy technique and/or looking elsewhere....Again, coming from *that* corner of my brain. I realize, since I'm currently here in hell with you, that such efforts sound far beyond anything doable. But they *are* options. Just let that roll around in your brain. Maybe something will grow from it and you'll find a way to make yourself heard.

You deserve GOOD help.

[MelanieK]

There are many different types of therapy than the one you experienced.

I am a psychology student and with the groups permission for which I interned was allowed to make observations in a group dynamic. The atmosphere of mutual support and understanding may be good for you since you did not feel rapport with your therapist. Expressing yourself in that environment may help you articulate what is hurtful for you, examine this, and form some ideas on a approach towards taking the steps which will improve the quality of your life.

One reason that you may have a bad fit with your therapist is that he may be solution focused as opposed to problem focused - there are debates amongst professionals on this. A problem focused approach feels that the client needs to be able to release (transference) the pain, shame, anger that a client feels in a safe environment with the therapist. The therapist has a positive regard for the client that lets them know that this is ok (and helps them understand the difference between release and acting out). This could be likened to cleaning a wound before attempting to dress it.
Solution focused can begin (in my opinion) in tandem with this or thereafter - but any attempts to go directly to behavior modification or cognitive approaches without examining psychoanalytical content is not as successful (according to the APA) as a stand alone treatment.
Because insurance is hesitant to pay for psychoanalysis, due to the lengthy duration of treatment, a therapist who has a psychodynamic approach is a good choice. That is a composite of therapies that is less long term and has a high success rate.

You expressed a hesitation with opening up to your particular therapist so finding the situation which allows you to experience your inner world and bring this forth in your communication within a therapeutic setting will be very important in your progress.

I hope that was not to much jargon - the main point is that therapy can make a lasting difference in a persons life. A good therapist will help facilitate your gradual building of skills and strengths, and help you form clarity which will give you balance and control over your life. You certainly are worth taking the time to explore this and find out which option is best suited for you.

Do not despair - you are 23, and that should be good news because you can transform your present and your future. Yes there are many people who are older and who suffer - there is no magic age, Erikson's life stages continue throughout our lives, it is a good suggestion to search on the net and read about Erikson's 8 stages of development as is taught in developmental psychology.

We continue to face difficulty and transitions in our lives but with a competent therapist you can begin the process of deconstructing what does not work and structuring a solid base of peace and possibility for yourself that will shape your future. I would not say this if I did not know first hand that it is true :>

[lindammarie]

Sadly,

If you can't speak to your therapist, it's not your fault. You are talking to us...

Keep talking here. You will find people who are willing to listen. And in time I think you will be able to decide what to do next.

It is horrible to feel so stuck, but stuck doesn't have to be forever...

[GreyThinker]

Just want to agree with everyone here. I don't have anything new to add, unfortunately. Can't you just tell this therapist it is not working out and you would like a referral? Must you give reasons? There may just be communication problems that you won't have with someone else. Like lindamarie says, there are lots of different types of therapists, which is good because that means there is one (or many) out there that are just right for you.

[browneyed tx girl]

Originally Posted by Sadley

Thanks for replying. I read what you said and I know that I am not alone in depression but I still can't help but feel totally alone. My therapist makes me want to call and stop my sessions and never say goodbye. He says he wants at least one additional session if I do decide to quit so that I can tell him what he did "wrong". But I don't believe in right or wrong, or anything else, I just don't think this is helping me at all.

I have a real problem making decisions, so I don't know what to do, if I should just call the receptionist and tell her I'm not going anymore, or if I should really go back. I don't think I can go back. Oh yeah, well on Thursday whenever it was so quiet for a long time he finally asked me what I was thinking about, and I said, "that this is just not going to work" and I don't even remember what he said after that but the impression I got was he really didn't care. He just wants to joke around and he can't see what I really need I don't think.

I just want to give up. There is nothing in life that gives me pleasure, no joy in my life at all. I think I'm too far gone to even go along with these "self-help" books, they require you to have hope as a precursor and write down in exercises what steps you can take to help yourself, but for me I would just write down, "there is nothing that can help me", and "I didn't find any key ideas in this chapter that were useful" because truthfully they weren't useful because I have no will to live, no self-control, no motivation at all.

I know that he is trying to get me to open up and talk and whatnot, but I feel like no matter what I say, he still won't really understand me. And I don't have any needs, wants, or expectations of my therapist because I don't want anything from this world, I just want to die. I hate everything and I just can't function or live.

I feel totally not-in-control of anything. I feel like everything that will happen will happen regardless of anything we think we might be trying to change or do different.

Sadly- I am so glad you replied. I hope that each time you post, read our replies or reply yourself, you feel that there is a spark of hope and understanding. Those of us "older" (AHEM) folks who have dealt with this for so long, really take it to heart when someone is battling and want to spare you any grief and pain that we can! Like I said earlier, in my early days doctors wanted to ignore you and not acknowledge the problems or put you to sleep so you weren't a bother. The next generation had everything blamed on the parents and nothing was solved as well. Now days it seems they want to give you a new pill and pick it apart for EVER! But you are communicating to all of us here! It is a very vital step and you should be proud! This T may not understand you, true. BUT that is probably because he isn't qualified to help every person who comes in and he CERTAINLY isn't going to say that he isn't! It is not your responsibility to justify your decision to your T! Sounds like he is looking for some sort of validation and when he doesn't receive it, is likely to get defensive. So, seek out a new T. Ask your medical doctor or someone if they can recommend someone. Many insurance companies have a Mental Health program and can probably assist you with finding someone. As for the self-help books... well there is a time and place for those, but it doesn't sound like you are there yet. I couldn't find help in them for a long time either. Once I started getting things back into place and had some perspective, I found a lot of help in them. The first one I ever read completely and that made any sense to my situation was "Perfect Daughters: Adult Daughters of Alcoholics". After that I found some really good ones and still a lot that left me thinking WTH!? Not everything is going to work for everyone, but there is something out there that will. I hope that by seeking out this site and posting your story here that you will realize that you have more hope than you may think. You matter! It matters! We all matter! We have been there and we may not have a PhD, but we have ears (OK... literal people... we have EYES in this case), heart and experience. Drop me a line if you would like. I am not on here often, but will look for you when I am. Wishing you sunshine and sending you hugs!

[Sadley]

Thanks again for the replies, and also your concern, everyone.

I'm not the best at explaining things, but I try. This might be kind of long.

montanan4ever, my therapist said "You don't really want to do this (read out of my workbook for depression) do you?" And after I told him "No, I don't really want to do anything" he said "You leave me with two choices, to force you to do it, or not do it and I don't want to have to be your parent or teacher, so I will close the book". So you can see why I might feel like I am too far gone. It's like, I have to already have a will power to do it before I can proceed. But that is the problem, I need help that is further back than here, I don't know if that makes any sense.

lindammarie, thanks for the advice. I was reading your previous reply and I can't help but feel sad. I will never understand why us humans have to suffer and endure all this crap. I suppose I could try to find another therapist, but it is so stressful and frustrating for me. I really don't want to have to spend months of sessions just explaining the things I had just already explained over again...ugh. I did write down some things before I went one time on note cards, and that did help a little bit.

GreyThinker, my insurance just switched with the coming of 2013, I probably would have to find somebody else on my own. And yes, he wants real reasons and an explanation why I want to stop. Now that I have kind of gotten deeper into it I honestly think that counseling as a whole probably isn't going to work for me. That is, if all counseling requires YOU to be responsible of deciding what to talk about, and if it requires you to have goals. I don't know what else is out there, or what I really need, but it sure doesn't seem like it exists, and this makes me feel hopeless again.

browneyed tx girl, I am really afraid of going on some pills and trying to drive and work as normal. I don't want to end up hurting anybody else because of some pill that makes me have blurred vision, nausea, fatigue, and strange mood changes or altered thoughts. At least, that is what I have already experienced when I took 10mg Prozac for a very short amount of time. Yes, I have already pissed my therapist off and seen his defensive side. As I have said above, I really would hate to have to waste months in sessions just explaining everything over again, just to find out that another therapist isn't going to work. I am sorry but I cannot help but to think nothing matters.

[alantam]

I have been suffering from anxiety and depression since my early teens and now I am almost 40. I know exactly how you feel because I have been in the same position like you. My resilience is very low but I suggest that you can keep finding the right therapist that you and him/her can have a click. Also, try to keep your mind off by focusing an activity that you enjoy the most like watching TV shows that you like. Hope it helps.

[GreyThinker]

HI Sadley, good to hear from you again. I don't know why your therapist is acting like this; it is not the standard practise, in my experience, to try to force someone to do something till they are ready, or to be so forceful in pushing their own agenda. I get the impression that he is fixated on one type of therapy only, and forgets that different people need different approaches. You sometimes find this in young, new therapists or in older ones who believe the 'old school' is the only way. Please don't let this put you off trying someone else who might be a much better fit for you.

As for the medication... sounds like Prozac is not the pill for you, or maybe you need a lower dose. Lots of others you can try....

[lindammarie]

Thinking of you today, Sadley. Therapy is hard work and I, too, am sick of explaining "everything" to someone new. (Currently it's keeping me from looking for another internist.)

I guess the question is: Which is harder, re-explaining or sticking with "the devil you know"?

Once you know the answer to that question, then the work is to "commit" to your decision...

I wish I knew a shortcut.

[montanan4ever]

Um, WOW. This quote is very strange! "You leave me with two choices, to force you to do it, or not do it and I don't want to have to be your parent or teacher, so I will close the book".

I can well imagine that you would have heard that as saying you were too far gone for help! How very, very weird. I mean.....It's a good thing that he doesn't want to be your parent or teacher, because those roles are both WRONG for a therapist. But gee, what does it MEAN? Did the conversation go any further after that? Did he explain himself? Were you able to hear anything else he said?

I think if I were in your shoes (thinking back to when I was beginning in therapy at just a couple years older than you are now), I would have felt very hopeless and not heard, indeed. Yowza. If I could reach back to that young, very much suffering person I was and change anything, it would be to confront the therapist and let him know that he was not being helpful, that all I heard from him was condemnation, and WTF was he trying to DO to me anyway?!? Oy, does this bring back the memories.

I have this mental image of a mechanic taking tools out of his toolbox and throwing them at a car to fix it!

There are a lot of different medications, and I'd like to invite you to consider trying some others. Prozac is in one specific category, so perhaps you might respond better to an antidepressant from a different category, or even a newer medication from the same category.

It is terribly hard to be in this place where trial and error comes out more on the side of error. Please don't stop trying. Keep fighting. It *is* worth it. That feeling/voice/belief that nothing is worth it....is the disease speaking. We *all* know what it's like. The fact that you have posted again, and that you care to get up and go to work....That's wonderful. You are fighting for your life and that is a good thing.

[sadstar]

Tell your therapist what you think! Tell him you think the book sucks or what ever you think about it

[Sadley]

alantam, I am sorry you had to experience it. I will consider your advice, but I will give my current therapist at least one more try. I do keep myself occupied, I play video games all the time.

GreyThinker, yes I get the same impression also, but then again I don't know because I don't get the chance to see how he acts to other people who are depressed. I have an appointment for another Psychiatrist coming up soon, its just going to be another experiment.

lindammarie, I'm not sure I know the answer yet.

montanan4ever, I'm not so sure if those roles would be wrong for a therapist. What if that is what I need? Seems like they should do whatever works. What he is doing now isn't working. No, after that we sat for 30 minutes in silence, until he asked me what I was thinking. Then it was time to go. And I've flat out told him that the sessions felt worthless and unhelpful. Then he just started saying his speel about giving him one final session to tell him what he did "wrong".

I was utterly shocked with my 2nd psychiatrist, I couldn't believe what he was telling me. After I told him I stopped taking the Prozac because I was having a reaction to the drug he told me I just have to keep taking it for the two weeks, then come back to see him. I told him I could be endangering other people not to mention myself, and asked how am I supposed to drive to work and drive with these symptoms? He said: "Plenty of other people drive and work every day on the medication". Then I said, well I am different. Then he said, "Yes you are very different" and told me I was just skeptical and a complainer. I was so pissed that I thought I was going to reach across his desk and punch him out. I went through so much ******** at that place it is really sickening. At least now with that behind me I will be able to think more about what I will say to another psychiatrist.

[GreyThinker]

Originally Posted by sadstar

Tell your therapist what you think! Tell him you think the book sucks or what ever you think about it

yeah... this!!

[montanan4ever]

Good Lord :-O. I'm stunned.

[awebb198488]

From reading your posts I think it might be in your best interest to see a new therapist. If my therapist wanted me to read from a book during every session I would lose my freakin mind. Please don't give up. Try a different therapist and see if it helps.