[Gr3tta]

I originally posed this question in the "Couch" thread, but several people suggested that it needed a thread of it's own. I look forward to reading any replies - thanks!

I am wondering what responsibility you take upon yourselves to make therapy productive, and what responsibility you place upon the therapist/pdoc? Do you place a heavier burden on the professional? On yourself? Is it 50/50?

[WikidPissah]

wow. That's a really good question. I think I put most of the responsibility on him...but I know that is definitely not a good thing. I need to take more responsibility for the relationship...be open, honest, reach out. Heck, if I don't tell him what's going on he can't really help right? Well, that's what I have figured out...not sure how I am going to make myself change though.

[lrt1978]

My relationship is I need to try and be 100% honest, I expect my psychologist to be able to guide me and help me when I become stuck or fall, I am doing CBT so she sets the homework and in order for therapy to work I have to do the work outside therapy,

So I would say for me it feels 50/50

[unaluna]

I think it's like the SAT's and GRE's and GMAT's. When I took the paper versions, I scored high because I could skip the questions I couldn't answer. But ten years ago, when I wanted to tutor the GMAT, I retook it on the computer and scored horribly, because the computer wouldn't let me move on to a more difficult question until I had successfully answered all the easier questions.

A therapist is kind of like the computer version of these test. You think you're smarter, you KNOW you're smarter, you've PROVEN you're smarter - but they keep harping back on this one unimportant thing, and trying all different ways to get you past it, and you wonder why can't we just move on?! Why don't THEY get it?? How dumb are THEY???

Until you realize who is asking (and paying) whom for advice...

so not sure if this answers your question. I know that the therapist cannot go faster than the client is able to, it's like a 3-legged race, you are in it together.

[Sannah]

I think that it is 75% us. The 75% includes bringing issues to session to work on, letting our feelings out and working hard to get better. The therapist needs to give insight, listen, feel with us and jump into the subjects that we bring up.

One aspect of being healthy is being empowered. You cannot be mentally healthy and be disempowered. Why wait? Become empowered ASAP and take control of your therapy.

I think that T and I both give 100% effort and work as a team.

[stopdog]

Usually I think the therapist provides high price rent space and does nothing else - so the client does everything.

Originally Posted by stopdog

Usually I think the therapist provides high price rent space and does nothing else - so the client does everything.

Having had a couple of crappy therapists, I KNOW this isn't true for me. For me, the wrong person sitting there with was not only not helpful, it was actually harmful. So, while I take the bulk of the responsibility for my therapy, I know beyond any doubt that he does much of the work also. Or somehow helps me to do the work.

I can sit all day in therapy and do nothing, say nothing, work on nothing, etc., no matter how skilled the therapist is. If I don't commit to doing the work, taking the risks, trusting that other individual in the room, absolutely NOTHING will come of it. I really do have a huge amount of control over what goes on in that room. I have to take on the responsibility for myself and my progress in the first place for anything productive to take place. Once I have done that, it is the therapists job to guide me, listen to me, work with me, and move me along the path to healing. So what's the percentage? I'm thinking 75% is our commitment to do the hard work it takes.

You can lead a horse to water . . .

It certainly is team effort. A lot of what my therapist contributes is non verbal. To many People have a lot to say but not too give. Took a few yrs to understand what T gives its only suddenly when I felt that non verbal feeling toward someone that the Puzzle fit

[northgirl]

I would agree with the comments that it is 75% me, 25% T. I definitely feel that if I am not getting out of therapy what I need, I am not working hard enough. If I just "show up" without treating it like a task to complete, nothing substantial will get accomplished. I just see T's role as one of being there to listen, let me express things that maybe I can't tell anyone else, but will also try to push me to think about things and how they are related to everything I suffer with.

I do think this would be a good question to ask our T's though too- would be interesting to see how they respond to where they see the responsibility and burden lying with...

Originally Posted by northgirl

I do think this would be a good question to ask our T's though too- would be interesting to see how they respond to where they see the responsibility and burden lying with...

I suspect my T would agree about the 75% client thing, but that is the way he does things. He doesn't mince words with me and has no problem letting me know if I am not "doing the work". He is all about leading me to be empowered and finding autonomy. That takes work.

As a teacher, I see this play out with certain students every semester. There is always that one or two who come to class without their work, absolutely refuse to do the work in class, want to lay their heads down on the desk instead of engaging in the discussions and interaction in class. It is like they shoot themselves in the foot at every possible juncture. I feel for them because until they make the decision to engage and tune in, they are making the choice to not learn, to not pass, and to have to take the class again (which has to be a drag). I can do cartwheels around the room trying to help them, but they have to choose to do the work. I can't do it for them. As a teacher, and I imagine as a therapist, it is painful and frustrating to watch a student/client self-destruct.

[stopdog]

As a teacher, I am not usually bothered if a student does not want to play the game with me. It is their life, not mine. Perhaps their way will work for them eventually. I imagine the therapist feels the same way. The big difference is I explain what I am doing and why to the students and therapists do not.

depends where i am at, there at times i went in gave 110% and felt t did the same. then the times when i just didn't have have it in me to give anything, barely made it in there, those are the times t is giving me 150% because i don't have it in me to give at all. then the times we are both doing the 50-50 thing. i always feel like t is giving more cause he has the knowledge. i mostly try to take what he says and run with it outside of t...that is where i can give more as well.

Originally Posted by farmergirl

I can sit all day in therapy and do nothing, say nothing, work on nothing, etc., no matter how skilled the therapist is. If I don't commit to doing the work, taking the risks, trusting that other individual in the room, absolutely NOTHING will come of it. I really do have a huge amount of control over what goes on in that room. I have to take on the responsibility for myself and my progress in the first place for anything productive to take place. Once I have done that, it is the therapists job to guide me, listen to me, work with me, and move me along the path to healing. So what's the percentage? I'm thinking 75% is our commitment to do the hard work it takes.

You can lead a horse to water . . .

I agree with farmergirl. It is my life, and I have the ultimate responsibility for it. I'm working to improve my life and get through some issues. This is my battle and I do it continually. If I'm lucky, once a week I get 50 mins with T to discuss things and get his viewpoint. Also he has ideas and how and what to do.

But the bottom line is .... I'm doing therapy, with or without him. It's just a lot more fun WITH him.

[carla.cdt]

I think for me the % increased on my part as the therapy prograssed. I could process and see things clearly/wisely, so the therapist had to do lots of guiding, questionning, teaching...
Is the goal at the end of therapy to be for the client close to 100%...
Good question!

[Seshat]

I expect both of us to do our best. I know this is not always possible because humans make mistakes, but intention is what counts. My T doesn't send homework, but he knows I keep a journal and he knows I carefully try to look for answers outside of therapy sessions as well (I do talk to T about it all).

[Sannah]

I remembered earlier today what I learned from some therapists while in training. I was told to never want the client to get better more then they do and/or work harder then they do. The reason being boundaries. If the therapist is working harder, the client's outcome will become theirs and this is a slippery slope. Of course there can be give and take with this. If the client normally works hard and has a bad day the T can take up some slack that day.

[stopdog]

How could a therapist "work" harder than a client? I am serious - I don't even know what this means. Plus how does the therapist know how hard a client is working? Just because the client is not all submissive or compliant or whatever to the therapist does not mean they are not working. It sounds to me like just another therapist way to blame the client and accept no responsibility for what they do.

[Sannah]

A T makes sure they aren't working harder by letting the client take the lead. It isn't the T's therapy. It belongs to the client.

If a client is submissive and compliant this is not good at all.

[Perna]

Originally Posted by Gr3tta

I am wondering what responsibility you take

It's my life, my therapy, I'm the only one her can take any responsibility.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by Sannah

A T makes sure they aren't working harder by letting the client take the lead. It isn't the T's therapy. It belongs to the client.

If a client is submissive and compliant this is not good at all.

I think a better phrase would be the therapist should not care more about the outcome than the client. Not work harder. The client who does not know what to do cannot lead. Therapists are all so cloak and dagger and non clear that the idea of the client not taking the lead when the client does not and cannot - by the design of the therapist- know- is in my opinion - blaming the client. IF the client knew what to do, they would have no use for the therapist in the first place.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by Perna

It's my life, my therapy, I'm the only one her can take any responsibility.

The therapist is taking money to perform some service - surely they have some responsibility.

[rainboots87]

There is definitely more responsibility on me. My T can and does point me in the right direction, guide me, and bring up important things I need to hear. However, it 's up to me to be honest with her and with myself and to put in the time and effort to change and work on my goals. I think a good T facilitates therapy and sets the foundation and creates a safe space, but I hold the ultimate responsibility. My T could do whatever she wants (i.e., address the goals that she thinks are necessary, etc.), but I'm the one who has to do the work towards my own goals.

[rainbow_rose]

Originally Posted by stopdog

The therapist is taking money to perform some service - surely they have some responsibility.

IMO, they have an ethical responsibility.