My H says I don't need 90 minutes

This isn't helpful to your overall situation...but my ex-husband felt left out and was jealous of the attention I gave my chronically ill cats. Some of that came out in our therapy together, otherwise I would never, ever have thought it a possible option...he wanted more attention and felt like I cared more for them than him.
So your H might not agree and might be against your therapy because he doesn't feel part of it or understand it, or feels jealous of the feelings you have for your T and perhaps wonders (even if it's somewhat unconscious) where your feelings for him fit in.

It IS helpful because it's true. Thanks. I try, but right now we're arguing again about therapy and how I'm wasting my money. He won't go to marriage counseling, of course. He is angry about my T's salary. I guess all T's salaries. So am I, but I don't go yelling about it! I don't think we're happy with each other but we're staying together. Neither of us wants a divorce. I don't know if I love him or not and I don't know if he loves me but I'd be miserable without him. Married 40 years; we're not going to separate now. Too much stress. Then I'd need T and wouldn't be able to afford it at all! I keep trying to be nice to him, but it's very difficult.

Why are you angry about all T's salaries?

I have an idea (and this is just my opinion, mind you). Why not cut back to 45 minutes every other week? I say this because it could help greatly with becoming less dependent on your T. I don't think 90 minutes is healthy. I realize that you use every single minute of the 90 min. session but you don't need to tell her every little thing that is on your mind and going on in your life. Cutting back will help you decide what's most important to work on in session. The need to tell T everything is an OCD thing. I've been there, trust me. Maybe start with cutting down to 45 min. sessions weekly and taper off slowly to having more time between sessions. I know you won't like this, but from personal experience it helped me so much to stop suffering and it also strengthened my bond with my therapist. My whole life used to revolve around therapy, and I never thought i could live without it, but now i am finally ready to let go. I NEVER in a million years thought id ever get to this point. 15 years with my T! And we will always be connected. It's so freeing rainbow!

Perhaps you've already done so and I just missed it, but have you actually ASKED your T about the changes in your billing? Have you asked insurance why your co-pay is higher? Since this change in billing seems to be a big deal for both you and your H, I think getting some clarity around that might be a good start.

I do think the issues between you and H around therapy go deeper than just money, but it would be a place to start anyway.

I know this is a difficult situation on all sides, but I think I can understand a lot of your husband's feelings in this situation. As others have said, it doesn't sound as though it's REALLY about the money. It's about the fact that he does not see any improvement in the way you behave towards him/your relationship/ways that impact his life. All he sees is that his wife spends more of her time and more of her emotional energy with T/thinking about T/ posting about T than she does on him and on her family. He's your H and he wants the same kind of emotional investment put into him that you put into T. And, when you think about, isn't that a reasonable request? He's the one who is there every day, he's the one changing the light bulbs, mowing the lawn, balancing the checkbook, buying you birthday gifts, worrying about your health, double-checking your insurance forms, etc. He invests a lot into your well-being, and he simply wants to feel loved and appreciated. From his perspective, he's wondering why you're more emotionally invested in a T (who does not do all of these things for you, who has not shared all of life's moments like births, weddings, graduations, etc with you, who is not "in love" with you)-- than you are in him. If he's an old-fashioned guy in his 60s, he's probably not going to put this into elegant, heart-felt language, cry about feeling like he has "lost" you, or say that he or say that he feels inadequate because you'd rather be with your T than with him. But I would bet money that he does feel that way. One's spouse wants to feel that they are the most important person in your world, the only person you are "in love" with, and they want to be the one who makes you smile, the first person you think about when you wake up in the morning and go to bed at night, and the person who understands you the best in the whole world. It's incredibly painful to be married to someone and to know that they are thinking more about someone else than they are about you. It's probably much more confusing when the person your spouse is thinking about is their T! And, if your husband is thinking that therapy should help you improve your marriage-- and, instead, therapy is making it worse because it's causing you to take your attention away from your H and put it on your T-- then it makes sense that he's saying therapy is not helping. Therapy may be helping your issues around shame/body, but it is not helping your relationships. So, that's when you have to weigh what is important to you. To be honest, given that you have been in therapy 18 years, the idea that "once you deal with the baby and teenager stuff you will be done with therapy"-- is probably not the case. Even if therapy is helping with shame/body stuff/anatomy words, it does not seem as though those are the "biggest" issues or the real reason you are in T. You enjoy T because of the attention she gives you and the high you get from the "in love" feelings you have around her. I think your H realizes that and is frustrated because he knows that your therapy will continue to be about using T to satisfy those desires and not about improving the way you interact in your relationships. It must be frustrating for him to see you spend so much time fretting about an e-mail from T, instead of simply being "in the moment" with him, especially at times like the birth of your granddaughter. I realize that you were there-- you were doing laundry, cooking, doing childcare-- but, as your posts indicate, you were not "emotionally there" for some of that time because you were thinking about your T and her lack of an e-mail response. The people around you can sense when you are distracted, when your thoughts are wandering, etc. They FEEL it and it doesn't FEEL good. It hurts. In my experience, nothing hurts more than being with the person you love and feeling like they're a thousand miles away, thinking about something else. I think that is what your H is reacting to. He's talking about the money because it's tangible and it doesn't hurt his pride to talk about money. It's also logical. That's what men in their 60s talk about; they talk about money and they look for logical reasons. It's much more threatening to say that they are hurt or they are jealous, especially if the way they feel is that their wife is more in love with her female T than she is with them. I realize that your H is not "perfect" in this situation, either. There are things he could do to show you more love and affection, too, but it does seem that he is at least a little more plugged in to you and your family life. He may not know how to show you all the love and affection you want (in which case, you can help teach him!), but at least he isn't showing that love and affection to someone else. It sounds like, deep down, he really wants to be shown a little bit more attention. After all, he doesn't have a T. So who is showing him attention? Try to think about how you would feel if the roles were reversed. If your H were seeing a female T, and your H obsessed about e-mails from her, had "in love" feelings for her, and posted daily online about his sessions/thoughts/feelings for her, how would that make you feel? Would you support his therapy? Would you think it was helping him and your relationship with him? Would you be jealous? Would you support him in his therapy?

Sis, you know I love you and all, but your advice in this case is all theoretical. You should at least declare that. I think my post - get him thinking about his appendages and he'll stop giving you grief - was more reality-based, even it it was a little goofy.

And this is why I don't tell my partner anything about my therapy. (Not because of money, because I pay for it myself, but because I don't need him as a third person in my relationship with my T.)

And technically, Ts aren't supposed to accept a copay that is less than what the client is "supposed" to pay (according to insurance), because they have contracted with the insurance company for a particular rate that includes whatever the client's portion is. The T can make an exception in cases of financial hardship, but the reason for this needs to be documented.

I'm curious too,why you and your H are angry about all Ts salaries. Are you also angry about other professionals' salaries? (I ask curiously, not,accusingly.)

This is also for income tax purposes. T has to pay income tax on what she earns according to the insurance company (including your designated copay) regardless of whether or not she actually receives that amount from you. I highly doubt the IRS or the insurance company is going to follow up on any of this (they have bigger fish to fry) but, technically, accepting less from you is illegal (unless renogtiated with the insurance company).

It's also worth noting that just because T earns $125/hr does not mean she takes home that amount. She has to pay rent for office space, pay for utilities for her office, pay someone to do her billing, etc. That stuff adds up to more than you think! I'd be surprised if, after business expenses, she took home more than $40/hr.

This IS the most amazing post ever written to Rainbow. Chances are most people will not read the whole thing, but it hits the nail on the head. It is excellent and profound.

During one of the most beautiful events of life.. the birth of a child... and the love from a family that YES, requires giving as much as taking, you spent time obsessing over a T, not emailing. Doesn't that seem strange to you?

You are far along in life. That grandbaby will be the one to remember you in love when you are gone. She will hold you in her heart. Your family will too. They will think of you and the memories of you. You are lucky that you have some family relationships. Don't you think working on those is more valuable? Your T will reflect on your passing, close the file and move forward with her clients. She won't goto your gravesite on your birthday and talk about "rainbow"-- she won't goto the lake and think this was "rainbow's favorite place."

But guess who will? H, kids, grandkids, friends --

Therapy is about using and learning from the relationship to improve our "real" lives...not making the relationship our life. Sometimes the head has to take the lead and help assess to direct our feelings where they should be, especially when years of the same, have not been successful.

A whole lot of wisdom in that post.

Joining the club. This is an amazing, well written post with a lot of wisdom in it!

AMAZING SCORPIOSIS!! You always have such great responses but this one blows me away with your clarity and wisdom. I hope Rainbow contemplates what you are saying. Thanks for this.

I kinda feel like I need to explain my response. Sis's post IS gorgeous and romantic, I agree. But I think it's idealistic and therefore not practical. Sis is in the honeymoon phase of a r/s - everything still looks possible. But for a couple who are trying to stay together in a traditional r/s after 40 years - Idk. I'm not sure what I want to say. I agree h is not really mad about the money, but about what it represents. But sis is telling rainbow what it represents to sIs, instead of rainbow saying what It means to raInbow. And then I was going by the legality of the situation - the money belongs to both of us.

I don't really think that age means you can't keep trying to resolve things.
I think that people in their 60's are not as ancient, inflexible, incapable of change or able to change as some on here imagine them to be.

I think his problem is not the money itself, but rain's obsessing about T. If she spent it on manicures and kept talking about manicures during family holidays, what she is getting next and what her manicurists said... it would be simmilar.

THere's two sides of the story and there's weird lack of... bond and communication too between parties involved.

People in their 60´s are capable of working. Maybe a job, a couple of hours of week could solve the issue. It´s healthy, direct focus on something/someone else. It does not create dependence/conflict about money issues, in the relationship.

Originally Posted by Anne2.0
Given that I have not killed you yet in your sleep, consider the therapy productive.

...Or vice versa... From the husbands perspective! And he is not even getting any support.

I don't believe a spouse gets a vote in someone's health care choices.

No but they can CHOOSE not to pay for it. And theres a difference between " health care " and looking for "emotional supply"...( without any intentions of given back to your close relations )...Rainbow8 says she doesn´t even love her husband. So......Should she be offended if her husband won´t pay for her ( love) obsession...T...? He is still paying. Just question the billing. Poor guy!

In my opinion, money in a spousal situation does not belong to one spouse alone and I don't think anyone here is qualified to determine whether a poster is looking for narcissistic supply.

That's a slippery slope. What else does he get to decide because he makes the money? She doesn't get to decide anything? Might is right? We're trying to be civilized here. And not scare groundhog hankster back into her hole, never to have a r/s again!!

The issue is not about money.

The issue is about reality.

The reality is that Rainbow is in therapy FOR the relationship, which she refuses to see the realism of it. Her lack of reality about what relationships consist of is actually quite sad and highlights the level of selfishness that exists.

T-relationship is all about her. She doesn't have to give anything in return. T is there. T's also can't say "Stop focusing on email, your daughter just had a beautiful child!" Or "I am 25 years younger than you Rainbow, do you really think we have much in common? I am a therapist... this is my JOB" or "Rainbow, you are bothering me with your constant focus on wanting me to fulfill your needs. It's really annoying because I don't always want to hold your hand. I am your therapist, not your husband." That real-in-your-face slap of reality would probably make most clients leave. T's need to keep the payment coming.

We are not talking about someone in therapy learning about relationships because they have not had "appropriate" ones throughout their life. That is very valid in therapy. Rainbow is trying to get her perceived "needs" and "wants" met from the therapist by creating a relationship that does not exist.

Think about the recent display of selfishness about the salary of T's. Did you ever say why you are angry that T's make so much money???
T's are people who have to deal with alot of **** and the reality is they are GROSSLY underpaid. You of all people should want to pay more, because of what you require from T's.

Real relationships are give-and-take, sharing and giving, respecting boundaries, helping others in need, and YES, sometimes doing more for others than they do for you.... especially as a parent or grandparent.

The T'-relationship is real, but is is not realistic. It is a vehicle for self-growth and change to be applied.

Instead of saying you don't love your husband, you should be using what you learn in therapy to work on that or figure out how to improve it. You are not interested in that, though. Relationships are TWO-way streets... that is the reality.

I do not see most of what you have here as "the reality". It may be your perception of the facts as you know them.

P
Well, of course. What Rainbow presents here is what I am commenting on.

• She could be full of **** and just seeking attention for years on PC dealing with the same issues for years, to watch people's responses.

• She could be making all this up and sitting on her computer eating ice cream.

• She could be having a sexual relationship with her T and wants more, but only tells us she misses her hand holding so much.

It is actually really sad; spending so much time and energy (as posted) creating a relationship that you pay for, while ignoring the ones that are in front of her.

This is why many people compare therapists to prostitutes. Clients who work with prostitutes often try to create relationships and its all about their pleasure. Paid for, but they get what they want. Prostitutes often fake their pleasure during the "relationship" --- because no client wants a cold, completely unattached person during the meeting. Oh and if you don't pay the worked out deal --- you don't have a "relationship" anymore.

One reality is true: Therapists are paid to do a job to help us. The relationship is "real," but not realistic because of the nature of the relationship and the boundaries involved.