Remember me and admin guy?

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I didn't diagnose... I read her posts in Psychosis.

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And I didn't say he's writing a book about HER. I said he was writing about her PSYCHOSIS.

Special_k, who are you quoting?? I could take exception to that!

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Seriously? We're not allowed to talk about Dr. Bob here unless we bash him? But it's allowed in the lounge? What is that and why is it allowed there?

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post"> I have NO CLUE why what you all post in the lounge is allowed sometimes! Maybe you could answer why you get special treatment there, yourself?

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Please offer Greenleaves the same courtesy then. And if you post about "we all" on the boards versus in a PM, I can only assume you mean this entire community, and thus I address it here.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post"> You talk about being bugged by people making sweeping statements and assumptions??? What makes you think I haven't PMd Greenleaves? I am concerned about her... she hasn't answered...

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Wow, Greenleaves admitted she has a diagnosis of psychosis? Wow, I must have missed that. Oh wait. Maybe she didn't. Maybe that's an assumption.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post"> and yet another assumption by YOU that was wrong.

I clarified the statement about research and Babble in a PM. Parts of my recent post were sarcasm. In fact, most of it was said sarcastically. I realize that is hard to communicate in this medium.

And I didn't realize you were talking about the ITL forum. I frankly forgot that was called a lounge, so I didn't know what you meant by something being allowed there. My bad about that.

gg

I just want to say that I'm not psychotic, not that there is anything wrong with being psychotic. It's just that I'm not.

I know. I was asking the question disingenuously. Sorry if it seemed like I believed you to be psychotic.

Take care,

gg

I'm sorry sweetie I missed these bits when we crossed posts:

> Sometimes I'm moved by someone's post and I want to help, but I don't know what to write. I feel like nothing I write can really make a difference and I'm afraid I might write the wrong thing. A lot of the time I just end up giving the person a virtual hug and not much else because I just don't know what to say.

> I wish I had more life experience. I wish I had more wisdom and knowledge. I don't feel competent enough to give advice. I don't have much experience with living life, relationships, work or anything really.

>...When I reply I think I should read the person's post and none of the replies to it. I want my reply to be unique and not just echoing what others write. Yes, that is what I should do.

I tend to read what others have said because sometimes I can get a bit of a feel for what others are saying and I can say something from a different angle. Usually... It is other peoples replies that help me formulate my own.

It can be hard to know what to say to people...

I think that even just a quick note or a virtual hug... Well... That can mean a lot. A more indepth response can mean a lot too - but don't underestimate the value of saying something like 'I'm sorry, I don't really know what to say but I really feel for you and I'm thinking of you' and stuff like that. Sometimes it helps people just to know that their feelings are being acknowledged.

It is a skill...

But you have lots of other peoples posts to read and you are pretty smart. You should be able to figure it out ;-)

You can think too about the kinds of responses you like to get and start offering those to others

(We tend to get what we give)

I know you care.
I know you do.
((((Deneb))))

this bob sounds like he could be a bit of a freak ... sorry greenleaves it sounds like people who know the history of this person have some very damning things to say ... you didn't realise that your stuff may be used in research?? i remember looking at that site a while ago (now i know who we are talking about) and being very dubious about the ethics of it (and not signing up). i would have thought it should be more obvious, if a bright young lady like you didn't pick up on that (which to me is a lil unethical).

it sounds to me as if you need to rein in your thoughts a little - sure, allow yourself to feel some pleasure when you see him post something that makes sense to you. respect him for running a board (if you can truthfully step outside yourself and say, ok, he's not trying to mess with people, he is trying to do a good thing).

the rest of you - i think you raise some really good points too but maybe not talking about GL's diagnosis would be more pertinent - it seems to me (and i have been on this board a lot shorter time than most of you, so please consider that i may not know everything) that GL is maybe misappropriating her affection (if this dr bob is as people say he is), but it doesn't seem psychotic to me - just misguided and way too intense to be healthy.

now - excuse me if i have put foot in mouth, but those are my views, and i just felt like sharing them :P

i don't know this DrB from adam so maybe i shouldn't respond...but i do know the "uproar" that greenleaves had alot of us in last time she posted here on a regular basis......i would hate to see this happen again...i think its time for our admins to step in and put a stop to this thread before it gets out of hand....greenleaves...you had to know that your posts would trigger peoples emotions.....and you have to know that your feelings for DrB are not really healthy....but whatever you think....i think you should keep issues about DrB at his forums.....you asked our opinions here....we gave them.....you really don't want to hear them....so enough already!...PC is a wonderful group of folks who will help when they think they can.....

my sentiments, exactly, julia. i was reading your post and then planned on posting this......

folks, we're way in over our heads here with greenleaves and her affection for bob.

let's please "self-close" this thread and no longer post here....xoxoxo pat

Once again I'm disappointed in the responses of some people in this community.

If this community is the wonderful supportive place that people seem to think it is then I would have thought that people could either choose to post supportive posts or... just leave the thread alone.

I feel upset at the thought that people would intentionally try and get another person's thread locked.

I feel upset at the thought that people would intentionally try and get people to boycot a persons thread.

I feel upset that after so many times...

Some people seem to think that this is somehow supportive behaviour... Or that these kinds of posts are somehow okay or appropriate.

If you don't know that you can say anything supportive...
If you think someone is posting about stuff that is beyond your resources...

Then how about leaving the thread so others who are better placed to respond can respond.

Thanks.

Pat, I'll shut my mouth right after I respond to the next post. Promise!

I think what people that know about this so called Dr Bob is trying to do is be supportive in the manner of trying to get a misguided very young lady to understand what kind of man she is "in love" with. I have been to that site because of the things I had heard. I wanted the option of making up my own mind. If you have never been there ask someone for the address for it and take a look for yourself. You have to agree to be open to his research. "lab rats" in my opinion.
It is very unhealthy for someone online to have that much feelings for someone whoever it is without really knowing the person. Love is a very very strong word. I do believe this man putting his arms around her and telling her it is ok for her to love him is a terrible thing especially it being an older man with a younger vulnerable woman. To me that says predator! just my opinion so please don't jump me for that.

There are a few terms that people don't seem to quite understand and these are:

Sympathy versus Empathy - When you SYMPATHIZE with someone, you jump IN to their hole. When you EMPATHIZE, you understand their feelings/problems but you send down a rope to HELP THEM OUT.

Support vesus Enabling: When you SUPPORT someone, you help promote their interests or cause. When you ENABLE someone you to make possible, practical, or easy.

There's enough ENABLING going on here that people seem to think is SUPPORT. Those of us who haven't been what you call SUPPORTIVE know that GL is on the wrong path. It's not the first time! Are we supposed to cheer her on?? I don't think so!!

I think there's too much focus on who is loved, and not enough focus on where that love is stemming from and the potential in that alone for a person to be hurt.

I have never been to this other forum and don't know the admin in question but I have, as stated in a previous reply, been in the situation of loving someone who accepted my love but yet could not return it. It's not a safety net and it only feels good when it's going the way you envision it.

Supporting someone doesn't mean being a cheerleader when they feel good and lifting them up when they are down. Sometimes it means caring enough to tell them that what they're doing maybe isn't so good for them.

If some of the people from PB don't like it here, or they don't like the way things are run or how we respond, why do they come?

i have read this thread and have reserved my thoughts, but i cant help but think about this email i once got from a friend of mine thatt was intervening on my behalf. She told me exactly what I knew but didnt want to hear.... she said a true friend is someone that will tell you the truth even when you dont want to hear it...

Exactly!!

If you see a friend that's about to jump over a high cliff, what are you going to do? Tell them you understand and let them jump, or are you gonna do everything within your power to stop them??

What's so hard to understand about that??

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bebop said:
I think what people that know about this so called Dr Bob is trying to do is be supportive in the manner of trying to get a misguided very young lady to understand what kind of man she is "in love" with.

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Sigh. His name actually is Dr. Bob. Robert Hsuing, MD. There's no "so-called" about it.

"In love" and feeling "love" are not the same thing. I believe what GL is saying she feels is love, not that she is in love with Dr. Bob. Of course, only she can tell us for sure.

How is it that folks are able to say what kind of man Dr. Bob is truly? Has anyone met him or corresponded with him? Just curious.

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I wanted the option of making up my own mind.

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Always a healthy thing.

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If you have never been there ask someone for the address for it and take a look for yourself. You have to agree to be open to his research. "lab rats" in my opinion.

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Actually, Dr. Bob has acknowledged that the blanket consent in the registration process is NOT adequate for him to use poster's posts in research. Thus, he has since required specific informed consent to be given for any research projects he's conducted on Babble which use individuals' words. No one has to agree to these specific consents. This info is unclear in the registration process and should probably be clarified by Dr. Bob so that this misconception does not continue.

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It is very unhealthy for someone online to have that much feelings for someone whoever it is without really knowing the person. Love is a very very strong word. I do believe this man putting his arms around her and telling her it is ok for her to love him is a terrible thing especially it being an older man with a younger vulnerable woman. To me that says predator! just my opinion so please don't jump me for that.

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With all due respect, none of us were present at the meeting GL describes, but others were. There were at least five other people there who could describe the vibes that were present in the moment. I suspect they would be better able to judge this interaction than we are.

And as an aside...I love many people, some whom I do not know all that well. I agree it IS a strong word. It's a lovely and powerful word. However, loving someone does not mean that you do not also have boundaries. Boundaries can make even unusual relationships acceptable and not "harmful".

Perhaps instead of invalidating GL's feelings by telling her she shouldn't feel them, we could instead help her develop good boundaries and maybe also help her to see where these feelings stem from? Just a thought.

gg

Addendum from edit: In the interest of full disclosure, I should let folks know in case they were not aware that I am a deputy administrator at Babble.

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butterflylady747 said:
i don't know this DrB from adam so maybe i shouldn't respond...but i do know the "uproar" that greenleaves had alot of us in last time she posted here on a regular basis......i would hate to see this happen again...

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I remember that as well. Given that knowledge of how things went before, what do you think folks can do differently to deal with any "uproar" another person might trigger in them? Why should the admins have to step in versus individuals dealing with their own responses independently? If you know that something or someone is likely to create "uproar" feelings for you based on past experience, what can you do to manage those feelings? What have individuals done for themselves that worked before? What doesn't work? How can we learn from this phenomenon so that we do not have to rely on the mods to "protect us" from unpleasant feelings?

gg

I feel upset at the thought that people would intentionally try and get another person's thread locked.
NEVER, did i ask to have this thread locked or boycotted. i said that i felt that we were in over our heads, i still believe that, and that we should step away from it.

from the get-go, people tried to talk to greenleaves about her issues with bob.

i guess that i really don't know how to help greenleaves with her boundaries. i tried. i don't have a problem with greenleaves..it's the thought of the hurt that is going to come down the pike, at some point, due to her "behavior"......and i see special K saying the same thing.

i was feeling that a lot of the posters here don't know what to make of her feelings......and my suggestion was meant in a kind way. drop it. it was causing disagreements and i thought, for the good of all, that just ending it was the kind thing to do......i still stand by what i said. xoxxo pat

Dr. Bob is not a predator! I wasn't the only person he hugged on the trip. Dr. Bob didn't encourage my love in any way. Don't think badly and punish him for my strange behaviours and thoughts.

I'm sorry I bought this up. I don't know why I really thought people would be happy for me. I remembered in the past people were upset when I was e-mailing him threats to my life and people were worried that he might call the police on me or something. I just wanted to let people here know that he would never do such a thing because he hugged me.

Dr. Bob did nothing wrong. He doesn't take advantage of my love for him. He's a safe person to love.

Guys, I am at work, typing on my cell phone so I'll keep this short.

I know that we all have opinions about what Greenleaves should do or not do, but this thread is deviating away from its original purpose. Rather than have sidebar discussions about Greenleaves' situation within this thread, could you please talk to her directly if you have something to say, or else take the discussions with each other over to PM?

Greenleaves, back to you. I am happy that you're happy; just be careful, ok?

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I'm sorry I bought this up. I don't know why I really thought people would be happy for me.

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Greenleaves... no hon, you can't understand I think..and I'm sorry that what you posted upset many of us... I'm not sure why it triggered me so much, and why I was out of control with my thinking about this. (It's become a note of therapy work.)

I think your disorder is what prevents you from realizing all the views of this attachment you have for this person. Could you print off this thread, and let your therapist read it, AND tell us what the T says? I know you don't get much time with the T, but since this is an ongoing issue for you, and for us here at PC... it might help us all understand better.

I'm sorry that you suffer so.

our mods and admin are here for a reason.....to help us through times like these......but gg..i probably should have just kept quiet but when i see so many friends reacting so much to something like this...and i know that you...greenleaves..have caused this kind of upset before....i just could not stay quiet and i still think this thread should be locked.....greenleaves....although i don't agree with you on this matter..good luck....and now friends i will crawl back into my cocoon