[bwebb]

OK, here is my story. I would greatly appreciate the honest truth as to what you might think of it. I can take it whatever it might be.

My husband and I have been married for 10 years, we have 2 kids. we have never been good a communicating , but we loved each other and when we were young, we were just having fun. Now things are different and have gotten difficult. For a long time I have felt responsible. I was pampered as a child and I definitely was NOT a good homemaker at first. My husband was a great cook and he said he like to do it. I also failed at keeping up with housework and keeping things going. After we were married for 4 years and before we had kids we had a long talk. He told me that he felt the burden of doing everything around the house and that I was not doing my part. He confessed that he was worried about having kids with me because of the added work. I agreed and went to counselling. I did a whole year of counselling where I learned that I am not at all the lazy useless piece of garbage that I thought I was. The truth is, I work full time - always have - and part time. I have always had a second job to help make ends meet. I could see that there were areas at home where I was failing, and I worked hard to make laundry and cleaning more of a priority. And it has been. I do not expect my husband to take care of any more than half of the house work. Now that we have kids, all of the kid stuff has fallen to me. I am absolutely the primary care taker. My husband is a good and involved father, but he works long hours outside the home and I have the kids with me most often.

Ok, to the point. We started counselling about a month ago. At first he was angry and our first session was difficult at best. He said he was just going through the motions and didn't really see any home for us. He also said he didn't want a divorce, but that he didn't see how this can truly be any better. I was shocked and hurt. BUT he agreed to go back and now we have had 5 sessions in total. While I have really taken it to heart and have been working hard to do what the counselor suggests, he has not. At our last session he acknowledged that he has noticed that I have been working at this both in and out of counselling. It felt good to be acknowledged. But then as the counselor began to press him for his feelings and his part in all this, he started to get angry. He talked around answers and avoided questions. Until he finally said he is just here going through the motions. That hurt to hear. But I don't know if I believe it.

From the beginning I have felt like this mess is my fault. He has told me so. That I am the reason he is unhappy and hates to come home. But for some reason, after this session I began to suddenly feel like this isn't all my fault. And that I cannot fix it on my own. I am so tired of feeling guilty. But whether he meant what he said or not, I can't see the point in continuing if he isn't going to try. Surprisingly, right after that he agreed to come back next week. I don't know what to think. I am wondering -Is he just coming because I asked him to? Is he going to continue to go to the sessions but do nothing else to improve things? How is that not just a huge waste of time?

I suspect that he still actually loves me. I think that he hates himself. I think that he feels like his life is not what he expected. Although we have a good life. He thinks that I am crazy for ever suggesting that anything could be different. When I talk about making my side business my full time job and quitting my current full time job, he says I am delusional and idealistic. He has this attitude that things are the way the are and that they can never be any different. He tells people I am crazy for suggesting that things can be better. I guess it shouldn't be a surprise that he thinks that way about our marriage too.

This session was yesterday and since then I am just inwardly focused. I am tired of trying to fix this alone. If he is not trying then I am done. I am going to take care of myself. I am going to have fun with my kids and for now, I am not going to concentrate on making him happy. That has been my sole thought for 10 years = how can I make him happy? Well that is over. For now. For now we are living separate under the same roof. I plan to wait it out and if he comes around - I will work! But if he does not ever come around then I am going to suggest that it is over. The LAST thing I want is divorce. I hate that our children would have to go through that, but I refuse to stay in an emotionally void relationship. I just have no idea how this happened. I feel like I am in someone else's life.

If you are still reading - thank you. I know it's a lot. what do you think? Am I wrong? Can I do this differently? Is there another option? Thanks so much!

[kaliope]

hi bwebb
I think you have the right thought process going. you shouldn't worry about trying to make him happy. you are not entirely at fault. it takes two to make a relationship. I wouldn't write off counseling though. He may hear something in the process that triggers him into action. it sounds like he needs a lot of work on himself. welcome to psych central. you will find that we have several forums where you can post about your concerns and receive feedback from other members. you will get a lot of support here. again, welcome

[hvert]

Wow, it sounds like you have had some great breakthroughs! I hope you can rescue your marriage. He shouldn't be blaming you for everything and he needs to work on stuff too -- hopefully something will click for him at the next therapy session.

Will you tell him that you are done being the only one putting in any effort?

[bwebb]

Yes. I am feeling some incredible clarity about the situation. It hurts and I am angry but it is also pretty simple. I plan to say at our next session that I I cannot fix this alone. I am going to tell him that I don't like counselling any more than he does and that I know it's easier to just stifle the difficult feelings, but that I thought our marriage was worth more than that. I am going to be honest and say that I am not going to continue to make an effort alone. And that I am not going to stay in a loveless marriage my whole life. I know it would rip my heart open to put the kids through a divorce, but letting them grow up watching their mom settle for something less than love is not ok either.

[bwebb]

And thank you for your responses. I appreciate the support. I am going through a lot right now. Not just my marriage but other parts of my life are a mess right now too.

[hvert]

It all seems to hit at once, doesn't it?? Good luck with your next appointment -- I hope he hears what you are saying.

[Justagirl2602]

I'm happy to hear that you are letting go of pleasing other people. That is something many people struggle with but you overcame it.

I think you are totally right. If he doesn't try, it won't work. You have to do what makes you happy. Ofcourse you could help him with overcoming his depressed mood, but eventually he will have to do this on his own. You can't 'fix' him.

Don't worry about too much about how divorce will effect your kids. My parents are divorced. At first, ofcourse I didn't like it (I was still a little kid). But after a while, I adapted to the situation and realized it was better for them and for me & my brother. If you and your husband are unhappy together, your kids will see/notice that and that WILL effect them. You're their mom and you deserve love and respect and you shouldn't settle for anything less.

I hope you and your husband can make it work! Good luck!

[healingme4me]

If he's not going to put in even an ounce of the amount of elbow grease that you are putting into this, then yeah, why teach staying in a relationship that is less than love? Why teach, settling behavior?

And another thing, that catches my eye, how DARE HIM, tell people you are 'crazy'!! That's deplorable! Know why?! Doesn't display an ounce of respect, for you, as a human being!

[morealivethandead]

I am sorry that you are going through this. I agree with the posters above that mentioned that you are on the right track and that you cannot make others happy. This may be part of your personality but sometimes it is not what the situation needs. Take care of yourself and your little ones and enjoy life as much as you can.
My wife and I have been to 4 marriage counselors in the past 30 years. 2 were horrible, 1 was great (for me but wife hated her) and the other was just an avenue to open dialogue. We found later that having someone open the dialogue helped the most and at times we would re-direct the dialogue during the sessions since the counselor was stabbing in the dark for discussion points. Having a counselor that turns out to be one sided and always takes the woman's (or the man's) perspective does not help.
From a man's perspective - Like your husband, I used to work long hours (100 hours per week - yeah the depression ended that eventually) and hated going home to my wife. Many times a man will avoid home to avoid the perceived aggravation. Also, neither of us gave the most important things to each other in marriage. She needed me to tell her how wonderful she was and I just wanted physical (not always sexual) contact.
If he agrees to more session then I would say there is some hope - even if he is only doing it to appease you. He may eventually truly see that you still want the marriage and that has meaning to him.
Advice - take with a grain of salt- I would sit him down and quietly ask him what he needs from you and just listen and ask him to truly think about this for a later discussion. If there is a time that he is willing to listen, tell him what you need from him. I know this sounds really simplistic but I have found after so many years, if the basics can be covered, there is much that falls into place. I went through the motions for years so I know these difficulties can be overcome.
In the end, I can see that you love your kids and want the best for them. Even though I do not like the idea of divorce, think about where you want to be in 3 years, 5 years 10 years.
I wish the best for you I hope all goes well!

[bwebb]

Thank you all so much!! To address some of the things mentioned above - I have asked him what it is he needs from me and it is impossible to get a straight answer. He basically tells me that he wants the house more neat and orderly - I work full time and deal with the kids most often, and I do laundry, take out the trash, cook dinner, do the dishes, mop the floors, etc. Is our house perfect? NO WAY! But our kids are happy and cared for. That is more my priority. I do more of the housework than I would choose to because he wants it done. I do it to please him, but he tells me that is wrong. That I should not think of the housework as something that pleases him, but rather I should consider it just what needs to get done. I am not inherently neat and orderly. I never have been. I am ok with that part of myself and I never pretended to be something I am not, although I will admit it was easier for me to keep the house up when i didn't have kids! If what he needs from me is for me to change who I am and what I value, I just can't do that. But I am still trying to do what I can. I know he can see my effort.

I do worry that this counselor is too sympathetic towards me. I am not sure if this is true or just my perception of it. He believes that it is ALL me who has to change, so when she presses him for answers or to open up, he gets more defensive. She doesn't press me because I volunteer information. I am also afraid to change counselors though because I don't know if I can get him to go to another one. The fact that he is even showing up to this one is a miracle. I have asked him if he likes this counselor, and he said she's fine. I am still hopeful, but realistic. Thank you again for all of your thoughts!!!

[Perna]

Have you talked to him about how you perceive his attitude and seeming lack of effort and "downer" :-) words? I think you have to start communicating rather than just going on what you think and feel? You have to confront him and tell him about his contradictory words (he sees how hard you are working and you feel good but then says he doesn't see how things can be better). Have you asked him how "better" would look to him? He could just be lost and scared; you are working hard and doing better but he doesn't know how and is ashamed or something.

I would try to work directly with him, learn to get specific and tell it like you see it both good and bad. Have you told him you are just going to see what he does and if he does not "try" according to your unknown-to-him specifications, you aren't hanging around? Sounds like you each have your own ideas and agendas of what trying to make it work is and you are not telling each other your agendas. I don't think just doing what the therapist says like a good client can work; it isn't a contest to see who can be the best partner; I believe you are supposed to be talking to your husband and working with him on what the therapist suggests, seeing if it is a good idea for the both of you.

My husband's first wife sounds like your husband a bit. She kept complaining to my husband that he did not make her happy. It is never another person's job to make a person happy. One runs into too many unsolvable double-bind situations one can't win that way. When I was a child my brother trapped me that way by telling me I was "wrong" handed; I am left-handed but was too young to understand and was only seeing the right/wrong scenario.

What would you like your husband to do, specifically? Tell him. But think about it so it isn't something like, "I would like you to take the trash out every night without my asking you to." While that may need to be said, I think there are a lot more interesting and life-affirming words that could be said first? What we want is not the other person's problem. If we want the trash taken out, we can ask another person to do that but it is our job to get what we want. I love my husband and want him around for himself, regardless of what he does around the house; my soul feeds on his sheer presence near me, LOL. He was raised differently from how I was and his mother did not teach him the same values as mine taught me. I look around for what chore needs doing, what is out of place; I'm female and was raised and am able to look for such details. My poor husband, I routinely plan major surprise parties for him when he is sitting not 10 feet from me and he's clueless.

You have to talk to him! What he thinks, feels, and wants is not imaginable unless you are him. Likewise, he cannot imagine what you think, feel, or want unless you tell him, spell it out, make it clear who you are. First, you have to know you; then you share you with another and get to know them a little bit. That's what communication is all about. It takes curiosity, imagination, acceptance of responsibility for your own thoughts, feelings, wants and actions and the ability to let the other person "be" who they are and where they are at this moment.

When my husband disappoints me, doesn't notice the overflowing kitchen trash can, I think to myself: You can live alone and take out the trash, or you can live with the love of your life and have his talents (he is a wonderful provider, much better than I was/can be for myself) and take out the trash.

[trying2survive]

Originally Posted by bwebb

OK, here is my story. I would greatly appreciate the honest truth as to what you might think of it. I can take it whatever it might be.

My husband and I have been married for 10 years, we have 2 kids. we have never been good a communicating , but we loved each other and when we were young, we were just having fun. Now things are different and have gotten difficult. For a long time I have felt responsible. I was pampered as a child and I definitely was NOT a good homemaker at first. My husband was a great cook and he said he like to do it. I also failed at keeping up with housework and keeping things going. After we were married for 4 years and before we had kids we had a long talk. He told me that he felt the burden of doing everything around the house and that I was not doing my part. He confessed that he was worried about having kids with me because of the added work. I agreed and went to counselling. I did a whole year of counselling where I learned that I am not at all the lazy useless piece of garbage that I thought I was. The truth is, I work full time - always have - and part time. I have always had a second job to help make ends meet. I could see that there were areas at home where I was failing, and I worked hard to make laundry and cleaning more of a priority. And it has been. I do not expect my husband to take care of any more than half of the house work. Now that we have kids, all of the kid stuff has fallen to me. I am absolutely the primary care taker. My husband is a good and involved father, but he works long hours outside the home and I have the kids with me most often.

Ok, to the point. We started counselling about a month ago. At first he was angry and our first session was difficult at best. He said he was just going through the motions and didn't really see any home for us. He also said he didn't want a divorce, but that he didn't see how this can truly be any better. I was shocked and hurt. BUT he agreed to go back and now we have had 5 sessions in total. While I have really taken it to heart and have been working hard to do what the counselor suggests, he has not. At our last session he acknowledged that he has noticed that I have been working at this both in and out of counselling. It felt good to be acknowledged. But then as the counselor began to press him for his feelings and his part in all this, he started to get angry. He talked around answers and avoided questions. Until he finally said he is just here going through the motions. That hurt to hear. But I don't know if I believe it.

From the beginning I have felt like this mess is my fault. He has told me so. That I am the reason he is unhappy and hates to come home. But for some reason, after this session I began to suddenly feel like this isn't all my fault. And that I cannot fix it on my own. I am so tired of feeling guilty. But whether he meant what he said or not, I can't see the point in continuing if he isn't going to try. Surprisingly, right after that he agreed to come back next week. I don't know what to think. I am wondering -Is he just coming because I asked him to? Is he going to continue to go to the sessions but do nothing else to improve things? How is that not just a huge waste of time?

I suspect that he still actually loves me. I think that he hates himself. I think that he feels like his life is not what he expected. Although we have a good life. He thinks that I am crazy for ever suggesting that anything could be different. When I talk about making my side business my full time job and quitting my current full time job, he says I am delusional and idealistic. He has this attitude that things are the way the are and that they can never be any different. He tells people I am crazy for suggesting that things can be better. I guess it shouldn't be a surprise that he thinks that way about our marriage too.

This session was yesterday and since then I am just inwardly focused. I am tired of trying to fix this alone. If he is not trying then I am done. I am going to take care of myself. I am going to have fun with my kids and for now, I am not going to concentrate on making him happy. That has been my sole thought for 10 years = how can I make him happy? Well that is over. For now. For now we are living separate under the same roof. I plan to wait it out and if he comes around - I will work! But if he does not ever come around then I am going to suggest that it is over. The LAST thing I want is divorce. I hate that our children would have to go through that, but I refuse to stay in an emotionally void relationship. I just have no idea how this happened. I feel like I am in someone else's life.

If you are still reading - thank you. I know it's a lot. what do you think? Am I wrong? Can I do this differently? Is there another option? Thanks so much!

i don't think you're wrong, i just think you guys need to go out to dinner sit down and have a long talk about what you guys really want and expect out of each other, also it sounds like the magic is gone out of your marriage. is there anything you guys can do to spice it up? i know you guys have a busy schedule, but you have to make time for each other somehow or it's not gonna get any better. you are right to be frustrated, because it's not fair for you to be doing all the work in a relationship, i broke up with one of my ex's for the same reason. i felt like i was putting in 150% and she was only putting in about 30% (effort), i got tired of doing all the romantic things and really really trying while she barely responded to my efforts. also you may want to look at the condition of you guys' sex life ( that's none of my business so i'm not gonna pry) but that's something you should look at personally & assess where you guys are there. sex is a very important part of a relationship and it's amazing how much a relationship can improve if that area of a relationship is worked on. i suspect he loves you and you love him & i believe you guys love for each other can overcome this but it will take effort on both parties.
he needs to know this. also you guys may need to look at your finances and how you are allocating your money, how you could budget a lil better and eliminate the need for a second job, with you being gone all the time that could be putting a huge strain on him (he probably misses you and doesn't know how to say it! ) so all is not lost, anything can be fixed, it just takes 2 people that love each other to be willing to work it out! good luck

p.s. also think of the little things you guys used to do when you were dating
maybe you could go to some of your old favorite places..bring the magic back!
it can be done, don't give up yet!! you guys can make it

[Justagirl2602]

He is complaining about your house not being clean enough while you are working your butt off?

Tell him that if he can do it better, he can do it himself.. If not, he shouldn't complain.

[kawaiigurl1981]

It sounds like you are going through a tough time but it also sounds like you are thinking very clearly and pragmatically. You cannot make a relationship work on your on and I would venture that your husband has some emotionally issues that need to be addressed before you can resolve the issues in your marriage.

I am imagining your home to comfortable if somewhat disorganized and he is seems to be asking for an excessive level of houskeeping. My question is why ? As long as there are clean clothes to wear, clean dishes to cook on and eat from, and an acceptable level of sanitation why is the housework such an issue for him? Does this represent something else entirely to him that he had never bothered to explain to you ?