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  #26  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 09:57 AM
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KarenSue KarenSue is offline
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You are not a bad mother, Always.

I have a son, and I remember having to NOT criticize his girlfriends along the way. I held my breathe hoping he'd come to see that "she" was not right for him. Criticizing his girlfriend would only have made him more determined to see her. Thankfully, he would finally figure out a girl was not for him, on his own, and move on. He finally met someone who was a great match. They married when my son was 29. They have a nine year old girl and a 3 year old son.

I think your daughter will come to the proper conclusion about "him" as my son did, on her own. They have to think it is their idea. This is where your raising will begin to show. I can't tell you the number of times my son has shared "his idea", and I hear words I told him during his upbringing repeated back to me. I don't mention it to him. I don't care who gets credit! I just am happy to know that he really was listening all those years.

I'm way past the stage where you are today (son is 40) and I think that the mother/daughter relationship may be more complicated than the mother/son relationship, IDK. I will say this, I waited too long to "cut the apron strings" and helped my son financially. That turned into some resentment from my son in later years because I did not make him struggle when he was at the age where he should have been learning those lessons. Hindsight is 20/20, but wish I would have known that when he was 22.
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  #27  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 10:43 AM
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hannabee hannabee is offline
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It is very difficult when she is poisoning your mind about this guy and probably doesn't even realize it. I had this happen. My suggestion would be to tell you that it does make you not like him when she tells you these things. 22 is still very young. Hopefully things will get better as she matures.
I'd probably be most worried about a pregnancy at this point, but no doubt, you'll get blasted if you mention this subject.
Is there another trusted adult in her life that you can have help you?
I agree with Bill3's suggestions, they are right on. Good luck and big hug!
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  #28  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 11:14 AM
Talthybius Talthybius is offline
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You are making a problem that is your daughter's boyfriend's problem, your problem.

It is not even clear to me that your daughter has a problem. She 'blows money'? What does that mean? She is in college. That's not the stage in your life where you save up money. And even if she has a money problem, if it is her money and if it doesn't get out of hand, what you can actually do is limited.

Now, if you are paying for all her expenses, you might have a say. But her 'wasting money', that's just your judgment. Maybe it is an investment. Maybe she is getting important life experiences partying, traveling, or whatever she is doing with her money.

As for her BF, why withhold approval? It's not how you influence who she picks to out to start a relationship. Parent's have a huge effect on how their children pick their spouses, but they don't do any of that by approving or disapproving. You did that by learning her what good partner qualities are from the nature of the relationship you and your husband have.

Don't know where the the daughter using drugs and being almost pregnant come from. But maybe thatś just culture difference.

As for the argument that she cannot possibly even drink alcohol, my parents are both alcoholics. One a functional one, the other a totally dysfunctional one. As a teenager, I used to be the only one not drinking, and I was able to do this because I was too autistic to be affected by this thing called peer pressure. Now that I am older, I have 'secretly' drunk alcohol, just to mellow stress away and 'help relax', even though I despite alcohol.

I'd say it goes the other way. If a parent is alcoholic, the child is more likely to be. Both because of genetic reasons as for nuture reasons.

Last edited by Talthybius; Aug 21, 2016 at 12:23 PM.
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Always Hurting
  #29  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 01:30 PM
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Rose76 Rose76 is offline
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If she asks you to let her and boyfriend come live in your house, the answer should be a firm "No."
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Always Hurting
  #30  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 05:38 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Originally Posted by Rose76 View Post
If she wants to support a gigolo, that's her business. You don't really have to step back or withdraw from her. You don't have to pretend to like this guy either. Just stop telling her what you think he should be doing. That's not for you to figure out. Be polite toward him. That's all you owe your daughter.

Don't, in any way, enable the situation . . . like by giving her money. Invite her for Sunday dinner now and then. If she brings the boyfriend, feed him too. Expect that he acts courteously toward you and expect nothing more. Don't ask what he's done about finding a job. That's his business. If he's sponging off your daughter, that's her business.

In your situation, my fervent prayer would be simply, "Dear Lord, please let her not get pregnant anytime soon." Hopefully, before that happens, she will get sick of this guy leeching off her. When she complains to you about this guy, you might say: "Sweetheart, I agree with you that he's not a good catch. I happen to think you could do better for yourself. But, if you want to hang on to him, that's up to you."
Thank you so much! There is so much more to the story between my daughter and this guy. But you are exactly correct, I need to stop telling her what I think she should do or what the guy should be doing. I know it's really none of my business. It just frustrates me. And I do pray very hard that she doesn't end up pregnant. She is taking birth control pills and I do check with her to make sure she buys them and takes them. That IS something I would give her money for if needed.
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  #31  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 05:59 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceCreamKid View Post
A few things come to mind. The bum she is living with probably gives her good feelings coupled with low expectations. She likely feels capable and in control with him.

I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the effect having an alcoholic (and absent) father had on your daughter. The fact that she now has a resident, omni-present boyfriend who is dependent on her for his support, says a lot.

I agree with Rose for the most part. If you need to interact with this man, be polite and nothing more. But I would also suggest you not in any way encourage your daughter to take on more debt: schools are far too quick to encourage young people to take on massive debt. This is a mistake in my opinion. So if you had the chance to encourage your daughter one way or the other, I'd suggest the other. Example: Daughter says, "I don't know whether to take out another school loan, or to extend my education a year by going part time." If my daughter said that to me, I'd say: "I would extend my education; a year goes by quickly, a debt can take many years to pay off." I think that is appropriate parenting; you are offering wisdom that your daughter, because of her developmental stage, does not yet have. Legally she is an adult; but her brain, and her judgment, are still developing, believe it or not, until she is about 25 or so.

If it comes to pass that she decides she is done supporting a bum, you could be ready with information and an offer for a happy and successful transition back to your home for the time it takes her to finish school near you: She could live with you for no or reduced rent and attend the XYZ school close to you (assuming this is possible), for example. I would not offer a place for him; if she wants to move back and he is part of the deal, then he has to find his own place to live.

One last thought. "Active listening" can sound a lot like an interrogation, and is especially dependent on tone of voice. "You're angry he doesn't do the dishes!" You're ANGRY he doesn't do the dishes?!?!? YOU'RE angry HE doesn't do the dishes??!?! I much prefer thoughtful listening; which is a whole lot more listening and a whole lot less parroting what the speaker says. "I'm so angry Lazy Larry doesn't do the dishes!" (silence. Let her sentence lie there and let her think about it.) Only if she asks for advice do you comment. "What should I do?!?!" Answer: "Paper plates, eating out, equitable division of duties--there are lots of solutions to problems, dear."

I'd also buy and send her a copy of Adult Children of Alcoholics. It's very illuminating and she can pick and choose what she takes from it.

I wish you and your dear daughter the very best.

Believe me I know having an alcoholic father and then him not being in her life since she was very young DID affect her tremendously.

I think you are exactly right that she doea feel very much in control with this guy.

I tell her she will have to pay back loans one day so she should just stick with grants that she won't need to pay back. I've always told her that. This guy takes out tons of loans, according to her, and I know he recently encourgaged her to get a credit card at a golf place so that he could buy new golf irons. The credit card is in her name so the debt falls onto her. Which she knows better to fall for that type of manipulation. But once again I know I am powerless over that too.

A couple of months ago my daughter was "thinking about" either moving in with her sister or moving back home. I offered my home to her and told her she could go to the local college here and work. I told her I wouldn't require any money from her that I would just want her to get herself a savings set up and get herself together. He of course sweet talked her into staying with him. She knows my offer always stands.

He will never be allowed to live in my home.

I think I need to do active and thoughtful listening with her.

I will get that book and read it first and then offer it to her. Thank you for suggesting it.

Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and advice with me. I appreciate it very much.
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  #32  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 06:04 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rose76 View Post
If she asks you to let her and boyfriend come live in your house, the answer should be a firm "No."
No, he would NEVER be allowed to live under my roof. No way at all would I put up with this!
  #33  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 06:08 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Originally Posted by divine1966 View Post
I am so glad to hear it and never doubted it. I just couldn't figure out why someone suggest you go to al anon when you already said that none of the involved parties have the issue. Seems very non sequential or projecting.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thank you. I think they were just trying to be helpful.
  #34  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 06:19 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KarenSue View Post
You are not a bad mother, Always.

I have a son, and I remember having to NOT criticize his girlfriends along the way. I held my breathe hoping he'd come to see that "she" was not right for him. Criticizing his girlfriend would only have made him more determined to see her. Thankfully, he would finally figure out a girl was not for him, on his own, and move on. He finally met someone who was a great match. They married when my son was 29. They have a nine year old girl and a 3 year old son.

I think your daughter will come to the proper conclusion about "him" as my son did, on her own. They have to think it is their idea. This is where your raising will begin to show. I can't tell you the number of times my son has shared "his idea", and I hear words I told him during his upbringing repeated back to me. I don't mention it to him. I don't care who gets credit! I just am happy to know that he really was listening all those years.

I'm way past the stage where you are today (son is 40) and I think that the mother/daughter relationship may be more complicated than the mother/son relationship, IDK. I will say this, I waited too long to "cut the apron strings" and helped my son financially. That turned into some resentment from my son in later years because I did not make him struggle when he was at the age where he should have been learning those lessons. Hindsight is 20/20, but wish I would have known that when he was 22.
Thank you KarenSue! I think parenting is the hardest job we will ever have. I just continue to hope and to pray that one, she doesn't end up pregnant; keeps taking her birth control, and two, that as she grows, learns, and matures more that she will see that she deserves so much better than this guy. She knows I am and will always be here for her. But I know I need to stop trying to tell her what to do or what I think the guy should do. I have to come off more supportive and less judgmental. I have to work very hard at changing the way I communicate with her.
  #35  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 06:38 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hannabee View Post
It is very difficult when she is poisoning your mind about this guy and probably doesn't even realize it. I had this happen. My suggestion would be to tell you that it does make you not like him when she tells you these things. 22 is still very young. Hopefully things will get better as she matures.
I'd probably be most worried about a pregnancy at this point, but no doubt, you'll get blasted if you mention this subject.
Is there another trusted adult in her life that you can have help you?
I agree with Bill3's suggestions, they are right on. Good luck and big hug!
She and I have discussed how the things she tells me about him and his family does paint a poisoness picture in my mind. So I actually asked them to dinner and I spent some time with the two of them at the first apartment they had together. Then when they lost that apartment and moved in with his parents I actually went there and met his parents and again we had dinner together. All the times I've been in the presence of the two of them he speaks to my daughter was much disrespect. During one of these occassions he was very disrespectful to my daughter out in public and I could see that she was embarrassed. I couldn't hold my tongue. I had to tell him that I did not appreciate how he treats her and then I turned to her and told her that she should never allow anyone to degrade her in such a manner. As a result he banned me from coming to their home. I'm not allowed to go there to see my daughter and he rarely brings her to see me. Of course I've offered to pick her up. It is over an hour away from my home but she declines because she doesn't want me "causing trouble". So now I get to see her when my other daughter is able to go pick her up. So you see despite the things she was telling me I wanted to go out on the limb so to speak and try to see things for myself. I know there are always two sides to every story. But this guy has proved over and over that he is just a manipulative, abusive dirt bag. I pray for the day when she realizes it and gets away from him.

I discuss pregnancy with her even though she doesn't want to hear it from me. I had her when I was 22 which is her age now so I hope she doesn't do what I did. She's certainly not ready.

Unfortunately there isn't any other trusted adult in her life that could help me. The power of prayer is all that I have.
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  #36  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 06:39 PM
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Rose76 Rose76 is offline
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You've come to a very good conclusion. You cannot live her life for her or make her decisions for her.

It may be her destiny to make some big mistakes and learn some hard lessons in the hardest way. Respect that. Then the bond will survive between you. When she has learned what life will teach her, she will still be glad of a mother.
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Always Hurting
Thanks for this!
Always Hurting
  #37  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 07:03 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talthybius View Post
You are making a problem that is your daughter's boyfriend's problem, your problem.

It is not even clear to me that your daughter has a problem. She 'blows money'? What does that mean? She is in college. That's not the stage in your life where you save up money. And even if she has a money problem, if it is her money and if it doesn't get out of hand, what you can actually do is limited.

Now, if you are paying for all her expenses, you might have a say. But her 'wasting money', that's just your judgment. Maybe it is an investment. Maybe she is getting important life experiences partying, traveling, or whatever she is doing with her money.

As for her BF, why withhold approval? It's not how you influence who she picks to out to start a relationship. Parent's have a huge effect on how their children pick their spouses, but they don't do any of that by approving or disapproving. You did that by learning her what good partner qualities are from the nature of the relationship you and your husband have.

Don't know where the the daughter using drugs and being almost pregnant come from. But maybe thatś just culture difference.

As for the argument that she cannot possibly even drink alcohol, my parents are both alcoholics. One a functional one, the other a totally dysfunctional one. As a teenager, I used to be the only one not drinking, and I was able to do this because I was too autistic to be affected by this thing called peer pressure. Now that I am older, I have 'secretly' drunk alcohol, just to mellow stress away and 'help relax', even though I despite alcohol.

I'd say it goes the other way. If a parent is alcoholic, the child is more likely to be. Both because of genetic reasons as for nuture reasons.

Thank you so much for your comment. Let me explain, I am affected when my daughter comes to me with this guys mess. I know the actual problem is his problem but it affects my daughter which then affects me. In other posts I made I said there is way more to the story.
As a mother of course I want what is best for my daughter. To see her with a manipulative, verbally abusive jerk of a guy hurts me deeply. Not to mention he is a bum who refuses to work and she works double shifts all the time trying to provide for her needs and his. She also attends college full time. She has a lot on her plate by her own choices I know. Yes I know it is age appropriate for her to want to blow some money but when she wants to move into a new apartment she can't be doing this. I'm not going to give her money that he will benefit from. I've always taught her that she has to work hard for what she wants. No one is going to spoon feed her. I know that I am powerless over the choices she makes with her money. I understand that.

I'm not sure if you have read all the posts I've made in this thread. But if you decide to, it will help you understand why I disapprove of this guy.

I meant that my daughter can't possibly even drink alcohol. I said that because of what she has already seen and been through in her life with her alcoholic father that she has decided that she doesn't want to drink or do drugs. She has made that decision for herself. She told me she tried alcohol and smoked a little pot while at the University and she decided it wasn't something she wanted to keep doing. I was and am very proud of her for that. Alcoholism/Drug Abuse runs deep in our family so she understands that drinking is not going to be a good choice for her.
  #38  
Old Aug 21, 2016, 07:06 PM
Always Hurting Always Hurting is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rose76 View Post
You've come to a very good conclusion. You cannot live her life for her or make her decisions for her.

It may be her destiny to make some big mistakes and learn some hard lessons in the hardest way. Respect that. Then the bond will survive between you. When she has learned what life will teach her, she will still be glad of a mother.
Thank you! I just have to keep reminding myself of this.
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Rose76
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