more push pull, even in a fantasy!

Afternoon.

It is still impossible for me to completely renounce the fantasy.

I am still working thru the degradation cycle. I am trying to do a healthier scenario, where our power is more equal.

Ani has been encouraging me to do some things I am afraid to "in front of Boukreev", like dancing. I still feel this feeling of "What does Boukreev think of my dancing?" and also fear of "Boukreev hurting me or grabbing me and pulling me off the dance floor for being a showing off w****."

I know that this is a fantasy.

I want him to watch me dance. But I am scared of feeling vulnerable, as if he can do something bad to me.

Maybe I am working thru the fear.

Maybe I am processing this approval-seeking thing.

I hope to reach a goal of "not giving a d what Boukreev thinks".

Maybe I am confronting my fear.

Ani and I agreed to "make Boukreev go away" (stop the fantasy) if it's too much.

Like telling the computer to "end program" or "freeze program" when it's too much. Like on Star Trek.

The dbt site talks about star trek stuff; imagination. Holodeck programs and scenarios.

thanks,

Carol

Wow. I, like so many others here, did not realize that my tendency to obsessively and unwillingly sink into fantasy life could be related to BPD.
I am so sorry you're going through what you are going through, BrokenNBeautiful, but thank you for being so open and honest about it. It's very likely that you're helping others; you certainly just opened my eyes. I wish you the absolute best.
And also, to Longleaf - "impossible to switch off": well put, thank you.

This fantasy is wearing me out. Or working at it, anyway.

I stayed up again all night, until 8am and fell asleep until 1pm today. I got up and did some work and fought off some guilt about sleeping all day. I forced myself to get up after 1pm.

I am glad I am my own boss; dont' have to work for anyone now.

I would not last at a job! lol

My mentor does not approve of this fantasy but he does not scold me either; he knows how hard this is for me. I had tried to give it up and could not (yet). not sure, still if I want to.

But I am so tired. I feel like it's taking so much out of me.

thanks,

Carol

I still can't get rid of it.

I am attempting again.

I can't get rid of it cold turkey; have to wean myself off it.

I realize how destructive it is now.

It distracts me so from reality. Even from the work I do with Ani.

I have been behaving like a drug addict in withdrawal.

I may post a new thread about how that's going.

No more high.

No more pink cloud.

Cold stone cold reality now.

OMG.

Carol

back off the wagon.

g*d.

You need to come up with something meaningful to do that is away from this fantasy. Think and actively practice your DBT stuff. Try to let the thoughts be clouds, etc. Take a mindfulness walk, a warm bath or shower, clean your fridge, anything that can take your mind off of it for a while. Try meditating in bed or before bed. Get online and play games or play the games on here. That is the only suggestion I can come up with.

he was still on my mind, but I focused on Ani and on our self help mental wellness session.

I am coping, I am living, but things are still the same.

I can't sleep.

I cant' stop thinking about him.

Wanting him so badly.

And feeling an almost psychic feeling that I need to meet him and he's dead.

Does a dose of reality ever help? I know, reality sucks, that's what we're trying to get away from in the first place... but sometimes I'm able to step back and tell myself that (1) I don't even know if the object of my obsession is still alive after all these years and (2) after the way we parted, he wouldn't give a **** if he did know what I'm going through now. Which hurts, of course, but it sometimes stiffens my spine and helps me focus on other things. At other times, when I'm at a low ebb physically, I'm able to feel what such an intense focus on the past is doing to my energy level, as if all the oxygen is being sucked out of the room, and that helps me turn the thoughts off. I dunno... grasping at straws here. Wish I could help.

Maybe his being dead is part of it.

I was able to snap out of another thing for a singer back in 2004 because I found out his wife's name and that he lived somewhere with her. Gradually it went away.

Maybe imagining that Anatoli, if he were still alive, might have been engaged or married by now, to his gf.

Ouch.

But maybe that would have made me get over it.

Carol

When I applied this last night, I began to feel very let down; I came down down down.

I sat in my feelings, in bed, last night, very very uncomfortable. Very sad and afraid.

then I talked to my Higher Power. I am spiritual, not religious.

I said, "Take me away from this now. Channel away this reproductive feeling so that it becomes somthing useful in the universe."

And then I slept. I woke early and I will make it to my uncle's mom's memorial. Thank you Higher Power.

Carol

Just giving Longleaf a big thanks.

Carol

I think so. Often with my obsessions they end when I 'split' and move from the idealization stage to the devaluation. If the person is around me, their 'flaws' are more accessible. It sounds horrible, but I can devalue the person a lot easier when they are accessible and thus end the fantasy/ obsession. Sure devaluing is unhealthy, but it is certainly convenient for getting rid of an obsession.

If the person is dead, well that is not the case --the circle of idealization will continue on. There are a few things we can do, but we have to be entirely ready to give up the obsession (this is hard, obsessions are soothing and fantasies are a pleasing break from reality, I know that my obsessions definitely bring me comfort why would I want to get rid of them?). But if we really do:

-we have to get rid of anything to do with the person/ thing (throw out books, posters, pictures or give them to a friend to hold onto if we can't part with them just yet). removing the 'stuff' from your space can help with closure.
-use mindfulness and distraction to redirect thoughts. When we feel a fantasy coming on think about something else that excites you: a concept in a movie, a story you read, a new hobby. Practice breathing and meditation...need a guide? go here: www.audiodharma.org. Sit quietly. when you feel your mind going back to the person, bring it back to your breath.
-sounds harsh, but go and flirt whether online or in person, realize that this person is not the only one.
-practice mindfulness all day everyday as often as you can: be aware of reality and the sensate. do things to stimulate your senses and bring you back to reality when your mind wanders off.
Just a few things you could try...

I can relate either way, I have obsessions and am not ready to let them go...

ps. B, I just want to thank you and say that I admire your honesty and bravery in this thread, it is not easy to talk about such deep feelings and thoughts. Thank you for inspiring us with your honesty.

Just wanted to echo this sentiment. Thanks, Carol.

your thing is still working longleaf.

I am on night 4.

Carol

That's so great! Keeping my fingers crossed for you!

I slipped again.

this does not make sense.

I don't think addictions do.

I got back on the wagon this morning.

My uncle and his gf came down, sometimes triggers happen when you don't realize it.

Many of us do our drug of choice when we are h appy, sad, bored, aroused, angry, or just empty.

The thought went thru my mind, "Why not do it? It's just a fantasy."

Even the idea of the man's gf did not stop me this time.

But I felt BAD this morning.

Felt trapped all night.

I have never done without it before, though.

I have to keep trying.

Never give up.

As long as I keep trying.

Carol

I will make a greater effort to distract myself. it will be difficult. I am tired of the bad feelings.

You're right, addictions don't make sense. When I'm triggered, stressed, or sometimes for no reason, at all, my mind decides to fall into its old patterns like a car with faulty steering running into a ditch. It's not necessarily always about lost or otherwise unavailable men, either-- sometimes it's just an endless rehash of what I should have said, or a projection of what I might say or do in situation X, but it goes on without my willing it and keeps me from being in the here and now. My private name for it is "the machinery" because it feels like falling into some automated device that I have little control over. But I have a little more control than I used to, and I'm hanging on to that. If you've never done without the fantasy process, then it's remarkable that you were able to short-circuit it for three days-- don't sell yourself short.

I appreciate Longleaf's response.

this is hard.

Carol

I am still online; it's 12:29 am pst.

I am so scared to go to bed now.

I am so scared I am going to surrender again to him.

I want him so bad. So bad.

But I keep remembering how sick it really makes me.

All day, I was working and thought about him, at times; he drifted into the fore and the back of my mind and it just made me sick.

I am so scared if I lie down or be still, thoughts of him and longings for him will return and I won't have any way to fight it.

Just checking in.

Help...

If you don't know what to say, just say, "I am with you, Carol."

or just give me a hug or a thanks.

thanks,

Carol

Okay, I will try stratocaster's suggestion. "Bring it back to my breath".

Maybe I'll listen to Melody Beattie or one of my abuse recovery tapes.

thanks again,

Carol

With you, sister.

I did not quite make it.

I did breathe.

This is so hard.

One thing that did change, though. I was not as obsessed with him in a romantic way.

As I may have shared in a much earlier post in this thread, I think that loving him was for a reason.

It just got out of control.

I am not sure I know what I am doing.

Ani and I are trying to figure out, still, how to deal with it.

I have bpd. I think in absolute ways.

I am not sure I want to really *give up* Anatoli. But how I deal with him; projecting this imago on him, wanting him, etc.

Ani suggested that I read his book and face who he really was, not this image I have of him.

I have to see him as a person. maybe imagine again him being alive and me having the relationship that G*d may have intended me to have, not this distorted, fantasy projection of what I think I want to have with him.

I will keep you all posted.

Carol