my doctor may not help me...

Two years ago I went to my doctor with depression. Admittedly, a lot of very bad things had recently happened, which I disclosed to him. He told me to sort my life out. Nothing more.
I went back, said that was all very well, but how could I if I wasn't sleeping? He told me to sort my life out. Nothing more.
It took nine month on the dole, pretending I was looking for work, before I had the strength to really "sort my life out."

But now I'm depressed again. This time with no apparent reason. I want help and recognition, but I daren't go to my doctor for it. He made me feel like a the most good for nothing wretch. Instead of accepting I was depressed, he made out there was something wrong me. By which I mean, my attitude.

Does anyone know how to make a doctor understand? All the advice says they will help, but mine did not. Now I don't believe any of it.

Suggestions?

Gram

Can you find a new doctor? It's so much better to have one who actually listens to you. It might be a better idea to start by going to a therapist, who can refer you to a psychiatrist also.

If your doctor is a GP, he may just not feel competent to deal with mental health issues. General practitioners really are not trained in that, but should be ready to make referrals.

Here are the criteria for depression. I copied it from <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/>http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/</A> If you think you meet the criteria, you could show him the list and maybe he would take you more seriously when he sees that you know what you are talking about:

Criteria for Major Depressive Episode
(cautionary statement)
A. Five (or more) of the following symptoms have been present during the same 2-week period and represent a change from previous functioning; at least one of the symptoms is either
(1) depressed mood or
(2) loss of interest or pleasure.
Note: Do not include symptoms that are clearly due to a general medical condition, or mood-incongruent delusions or hallucinations.

(1) depressed mood most of the day, nearly every day, as indicated by either subjective report (e.g., feels sad or empty) or observation made by others (e.g., appears tearful). Note: In children and adolescents, can be irritable mood.
(2) markedly diminished interest or pleasure in all, or almost all, activities most of the day, nearly every day (as indicated by either subjective account or observation made by others)
(3) significant weight loss when not dieting or weight gain (e.g., a change of more than 5% of body weight in a month), or decrease or increase in appetite nearly every day. Note: In children, consider failure to make expected weight gains.
(4) Insomnia or Hypersomnia nearly every day
(5) psychomotor agitation or retardation nearly every day (observable by others, not merely subjective feelings of restlessness or being slowed down)
(6) fatigue or loss of energy nearly every day
(7) feelings of worthlessness or excessive or inappropriate guilt (which may be delusional) nearly every day (not merely self-reproach or guilt about being sick)
(8) diminished ability to think or concentrate, or indecisiveness, nearly every day (either by subjective account or as observed by others)
(9) recurrent thoughts of death (not just fear of dying), recurrent suicidal ideation without a specific plan, or a suicide attempt or a specific plan for committing suicide

<font color=purple> Or there is also dysthymic disorder, which some people consider to be a less severe form of depression, but I think it is just as bad although less intense, because it hangs on for so long. Here are the criteria for dysthymic disorder:</font color=purple>

Diagnostic criteria for 300.4 Dysthymic Disorder
(cautionary statement)
A. Depressed mood for most of the day, for more days than not, as indicated either by subjective account or observation by others, for at least 2 years. Note: In children and adolescents, mood can be irritable and duration must be at least 1 year.

B. Presence, while depressed, of two (or more) of the following:

(1) poor appetite or overeating
(2) Insomnia or Hypersomnia
(3) low energy or fatigue
(4) low self-esteem
(5) poor concentration or difficulty making decisions
(6) feelings of hopelessness

C. During the 2-year period (1 year for children or adolescents) of the disturbance, the person has never been without the symptoms in Criteria A and B for more than 2 months at a time.

<font color=purple>There is more but the rest of it is about excluding other diagnoses, since someone who has had a major depressive episode should be said to have major depressive disorder and people who have had manic episides are bipolar, etc....</font color=purple>

<font color=green>"Someone may have stolen your dream when it was young and fresh and you were innocent. Anger is natural. Grief is appropriate. Healing is mandatory. Restoration is possible." -Jane Rubietta</font color=green>

Hey, thanks.

As it happens, six months after the episode I spoke of in my original post, I saw a simplified version of that list on a waiting room wall. I had all but one of the symptoms. It's just that doctors like to tell you what is wrong with you, and not have you tell them. So I did nothing.

I have managed to get an alternative appointment tomorrow with someone associated with a mental health centre. Luckily my girlfriend had had dealings with them in the past. It's who you know, it seems.

Thanks ever so much for the reply. It does seem GPs are not the ones to ask about this kind of thing, even though that is what we are supposed to do. Honestly, you would of thought they'd make it easy for people.

I never would have got a different doctor organised without some help. That's the way of it, when you most need to act, that's when you can't. As an illness, it would be ironic if not so severe.

Thanks once again.

Gram

I hope it goes well with your appointment tomorrow and you finally get some help. It is ironic, isn't it? Depression keeps you down by keeping you from doing anything about it. Sometimes it takes someone stepping in and noticing that you need help. And when you do ask for help from someone who should be in a position to help you, and they don't want to admit that there is a problem, that just makes it worse. The first counselor I went to for depression told me that all I was was just homesick, and I was meeting most of the criteria for a major depressive episode (or maybe all of them), but he didn't ask the right questions and I was too withdrawn to be able to volunteer much. I had been depressed for about 10 years already then, and it wound up being closer to 25 years before I got help that was effective.

<font color=green>"Someone may have stolen your dream when it was young and fresh and you were innocent. Anger is natural. Grief is appropriate. Healing is mandatory. Restoration is possible." -Jane Rubietta</font color=green>

Gulp... Twenty five years???

That's terrible. It's good you can use that to help people now.

I shall try to speak my mind tomorrow.

Gram

your dr. may see things amiss, but have experience with how actually awfull many shrinks and current meds may be. perhaps he has faith you'll 'pull-out' of your spin. the mental health system is easily the most perilous. if an md chops the wrong foot---that's malpractice. if a shrink md 'burns-out' your true self, that's malpractice---but shrinks are near 'untouchable' in court---you have both feet---and they are incredibly dependent on the guy with a salesman case full of new wonder drugs---and although some clients obviously need shrink intervention, even then the resulting harm may not be seen for years, or sometimes only months. but you will have no recourse. the difficulty of litigation against shrinks breeds incompetence---easy to see why. cognitive talk therapy never wasted anyone---if you trust this gp with your physical health, and are ok with that, i'd find a super talk therapist before embarking on the current shrink situation. and use the net to educate yourself---you will find, 'here be monsters'. be carefull. please.

pirate

Gramlin, I am sorry that happened with your doctor. I had a similar experience A good psychiatrist or therapist will listen and help, and take you seriously.

Take care and keep posting,
Fuzzy

Very sinister sounding words. I am hoping for acknowledgement and to be granted rest. If my doctor is a person, maybe that will be what I am given. I just feel hopeless. I don't want to damage anything, not even myself. I'm going to ask for help in getting better.

Hope, wait, see...

Gram

well, i am left-handed, but hardly sinister. but for decades i've seen the damage possible. from groups where half the members have tardive dsykinesia---nobody warned them, and it's irreversible once seen, to my cousin put on zoloft take off into mania, divorce her architect husband and join a biker club. i have truly seen a lot of shrink damage, and if you surf, you will see i am not trying to scare you or be sinster, rather protect you from an area of medicine that is just plain dangerous. if you search and read the article on lithium being superior to depakote at stopping self-harm, you will read a story of an older, non-patentable drug being replaced by drug cos. with a more exspensive 'improvement', which they hold a patent on. shrinks rely on drug co. data---like asking the wolf to guard the hen-house. the goal of these cos. is profit. your well-being is secondary. mortality among depakote users is much higher than lithium patients. search 'lithium and suicide'---the article is there. and consider this, 'atypical neuroleptics' (zyprexa-risperdal) are being marketed for bipolars, even though made for the schizophrenias. while they may have use for acute mania patients---short-term---many shrinks just put patients on them indiscriminatly---and don't keep up to date. my 4th daughter, ex regent berkley scholar went manic---zyprexa steadied her---but now, only a year later, she can't control her tongue motion---tardive dyskinesia pure and simple---she's only 26. i was put on librium, with no warning it was addictive and that after months or years, withdrawal is harder than heroin. my current dr. is truthfull---'you're almost 60. you don't have time to 'come-back'---it's a year's taper, then recurrent withdrawal horror until death.'--- these drugs are illegal for more than 28 days in europe and the uk. they have their short-term uses, but decades after 'the valley of the dolls', now no resonsible dr. will script them long-term. as a perhaps 'newbie' to shrinkdom, i've only tried to keep you from walking in blind. that's not sinister---that's a firend.

pirate

please read the new post on cognitive---i don't know here it is, but just showed up today. bless you

pirate

HI Bunny, I'm glad you wrote. I can relate. The experience I had with one psychiatrist was absolutley horrible.. I'm sure there are some good mental health professions out there, but I am having a hard time finding one..

there are good shrinks---the best i ever had was a retired neuro-surgeon from u of michigan---developed a fine hand tremor., so he switched to shrinkdom. another was a lady on maui, top yale grad., and her stance was 'minimal drugs'. now i understand. the real problem is that most become drs. for money---and there is no safer area for an idiot than pschychiatry---almost impossible to catch them at malpractice.
and they know it. and even the best screw up. my alaskan u of mich switched me from imipramine hcl to the pamoate version so i could take one pill vs. 4---i went berserk. he'd never seen this---we looked at the pdr---completely different molecules. that was the 1st time i was called 'the fine print man'. i'm a 'paradoxical reactor'. the best way i've seen to sort the quacks from the real drs. is regrettably experience. you'll find one, but as i recall you spoke of orthomolecular treatment. it's safe. i wonder why you're not on that track? best wishes

pirate

and there is no safer area for an idiot than pschychiatry---almost impossible to catch them at malpractice.

Bunny, you are way off base in lumping psychologists and psychiatrists in that way. I have the most awesome therapist there is - for the last two and a half years. I don't know what I would do without him, to be honest I would not be alive.

If you have had bad experiences, that is too bad. There are always people that shouldn't have the jobs they do, but at least phrase it that the ones YOU have had are bad.......not all of them are idiots.

Mary Alice

i've said i've had great drs., so you have an error of fact. my point on this medical area being more suitable to inept drs., vs. say neurosurgens is an obvious truth. i'm not out to shake your security---you found a great dr., i'm happy for you. the area is so vague it's a miracle any are good. seems about 20% to me, having been thru a dozen---including a respected graduate of the u of santa domingo---which got roasted by '60-minutes' as a diploma mill. he had my blood pressure at 140/160---then suggested his brother, a cardiologist--i fired him. you found a great dr.---you must realize all are not so lucky. just like with gps or dentists.

pirate

thank god somebody's glad i wrote. seems most here have been lucky beyond expectations. i'm not out to flame or cause pain---but when you see drug cos. shove a cheap unpatentable drug, lithium, aside for depakote, big$$$, and a much higher suicide rate (search 'lithium and suicide'), perhaps you'll see my angst. that article was in every major newspaper. it's online. drug cos. show the same ethics of big tobacco---money---the love of money, is the root of all evil. i'm no religious zealot, but there was a man who said, 'all i ask is you love one another'---seems that idea has been trampled under boots made of $1000 bills.
thanks for the kudo---i'm not the mean man some suppose. i've just seen too much. whoops, out of smokes, gotta run.

pirate

I was on depakote and stopped by myself. Although it was a exfriend, who told me that I wasn't sober since I was on meds. 6 in total prescibed by my pysch to help with my depression (bipolar). Limactal, geodan, paxil, along with the Depakote...oh I can't remember them all. I stopped taking the meds in
April 2008 and now I'm having a depressive episode. So I think, I haven't been to work in 2 weeks. Was is the blues of the Christmas expectations? My parents were they going to be drunk. I stopped taking the meds after trying to get off of them by going the a psych ward. I commited myself (I told them I was sucidental). and they didn't take me off them that was last July 2007. So I'm bad questioning myself. And I depressed or am I lazy. My psych told me that I was lazy that I was like a little kid that didn't want to get up and go to school. I'm afraid to go back to work. I'm in a funk. I don't want to go out of the house or get dressed or worst take a shower. I want to go and crawl back into my bed. I went backt to work in July 2008 after being on medical leave for 3 months (that's all they allow) I was doing great. Everyone loved me (I transferred from the other location due to fear of bullying from coworker). I was working so hard everyday. I came in really early and I stayed really late. I worked continueously all day, bearly stopping to go to the bathroom or eat something. One of my co-workers took it upon herself to dragged me out of the office to go to lunch. After a few months of that I was glad to have my lunch hour changed...this way I can stay and work. Now that I've finally settled into a desk of my own,the supervisor wants to relocate me upstairs where I won't be around the people I've gotten to know after these past months (since July). I will have to meet new people and I don't know what to expect. I guess I'm scared. I don't want to face this change. It may be a promotion but I don't care. I'm happy working where I am. Maybe that's the problem I'm having. Or the depression has just added to this situation. I'm worrying all the time when should I go back to work. Monday starts the third week of me being absent. OMg. What's happening to me? Do I need to go back on meds.?
Should I take time off of work, again? Please advise. Thanks. I need your help.