The right kind of blue... do you enjoy some aspects of depression?

I once went to a therapist who asked me what I was getting out of being depressed. She said I wouldn't continue the behavior if I wasn't getting something I wanted out of it. It really offended me and I didn't return for a follow up. However, there is a grain of truth in it although it is not the whole answer. I do get to blame my failures on my depression not my abilities and effort. I also, when I was younger, had some of the same sense of feeling deeper than others, etc. At this point, more than 20 years into the whirlwind, I feel numb must of the time.

Do I enjoy depression on an intellectual level?

When people out here (including myself) are actually suffering from mental illness, you have the nerve to ask this ridiculous, frivolous question. I think you have too much time on your hands there in your ivory tower. This is an insult to anyone who is trying to grapple with very real, very damaging, very painful issues.

I also choose not to be on meds but I also don't go around whining about not being able to save the world. I'd give my left you-know-what to be completely rid of my depression. And if you enjoy the depths of yours so much, you're welcome to mine. My depths don't stimulate me the way yours do. Jesus what a question.

So is it a competion now? Who suffers the most?

Look the past week has not been fun for me. Dramatic mood swings. At times I am losing sense of time and space. Not enjoyable... but maybe in retrospect it will make sense.

I am talking to a level where you are down, but still conscious... the one particular place which, I, and as seems others, seem to have found. Is it worth it? I don't know.

And I whine? Look, I feel powerless, but I doubt meds would give me power to save Euro and prevent Assad from killing more civilians. I am aware of these, and it scares me. But I have been to Eastern Europe, trying to do my good. I study (yes, I am ivory tower dweller, and I study hard to gain skills to be able to do more).

I don't necessarily think it's enjoying it, I think it's that it goes on for so long and effects you so deeply that you get used to it, so much so that the thought of not having depression anymore canbe a bit daunting because it seems like it would be someone I've lost touch with completely due to being so used to the depression. It's a horrible horrible thing to deal with, and I no I would do almost anything to get the old me back. I don't enjoy depression, it ruins so much and is so powerful, but then I may be afraid to let go of it because of what a massive part of my life it is. But no, not a single aspect of it do I enjoy.

I think it's an excellent question. I don't enjoy depression. I may find a little perverse satisfaction in my suffering but the reasons for that is in the "self sabotage" thread.
Melancholic nostalgia...yes I do think I have enjoyed a bit of that.
Oh yeah...I can relate to that. I envy people who don't see it.

And THIS is why I think that whoever's therapist said this, the comment was a little insensitive..."Pity Party"? Really? I don't know...Maybe it's me looking too deep into that comment, but the words that people choose to use can be very telling about how they feel or think....

But anyway...I agree with the poster....I do tend to find myself thinking alot...Over thinking maybe sometimes? I can get deep into analayzing...Sometimes this is a bad thing though...It's good when I gave an "ephiphany" but when I think so much to the point where I'm beginning to over think and worry....Yea, not good And I totally get what you are saying...I've notices this about myself as well...What can I say?

I can understand what you are talking about VenusHalley. I also tend to feel things deeply, and I am thankful for this. Because if I didn't do it, I'd be more like my peers in that my feelings would be pretty superficial. When you mention "whiney emo", this is what I am talking about. I guess what I'm trying to say is that my depression allows me to think and feel to a profound level that many people my age never really stop to experience. This helps me in my writing, too. It's a trade-off of sorts - could this be the reason many brilliant thinkers in history also showed signs of mental illness? They used it to their advantage rather than constantly fighting to hate it.
Interesting.

Love Plath too I agree with this post because I see so much of myself in it. Which isn't a problem for me at all.

I agree it may partly be being used to it. It becomes part of you.... and I guess one would feel losing part of their identity.

Maybe it is pathological. But I have been a dark person whole my life. I play acted "dying" in kindergarten. Depressed child? Maybe. Vivid imagination? Totally. I got send to psych eval for claiming I am a rabbit. I learned to fake better with time. (and I still like to pretend I am a cat. Meow). Point is... this is me. Maybe I my baseline is lower than general's populations, but I don't know. I am not sure I wanna change that. I just wanna know how to cope the best I can.

Arcangel... I guess I percieve some people somehow shallow. Maybe it is a pathology... but... what if I cannot really change the way I am and feel? Maybe recovery in the sense of "being old self" or "being normal" is not possible. I can alleviate symptoms a bit, the lowest dips and calm down the outerspace manias.... but it is still there....

Indie, yeah... there is something with geniuses being mad. Maybe it is the sense of feeling strongly. Maybe feeling strongly is not good for us in the evolution sense... but what would world be without art and philosophy? It is trademark of humanity.

I was a dark child too, and continue to be now in my late teens. I strongly believe it is just "me". When I was sad, I would write or draw or study whatever topic happened to be on my mind at the moment, i.e. nuclear chemistry or linguistics or Old English, etc. If I could have chosen to have grown up happy and normal while not possessing my interest in these sorts of things, I would have turned it down and stuck with my melancholy.

does anybody feel the same way? Do you enjoy depression on intellectual level?[/QUOTE]

Yes, I do.

I feel you completely and 100 percent. Some of my best writing in the past came from a very dark place. While I don't enjoy the "I want to die" point either (and I've been getting there here lately ) I do get the intellectual level. I've been told by many people that I'm an empath. I've always been able to tell what people are feeling and thinking just by being near them for a minute. I feel things too deeply sometimes it feels but I like it in a way and hate it. It really is hard to understand and describe but I never thought I would see anyone with the same views.

Excuse me gulus, but you are way out of line here! Attacking a member because of their beliefs is totally unacceptable. Yes on some level people with depression (including myself) may get some benefit from it. Acknowledging that is the first step to change.

I think you owe venus an apology!

Love and Hugs,
Tara

What is this, some sort of cabal of enablers? I think anyone who has read my posts since joining a month and a half ago might deduce that I am an empathetic listener. When I hear people tell of hardship, I empathize. Look, I buried my brother 14 yrs ago after he hung himself, I dragged my poor mother out of the woods on a rug to save her from near suicide. I realize these are dramatic examples but when I hear silly philosophizing, I have a immediate, gut reaction of disbelief, disgust. There are very real problems out there and here we are philosophizing about whether it occasionally feels good to feel ******. I thought we were trying to get better here, not wallow in it. Again, I'm offering my depression to any of you who like to stew in it. Come take as much as you want, there's plenty.

Venus is an adult and can defend herself. Therefore, I'm sure she can deal with a single, solitary dissenting opinion. Furthermore, I've enjoyed responding to some of her other posts, as she knows, so the idea that this is a personal attack is ludicrous, I don't even know her.

But I have too my opinion. When it comes to mood disorders... it is problematic that these are normal emotions, amplified. Hence, you cannot compare mood disorder to let's say cancer, which is pure pathology. Emotions are not, and degree in which we can handle them without intervention differs from a person to person... But to hate your emotions is not a good approach, imho.

And I am offended that you call my thoughts "silly philosophizing" (have you read all my comments here. I poured my soul out. Yes, I may sound academic, but that is my style... my casual style. I talk in this style when talking to friends too. But this is very real for me too. And since I think I handle myself pretty well, I think my point of view has some value (and believe me I had plans how to end it all. Maybe it was my ability to see light in darkness saved me? Or maybe this over developed sense of self preservation?).

And real problems? How can we compare what problems is more real? Because we could always say there is civil war in Syria and people in Africa die cause they have no access to clean water. And while this is consider a big no-no and offensive to tell to a struggling person... it is somehow considered okay to start the "I suffered more" competition. But who is helped when we turn mental health into pissing contest?

I'm going to end this dialogue on a positive note, since negativity-perceived or otherwise-is counter-productive. In the end, it's whatever gets you through the day that I'm in favor of...so if you find some solace in your bluest moments, I'm happy for you.

To many, a mood disorder is just as devastating as cancer. To say someone pours their soul out implies another does not. What I see in this thread is a difference of opinions that are sincerely held.

Point is, mood disorders are not cancer... so the way we think about them is very important. Cliche goes "you cannot think yourself out of depression...". But maybe you can think yourself through it?

I seen plenty soul sharing here in the thread... and I applaud those who do. After all, it doesn't have to be show me yours, I will show you mine...

Point could also be cancer is not mood disorder. There is a movement to do away with dualism. Instead of treating a mental component differently from a physical component, the treatment team treats the whole. Whether one thinks out of or through seems to me a distinction without a difference. In either case the mind is used to better your life.

Treatment team? For mental health nevertheless? Life must be wonderful in countries with high GDP...

I am not gonna pretend we cannot even afford food here, because that is not the truth... and things are well here. Still cannot think of a person who has a team for their depression over here...

Thinking out - not being depressed anymore. Thinking through - getting through a period of low without external damage. You are still depressed but it is "okay".

The treatment team in my country most often starts with a general practitioner and includes others who treat the maladies that plague you, both physical and mental.

Your post started with a query whether some enjoy aspects of depression. People have sincerely disagreed. It is far afield now and people still sincerely disagree.

I will post here no more. The target keeps on moving.

I am just replying the posts with my own thoughts. You know a discussion. Somebody says something, somebody else says something else......

And I don't mind people disagreeing with me, when they are not personally attacking me or others. I have every right to defend myself.

One of the few aspects of depression that I enjoy, is the fact that nothing can truly surprise me in a negative way. I can get to the point where I feel so low that any bad news is expected and becomes the norm. Anything better than bad news is a lift. No one can hurt me more than I do myself, my own pain makes me invincible to the pain others try to inflict on me.

Plus I always find myself preparing for the worst.

of course i feel that way, that's what makes happiness so hard to swallow, its just not as raw or familiar as sadness. I believe in chemical imbalances, but i don't believe I have one. Sometimes sadness brings me peace in its authenticity. It is a relief to face my sadness and it feels even more rewarding when that sadness is accompanied with a feeling of acceptance. You are very insightful and I agree that misery can be rewarding in the same way happiness can be destructive.

Venus, after reading through this I've gone through a bunch of different feelings about the thread as a whole. First I was angry, not VERY angry mind you but a bit hurt-angry, if that makes any sense. Then I thought about it for a second. I have been through some of this before, where people will say you've been depressed "use it!". Use the feelings to create artistic expression or whatever.

But to me, honestly it's not depression that creates any depth. Depression takes EVERYTHING away, at least for me. It takes AWAY creativity, it takes away the ability to think. I can't see anything positive that comes from depression specifically.

I CAN see how working through suffering can be turned in a positive way. This is a well documented fact... that we learn through adversity, and sometimes we gain more from suffering than through happiness.



So I do see where you're coming from.

My question to you is, what brought you to post this? Do you feel connected to your depression? If so does this connection confuse you, or are you looking to see what others think about it, or if anyone else has felt this way? Does feeling that depression can be positive in some way make you feel better about having to deal with it?

In a weird way you're almost fighting depression with "well if I'm stuck with it I'm going to make the best of it" and that's good. For what it's worth I've felt connected to it too sometimes. I DO NOT like this, but it has made me who I am for better or for worse.


Enough rambling. Hope you don't mind a long reply - depression makes me not think or write as clearly