[ScientiaOmnisEst]

So I went on a triggering rampage here a few days ago, and just had a huge self-harming episode an hour ago. The one good thing about it is it made me cry - long, hard, and uncontrollably for the first time in months. It feels so amazing even though it hurts so much.

I've been ruminating almost constantly about the unreality of my so-called issues. Even my mom, who witnessed and was slightly involved in my episode just now, calls it all "drama queen nonsense". I made a bunc of deleted posts about it. It's so common, I hear about it constantly - "Some people have real problems, so stop being a whiny little b!tch." Real problems. For years I've thought if I had those, I wouldn't have to feel so guilty about not having them. It sounds dumb. But it rips me apart, all that guilt, knowing that because I have no "real problems", I have no right to feel anything except happiness - which I'm not sure I've ever really experienced. I have no right to feel empty or in pain because I didn't spend my childhood fearing for my life. I have no right to be sad because I've never been abused.

It kills me, this guilt. This guilt that I'm a living insult by being so miserable with my perfect life, yet I can't make myself stop. Or maybe I don't want to. Or maybe I'm just too weak, which is another whole avalanche of moral guilt.

What makes the whole thought so unbearably painful is...there's nothing else to me. If I stopped being depressed, stopped indulging my first world problems, stopped being a whiny little baby and developed the emotional state I'm supposed to have as an adult with a perfect life - all I can imagine is a kind of living death. It's incomprehensible, the sheer emptiness of it. Is that what being a normal person is like, just totally empty and blank, all the time? There's nothing else in my life. I don't care about anything. I can't relate or connect to people at all. I'm fairly sure I'm incapable of feeling love even for my family. I'm afraid of too many things. I'm bad because of all of this and feel like no punishment is enough not the least because there's no escape.

I shouldn't even be posting here, for multiple reasons, but I needed to get this out somewhere.

[MtnTime2896]

Most people who haven't gone through it themselves will believe whole-heartedly that what you're enduring is "make believe". It's easy to judge what you don't understand and lay blame where ever you see fit. Your mom's doing that to you by not acknowledging what you're going through. Hell, the way she talks to you...well, lets just say that a mother should never call her child a ******. You just don't do that. It's like people don't understand that someone can just be ****ed up based on simply being truly unhappy. Just at their very core depressed, with no explanation. That has to be the worst for, at least to me. At least someone who's gone through bad **** can have an idea why they "aren't right". You don't seem to have that. You just are.
I don't have really any advice to give other than I hope you have someone looking out for you who isn't wrapped up in themselves.

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Thanks. I've posted repeatedly about feeling distress over my "depression" not being real or valid. I mean, last night I laughed! I was watching something on Youtube and laughed until I couldn't breathe for the first time in months (really, I went from crying for the first time in months, to laughing harder than I have in maybe a year, in the span of 24 hours. Is that normal?), possibly a couple years. I can't be depressed, right?

If I'm depressed at all I'm dysthymic, stuck in a chronic low mood that spikes up every now and then, but it doesn't last long. But there's plenty of egoism mixed in too (granted, I'm increasingly convinced I'm a narcissist). So maybe, like an article I'll get in trouble if I post claimed, I'm not depressed but merely selfish. I don't know what to make of myself.

[MtnTime2896]

It's actually perfectly possible to cry hard one moment and then laugh harder than life the next, especially if you haven't been able to do either in a very long time. When the emotions do come out, they pour out. Too much pressure in the spill way, you know?
All of those, especially the dysthymia is perfectly possible and should be further explored. I know it's easy to just assume that everything is all just made up because it isn't physical. But it is real, very real and shouldn't be shoved aside. It's really a good thing that you let those emotions out, that's healthy and needs to happen. You also need a healthy support system there to help guide you through it, or at the very least just sit with you until you're through the episode. Your pain, your mental state, is very real and should be treated as such.

[Clara22]

Many people do not understand the nature of depression. Even some medical doctors do not understand depression. Depression can be caused by several factors. You can have depression because of a major trauma (associated to PTSD) or for a sudden change in your environment. But also you can have depression while you do not have traumas to overcome. Depression itself is a "real problem" and it is epidemic.
Successful people can have depression Forbes Welcome
Also you can see https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List...ssive_disorder

[Hopeofreedom]

I agree with the posters above. Even in 2016 people don't understand depression or mental illness . I do believe it's getting better but we have a LONG way to go.

I've also made a post about the guilt of having depression when , from the outside you appear to be privileged.

I would be lying if I said I had the answer, but I think there are different categories of problems no matter where you go.

One thing thats helping me is to not be with "myself" so much. I noticed that when I'm alone too much I focus on only myself and thoughts start to eat away at me. My focus is to narrow.

So now I'm getting out more and using some of my focus to help others.. (work, volunteering, etc.)

Depression has definitely darkened my outlook on life too. But just knowing that helps me too.

You can do it 👍😘

If your going thru a hard time , please don't hurt yourself! Use this instead

http://www.crisistextline.org

Text START to 741-741

I think when we have guilt about something, it "magnifies" and makes it harder to recover from depression. You probably have more "real problems" than you realize. And as other's have said your mom's lack of understanding is one of them.

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Originally Posted by Mysterious153

I think when we have guilt about something, it "magnifies" and makes it harder to recover from depression. You probably have more "real problems" than you realize. And as other's have said your mom's lack of understanding is one of them.

When I say real problems, I mean things like abuse, disability, chronic illness, or social strife (war, persecution, etc).

Funny you mention my mom not understanding. I think she's just starting to, though damn did she miss a lot, apparently.

My mom has bipolar II, and has recently been slipping back into a depressive episode. The other night she told me so, and asked if I understood what was happening. I said yes. Apparently, she didn't realize until now just how cognizant I was of something being wrong with her, and how much her mood swings and episodes scared me at times. By the time I was 12, I was prepared to come home and find her dead, or would worry that she was late picking me up because she had killed herself. Crazy, I know, but to me it seemed a perfectly reasonable possibility from someone who would start randomly talking about suicide sometimes.

My mom now sees me as incredibly mature for witnessing her for having coped with her disorder at such a young age. Somehow this segued in to her declaring my own depression is definitely real, and it's not faking. At the same time, like I mentioned in my OP, she'll call my SI melodramatic and such. So I don't know how much she understands of me.

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

I hate randomly hurting for no reason.

It always seems that when I get excited about possibilities in life, my mind (and a bit of luck) is right there to screw it up. Today I got hit with another nihilism fit, the first in months. Sudden, pervasive emptiness and remembering old online discussions about how values don't exist/aren't real, everything's going to die so why bother with anything, etc. Arguments from others that depression is the "optimist's disease" caused by being unable to accept reality as it is; or that it's caused be realizing "nihilistic truths" like 'I'm worthless' and 'nothing matters', but not being able to accept it. A lot of bull.

I also remember refutations: claims like these being feelings, ideas just as much as an exciting ideal; nihilism being a power play; the necessity for a conscious mind to form a judgement at all; or my favorite, the reminder that all thought and life is a projection, and nihlism is the glitch that results from trying to strip away that projection...with the projection.

I don't know why I'm writing this other than to make myself feel better. Because this always, ALWAYS hits when I can feel myself getting excited about life, eager to do this and that, bring about this change, chase that dream, whatever. Then this emptiness hits out of nowhere. On one hand, it makes me worry that those thoughts are correct and hope is stupid. At the same time, this all makes me want to distrust it, and the philosophy behind it. If others find satisfaction in it, good on them. I think they're wrong and kind of crazy. Or maybe I'm trickng myself. I need reason to do what matters to me. Whether it's supernatural, natural, or merely human, I cannot just do things that affect others "for myself."

Sorry for the long and off-topic post.

"I've been ruminating almost constantly about the unreality of my so-called issues. " Just some random thoughts of mine: your mind is a blessing (you seem very intelligent) and a curse (you seem to get caught up in your thoughts). Some people are not into the "mindfulness" thing. I can't do yoga anymore but I used to do a lot of it. Most classes end with guided meditation. They would have you lay on your back, close your eyes, and breath in a relaxed, steady and full sort of way. Trying to just listen and think about your breath. Other thoughts will creep in, the sort of things you post about. That's OK; you're supposed to just acknowledge it, be relaxed but return to thinking about your breath. The more you do it; the more you sort of train your mind to return to focusing on your breath. When I went through a bad period (ruminating, disturbing thoughts), I sort of did this last week as part of my bedtime routine and it seemed to help. Of course, all the years of yoga sort of trained me to be able to return to this feeling. Anyways, I just saying that some form of meditation might help if you are open to it.
Another random thought (I'm sure your mind has already explored this). The unpredictability of you mother's mood swings may have affected your brain in a "PTSD" sort of way. That kind of thing is more traumatic when you are very young. No, it's not as bad as people who have been abused or in a war zone but it still could have affected you in that sort of way. (Makes you really have empathy for people who have suffered worse abuse, doesn't it?) But, nevertheless, the SH thoughts, isolation, guilt, emptiness, etc. are very real problems. All you can do is try to learn to accept it and work with it. Perhaps you need to consult with a therapist of psychiatric if it becomes to overwhelming for you.
So I hope you are doing a little better this morning and I enjoy your penchant toward philosophical discussion (but try not to allow yourself to ruminate about philosophy so much that you're in utter anguish).

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Originally Posted by Mysterious153

Another random thought (I'm sure your mind has already explored this). The unpredictability of you mother's mood swings may have affected your brain in a "PTSD" sort of way. That kind of thing is more traumatic when you are very young. No, it's not as bad as people who have been abused or in a war zone but it still could have affected you in that sort of way. (Makes you really have empathy for people who have suffered worse abuse, doesn't it?)

Yes, I have considered it. Apparently, my dad would "run interference" when I was very young and my mom was having a depressive episode. In the first few years of my life, she was also battling her own, actual postpartum PTSD (she nearly died giving birth to me) complete with anxiety attacks and physical impairment. Could this have affected me? Sure. I didn't really become aware of and afraid of my mom's moods until I was maybe 11 or 12.

I doubt it's any kind of pseudo-PTSD though. My generation (Millennials) is notoriously fragile, and everything causes PTSD today, it seems. I mean, in my mom's day, you just put up with bullying or fought back, and when you left school, it never bothered you again. No one got depressed about it, developed PTSD from it, or committed suicide over it. Likewise, I understand in the past it was normal for parents to beat their children - that was just called discipline. Now it's "abuse" and causes "trauma". My generation is inherently weaker than others, I don't know why. But I'm inclined to see these claims of "trauma" coming from obviously non-traumatic sources as ridiculous and weak (including in myself. I never insult a group unless I'm part of it).

Trust me, I would love for it to be valid. There would be a lot less shame and anger that way. But I can't accept it.

So I hope you are doing a little better this morning and I enjoy your penchant toward philosophical discussion (but try not to allow yourself to ruminate about philosophy so much that you're in utter anguish).

Sleep always helps. I feel like I'm back to normal in a sense.

My philosophical streak is kind of artificial - the internet inspired it in me, and I'm not much of a truth seeker by nature. But I feel like I should care about it and consider it.

Is your mom willing/able to take you to the psychiatrist? I was just thinking, you really are at the point of being overwhelmed.

Dear ScientiaOmnisEst,
This morning when I woke up I was thinking of you.
I was thinking of you because I had my own sort of "triggering episode that started late August. Like you, I felt like I was "back to normal" (beginning over last weekend). But yesterday I went to my therapist. When I think about the conversation I realize that I am still struggling with distorted thinking. I know that your problems are not exactly the same as mine but I still need to see a psychiatrist and a therapist otherwise my distorted thinking gets worse and worse. I hope that you tell your parents about your SH and unbearable thoughts. I think it should be evaluated but a psychiatrist.
Sorry for being such a busybody. I hope it doesn't make you angry. Just let me know if you are tired of it (and I will stop posting reply after reply). Sincerely, Myst

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

^ I wish you guys wouldn't be so nice.

My mom knows about my SI, my depression, and much of what's wrong with me. She alternates between saying I need to get out, and that I need psych help. She's on one of her tirades again threatening me with legal action for not helping around the house, and for allegedly destroying it. She tells her psychiatrist about me and he hates me, says I should be kicked to the curb, who cares if I live or die. Her lawyer says the same thing.

She's forbidden me from cooking in the house, says I'm only allowed to eat fast food from now on. If I try to cook, she says I'll go to jail. I'm not sure whether she's serious this time

You can probably tell we don't always get along that great. I know I should move out, but between paying her and my own terrible spending habits, and that I'm losing my job in about three weeks, I don't have much choice but to pitch in more and put up with it here until then.

Back on topic, I know my thinking can get distorted. I sometimes feel this weird dissociation from my thoughts, where I can fully realize when they're "crazy" but see nothing I can do about it and don't want to do anything about it.

I'm just kind of 'living' right now.

[Humpty Dumpty]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

I've been ruminating almost constantly about the unreality of my so-called issues. Even my mom, who witnessed and was slightly involved in my episode just now, calls it all "drama queen nonsense". I made a bunc of deleted posts about it. It's so common, I hear about it constantly - "Some people have real problems, so stop being a whiny little b!tch." Real problems. For years I've thought if I had those, I wouldn't have to feel so guilty about not having them. It sounds dumb. But it rips me apart, all that guilt, knowing that because I have no "real problems", I have no right to feel anything except happiness - which I'm not sure I've ever really experienced. I have no right to feel empty or in pain because I didn't spend my childhood fearing for my life. I have no right to be sad because I've never been abused.

I understand this so very much. Do you do this/go through this strictly for attention? Based on everything you have wrote I would say not. Yes there is a difference between seeking attention, and seeking advice or just having to get something off your chest. So I would say this does not make you a whiney little bit ch. I too was never abused growing up. I had good parents that love me. I am now a grown man with my own family & I struggle with sever depression and suicidal thoughts. I see how happy other other people are around me so I don't think not being depressed is just feeling hallow. Feeling hallow can lead to depression, or so I've been told. I try my hardest to hid my depression from everyone & I do a good job of it. Yet when I reach out for help or advice I honestly feel like I'm standing up and saying "look at me. Look at me." When the truth is I hate being the center of attention. You don't always have to have a "real" reason to be depressed. Sometimes people are just depressed for "no reason" at all. That does not mean they are just seeking attention. Most often it is just the opposite. They want to be left alone. Even if you don't want to be left alone though that does not mean you are being a crybaby or a whiney little.....You're just depressed & need help. I strongly encourage you to go get the help you need. And remember you can always post on here whenever you want. We will not think any less of you for it.

Also based on your last post it seems as if your mom has some serious mental issues she needs to deal with her self. As for her lawyer they need to STFU. They are not a dr and they don't know you & everything you've been through. Her dr is treading dangerous ground trying to diagnose you solely based on what your mom is saying.

You have a lot to deal with. Honestly, you have described so many real problems. Your mom's mental illness, yours, job loss, and the fact that you are stuck in a terrible environment (can't cook, etc.).
Obviously, a new job search has to be a new priority. If you find a job in the future, maybe see if you could be a roommate somewhere? You said that you've been paying you're mom some sort of rent anyways. You probably already realize that a new environment might help your mental illness. And, obviously, there are many who post here who are also trapped in less than desirable environments. But each situation is painful in its own very real way.
Still thinking of you. Myst

Something else to consider. If you live in a state that expanded medicaid (we didn't in Florida but a majority of the states did), you might be eligible once you are unemployed. The cutoff (this is very approximate and varies by state) for eligibility is around $12,000 annually.

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Myst: For all I know, the whole "if you try to cook I'll have you arrested" deal is just another empty threat, another angry ramble. It wouldn't be the first time, and it's certainly not the first time my mother's gone on about having me removed or put into care or something of that nature.

My living situation, I've realized, is not a real problem. I'm an adult and I should have moved out four or five years ago. Everyone - from the internet to my mom's lawyer and psychiatrist, stand by "my house, my rules" - if she wants to forbid me from cooking, not let me leave the house, dictate what I can and can't wear, she can, and I have no rights because I'm a "squatter". To me it's absurd, partly because of my age and that, although my mother claims I live for free, I actually pay around $250 a month (according to her, no judge would accept that as "valid" rent, and her psych calls that paltry amount "responsibility money" that I should pay out of my own conscience).

Also, it's one thing for a landlord to set rules like "no pets" or "no smoking". But can you imagine a landlord dictating what their tenants could eat, watch, practice, when they could leave the building...? It's ridiculous and frustrating.

In other words, I have no rights, I'm a failure at life, and I deserve to be here. There's nothing I can do but leave when I can, or else be thrown out.

I tried to live alone for about a year, and if anything I got worse.

My mother hates me. I think. She's been really batting between love and hate lately. It's kind of weird, though I'm used to it by now.

[Clara22]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

Myst: For all I know, the whole "if you try to cook I'll have you arrested" deal is just another empty threat, another angry ramble. It wouldn't be the first time, and it's certainly not the first time my mother's gone on about having me removed or put into care or something of that nature.

My living situation, I've realized, is not a real problem. I'm an adult and I should have moved out four or five years ago. Everyone - from the internet to my mom's lawyer and psychiatrist, stand by "my house, my rules" - if she wants to forbid me from cooking, not let me leave the house, dictate what I can and can't wear, she can, and I have no rights because I'm a "squatter". To me it's absurd, partly because of my age and that, although my mother claims I live for free, I actually pay around $250 a month (according to her, no judge would accept that as "valid" rent, and her psych calls that paltry amount "responsibility money" that I should pay out of my own conscience).

Also, it's one thing for a landlord to set rules like "no pets" or "no smoking". But can you imagine a landlord dictating what their tenants could eat, watch, practice, when they could leave the building...? It's ridiculous and frustrating.

In other words, I have no rights, I'm a failure at life, and I deserve to be here. There's nothing I can do but leave when I can, or else be thrown out.

I tried to live alone for about a year, and if anything I got worse.

My mother hates me. I think. She's been really batting between love and hate lately. It's kind of weird, though I'm used to it by now.

Perhaps your mental health issues are secondary to hers. Maybe if you leave her, your life improves

[DepressedMGEM]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

I doubt it's any kind of pseudo-PTSD though. My generation (Millennials) is notoriously fragile, and everything causes PTSD today, it seems. I mean, in my mom's day, you just put up with bullying or fought back, and when you left school, it never bothered you again. No one got depressed about it, developed PTSD from it, or committed suicide over it.

Actually, I disagree (at least a little) with this statement; Im 45, I was bullied mercilessly in school, and had an attempt at 18 because of it. I think Millennials are a bit misunderstood, as they seem whiny to some people my age, but I think its because they have more ways of being vocal thanks to social media, which didnt exist when we were young.

I will add that I thank you for bringing this topic up, as it led to a discussion on PTSD, which I thought only affected veterans and victims of severe abrupt trauma like a car crash or something. Now Im starting to think between the bullying i endured for 7 years, my narcissistic wife, and my ex-boss who also bullied me, I probably have PTSD and didnt realize it!

[MtnTime2896]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

Myst: For all I know, the whole "if you try to cook I'll have you arrested" deal is just another empty threat, another angry ramble. It wouldn't be the first time, and it's certainly not the first time my mother's gone on about having me removed or put into care or something of that nature.

My living situation, I've realized, is not a real problem. I'm an adult and I should have moved out four or five years ago. Everyone - from the internet to my mom's lawyer and psychiatrist, stand by "my house, my rules" - if she wants to forbid me from cooking, not let me leave the house, dictate what I can and can't wear, she can, and I have no rights because I'm a "squatter". To me it's absurd, partly because of my age and that, although my mother claims I live for free, I actually pay around $250 a month (according to her, no judge would accept that as "valid" rent, and her psych calls that paltry amount "responsibility money" that I should pay out of my own conscience).

Also, it's one thing for a landlord to set rules like "no pets" or "no smoking". But can you imagine a landlord dictating what their tenants could eat, watch, practice, when they could leave the building...? It's ridiculous and frustrating.

In other words, I have no rights, I'm a failure at life, and I deserve to be here. There's nothing I can do but leave when I can, or else be thrown out.

I tried to live alone for about a year, and if anything I got worse.

My mother hates me. I think. She's been really batting between love and hate lately. It's kind of weird, though I'm used to it by now.

My dad fit the same bill when I had to live with him again for a bit. When I moved out, I made sure it was with someone I trusted and who knew about my issues. It took me leaving again to realize that I had more rights than I originally considered. All of my dad's friends hated me with a passion. Said I was a free loader and shouldn't have been getting any help from him. That it wasn't teaching me anything and that I was just an extra stessor for him. Thing is, the reason I went back in the first place was because I needed full time care (which I received from my mother) because I had undergone two surgeries and was beginning radiation therapy.
I didn't deserve that. I'm guessing you aren't physically ill but that doesn't matter. Your mental health issues, believe it or not, are equal to my physical ones. It's just as debilitating and demands treatment. You are worth it. You deserve the help, not hostility.
I'm not attacking your mom, I'm attacking the idea that has been put into your head that you don't deserve help. You do deserve it. You need it. No one has the right to say otherwise. You sure as hell don't deserve to feel guilty for being sick.
Look up "renter's rights" and "valid rent" laws for your state. Be armed with information so that her scare tactics won't mean anything. Get a free lawyer consultation to see if you might be able to stand up to her in court if it comes to that. Information is power and that's what you need with someone like that.

[unhappydaze]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

Even my mom, who witnessed and was slightly involved in my episode just now, calls it all "drama queen nonsense".

Speaking as a parent I had a visceral reaction to that. Calling a genuine crisis "drama queen nonsense" denigrates and devalues to the point of nothingness the existential pain. IMO no one who reports being in such a state should be blown off with such a superficial statement.