why dont people like borderlines?

thats all i want to know. please enlighten me.

That's a pretty general question, inviting stereotypes. I seriously doubt that all people dislike all borderlines.

I think you should find a way to rephrase that.

Because they don't take the time and effort to understand them. That's often true for people who don't like "borderlines"

that's the thing, Fuzz. I can think of two borderlines who I HAVE taken the time and made the effort to understand, and afterward, I discovered that I really didn't like them.

But then again, I've had that experience with non-borderlines, too.

Just because someone is borderline (or not), doesn't mean that they're guaranteed to be likable even if someone understands them. That puts all the responsibility on the other person, which is not fair.

as a borderline myself i can say we can be difficult to put up with at times.

from talking with you i believe you have more than borderline going on.

try working these issues out with a T

say more about what you mean? who is the "they" in your question?

since no one knows if we have this diagnosis (even us, as many therapists don't use diagnoses), then I'm thinking it isn't the 'borderline' that is being 'not liked' but something else.

Can you say more about what prompted you to make your post?

Sometimes "borderline" is the label therapists give to difficult clients, sometimes, unfortunately, without enough thought to it. I admire a lot of qualities that I have seen in several people who are/were borderline. When they start understanding themselves, they often develop a deep wisdom and maturity that you can't really get any other way. They learn to laugh at themselves and accept that things never stay the same, and that it's okay. Some of my favorite people are borderline. Everyone needs to be known for who they are, though, and not for their dx.

For the same reason borderlines don't like people? It's truly a mirror.

well said, that is so beautiful rapunzel

That really is a broad statement. Isn't that true of most people with MH issues. People will not take the time to know them. I am BPD and with the therapy I have received I have learned how to deal with my own issues and how I look at people and what I expect from them as well as myself. Yeah I have read that docs don't like working with BPD only becasue it can be changelling. But I would like to think I am worth it.

Islander

borderline personality used to (and still does in some quarters) inspire an avoidance reaction in clinicians and in other members of the public.

how come?

people with borderline personality disorder often experience themselves as living on an emotional roller-coaster. happy and bubbly one minute, angry and hostile the next, in an intense state of distress the next minute.

people with borderline personality disorder often experience themselves as clinging to people one minute, and shoving them away hard the next.

precisely the things that make it hard for the borderline to live with themself can make it hard for other people to live with them.

people with borderline personality disorder often present in intense and extreme emotional distress. they can be the most active help-seeking population. since they often don't know how to regulate their own emotional responses they attempt to obtain emotion regulation from others. this can often manifest as the person pleading for help (i'll feel better if only you don't leave me etc) and in the person believing that others have the power to help them feel better without their understanding that they need to take responsibility for their own emotional responses. this is partly because the person with borderline personality disorder often doesn't know how to regulate their own emotional responses, but it can manifest as an ultimatum: if you leave me i'll have to kill myself, but if you stay then i'll feel better (for example). this can lead to other people feeling manipulated by their demands.

borderline personality disorder isn't as readily managed / controlled by medications as other disorders. this can lead to biologically / medication minded clinicians wanting to pass them on to someone else... people with borderline personality disorder typically aren't very validating of others attempts to help them (a person may rage at their clinician for not alleviating their distress - believing that the clinician would help them if only they knew how bad it was - even though the clinician has been racking their brains as best they can for a medication that is likely to help).

clinicians often used to report that they felt manipulated by their borderline clients. a couple of coping strategies that tend to be employed by borderline clients make it hard for clinicians to deal with them. SPLITTING - a person can swing between idealising their clinician (best doctor in the world) to devaluing their clinician (berrating them for their stupidity / ignorance / uncaring). PROJECTIVE IDENTIFICATION - attempts to induce their (distressing) emotional state in other people because the person thinks that if only they feel it too then they will help them.

it doesn't feel very nice to be the object of borderline rage / demands.

borderline personality disorder used to be a diagnostic dumping ground for patients who seemed to deteriorate despite their clinicians attempts to help them. 'borderline' accompanied by the rolling of eyes was a way for clinicians to indicate 'don't go there' to their colleagues.

more recently theorists such as Linehan have emphasised that borderline personality arises as a response to an invalidating environment. Linehan offers non-judgemental descriptions and explanations of borderline behaviours in an attempt to help clinicians like their borderline patients. she really had done wonders for the disorder (and for people with the disorder).

times are a-changing... but not really for old school biologically / medication focused psychaitrists

I personally don't like the label of "bordeline."

It's not just getting people to understand, I think, but often the amount of patience to go along with that knowledge is absent. There doesn't seem to be a definitive definition and thus the label, and that makes healing and personal understanding by the patient difficult to begin with.

I don't think it's "just" those with this label, but with people in general, mental unwellness or not. Many people today are so involved in their own lives, in themselves, that they just don't have the time or energy for high maintenance others.

Don't take it personally, it's their issue.

Simply stated? It is mostly our Black & White attitude!

Too simplistic an explanation? Watch, if you can, your feelings about a certain issue, position you have taken, etc., and see how extreme they are from one time of consideration to the next.

This can be really hard for anyone to keep up with! (But I think it's because we can project too many scenarios as we gain more insight!) Just my opinion, though.

Oh, and of course, this is only ONE aspect of why people have difficulties dealing with us.

actually, i like a label for it. not in the negative sense, but more of the "ah, this is why i am the way i am" feeling. i read up there, the black white thinking is what causes too many scenarios in the head. wouldn' tthat be why in therapy i'm always asking my t to be more specific in questions? oh, and does anyone else catastrophize? roll over in your head all the possible bad things that could ever happen...in a fantasy sense? (best friend/sig other/parent/child dies and it builds this other relationship and life turns out for the better from this terrible thing?) i always figured it was if i planned for it, it would be ok.......? dunno. i also have the bipolar and panic disorders, but i'm not sure how that makes anything different, except the panic with the fear of wind and all. maybe it's easier to blame the people hating thing on the bpd, instead of thinking that i'm just a crazy ***** no one likes, which is my defensive way of saying bad person. just less depressing that way i guess. i hear a lot of people saying how the labeling is bad, which i dont think it is. the name is vague, but for example my mom gave my hubby when we got married "stop walking on eggshells", like an instruction manual. reading it depressed me though, only got thru part of it. it was a "damn, thisis how people see me. that sux.". so if you have bpd, i don't remember reading it personally. i guess i phrased myself wrong. i know why people don't like us, i just don't like why they don't, and the simple fact that they do. oh, thnx for all the feedback it helped me see this.

im not so keen on the labels. 'cause people say 'borderlines do this and borderlines do that' and the trouble is that i don't do some of that - even though i'm supposedly borderline.

its kinda like how there are stereotypes about gender...
and there are stereotypes about race...
and there are stereotypes about age...
and there are stereotypes about mental illness in general...
and there are stereotypes about borderline personality disorder.

people have a natural inclination / tendency to classify and categorise different kinds of thing...

it can be helpful / useful when instances of a category have a lot of features in common.

it can be positively harmful when instances of a category don't have a lot of features in common but when people ASSUME that since the individual is a member of the category they MUST have these features...

it can be harmful in the case of nationality (the assumptions we make about personality characteristics)
it can be harmful in the case of race
it can be harmful in the case of gender (get back in the kitchen woman)
it can be harmful in the case of borderline personality disorder.

i looked far and wide to find a characterisation of some of the things that i struggled with that wasn't unnecessarily judgemental and condemnatory. i worried a lot that i was in denial or was self deluded for not 'facing up' to some of hte negative characterisations that have been offered about what is meant to be wrong with people with borderline personality disorder.

i'm not a diagnosis. i'm not a 'typical' anything. i'm a person. a PERSON. and i'd rather people view me as a person (and I'd rather view myself as a person) than a typical instance of mental illness (or a gender or a racial group or whatever). i refuse to let the stereotypes and prejudices and assumptions limit me.

you ask 'how come people don't like borderlines'? part of the reason (insofar as clinicians and people who read what the clinicians have to say are concerned) its because of the assumptions that people with borderline personality are malevolent and have an innate agression and because they are black and white thinkers and so on and so forth. when i read those characterisations i started to hate me (and other people with the dx) too.

but maybe what your issue is really... is that you feel like people hate you. and it is easier to think that they hate your category than your person?

i don't hate your person.
i hate the BPD label for what it does to people...

that's right with the they hate me %#@&#!. but lately i feel that the bpd is all that there is, ya know? like my instruction manual or something. i guess maybe it's easier to blame the dxs than myself.

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BorderlineAnn said:
i guess maybe it's easier to blame the dxs than myself.

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sure, i used to blame myself for my bpd. then, realizing what spawned it, i placed the blame where it belonged - with my dysfunctional upbringing. my unpredictably abusive father and my neurotic mother. perhaps even some genetic material i inherited.

as for the original question "why don't people like borderlines?", i haven't generally found that to be the case. people love me. but then...i don't walk around with a WARNING - BPD - UNSTABLE sticker on my forehead. not saying you do - just saying. people in the mental health system are a different story. they tend to prefer treating people who aren't resistant to treatment. people who'll stick with the program - stay in therapy - stay on their meds. borderlines have far from a stellar record in this.

very well said

Is it that they hate you or that they feel a little frustrated with some of the particular things you say or do?

> lately i feel that the bpd is all that there is, ya know? like my instruction manual or something.

Yeah, I think I understand. That is one of the troubles that I have with the label. It can become... Part of ones identity. And that can result in one conforming to the stereotype when one wouldn't have done otherwise. More harm than good, thats my concern.

> i guess maybe it's easier to blame the dxs than myself.

Yep. But maybe... The key is to lift the blame. Maybe... Nobody is to blame. Maybe blame doesn't need to factor into it at all. I'm sure you don't like every single thing that everybody else in the world does... I'm sure you might feel frustrated or disapointed or sad or annoyed at some of the things that people say or do at times... And similarly sometimes people might feel a little frustrated or disappointed or sad or annoyed with some of the things you say and / or do at times... But it doesn't make you a bad person and it doesn't make them a bad person either.

Part of facing up to hard stuff... Is being able to have some sympathy and kindness and acceptance for oneself. I really think that a lot of the things I did that hurt others was me trying to defend myself against unbearable pain. I needed to learn how to bear the pain and how to face the difficult things in a way that wasn't hurtful for me. That was really really hard. I don't think you are to blame. But acceptance of oneself and liking for oneself.. Is hard.. And.. Kinda necessary on the way forward. Experiencing others being kind to us... Learning how to be kind to ourself.

too general a question, i recall a chat with a friend who is a psychiatrist on p/d.s his answer- labels made by men in suits! they are observed behaviours which do cluster in people. i have met two people with bpd who i found extremely hard to figure out ,i'm generally good at it .but i used to find i'd get too close to them and then it was ---back off, they ended the friendship not me. i found their energy to be intoxicating, but their sensitivity- ouch! treading on eggshells is an apt description, i still wish they were my friends

<font color="#000088">A lot of Borderlines tend to have abandonment issues, so they tend to form close relationships, then sabotage the relationship on purpose, so they don't feel like they were the one that got abandoned by the other. It's really unfortunate for the other person in the relationship, because their the one that ends up getting hurt, and doesn't really understand why,or what happened!
They also are labeled so often by others, that it causes much anger inside, and they tend to act out a lot, much of this acting out is attention seeking behavior,and it gets on a lot of people's nerves! But you've got to really understand a Borderline in order to appreciate what they are really going through inside! And there are not too many people that really understand Borderlines, that's why they are judged so much and not liked very much!
You've kindof got to be labeled a Borderline and actually walk in thier shoes for awhile to understand the way they really get treated. It's pretty bad!
Not being a Borderline, but being able to see how they are treated, sheds a whole new light on understanding them better!</font>

I think what you say is pretty accurate. Its hard not to be angry when judged wrongly and treated like %#@&#! just for being themselves.

"why dont people like borderlines?"

Because they reveal to people something they already "know" but do not want to know -- something very, very scary. Something about how they got to be the way they are.