Question regarding my T!!!

My name is Bridgett and I'm 23 years old. I've been seeing my T for a year and a half now and she's WONDERFUL!! I've had a couple of T's in the past but not one can measure up to the one I'm seeing now. She's awesome, goes out of her way to make me feel comfortable and relaxed. Whenever I'm upset/angry I can tell her and she says the greatest things. Alot of the times I leave her office feeling like a million bucks!!

Anyway, I have a question that I'd like to share with y'all. Yesterday my T and I shared some very personal things that I've been going through lately(My job, my past, my cat being put down, my ex b/f putting me down, etc.). I cried alot and for the first time ever.....I saw her tear up as well. I felt bad at first but realized she is human and has feelings just like we all do. In a way, it felt nice to see that side of her and it just made me open up to her more. When our session ended, I got up and for the first time ever.....she hugged me. And not just a 'you'll be ok' hug...but a real HUGE bear hug. I didn't want to let go....we held each other for about a minute!! It was in the heat of the moment and I don't know why I did it...but I just grabbed her face, pulled her close to me and gave her a quick peck on the lips....and to my surprise....she kissed me back. Then we hugged again and I walked out. It's very hard to describe but what I want to know is...did I cross the line? Did she cross her line by kissing me back? What's going to happen?? Am I in trouble?

I'm just a mess here wondering what it really meant when she kissed me back and if what I just did by kissing her was totally wrong and unethical.



Thanks!!

To be honest I'm not 100% sure how to answer this one.

If she were forcing herself upon you I'd say it's wrong. And vice versa. However this is not that case.

I DO think that it is not a good idea to go any farther in this direction... I personally think it's dangerous for both of you and that the relationship between a T and patient should remain "professional" and professional only. Hug, ok - great in fact. Kiss, not so much. The reason I say this is that an actual relationship would undermine the therapist - patient relationship.

I don't think you should be harsh on yourself for what happened, but I do think it might be a good idea to talk it over with the T in the next session, so that you are both on the same page.

For what it's worth I don't think you "are in trouble". I just think you're confused about what happened. And if you really do feel something about this T (more than friendship) it's ok to feel that way about someone, it just will get really sticky if you and the T are still in a therapist - patient relationship. If for any reason you and your T decide there is a possibility of a relationship I would advise finding another T while this relationship takes place (that's just an "if"... I'm kinda trying to cover all bases here I'm sorry if I offended in any way, I don't want to imply anything)

ps do tell us how everything goes next time you and your T talk =D

Bridgett,
First of all....I AM THE WORST PERSON to be replying to this post...LOL

I really don't have any words of wisdom other than...your post caused a gut reaction within me. Not because your T crossed the no-touch boundary, not because you kissed your T, not because of the gender thing. More because of the grief your actions seem to be causing you. And... well your expression of just not KNOWING what to expect next, just hit a core fear of mine.

I am SOOOOOO afraid that if I ever let go and let myself get caught up in the moment something like what you just described might happen. Not necessarily kissing my T, I really don't think that will happen, but just... doing something that later I would just be mortified by.

First... I would say YES (IMHO) a boundary has been crossed. Maybe it was just a bit of empathy taken a bit too far, then again...maybe not.
Either way I DO NOT THINK you should beat yourself up about it or think you are in trouble. You were emotional, your T was providing you with a lot of caring energy, she initiated the contact and well it is not uncommon for your body to respond in a routine way. Here is a question for you... Who was the last person who you felt emotionally connected to, who you might have sought comfort and protection from, and who gave you big firm bear hugs? My guess is that maybe it was your bf or at least someone you were intimately involved with. Your body likely just reacted to this type of comforting. I don't think it necessarily means that you want to be involved with your T. Physiological response vs. a conscious choice. I understand why you would be regretting what happened but... I see nothing wrong with your actions. I think this situation is exactly why many T's have no touch policies, they just prevent stuff like this from happening.

Now, your T... her kissing back...IDK I have trouble seeing her response in the same light. She is a professional, she is trained to provided empathy WITHOUT getting caught up in the moment. IDK from an East Coast US perspective... I think she crossed a major boundary. Maybe kissing people on the lips is OK for some cultures that kisses a lot..IDK.

I can totally see why your confused about what it all really means. MAYBE it would be appropriate for you to go into your next session and be open minded and see what happens. I would be extremely cautious thought because you are emotionally vulnerable at this point. If your T is an ethical T, this situation will need to be talked about in detail. It is totally unethical for your T sexualize the relationship, EVER. Your the client and if you get caught up in things and attempt to sexualize it, their supposed to be able to handle this and protect you against this. But THEY shouldn't be the ones getting carried away.

not sure what to say because one part of me says its ok and the other part says its not. No wonder you are confused. I think that since you made a move first that it was consensual and not an abuse of power or anything.. I have seen my T get kiss on the cheek from another client. I was conflicted about it. Some Therapists just know what a client needs. I wonder whether she crossed her boundaries though. . Also where does the touch stop because sex is wrong completley . Thats why some therapists don't actually touch their clients. Anyway i'l stop now cos i'm as confused as you are..

Every part of me is saying this is NOT OKAY! Your therapist is NOT supposed to kiss you on the lips. This is a major boundary violation in my opinion. Your best interests have not been met in this case. I'm not sure what to tell you to do, but I hope that you won't be too hard on yourself about this. I doubt very much that I would return to this therapist if I were you, but that is up to you to decide.

It is indeed an abuse of power, whether done with malice or not. I'm sorry you've been put in this difficult situation.

I agree with you here

Quote:

If for any reason you and your T decide there is a possibility of a relationship I would advise finding another T while this relationship takes place

Honestly, if her T is an ethical... this should not even be a possibility. I do not think a healthy initimate relationship can come from a situation like this!

Bridgett, if your T does not come out and firmly say that the relationship between the two of your cannot become initimate or if she even hints that an other than professional relationship can develop between the two of you...I would head for the hills-whether you want to or not.

hi bridgett, welcome to PC . i hope you stick around, i love it when we get newbies .

i don't think you did anything wrong, at all. so please put your mind to rest on that one. you won't be in trouble.

re: your T. i am conflicted about what to say. i do think she probably crossed professional boundaries, but i'm not sure if i would then say you need to terminate or be 'wary' of her. given that i'm not in your situation (so wouldn't be feeling all the same anxiety as you are!), i think i would go back next week and try to discuss what happened and make sure both of you are on the same page.

Ts can experience very strong feelings towards us too, which also makes them get caught up in the moment (even though, as professionals, we would hope they could keep that distance). it is not necessarily a 'sexual' feeling e.g., my current T has admitted to me that he feels very strongly about me, almost wants to 'save' me and he needs to be aware of that so it doesn't interfere with our therapy. i know a lot of parents who give their children a quick peck on the lips (it's a european thing?) and maybe if your T is feeling motherly towards you then she might have also been caught up with the unexpected development.

i am just throwing out possibilities, because - given that you've had such a productive relationship with her so far - i think it would be a shame to see this as a red flag and terminate prematurely. i think that your strong professional past history with your T could allow you to at least discuss what happened - you explain the way you saw things develop, and your confusions - and T also explain what happened from her end. then you can decide whether this relationship (the therapy relationship!) is something worth continuing.

like everyone else, of course, i would advise you to run for the hills if your T suggests anything beyond a therapeutic relationship can develop (friendship, mentor, romantic relationship). but i think i would want to see what the actual facts are first before making any decisions.

(((((((((((bridgett)))))))))))))

What your T did is absolutely NOT okay. There are definitely situations where hugging/touch is fine in therapy (I have hugs and touch in my therapy), but kissing on the lips is crossing a boundary into something sexual.

YOU are not in trouble, and the fact that you did that is totally, totally fine. It is not up to you to keep track of the boundaries in the relationship. Even though you can't have that kind of relationship with someone who is your T, you are the client, you were caught up in the moment, and that's how you responded.

But I have read that even if a client comes in and takes off all of her clothes and throws herself at her therapist, the THERAPIST is 100% responsible for maintaining boundaries and ensuring that NOTHING happens between the therapist and the client.

I agree with chaotic...what happened needs to be talked about in great length with T. And after that?? I'm not sure.

I'm sorry you are in such a confusing situation.

honestly...i can see nothing wrong with her giving you a hug...BUT i can see everything wrong with the kiss. there is everything wrong with that in my opinion. i can't think of any possible therapeutic justification why she would respond to you in that fashion. i think she should have handled herself better professionally.

having now spent the last 3 years trying to heal from the damage imposed upon me sexually and emotionally by a therapist who felt it was okay to cross boundaries (that i did not cross first mind you) i would be very wary of this t.

Hmmm... I thought about what Deli said - I give my little boys quick pecks on the lips, so I see what you mean about the parental thing. It just feels very inappropriate for a therapy relationship, though. No matter how much "re-parenting" the T is doing, there are still two adults in the room, and in the US, adults generally do not kiss on the lips, unless it is a sexual relationship.

I think every patient/herapist relationship is different, and there is never any same exact situation. If it were me, I wouldn't have a problem with it, I love the hugs I get from my T, and she has kissed me on my forehead before. It's not a threat to me at all, its called caring and comfort and I deeply appreciate it. But that's me, I don't think we should jump and say that's totally wrong because every situation, and relationship is very unique. If your T hads a problem with it, she will bring it up.
I'm happy you have a T that you really like and that helps you.

Bridgett- I saw your post before and I was afraid to be the first one to respond. This situation triggers a lot for me. I have been in that situation. I was exactly your age. I have to say, the therapist I was with was a very huggy, touching person. The kiss on the lips, I believe crosses a boundry. You, as the client, as others have said, may have gotten caught up in getting some soothing hugging. The fact that she kissed you back on the lips is not OK. You've been with her for 1 1/2 yrs and its a long time, and she is good with you, but I would find the words to bring up how you feel. Your ethics are not in question, you did nothing at all wrong. You didnt cross any lines and you are not in trouble. There is a distinct possibility that she did something she should not have and confused you.

Please post again and let us know any conversation goes with your t.

Hmm...

What would you say if the therapist was a male?

Wow, I can certainly see how you could feel so conflicted about this. I would not want to jump to conclusions or pass judgment....but I do feel strongly that it's a topic you will want to visit in your next session.

My T doesn't do any kind of touch at all.....but my ex-husband's T, who was a T in my group therapy for a good several months, is a very huggy person. I can always count on him for a good hug - and I've gotten 3 of them in the last week from him.

I wish that my T would hug me, but I do respect his professional boundaries. I am sure he would prefer that his clients get that kind of caring/support from their "real life" and not become dependent on him for that. I'm just assuming, though, because we've never talked about it.

I had the same thought, Simcha.

I think what the T did is not OK. At all.

Hi there,

I'm going to disagree with the consensus here. If it caught her by suprise, maybe it was just an instinctual reaction. If it was thought out/planned, such as a longing, I'd say it was not a good thing....

Our T relationships are all so unique, so it's hard to say. I once had a T hug me on occasion. People seem to think differently of opposite genders sometimes..but she was a she (and I am a she), and although she was gay (and I straight) I never thought anything of it besides the warm, but casual gesture that it was.

About the cultural aspect that was raised--I am here in the US, and one of my best friends kisses on the lips all the time. She is Italian-American, so her family has been doing this for many years, and it is just habit for her. There is nothing sexual about it; just a gesture of affection. She kisses both males and females.

I wouldn't make a habit of it! If this is a longing, it may not be a good thing to do...but if it was just a gesture of affection, and maybe caught T by surprise, I don't see the big deal here. It was just a little peck-sounds pretty distant from a sexual-attraction type kiss.

Bridgett:

You did nothing wrong! Please know this.

Bridgett

I think the most important thing for you to do is talk to your T about this. Only you two can talk this through and figure out what exactly happened. It sounds like your T has really been there for you in the past, and I'm guessing she will come through again and will see you through this.

[quote=BlueMoon6;1175710]Bridgett- I saw your post before and I was afraid to be the first one to respond. This situation triggers a lot for me. I have been in that situation. I was exactly your age. I have to say, the therapist I was with was a very huggy, touching person. The kiss on the lips, I believe crosses a boundry. You, as the client, as others have said, may have gotten caught up in getting some soothing hugging. The fact that she kissed you back on the lips is not OK. You've been with her for 1 1/2 yrs and its a long time, and she is good with you, but I would find the words to bring up how you feel. Your ethics are not in question, you did nothing at all wrong. You didnt cross any lines and you are not in trouble. There is a distinct possibility that she did something she should not have and confused you.
quote]

I agree with Blue Moon.
And I think there should be a trigger icon on this post.


Bridgett - I can't say much right now, but maybe it helps a little to know you are not the only one who has been through something like this. You've gotten a lot of great feedback here, and I hope that things work out for you.

No. This was not okay for the therapist to do. The professional sets the tone and is to carry things out in a professional atmosphere. Kissing a client on the lips is inappropriate. I would save yourself the grief and find another therapist who you can talk this through with. Definitely talk about what happened as you are not at fault. Sending good thoughts your way. phoenix47

When you talk about your T 'kissing you back' do you mean she returned the peck, or do you mean a more lingering type of kiss? I think there is a distinction that needs to be made here.

Because... if she simply returned the peck, simultaneously, then I would tend to think that she was caught out in the moment by having her face grabbed, and pulled towards you, and then being given a kiss by you. If that is the case then i think people in this thread are judging her too harshly. Of course a T should *never* kiss a client*. But, if in the space of a microsecond you are kissed and the socially acceptable thing to do if one is 'given a peck' is to 'peck back', then I would be very willing to forgive her and not consider it an intentional boundary crossing on her part.
I would be very willing to give her the benefit of the doubt about her being able to maintain appropriate therapeutic boundaries at other times. unless of course something else happened. Then I would reevaluate.

I agree with Luce -- it was definitely wrong and needs to be discussed, but what was the nature of the kiss? If it was a peck back it still shouldn't happen again, but wouldn't be grounds for termination or anything.

I also would want to know. . .was the returned kiss a quick peck or something more? If it was a quick peck, i'd say she crossed a boundary but talking about it might help work things out. If it was any kind of lingering kiss, I definitely think it was a major boundary crossing and i would suggest changing to a different therapist.

Just to clarify, 'the kiss' I (at age 19) I refer to here (in my post) was not from me to the 50 to 60year old (or so) psychoanaylst. It was one from him to me. NEVER did I kiss back! There was an internal affection for him but yech! nothing reciprocated by me physically in a touching way. He used hypnosis and was very Freudian.

A Unitarian minister at a church I had started attending around the same time also advocated taking their clothes off at various nature outings they took people on. They showed photos of the group on the outing in church one day. I stopped going there too.

But, from both experience, I was devastated, and the damage was done.

Bridgett,

I hope you are okay...I am more than concerned about you...

Are you still around? You needn't respond but sending along care and concern for you.

Hey you guys,

First off, you all are SO awesome. Thank you for the welcomes and replies. I really feel great and not at all hesitant as I was the first time I visited this site. Thanks again!!!

Sorry for the late reply...I was away visiting my aunt for 2 weeks and am just getting back to the swing of things. However, while visiting my aunt, I still saw my T. The next week after the "kiss", I was kind of hoping she would not bring it up but, it was. My T was very understanding and told me she wasn't at all offended but was a bit thrown off and surprised that I had kissed her right then and there. She knows how I feel about her so she wasn't too shocked that I had done it. She also stated that she's aware that I have alot of love for her and being caught up in the moment, the kiss was just a natural reaction from me. She knows that I've never really had much love in the past and I was just being affectionate towards her. She made all this very clear to me. However, she suggested that it never happen again(the kiss). She told me that she doesn't do this with any of her clients and she gave me more of an insight on boundries. I told her that I knew I had crossed the line and I was just caught up in the moment. She nodded....she knew. I told her that I did regret doing it and that I wasn't going to do it again. I also shared that I don't do that to anyone....not even my friends. I apologized and she said I didn't have to. She also asked if I had any sexual feelings toward her. I told her no but to be honest, I don't know what I really feel for her. I'm not gay or bi, not that there is anything wrong with that, but I'm not. But for some reason I do get these bi feelings for her and I know that's not good. I told her I wouldn't do anything at all to jeopardize our relationship because I do value it. That is when she told me that she does like me alot but in the end, I'm her client and she's my T. She said everything very kindly and warm so I wasn't at all upset or took it personally. My T knows alot about me and she didn't seem at all shocked at what I had done to her. She just wanted to clear things up so that there is no confusion but open honesty between us.

After our session, I was still feeling confused. I was nervous that she'd feel different about me now and all that. I walked out feeling very low and horrible.

The following week, I told all this to my T and she told me there was no need to feel that way. She made it clear that I did nothing wrong. I told her I felt I took advantage of her by kissing her. She shook her head and said no. She laid everything out for me and we talked more about the kiss and my feelings for her. I finally gathered up enough courage and told her that I did feel something for her but I didn't know what. She smiled and exlpained transference to me. We also talked about my feeling vulnerable and because I have a special bond with her, it's why I feel so strongly about her. My T is great and she explained alot with me. That day I left her office feeling so much better and we shared a hug for the 2nd time. I love her alot and although I may not know how I feel about her, I wouldn't change her for anything!!! She's an awesome T and I don't see a reason as to change her!!!

And for those of you who asked, when I quickly kissed her, she quickly kissed back. Just like if someone gives a quick peck and that person pecks back. It was like that!!