[zooropa]

a friend of mine (some of you may remember M, from my group?) is in the hospital with complications following an outpatient medical procedure. She wants me to come visit her.

How do I tell her that I won't come see her because she's in the hospital I was in so many times when I was overdosing? She's in the CCU where I was on life support 3 times in 3 months. Not only am I ashamed to go there, afraid someone will recognize me, but I'm also afraid of being triggered. I don't think my T would like me saying that, because being afraid of being triggered is no way to live, but it's how I feel. I'm emotionally vulnerable, it's the holidays, and T is far, far away. I don't want to push myself any further than I am already.

I just feel really guilty about it, I don't think M understands and I don't know how to communicate it to her. She is very, very ill and I know she doesn't have many people in her life to visit or call. I had a dream last night that I read in the newspaper that she died, and it was really sad.

But. I still don't want to go to that hospital. I can't even make myself call her there, although I did google the main number, so I guess that's something.

zoo- I need some time to formulate my thoughts on this. However I offer hugs. (((zoo))) Are you allowed to call your t for advice over break? If so, now might be a good time to do so.

[WePow]

((((((Zoo))))) You need to first take care of YOU. You have to do that.
If you are strong enough to call, that may be all you can do. But this is a hard position for you to be in - I get that. But you need to first be able to stay mentally healthy. It is only after you are safe when you can be a help to others. Don't push yourself beyond what is safe.

[lostin08]

You can only do what works for you. Just remember hospitals have confideality rules. Hang in there

[ECHOES]

zoo, you don't have to try to explain why when you tell her that you won't be able to visit, but you will be keeping her close in thought and will call to visit with her on the phone (if that would feel okay for you to do).

You can send cards to brighten her day, and maybe tuck small things like bookmarks or photos inside.

I wonder though, if you would be recongnized and if you were, if the person remembering you would be thrilled to see you doing so well.

[zooropa]

Thanks for reminding me that it's okay to take care of me, you guys. I forget that sometimes.

Also, echoes, I hadn't thought of it that way (if someone recognized me), thanks for that

M called me tonight and she checked out of the hospital AMA and said she was just going home to die. It was a difficult conversation, because I'm not a therapist and I don't know how to handle that kind of thing. It also made me selfishly glad that the town where M lives is an hour away from me, so I have a pretty good excuse for not dropping everything and going to rescue her.

Which is hard, because I am a rescuer, and I feel bad for her for being alone, and I don't want her to get sicker or die. And I can't control any of that, except my own actions and reactions.

I'm remembering all the times my T has said to me "stop and think about what is true for you, in this moment." I felt panicked when M called me, and that I had to do something, anything. Then I took a breath, and realized I am still here. I am still home. Tomorrow is xmas eve and my kids are coming over. I am okay. Even if M isn't, I'm okay.

It made me think. Even if nobody else around me is okay, I'm okay. Even if T isn't okay, even if T isn't there, even if she was gone, I'm okay. I might be happy or sad or angry or frustrated or goofy or hyper or tired, I might even be all alone, but I'm okay.

what the...when did this happen?

doesn't matter when it happened, just that it did. You are learning to put you first. You are the most important person in your life. You go girl!!!!!!

[Lauru]

((((((((((zoo))))))))))
Darn, you are one smart cookie! I am in awe that you have reached that "OK" level. I am still on my way there. I hope some day I get there. Thanks for being an inspiration.

[googley]

(((((((Zoo)))))))))

That must be so hard. I am so sorry. I'm glad that you are taking care of yourself. You can only do what you feel comfortable doing and that is enough. Sometimes others want more than we can give, but that doesn't mean we can or should provide what they want. Also remember that you are not her only source of support, she has T and group T also if she needs support, they are trained to deal with this type of stuff. I am so glad you are taking care of you. And that you are okay.

[Sannah]

Very good self care Zoo........

[Christina86]

Zoo, I like you're being "okay" stuff. That is AWESOME!

You have every right to take care of yourself and a responsibility to take care of yourself first too. I'm sorry about your friend. If she calls you, you can tell her to go to the hospital or call 911 -- that isn't considered rescuing, that's considered helping. Rescuing would be driving all the way down there and making sure she was taken care of.

[WePow]

(((((((((((((Zoo)))))))))))))))) I think that what just happened is you gave yourself a very nice present!!!

((((zoo)))) I think you made a very wise mind decision. I'm so proud of you. I don't think I could have made a decision. I racked my brain for advice for you but nothing. It was a very hard decision and I'm so glad you were able to make it.

[zooropa]

crap. M texted me this morning saying "I'm not dead yet" and then throughout the day she sent a number of texts about being in pain, and wanting to die, and taking enough drugs to "sleep forever."

So tonight I tried to call her, but she didn't answer. I have been around the block with her a few times about texting and how it can sometimes be really ineffective. So I said "I understand if you can't talk right now, and that's fine...texting has not proven to be a really effective way for us to communicate in the past, and I'm trying to avoid those same pitfalls. Saying you can't talk when you can't is good self care, but maybe you could let me know when would be a good time?"

Her response was: "never mind. I talk 2 u when I stop screaming. Phobe is off until March. 2012"

So, then I felt bad, so I said this: "I'm sorry you're in such a bad place, M. And I'm sorry I can't help you. I can give you T or group-Ts numbers if you want. They have the experience and skills I do not. If you are in that much pain, go to the er. That's all the advice anyone can give you about that."

Her reply: Never

so now I'm getting pretty damn annoyed, but trying to be calm. I said: "Ok, well maybe at some point you will realize how irrational that is. Physical illness only makes it that much more difficult to use our wise minds. I am not a mental health professional and I don't have the skills to know what else to say but I do know that you are stubbornly refusing to speak to me and there is NO WAY this conversation is going to to be effective in this format. None. So, if you are emotionally unhealthy, call T or group-T. If you are physically in pain, go to the doctor. If you just want someone to talk to, call me. But please stop sending me texts saying you are dying, want to die, or wish you would die. This is upsetting and it's mother sucking xmas eve."

I mean, god. Seriously??

[ECHOES]

Wow, zoo!! Good for you for not letting her manipulate you!! What you said to her was perfect. It can be very hard to say what needs to be said, and you told her what you needed to say for you, and what she needs to hear. I am so in awe of you!

[zooropa]

I got a series of texts from M this morning while I was opening gifts with my kids. A bunch of mean, nasty, hate filled texts. I mean, who DOES that on xmas morning, of all times? I'm disgusted, but not very hurt or upset. I don't know if I'm just not feeling it yet or if I just don't care. I hope it's the latter.

[WePow]

(((((((((((((Zoo)))))))))) I think the shutting down you did and not getting upset is VERY healthy for you!!!! You are not letting yourself get sucked into her drama. Sometimes it is hard for people to realize that it is not being unkind to give yourself emotional distance. It is just being wise and staying healthy. You have a RIGHT to your space and your time. You told her what you could do for her and you set your boundaries. That was perfect!

Hope that you continue to have the holiday you deserve!

[zooropa]

I really want to share the texts she sent me with you guys, I hope nobody minds. I guess I need to feel validated.

*edit* just for context, here's the last text I sent last night, which she's replying to:

me: I'm just me, with problems of my own and my kids are here and it's kind of a holiday. My therapist is out of town and I have
to do what I can to keep myself healthy without her and in the midst of all the huge changes going on in my life. Try to look at it from my point of view.

her reply this morning:

M: Now it's other ****ing Xmas. i will leave you and your ****ING DBT all to you. I have listened to you for enless hours about your issues over the last few years. I cared, never once told u I'm not your theripist. your safty blanket is out of town...**** give her life back. i keep forgetting its always about u. i won7t bother u again, so do me the same favior. Have a drama free day with your kids. I hope they have a great day. I won't be going to the support group anymore. i'm finished with all this BS. BS,BS! merry ****ing, ****. **** christmas, since there is no christ how is that being you.!

my reply: Wow. Nice way to behave on Xmas morning. Your lord must be so proud.

I told you several times last night to call me if you wanted to talk. I don't know what response other than that you expected or would have accepted from me. You are so deep in emotion mind I don't think you are even thinking straight. You'll be pretty embarrassed later over the way you have behaved today. I encourage you to call T and continue seeing her. And yes, she is a security object for me. And that's okay. That's her job. That's what she wants. That's how I learn it is okay to trust someone. Maybe you should try it. I can't understand how you can do two years in dbt and not learn anything.

[WePow]

((((((((((((Zoo))))))))))))))))

You said what you needed to say. I am sorry that you have this stress for the holiday. It is sad that M is hurting this much. Sending you big hugs~!

Ack!! (((((((((((zoo)))))))))))

SOOOOO sorry you are having to deal with that drama. It sounds like you are handling it well....and redirecting M to just the right people. Good for you.

[googley]

((((((((Zoo)))))))))

I think you are doing a great job putting up boundaries. You are protecting yourself. That is the most important thing. It doesn't seem like whatever you say, M is going to listen to it. We can only help others as much as they are willing to accept our help. It sounds like M is not willing to accept any help right now.

I hope you had a great Christmas with your kids.

[Irine]

keep it up zoo. Sorry to hear the this triggering is causing you to avoid things and makes difficult times even more difficult!!

[Sannah]

She sounds toxic. Good work Zoo.........

[zooropa]

this is sticking in my head, out of everything she said, this one bit:

your safty blanket is out of town...**** give her life back

.

my response was that yes, T is safety for me, and that's okay. But...in my heart, in my gut, I'm afraid M is right. I'm afraid T or other people think the same thing, that I depend on T too much. I'm afraid I have asked too much and pushed too hard and demanded what I get from T.

Anyway. That's what's sticking with me, what I can't shake or quite stop thinking about.

[ECHOES]

Originally Posted by zooropa

this is sticking in my head, out of everything she said, this one bit:

.

my response was that yes, T is safety for me, and that's okay. But...in my heart, in my gut, I'm afraid M is right. I'm afraid T or other people think the same thing, that I depend on T too much. I'm afraid I have asked too much and pushed too hard and demanded what I get from T.

Anyway. That's what's sticking with me, what I can't shake or quite stop thinking about.

Well, sometimes people who don't "get" therapy, don't "get" therapy. Maybe this is why DBT hasn't been helpful to her.

Or, she is terribly jealous...