shame spiral

ACK! I know this place. It's so hard to bridge the gap between what you KNOW and what you FEEL. And those feelings are so incredibly real to us...and those feelings sometimes turn into a reality, for the time being.

I hate therapy too....REALLY hate it...when it feels so bad to FEEL a certain way. YUCK!

(((( You are loved here. ))))

((((((((tree)))))))) I'm sorry that it's hard and that it hurts and that it feels (or is!) so unfair.

My reaction to your post is that when it hurts and when you hate it, I can tell it's real change and real work. But that doesn't mean it doesn't hurt. Sorry. just it's better than the alternative.

I wonder if your t has to make an effort to take care of himself so he can take care of you. I mean, it might be hard for him to not be there on the weekends for you.

You're not too "needy, crazy", etc.... you're incredibly supportive of everyone on PC and incredibly intelligent and self aware.

hi ((((((learning1))))))

When i reread my post it looked like it was a response to what you wrote, but it wasn't...I really appreciated what you said, and I hope I didn't sound...dismissive? argumentative? unappreciative? I read it and signed off of PC and then checked e-mail, found nothing from T, spiraled out a bit, and came back and posted. Thank you for replying (twice!)

MUE and Poet, thank you for your nice words. It's clear that T isn't going to reply tonight either.

Sometimes I think my neediness gets REALLY blown up in my head. Like...I e-mailed him yesterday, (the e-mail above) and called to ask if we could talk, and if not, if he could e-mail. That's it. It's not like I've called a million times or sent scores of e-mails or whatever. But I THINK about him and his lack of reply so much that it FEELS like I'm being so needy (I am, actually), but really, I was only on HIS radar for the 30 seconds it took him to read the e-mail and the 60 seconds it took him to listen to the phone message.

Damn this stupid medical procedure on Monday! I hate triggers because it makes everything so REAL, pulls me out of NOW, puts me back in childhood where I had no power or control.

I really need T. I'm having SUCH a hard time not going to the "he hates me" place. Oy.

((((((((tree)))))))))

Yup, this is EXACTLY where I am now. That comment my T made before I left about going over our time left me feeling like my needs were way too overwhelming and HUGE for him to handle, and it was time to kick me out. Too needy, too time-consuming, too dependent, too attached, too selfish, too stupid...just TOO MUCH of everything. I hate that someone else has to feel that too...I'm sorry you feel so much hurt, wish I could make you feel better.

How about we put your "shame spiral" inside my "dark place", set up a couple of recliners, eat pizza, have a glass of wine, and just hang in our "dark-shame-spiral-place"? Cause I'm really sick of being alone!

Yeah, I'm pretty much in the same boat. I have no idea what is going on with my therapist, but he has been insanely distant these past few sessions. No warmth, no understanding. He has barely spoken.

I'm beginning to wonder how much longer I'm going to subject myself to this. It hurts - and it's not the healing kind of hurt either.

Tree, I will be thinking about you tomorrow and sending protective thoughts your way.

Peace to us all

Can I get in on this shame spiral party... I'll bring the little hats and noisemakers!

I'm SO sorry others are going through the same thing. I know that almost all of us go through it at some point, but, wow, it just sucks.

I woke up today thinking *maybe* he would have e-mailed me back last night, but he didn't. He almost always e-mails around 2 on Sunday if I'm waiting for an e-mail, so MAYBE...

I just wish he'd be open about his schedule. Like "I almost never check voice mails/e-mails between when I leave work on Friday and 2pm on Sunday". If that's the case, and I KNOW it, it would save me from a spiral. He always tells me if he's going to be gone for the weekend and that helps.

The other thing is, for some reason, I asked him at the end of session on Friday if we would be friends if we had met in real life (because I was feeling so crazy, and wondered if T would be friends with someone like me). I have asked him that before, and he has always answered in the affirmative...and once he volunteered out of nowhere that if we knew each other in real life, he would probably be kind of selfish with me and want more of my time than he could have. When I asked him on Friday, he said "Yeah, I think so". And I said "you THINK so?" and he said "oh...yes, I'm sure we would be". But that "think so" keeps echoing in my head. I know he was probably distracted, or not thinking about the question, or whatever...but I FEEL like he had finally reached a point of "wow, I am SO SICK of tree" and wishing I would just disappear.

And he disappeared instead.

Nope it's just one of those things where the t can't say "let's be friends!" or it would be creepy. He cares. I think even my t cares. Boundaries suck sometimes. You can't really be direct like in real life.

tree i am so sorry you are in such a bad place these days i hope your T calls back today.i will be thinking about you please check in later and let us know how you are doing

Hi Tree, don't worry, I wasn't taking your post as a response to my post. I was thinking how I like when someone replies to my posts and so figured I'd post something for you. I'm just wishing you didn't have to feel bad. And I'm totally admiring how aware and open you are about explaining your reactions to things your t said.

((((Tree))))

It is almost like we keep asking T and testing T over and over... expecting that ONE of the answers (out of the hundreds of times we ask) is going to result is us being harmed.

A HUGE part of being a trauma survivor is that we don't trust permanence. As a child, each day and month and year are our entire lives. It is all we know. What happens is that those we loved and depended upon for our survival could be absolutely PERFECT for hours, days, or even months or years at a time. Then almost out of the blue - WHAM!! Something would go wrong. Something might be VERY wrong. And we are hurt in a very big way.

What resulted was us always waiting for the proverbial "other shoe" to drop.
No matter how much love we were give, we knew that the person WOULD turn on us. All it took was time or just the right circumstances. If we had a B+ instead of that A - well suddenly instead of basking in tons of love and being supported, we may find ourselves being hit or screamed at, or being sent to bed without dinner ((Side note - I H A T E !!! the act of a parent taking away a basic NEED such as food as a punishment!! UGGGG!!!!!))

Along with all of this, we had to watch for clues as to when the bottom would fall out. Every single morning before daddy leaves, he gives us a hug and tells us to have a good day. Then one morning daddy walks out the door without saying anything. Our alarm goes off - something is wrong. And we know what happens on days daddy isn't happy. So we rush out the door to "fix" the situation - to give daddy and our universe another chance to make it right. We feel OFF. Daddy smiles and says "Oh I forgot something!" He says "Have a good day, Sport!" and gets into his car.

Ok... we didn't get the hug. It is still wrong. We will spend the entire day with this in our mind... wondering how we messed up. Wondering if when daddy gets home, will daddy be in one of his bad moods? "Will daddy hurt us again like he did that one day two years ago?"

Working with our T is a very delicate sitation. All of this will play out for us emotionally. Our job in therapy is to dig down and find out why we emotionally respond to the things that happen in the T relationship the way we do.

And even though it is such a strange (and sometimes scary) relationship, it really is a safe relationship. This is where we can heal.

(((( Tree ))))

I hope your T gets back to you soon....

tree, I just want you to know that I'll be thinking of you tomorrow and hoping your medical procedure goes okay for you. I'm sure your T will connect with you as soon as he can.

I love that you've taken time to explain this more. I have a friend who has abandonment issues and sometimes it drives me crazy. She keeps wanting me to reassure her that we'll stay friends. She's also extremely sensitive to my moods and I need to constantly tell her that it's not her, it's just my mood at the moment. Your post is quite enlightening. Thank you. I will try to be more understanding with my friend.

((((((((tree)))))))) I am thinking of you now and will be thinking of you tomorrow too. Hope everything goes well and that you have connection with T, too.

T and I finally sort of connected.

I felt lonely today and asked H to come and sit with me. I can't eat/drink today and I'm scared about tomorrow so I'm kind of drifty anyway. I was watching myself talk to H and I said "I wish T could come here" and started CRYING. ?!

Anyhow, I pulled myself together. H doesn't like when I'm sick so he wandered off. I e-mailed T and told him I am lonely. He FINALLY e-mailed me back tonight and asked if I wanted him to call me on his way in to work tomorrow. He is going to call at 9:30 and I told him I would answer if I can talk then, and if not, could he please leave a message.

So.

I am SUCH a baby. I just want tomorrow to be here and everything to be okay.

you are not a baby, tree. You are facing this huge hurdle with courage and with optimism. I am so proud of you, and I can't wait until this is behind you. Everything is going to be okay. Everything IS okay.

You are not a baby, Tree....It's hard to feel the right to have needs - and to reach out for others....When we depend on ourselves and only ourselves for SO LONG, it's hard to let go of that total independence. It is human and absolutely OK to have needs...to need support, to need love, to need caring, to need someone by your side. And it takes courage and strength to do exactly what you're doing - reaching out to get your needs met.

(((( HUGS ))))....You are in my thoughts today and tomorrow. Please post an update when you can, ok?

(((tree))) I am so glad that you and T connected at last
Wishing you a speedy and tolerable procedure tomorrow. I hope it's over and forgotten before you know it. I hope you can let us know that you are okay when you feel up to it.

I agree with all the others who have commented and said that you are most definitely NOT a baby....BUT, if you feel like acting like a baby right now, then I say go right ahead. It's perfectly understandable and, for those of us who never really had the luxury of acting like babies and children when we really WERE babies and children, sometimes, we just need to give ourselves permission to feel that fear, insecurity and vulnerability now....regardless of current age.

Wishing you peace and courage as tomorrow comes.......

((((((Tree))))))
I am so relieved you connected somewhat with T. I hope you get to talk to him in the morning, but at least you get a voicemal and hear his voice if you can't answer your phone. I hope he says EXACTLY what you need to hear and puts your mind at ease.

You are sooooo not being a baby. I think I act like a baby whenever I have to have anything medically done and usually it is very simple...so I can't imagine what you are going through. You deserve every bit of love and support anyone can offer.

I'll be thinking of you tomorrow...sending a HUGE amount of love, luck, support, hugs, well wishes..whatever you need right now

I have a friend who is a very good and successful therapist. She has a waiting list for people wanting to get in to see her - her reputation for helping people is well-known.
Yet, when she has to face any kind of medical experience, she becomes undone.
So, I become the person to help walk her through it.
There is no shame in needing help. Good luck today.

So so glad that T is calling you this morning Tree.

I hope you get what you need- don't be afraid to ask

Sending you love and strength for the day ahead