So T is going to keep seeing me... Last session she gave me the what for .... T said she didn't want me as a daughter , we would never be friends and she doesnt want to answer personal question... T also said it was none of my business what she and her friends were doing either.... But that doesn't mean she doesn't like me. T said she didn't like being mad at clients and the other day she was mad at me. Then she said the balls in your court...... Ok, well if I didn't deserve all that I'd say no and some of it I have no idea where it came from (the friend and her thing .... No idea) ... Did she say things out of anger? I left and then called her the next day to ask if this rupture was too much for us to survive? T said as adults we have to learn that people can have disagreements even heated ones and they will make it through. After all that was said by her I wonder why she would even agree to keep seeing me.... What she said hurt me, deeply.... But I guess I deserved it. Anyone else have an experience like this?

[Wren_]

Why do you think you deserved it? ... some of those things, if she said them gently, carefully and used them in a way that would help your therapeutic relationship make sense to tell you ... but to say them angrily from a place of "being mad" as she acknowledged she was, doesn't sound so good

...thanks tigergirl

As for why I deserve it, U can look at old threads but long story short she told me to stop using substances and I lied to her and said I did. I have stopped now and had my meds adjusted and I'm better now , not using . But I lied to her and she has a right to be mad, but I have severe issues with people " liking me" and a mommy issue but the things she said were not gentle at all. I'm going to go back I may tell her how much it hurt me ... I mean I knew all that stuff but to tell me as I sit there bawling ... I think T was angry . I'm kinda afraid now about saying the wrong thing or asking something I shouldn't .

I guess my issue is that all children (even regressive one's ) lie to their parents. It's part of children's growth emotionally. I'm not saying that your therapist has responded incorrectly, it just puts up a red flag for me that she mentioned (according to your previous post) she didn't want to be your sister, mother, friend. . .. did you ask her to be those things previously? If you didn't SPECIFICALLY ask for this, than it is her projection/countertransferance. I'm not saying that isn't what you might have been thinking or indirectly saying , heck that happens in therapy, but if you don't address it directly, than your therapist needs to explore and examine this . .. doesn't sound like she's done that .. . sounds like she's gone to "interpretation" before exploration. ... just my take one things.

I sure hope things work out for you because I've read your posts for a while CC and I get the feeling that you are really trying to make some significant changes in your life. ... and you have been very trusting and connected to this therapist . .. just my view on things. Good luck on solving this tangle!

[Wren_]

it makes sense she was upset about being lied to ... but were the things she was saying about the relationship between you part of that being angry, or was she saying those to try to help?

Originally Posted by tigergirl

it makes sense she was upset about being lied to ... but were the things she was saying about the relationship between you part of that being angry, or was she saying those to try to help?

I think they were things I needed to hear but I think they were spit out with anger... Either way it's all true

[Wren_]

and also ... hurtful ... I hope the two of you can work through this

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by LolaCabanna

T said she didn't want me as a daughter , we would never be friends and she doesnt want to answer personal question... T also said it was none of my business what she and her friends were doing either.... But that doesn't mean she doesn't like me.

Good grief!

[growlycat]

There is the possibility that you and she are not a "good fit". I guess I am reminded of my own experience with a standoffish therapist years ago. I struggled with constant ruptures and wondered what was wrong with ME. I had a psych consult and the 3rd party therapist actually advised that I seek a "warmer and fuzzier" therapist!

I'm glad that I did! It doesn't keep you from T ruptures but it helps overall, a general sense of well being and being cared for. Just something to consider.

Originally Posted by growlycat

There is the possibility that you and she are not a "good fit".

I've thought that for awhile, but I'm afraid after this I have a bad taste in my mouth for Therapy in general. I'm going to go one appt at a time. Funny thing is, anger is an emotion I can deal with from T. My mom hates me and was mean and angry toward me growing up. Is it possible that my mommy issue is causing T issues? T has no biological children and her mom died when she was young, I asked about her having kids ( a personal question ) , she told me about her mom. I think I may trigger T? I've tried to talk to T about this attachment but she never seemed comfortable talking about it. T said she kept me on because if she dumped me it would be perpetrating the pattern I have had in my life, all people I try to open up to leave me because I am too needy and clingy. Is there a needy pill? I'm 38 but around her I feel 15 and the 15 year old is hurt. Maybe her hard stance is supposed to help me break the neediness?

Thank you all for listening to my drama as it unfolds, it helps to talk to people who have " been on the couch " .

I think if things have happened as you say here then your T is an insult to "the couch". There is nothing theraputic in the angry outburst you say she had. I've been with my T for a few yrs and have never been treated with anything but total positive regard. You do have the choice to find someone else. Or are you stuck in a dysfunctional relationship because you don't recognise it as such?

Originally Posted by earthmamma

I think if things have happened as you say here then your T is an insult to "the couch". There is nothing theraputic in the angry outburst you say she had. I've been with my T for a few yrs and have never been treated with anything but total positive regard. You do have the choice to find someone else. Or are you stuck in a dysfunctional relationship because you don't recognise it as such?

It happened as I said... I called T after hours ( 5 or 6 times in 6 months) and I've emailed about 40 until she said no emails ... but T said it was too much. Dysfunctional relationship , hmmm , those r the kind I am accustomed to , you may b right. Since there is no instructions on how it works , how was I supposed to know ? I can't call T or email anymore , appointments face to face only. I think I th ought it would b more warm and fuzzy like many people have with their T but maybe that's NOT what I need? Is this tough love? I told T I wanted to run out of her office when she asked why I was crying, she said I could. But I dont want to run, I need to get over this mommy thing, she's the professional maybe this is part of a larger plan on her part? Thanks earthmamma

[stopdog]

Just because she is the professional does not mean she is always right nor that she is right for you. If you are okay with how she is handling you, then fine. But if you are not, then try someone else. You can take a break from this one to try someone else. Most times they will see you again if you want, in my experience.

[Perna]

Anger is a natural feeling we all have, just like sadness or disappointment or any other feeling. I think we often get confused between anger, and the expression of anger. Punching a wall when you are angry, is not a good expression of your anger. Words are a good expression, especially words that explain why you are angry and where you are coming from.

I did not hear anything about "you" in the T's anger. She explained she did not like being lied to or being questioned; that is not about you; that is about what she likes. If you lied to her, she does not like it; that is just the way she is. She does not want to be your friend, have you as a daughter, or any other relationship other than as a client. That is good for you to know, not said to make you feel bad!

Your hurt is yours. You feel hurt. Whether it is because you want to be her friend and can't or want to see yourself as pleasing and here is evidence you did not please, or just don't think someone else should ever be angry with you, or something else, I don't know, only you can know and work with your hurt to understand yourself and your world better in light of it and thus resolve it.

T had to decide what to "do" about what she is angry about. She has stated her boundaries now and is certain you now know them. If we want to work with another, we have to know the other's boundaries. If you don't pay a lawyer, he he won't represent you, plain and simple. If you don't have the money, you cannot buy the merchandise. If you lie and/or drag your feet complying with this therapist's boundaries or therapeutic judgement, she will not see you anymore.

Your T shared her feelings with you. That is a wonderful gift to be given by a T. You know where you "are". Many of us don't have the courage to ask our T questions and think to "steal" information by searching the web instead of talking to the T and having a conversation about therapy and our roles working together. The T's expression of anger does not sound like your mother's but it looks to me like you are lumping the two together as one. Maybe you should start again with your T discussing anger and its expression? As she said, adults can learn to work with the emotion (whereas children have a harder time because they are just learning about emotions and have no other experiences to compare theirs with other than a usually "bad" expression on the part of their parent or care giver). One of my favorite, most useful sayings my T used was, "It's not like that", letting me know I was on the wrong track, could drop that line of thought and search for a different one. Your T has said she is not your mother and that you two adults can work together through anger expression by either of you. I think that is a great place to start from.

[SoupDragon]

I am such a hypocrit to say this as I find it really hard to open up to my T - but I wonder whether you can share exactly what you have shared on here - how hurt you were by what she said and the tone of her voice.

I think T is partly about learning to be able to express ourselves and our needs and maybe being able to try to resolve things with people in our lives.

However I have been very passive in relationships in the past and am not good at judging those that I should walk away from and I can feel the confusion that I would have in the situation you have described.

When does an outward display of extreme emotion become abusive?

Perna ... Good points , it is about me. Soup, I hear you ... Passive at home not at work for me. Maybe I will talk with her about this and if it doesn't go well maybe I should switch. Maybe we aren't compatible and I'm putting a square peg in a round hole? Of course in afraid to say anything now... For fear but in the end what am I afraid of? T dumpin me ... Maybe I should dump her?

Stopdog I wish I was as strong as you

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by LolaCabanna

she's the professional maybe this is part of a larger plan on her part?

I'm convinced that Ts don't have any kind of plan except in the Battle of Britain sense: "There is no plan but to persevere".

[amandalouise]

lolacabana - its never fun when a therapist feels they need to set some boundaries. Sometimes the boundary setting isnt totally about you. I am an integrated person with dissociative disorders. what that means is I used to have DID where I had alternate personalities. when my therapist discovered I had this, one of the first things she did was set some firm boundaries for what was going to happen in therapy and in regards to hers and my relationship. The session after she and the psychiatrist told me I had DID, I got the heck scared out of me..

I walked in to her office and sat down. she looked me in the eye and said "we need to talk" then she said there was going to be no mothering, coddling, sugar coating, nor expectations that she will tell me such mushy things like I love you, I like you, I will take care of everything. we have a business relationship, not a family or friendship relationship. I had no idea where this firm talking to had come from, so I freaked. I went to the next session with her totally reserved and on eggshells. finally during the session I started crying and asked her what I did wrong. I told her how I had reacted to her "talking to" she gave me.

her reaction and reply - she smiled and said she was glad her "talking to" had affected me, because that showed I didn't turn her out, I had listened to every hard word she had said. Then she told me some mental disorders and other problems they may have sometimes cause the client to feel, think and do some things that can never happen in therapy sessions with her. she felt we were at a point in our relationship where I could handle dealing with issues concerning boundaries, setting them, honoring them and following through with them. what better way for a client to learn about boundaries than by example. She also knew enough about me now that enabled her to set appropriate boundaries.. I was sexually abused as a child, sexual abuse during childhood sometimes leaves a person hungering fur love and attention in the wrong ways from the wrong people, I had DID, child alters usually want and expect inappropriate things and behaviors like expecting/wanting their therapist to take care of them, be their new mother. Some of my alters drank and did other inappropriate things, her job as my therapist is to help me find ways to correct my problems not condone, accept and not address those inappropriate things like drinking, suicide and other inappropriate behaviors. She also knew I was a lesbian. I'm a woman and shes a woman, I didnt have to tell her I found her attractive. my attitude, body language... all told her I could easily fall in love with her. she wanted to make it clear what our relationship was, is going to be and will always be, before the issue needed to be addressed by her having to refer me to someone else later on down the road after I had fallen in love with her. hindsight is everything in our therapy sessions. she wouldnt be doing her job if she didn't keep in mind where I'm at today and use that to keep a lookout for any possible future problems. all things considered I feel she did the right thing. All her reasons were valid ones.

Im not going to post all the stuff about whether she was wrong, was too harsh, maybe you need someone new and all that stuff that normally and understandably that others have posted. short and sweet its not my place to criticize you or your treatment providers. each of us knows what is right or wrong based on our own needs wants and the rules/guidelines for our location, that of the agencies where we recieve treatment. some people need, want and like to have therapists that just tell them what they want to hear, others need, want and like treatment providers that are strick and firm boundaries and others are somewhere in the middle.

you and your treatment providers are the only ones that should say whether your relationship, and what goes on between you and them is out of line, too harsh for you.

Talk with your treatment provider. there may be things that right now you are not seeing, about your problems, and mental disorders that pointed her to having the boundaries talk with you. only she can tell you why she set such firm boundaries, told them to you the way she did and only you and your treatment provider can decide whether she was out of line, too harsh, made a wrong move.