Therapists and apologies

I think sometimes, and too often, this happens. It happened to me with my former T.

Hmmm...well...my T and I have not had a rupture, and she has not harmed me or done something wrong, in my opinion, yet except for being late. She was late three weeks in a row, and she apologized each week. The last time she was quite sorry, and I said that it was ok. She said that it wasn't ok. I said, well, then, I forgive you. She then said that she should just be on time instead of apologize each week. I could tell that the person before me had a serious crisis situation though. I know I have kept my T late, and I try to be very forgiving and understanding when others need this too.

Because of how she acted with this, I'm quite confident that she would have no trouble apologizing if she wronged me in another way, but I can't be sure. I guess I just hope that she doesn't!

I feel bad that has been yours and others experiences. My T often apologizes to me, when something she's done or said has triggered a hurtful response in me. Just yesterday, my T was trying to point out an unhealthy pattern that she saw in me, but the tone of voice she used reminded me strongly of my mother, and all I heard from T was "you're wrong." I physically flinched and T noticed. She asked me what was going on, and I kinda lashed out a little, T just asked again what I was feeling, and I told her that I felt hurt and that I was going to cry, then proceeded to do just that. T waited until I stopped crying, then apologized that what she'd done had hurt me. We both understood that it wasn't really T, but more my own issues, but T still apologized for triggering me and wanted to understand what had happened. I talked a little about it in session, then reflected more later and sent T an email. She apologized again in email.

My T also always apologizes if she's running late or needs to reschedule or something (that rarely happens, though).

I think, with my T and I, there is mutual respect, and I've never felt like she thinks she's above me in any way. I appreciate that and am grateful I found her. I'm not sure I could work with someone that was always putting the blame back on me and couldn't work with me as an equal.

I don't think I could trust a T in they could not apologize. When my T has apologized, she readily admits that she is human and is as prone to mistakes as anyone else.

My challenge has been to be able to accept her apology because I tend to put her on a pedestal and if she makes a mistake it shakes me up a bit.

But that's part of the growth of learning about real human relationships.

Again, I would not trust a T who could never apologize. I'd say though that it's also important that we don't expect them to admit a mistake that they don't believe they made. That would be inauthentic.

Good luck.

"As most of you know already, my new t whom I have seen for 4 or 5 sessions didn't show up for two of those sessions and one other was extremely late."

Good morning,

Are all of her screwups administrative? If so, she is a poor businesswoman. If not, she doesn't understand the need for a therapuetic alliance or how to establish the basic framework for therapy. How in the world could you ever trust this woman?

Yes, your past makes you more sensitive to feelings of rejection. This has nothing to do with your past, it is about the here and now. Would you accept this behavior from an attorney, a banker or even a friend? I don't think so.

I am a retired therapist and the fact that she is trying to make it all about you infuriates me. I know there is a theme concerning a therapist who is willing to offer an apology. We are way past that with this woman. It is abusive to blame you for her screwups.

I would not see this woman again. She is harmful to your mental well being and a waste of money. Look at the emotional energy you are expending on her. This is not about a therapuetic issue to be worked on with her. It is about her being unwilling to accept responsibilty for her behaviors.

You deserve better than the happy horsesh*t this woman is peddling.

Sabra

I've been thinking about apologies and I'm not sure I like them. They are a way of closing the matter. I think I prefer to just have my feelings acknowledged.

Yeah having your feelings acknowledged and validated would be more pleasing than an apology that someone didn't mean TR.

THis has been my experience anyway


Thank you for validating my thoughts Sabra.
At first I was so angry when I read her email and then afterwards I thought: wait a minute maybe she is right I am blowing this way out of proportion. I sent her an email saying that I wouldnt be going back and she said she felt the need to tell me that she hopes I don't choose to isolate myself from and further trusting relationships.

Then of course I started to blame myself again and was afraid of losing all of my friends due to my poor judgement but now that I am in a different frame of mind- This is horseshit.
I wouldnt accept this behaviour for anyone who I was paying but I still feel bad about myself evewn though I know it wasn't my fault.

Well said.

Do I get this right?
She misses or is late for appointments.
She doesn't address it herself.
You still come back several times.
She doesn't feel badly or apologize.
She blames you for being too sensitive.
You decide this is beyond your limits and decide to leave
AND NOW she thinks you are isolating yourself for not accepting her bad behavior ?

Yes Syra, that is all correct. Tell me I am not ever reacting and that this is her stuff, right?

My t has been good at saying sorry when it is warranted. Just yesterday he aplologized because he has cancelled on me quiet a bit latley.

I wish I had paid attention to my former T's handling of issues when I was hurt. I noticed she didn't apologize, although she didn't strike out at me either like yours did - but she didn't own her behavior. That was the first sign I should have paid attention to. tHere were others later.

Later one (over two years later) she did start blaming me for her feelings. By then I had a few other red flags I ignored. I ignored this one too.

I think it's smart that you are paying attention to the red flags.

I have no idea if you are over-reacting or under-reacting. I'm not sure that is all that important. Clients don't come perfect. We all have our issues. It's HER job to help you with that, and I don't think judging and blaming and criticizing is an accepted practice for helping clients and I'm sure it's contrary to research. IF you are over-reacting (although I'm not hearing that) I don't see her as someone who can help you. And IF you are overreacting - that is okay. What's important is you are aware of your feelings, and observing yourself, and being thoughtful. That is how we grow. This is a good thing. You don't have to be perfect to go to therapy, and you don't have to be perfect to not like how the T treats you.

What I hear is she is blaming you for her bad behavior. I wouldn't like that in a friend. I wouldn't like that from family. And I sure wouldn't like paying for the experience.

Sorry your last t hurt you Syra. I am glad you found a new t who did not blame you for their feelings. I guess it makes us more aware of the red fllags for the future but its a pity it has to hurt us so much first.
I just wish that ts would realise what they are doing and that we are ALL human and make mistakes.
The fundamantal message in training school for ts is first do know harm so I wonder why some of them choose to ignore this rule.

Then of course I started to blame myself again and was afraid of losing all of my friends due to my poor judgement but now that I am in a different frame of mind- This is horseshit.
I wouldnt accept this behaviour for anyone who I was paying but I still feel bad about myself evewn though I know it wasn't my fault.[/quote]

Button,

I am jumping up and down while doing the happy dance. .
You did not let this woman switch your reality. What you thought and felt were the truth. I know how difficult it can be to discern whats right and whats wrong due to past abuse. Perps always try to make victims feel responsible for the abuse. They don't take responsibilty for any of their behavior, they dump it on the victim.

You took a giant step towards your recovery. Celebrate your victory. Please allow yourself to feel the strength you have. You did it......you pulled her cover. Don't let false guilt take your joy. The guilt belongs to her, don't pick it up and carry it for her. Pat yourself on the back for a job well done.

Sabra giving you a big hug,

The fundamantal message in training school for ts is first do know harm so I wonder why some of them choose to ignore this rule.

Button,

I know why..........they haven't worked on their own stuff. They carry the baggage into therapy and clients get to carry it.

Sabra

I like tiny rabbit's idea of having my feelings acknowledged and validated. That I what is important to me.

I am stunned, Button. Unbelievable. (((((hugs to you))))))

On occasion T has apologized when he has screwed up, but honestly he doesn't screw up too terribly often. Generally, if I find myself angry or frustrated with him, it has WAY more to do with my own "stuff" than it has to do really do with what he may or may not have done.

You mentioned your T said it was your choice to perceive and respond to the situation they way you did. I hate to tell you this because I'm not sure you want to hear it, but that very well may be true. None of us like to hear that we have choices in regards to how we internalize and personalize and respond to things that happen, but we really do.

Of course it sounds easy to just choose to perceive and respond differently, but actually doing so is so very, very difficult and painful. It sounds like your T was trying to get you to see a tendency or pattern in your own thinking and behavior that perhaps you need to work on. Boy, do I understand that! Been there; done that; have the t-shirt!

It completely pisses me off when T will bring my unhealthy, insecure, self-degrading thought and behavior patterns to my attention because they are SO hard to change. I'd much rather he just confirm and validate my skewed thinking; it is so much easier that way. Change is painful. But I wouldn't learn and wouldn't change and wouldn't grow and wouldn't move forward if my T just let me continue thinking and behaving they way I always have. I might not like his timing. I might much rather he "validate" my thinking because that would make me "feel" better, but the reality is that I've hired him to be straight with me about the places in my life that I need to make the choice to change, and sometimes his timing seems cruel even. But as the old saying goes: "You've got to strike while the iron's hot." If a therapist waits until the intense moment has passed, that window for true learning, applicability, and change may also pass. They have to make those tough judgment calls. Will they always get it right? Nah, but sometimes they have to take the moment and do and say what they feel needs to be said and heard in that moment and hope we are ready to take it in.

Therapy would be so much more pleasant if therapists would just let us be who we've always thought we were. Just not how it works though.

Thanks Chris, I appreciate your honesty and missed it around here!
I do understand I have patterns and am really starting to see them come into play lately and see how destructive they are to me.
I think t was right to point them out but her timing sucked and the way she did it, it was at my expense totally. The fact was she screwed up and blamed me, granted I chose to push her away and quit but I think I have every right to after her not showing up for the second time. I need a t who is going to be there for me, a reliable t. If I continued to work with her I would be worrying before every session if she would turn up. It is the least a t can do and have the curtesy to apologise for her mistake and blame my sadness at her not showing up as my own fault. I think it was a natural reaction to feel hurt about it and not important no matter what my past, these are normal reactions and I am really disappointed in her lack of apology because she seemed so nice before. I think she is heading for a burn out

This is so true Sabra but also sad. We come looking for help and sometimes leave worse than when we started.

I read this and smiled and thought "Good for you." Yes you have issues, like the rest of us.. Yes your issues may have a part in this and you are willing to consider that. But you know how you feel, you know you are losing trust in her, you know you are entitled to a better response than "it's just your issues." and the fact that you aren't perfect isn't preventing you from maintaining your own reasonable boundaries.

Thank you Syra, I think this is the result of my therapy- not with her! I have learned to trust myself and not believe what others say about me because that is just how they perceive me and their beliefs can get in the way of their judgements.

What other people say about you says more about them than it does about me!
Her trying to shift the blame onto me is her packing her guilt into a bag and giving me her luggage to carry. I would be doing myself no favours if I let her do this because she is always saying I need to stand up for myself and believe and protect me.

I don't know all the details in your story. It kind of sounds like there were two different issues going on in your situation at the same time.

First, the therapist's missing of your appointment which was inconvenient for you. Sounds like she took responsibility by admitting she forgot to write it in her book. That may not sound like an "apology" to you, but she didn't deny she made that mistake; she owned her error, just perhaps not in the fashion you would like her to.

The other issue is your reaction/response/interpretation of what her actions meant which, as you say, could very well be a product of old patterns and behaviors that might be destructive for you.

Your agenda was to get an apology. Her agenda was to have you see that your interpretation of her motivations, etc. was perhaps inflated or skewed by old habits of thinking.

You are not seeing her ownership of her error as an apology. She is not seeing your need for a different kind of apology.

She is wanting you to make the choice to interpret her actions more based on reality than old habits of thinking. You are not seeing her input as focused on your therapy and growth.

Sounds like the responsibility for this impasse is about 50/50 (as impasses tend to be). You certainly are within your right to change therapists based on the scheduling issues. She is certainly within her right as a therapist to try to help you recognize the choices you make (although probably very unconsciously as these types of ingrained choices/habits are wont to be).

Well said.

My experience is that therapists will apologize if pressed, but their apologies aren't worth much because there is no commitment to change.

Hi Button,

This post was started on 4/9 with a topic that quickly served as a segue into the same topic you started in a thread on 3/29 (which spanned 11 pages and was ultimately closed). In that thread some people challenged you (on exactly what you're writing about here, though in some cases with a little more information), had different opinions/perspectives on the matter, which you very much disagreed with.

Why the redux? Are you looking for the support you feel you did not get on the other thread?

You have omitted from this thread something you wrote to that therapist which is what she seemed to be responding to.

In the last thread you wrote:

I also said in the email that my first t didn't show up for two of my sessions and that maybe it is a strange coincidence or maybe that I don't matter to anyone enough to show up! She was referring to this and felt the need to point out that I was choosing to hurt myself and that I was isolating myself by not going back to her from trusting relationships.

From the above, maybe she felt that you interpret others' mistakes as proof that you are unworthy and that they can't be trusted. I don't know about the "choosing" to hurt yourself, or if she used that word, but you do hurt yourself this way.

She owned that she made a mistake. You reacted by saying that she's just yet another t whose behavior proves that you don't matter and she challenged that. Maybe not very eloquently, but I do get her point of view.

I do not see any need for this other therapist to 'own' or 'apologize' for you coming to the conclusion that you're unworthy as a result of her forgetting your appointment. As I've said before, I do think therapists should acknowledge when they have hurt a client (however unintentionally), but they should not own their client's reactions.

In any case, after this particular thread, I hope you can put this behind you and move forward with your current therapist (who as I understand it, you never left). And I hope if you decide to look elsewhere again, you will do so because you have decided that that's what you need to do (you said you only went to see this other person because people here thought you should) -I think you'll be more invested if you do it that way.