[*PeaceLily*]

Hi everyone.

Well, in the never ending saga that is my relationship with my therapist, i once again feel out of sorts about the process. Namely, that there doesn't appear to be a process.

So far, it seems like it has been a huge waste of money, and I think that's why I'm afraid to cut my losses and stop working with her and accept that it was just a waste of money.

My background is one of trauma and abuse, as well as sexual abuse which is something I am only just dealing with now. This all went on for years past the age of 18, (the sexual abuse was a childhood situation though)

My situation is hard to explain briefly but basically I got trapped there going on and off medications which I didnt need and which made things a lot worse, and I literally had no life/no friends/no job

I am finally away at age 26 and in therapy. However, I just don't get it. She seems to be very present focused and skills based.. She says I have post traumatic stress symptoms, but there is no structure to the therapy really. I have spoken about this to her before. but it still seems that way. I don't really know where it's going, but I'm not sure whether I am meant to.

I feel a need to talk about what happened, because I am permanently bewildered by it with intrusive memories. I feel I need a narrative to have a sense of self and not feel like empty nothingness because my life has been empty nothingness.

Am i wrong to think I need to work with my past? Therapy is so present focused, but my mind is locked in a deeply confusing past. This is where I originally wrote about my situation: http://forums.psychcentral.com/survi...eful-help.html

I am not sure if it is me.After all, I guess I am a traumatised person, and there is therefore no guarantee that I am coming at this from the right angle.

What do you make of this?

Thankyou

x

I think the past is important but only as far as it is impacting me in the here and now. We cannot go back to the past and change it and we cannot go to the future and change that either but we are able to work in the present. That is my thought.

[*PeaceLily*]

It is impacting me a lot through flashbacks/memories, and also because I was in an abusive situation for a very long time,a lot of the time not present due to negative effects from prescription drugs as well as dissociation issues, it's kind of like not existing for 26 years.

My therapist seems to want to focus on skills to deal with the present. I just dont get why this feels wrong somehow.Like I said, it may very well be me

[*PeaceLily*]

I feel like the title of this thread is a bit misleading, because it implies my therapist has directly said 'your past isn't important' or something. She has said 'there is nothing we can do about the past.'

Its more that I don't get why she doesn't think I should talk about it so I can have more understanding of what happened and why it happened, so I don't feel like a 'rabbit in headlights' about it all the time. I don't really get that.I thought talking about what happened was good for trauma or am I wrong?

What is the orientation of your therapist? Is it CBT?

[Petra5ed]

Sometimes I think we have a compelling need to talk about our past because we can't otherwise. People with happy childhoods can and do talk about it, and those of us with traumatic ones can never talk about it without being labeled weirdos and really repulsing people. So I think some people, therapists included, just don't want to hear it. I wouldn't work with such therapists. If I was raped as a child how the F is that not relevant?

[ThisWayOut]

Many times, trauma t starts out with skill building so that you can get through the processing piece. Even working with an s.a. therapist, the first several sessions were spent making sure I had the skills needed to get me through the flashbacks and the other ptsd symptoms. It's work to be able to get to the processing point. However it may be good to have that conversation with your t again and clarify that you feel it important to deal with the past directly. I would also probably ask again what her idea of treatment is.
Even therapy that doesn't go as far as we'd like isn't necessarily a waste of time or money. If you don't agree with how the therapy is progressing, it's OK to look for a new t. But keep in mind that trauma work is generally slow and starts with skills. Even emdr and pe therapies make sure you have a strong skills foundation before jumping in to anything overly triggering.
That said, I can relate to the frustration around focusing on skills when the flashbacks and memories are so overwhelming. I feel strongly that (at least for myself), I need to fave the past to be able to lessen the symptoms. Skills feel useless when the symptoms are relentless.

[precaryous]

PeaceLily,

I could have written most of your post myself.

I can't say what your T has in mind for you, but here is what I am experiencing.

I am 59 and I have seen my T for one year. I had a curious expectation that once I told her all of my history that there would be some sort of cathartic trauma therapy that would help me feel better and more functional.

Two weeks ago she introduced mindfulness and breathing exercises. I am afraid I flipped out a little because I couldn't understand how breathing exercises are supposed to get me to that cathartic moment I was expecting. Then I realized there is no cathartic trauma moment..she had never promised this to me. I realized the idea came from me. Now I am feeling confused and hopeless. I'm mad at myself for having such a stupid expectation. I dont think I'll ever feel better.

Like with your T, there doesn't seem to be any plan or goals. We have had a discussion about this and she assures me that the exercises she is suggesting will lead us to trauma...and to me feeling better.

We are still trying to figure this out. T has said if anyone here has had success with a trauma workbook, or suggestions, we could look at them...

Have you asked your T if she is done examining your past?

[stopdog]

If the therapist is doing cbt - I would find one who is not. I believe in interviewing a lot of them and changing when they are more incompatible than useful.

[*PeaceLily*]

Thankyou for all your replies.I have read them all.

I feel like for me, it is not so much the childhood stuff. It is more what my parents did after the age of 18 which is so unreal because I was told I was mentally ill and that I needed medication and all the medications did was bring on constant manic episodes, but I was always told I needed more. i wasnt allowed to pick stuff up the floor or have anyone in the house,(not that I knew anyone in the end) or empty a bin.It was a 'captivity' kind of situation.I now realise it was out of my mother's envy of my potential success as well as a punishment, and to stop me talking as I had said as a teenager I would tell people of the abuse that had happened there, so I had to be physically isolated to prevent me talking. It was madness. It sounds terrible but I would go through all the childhood abuse again rather than get stuck there for 8 years after I turned 18 because that seems like a movie.

I haven't examined my past with my therapist. I have told her facts, like the broad outline. I have a feeling she thinks that examining it could push me over the edge. I had a pretty strong physical reaction to sexual abuse memories recently. I have spent my whole life naturally using dissociative states to be numb. Therefore, it is quite possible that I am overestimating my capability to safely deal with processing details of what happened and the grief and loss of it all. I still don't think I really FEEL it much at all, and I guess there is a legitimate concern that if I really feel the enormity of it, I could find myself in a very dangerous position. After all, I did wretch actually feeling sexual abuse memories for the first time, so I could see that if I were to feel all of the stuff that happened there after I turned 18, (currently I don't really feel any of it,) I may surprise myself with the emotions that surface and the strength of these emotions. Even though I can't feel it right now, I can see that my past is very bad, and I think worse than what I currently know. I may be doing a mixture of underestimating what's happened because I can't really feel it/remember it all and overestimating my emotional capability at dealing with it.

Maybe my therapist thinks I'm doing that too, and she doesnt want to put me in danger which is understandable.However, I just wish she would give me some structure so I could feel like there was some rhyme and reason to it all, and so I could feel more trusting and safe in the therapy. I'm ok with learning skills first if that's what is safest, but there's no sense of goals or time planning, so I don't know how long I am going to spend learning these skills before moving onto the next phase of treatment. She doesn't seem to be aiming for a certain time, but it is costing me a lot of money and it has already dragged on way longer than we had both planned and there are never any progress checks.

She is a dbt/cbt therapist so that is very present/skills focused but not even the skills seem to be very structured. we go all over the place with the skills we are studying an don't stay focused on one skill at a time. One good thing I can say is that she is a very pleasant person though. I do feel she cares about me, but I am not trusting that there is a clear structured process

X

[Restin]

I agree with Stopdog on that. Trouble is, we get into the transference attachment thing and can't leave the T even if they're all wrong for us. I went through several traumatic terminations before I knew the difference between CBT and Dynamic Relationship Therapy. It would be great if we could go into therapy knowing more. But it is complex stuff and I don't know if even a brochure on therapy methods would have helped at the beginning. Sometimes leaving one T gradually by starting up with another also, is an easier way to change. I can't imagine going to therapy where my past is dismissed. I know now to ask what kind of therapy a T does, but it's way too late.

[*PeaceLily*]

Originally Posted by Restin

I agree with Stopdog on that. Trouble is, we get into the transference attachment thing and can't leave the T even if they're all wrong for us. I went through several traumatic terminations before I knew the difference between CBT and Dynamic Relationship Therapy. It would be great if we could go into therapy knowing more. But it is complex stuff and I don't know if even a brochure on therapy methods would have helped at the beginning. Sometimes leaving one T gradually by starting up with another also, is an easier way to change. I can't imagine going to therapy where my past is dismissed. I know now to ask what kind of therapy a T does, but it's way too late.

Hi. Thanks Why do you feel it is too late?

x

[Raging Quiet]

A Psychodynamic therapist or a Humanistic one will incorporate childhood and PTSD into sessions. Sadly CBT is based in the clients present and 'here and now' so does not incorporate the past. CBT is good for phobias and mild anxiety/depression, but only when psychodynamic therapy has supported most of the work.

The therapist sadly won't change their model, so I hope you can find a psychodynamic therapist to help.

I've been with the wrong t for 9 years and as it was the wrong model (but I had maternal transference) it's taken years to make progress.

CBT therapists are trained to not work with transference usually.

I wouldn't go to a therapist like that. Their training is very targeted and symptom oriented. An experienced, skilled therapist who goes deeper than symptoms is hard to find since it seems the short term approach is all the rage. A lot of new therapists grew up learning the paint by numbers type of therapy. There are other types of therapists, of course, and some who do a combination. And, some people like and need the skill building stuff. Personally, I don't see a need for it. I talk about what's going on/went on and we work on it. It's messy and uncertain, but someone with experience feels okay with the messiness of it.

[CantExplain]

Some Ts focus too much on the past, some too little. In my humble experience, you can't change a T, you can only replace her.

[growlycat]

I have seen both psychodynamic and CBT therapists and I highly recommend psychodynamic for trauma. Only after years of psychodynamic was I able to start utilizing CBT/now-focused/goal oriented therapy. CBT would have been useless to me without the deeper work first. That being said, CBT in the past few years has been highly helpful to me in reaching certain goals.

I am so sorry to read about your past and your abusive dad. Don't stop looking for a good fit with a T…your current T may not be the best fit for you right now.

[iGottaBme]

I stayed with my CBT t for ten years because I wanted to believe that he could help me work through trauma. He couldn't and didn't. A trauma t has helped me significantly in short period of time work with trauma, attachment, and transference. Therapists are like any other professional. They have specialties and you should see someone who wants to help you with your specific concerns.

[*PeaceLily*]

Growlycat-I feel like I know what you mean about being blocked to the benefits of the present focused skills based models until you'd taken the psychodynamic approach.I feel like I can relate in the sense that I have so much grief and con fusion about it all that it leads to such a sense of nothingness and hopelessness that it's hard to have the motivation to do the dbt/cbt.
Plus, we have just started doing a worksheet on core beliefs and one of my core beliefs is that I am not like other human beings, that I am subhuman like an animal- my dad used to call me this, and this is how I used to live, so the belief is still very much there as it was cemented by so many years of it all. However, I find it hard to find reasons why this belief among others I have may not be true, and I feel this is because I don't 'get' my past. If you have never lived like other people, it's hard to believe you're not sub human. I have no framework within which to understand my past. I just don't get it, and because it continued past the age of 18, I blame myself and I think I may very well believe I deserve to be punished which makes incorporating the dbt/cbt skills to enhance my quality of life very difficult. I also feel like there isn't any hope which again is a block to practising and using the skills, and I guess that belief also comes from being stuck there so long.I have heard that dbt/cbt is supposed to be used prior to processing trauma though to stabilise the traumatised client.

Growlycat and IGottaBMe and RagingQuiet- Were you guys put off from cutting ties with your therapists due to feeling bad about wasting money or feeling like you had otherwise invested in the therapist? Also, did you struggle with berating yourself for choosing the wrong therapist for you, and did you feel bad for cutting ties with them if they were a pleasant person? I was wondering, because they are the kinds of feelings I have, so wondered if you had experienced similar. The waste of money aspect does get me down.It probably wouldn't bother me so much if I weren't in such a bad position financially.I was seeing her twice a week for quite a few months so that is a lot of money I have spent to end up not making any progress. :-/

[growlycat]

I started with psychodynamic from early on so in a sense it was pure luck that I started there.

However, I still went through multiple therapists that were psychodynamic, but a really bad fit for me.

My first T in my teens was a nice but inexperienced female T. The clinic just made the assumption that I would want a female T. (My early abuser in a daycare setting was female )

My next T was a more experienced female T but she was very hostile towards me. She had a previous working relationship with my stepfather so I never understood why she wasn't pulled from my case. Worst therapist!!

The next was a male psychiatrist who seemed to be working out but after 1.5 years he essentially dumped me because he wanted me to get a second t to manage my suicidal; feelings. A situation I could not afford to comply with--and it was just a stupid idea.

I had a temp T who was male and although I kind of liked him, he was too much like me at the time---dark and moody. He felt more like a parole officer than a T.

My longtime T was finally the right fit--warm, caring, humble , smart and flexible--and truly committed.

It was highly painful to break ties with most of my bad-fit T's. But in the end having the right T for me made the difference between wanting to live or die.

[growlycat]

PS-- I doubt that your work with your T was a waste of time or money. As long as you learned something then it was worth it--even if it meant learning you need a different mode of therapy.

[ScarletPimpernel]

My T is client-centered and CBT. I get the best of both worlds. Though, we don't really have a structure. It's very dependent on current situations and states. But if the past needs to be talked about, my T is more than willing to go there.

[Ididitmyway]

No, you are not wrong to want to talk about your past. You should work on whatever you feel is important to work on. It's your decision, not your therapist's. If it's important for you to talk about your past and explore it, then this is what you should be doing. If your therapist has a different idea, it is time to cut losses and to find a new therapist, as upsetting as it may be to realize.

[Raging Quiet]

Originally Posted by *PeaceLily*

Growlycat and IGottaBMe and RagingQuiet- Were you guys put off from cutting ties with your therapists due to feeling bad about wasting money or feeling like you had otherwise invested in the therapist? Also, did you struggle with berating yourself for choosing the wrong therapist for you, and did you feel bad for cutting ties with them if they were a pleasant person? I was wondering, because they are the kinds of feelings I have, so wondered if you had experienced similar. The waste of money aspect does get me down.It probably wouldn't bother me so much if I weren't in such a bad position financially.I was seeing her twice a week for quite a few months so that is a lot of money I have spent to end up not making any progress. :-/

CBT is loved by the NHS, it's the real flavour of the decade. And is effective, but the sessions are practitioner led, not client led.

I have spent years in a therapy that hasn't helped. I have seen her for many years totalling £4000+ but my maternal transference has always stopped me from leaving and she couldn't seem to let me go either. I pretended it was me being 'too broken to be cured' but I saw one different t for one session with my hubby who was another model and it impacted on me greatly.

Take care x