[Partless]

I would appreciate it if you can help me out. So it's been a few months since my break from therapy and today I saw a note I had made years ago from one of my sessions, when the T had said meditation/mindfulness will really help me and if I take one thing from the sessions, that should be it.

I had tried it for a while then gave up. Partly because sitting had made things so painful it was my least favorite part of the day, forcing me to sit for 15 minutes in a position that made my tension much worse and I would perspire heavily and could not think of anything but pain, after 3-4 minutes into my sitting sessions (even on a pillow). So I tried to lie down, but would fall asleep or otherwise did not feel I was really self aware, like I would fantasize and lose myself. So I gave up.

But I'm thinking of doing it again. But how?

Also why should it work?

Is the idea that present, in objective terms, for must of us who are very depressed or anxious, is much better than we perceive it to be (in our mental state of being tied with past and anxious about future but never present) so that if we let emotions come and go and not hold on to them then they will finally lose their hold on us and can't scare us or hurt us, and we can be fully present and free of pain and suffering? And how long would that take?

It's also philosophically confusing, and I browsed a couple of books on meditation, and I was like, What? Like to sit with no goals or wanting to achieve something and yet I'm sitting for some reason, and I think most people start meditating to feel grounded or less anxious or something, cause why else would you just sit for 15-20 minutes in your room with your eyes closed and not play a computer game to distract yourself from your pain and misery?

Appreciate your help.

[PinkFlamingo99]

I've never been able to figure out how to benefit from this either. Thanks for asking.

[laxer12]

When I went to my T to deal with depression, she talked a lot about mindfulness and really encouraged me to give it a try. However, she focused less on the meditation aspect of it and more on the "state of being" that it emphasizes. The biggest thing I got from it was to be non-judgemental of myself, my feelings, my thoughts, and ultimately, other people.

I have tried meditation a few times but I haven't gotten into the habit of it yet. I think it's easier for people trying for the first time to start with 5 minutes and then work your way up to 15-20.

There is a website I found that has been really helpful for me: Left Brain Buddha - the modern mindful life

I encourage you to check it out and read a lot of the postings on there. It's geared toward people who struggle with the concepts of meditation and mindfulness and for those who don't think they have enough time.

Good luck and just keep trying! Mindfulness is difficult when you start but even trying a little bit can make a big difference.

My T really got on a mindfulness kick a few years back, and the way he does it and was communicating it to me, just did not work for me AT ALL. I did humor him and read a book he recommended, but I found the methods as they were explained very contrived and unnatural to me. I don't respond well to things that feel unnatural to me, so I pretty much forbade him to bring it up anymore because the whole topic completely stressed me out.

I have discovered my own methods for calming my "self." They work for me even though they probably don't fit official mindfulness models. I've found ways to recognize when I am tense and ways to relax that physical and mental tension that work for me, and as far as I'm concerned that is enough for me.

[ScarletPimpernel]

I can't do meditation or visualization. I like focusing on deep breathing. I also like being mindful of my environment (primarily outdoors). And I like guided relaxation. I hate progressive muscle relaxation. Feeling my body triggers me.

I would suggest guided techniques and find a voice that you find calming or soothing. And do simple techniques. Don't worry about being a pro or doing it exactly how you think it should be done. Like body position: do what feels best to you. I know you're not supposed to fall asleep, I have, and I just chalk it up that the relaxation actually worked.

[BayBrony]

Mindfulness, meditation and yoga are helping me a LOT with my eating disorder recovery ( 26 years with anorexia and bulimia so no easy task). this book in particular

Radical Acceptance by Tara Bruch

The exercises in the book are helpful to me. Also working on breathing meditation helps. If sitting. Is painful there is walking meditation. Also 20 minutes is a LONG time for someone just starting with meditation. My The suggested beginning with no more than 3 to 5 minutes to avoid frustration.

[puzzclar]

I use Calm, its an app that you can use and its guided. Makes it easier. But benefits are if you do it consistently

[PinkFlamingo99]

Originally Posted by puzzclar

I use Calm, its an app that you can use and its guided. Makes it easier. But benefits are if you do it consistently

My psychologist recommended this one too.

[Partless]

BayBrony thanks for the book recommendation. Puzzclar I'll look up Calm. ScarletPimpernel, funny, I have problems with PMR too, can be triggering; I'll look up guided techniques, haven't done them in a while, thanks. laxer12, thanks for link and sharing how it works for you, appreciate it.

I guess we don't have seasoned veterans in mindfulness/meditation (or haven't seen my thread), and I was hoping their views could help this newbie (and others). I have gone to zen type forums before, but usually the only response I get is that I should get a teacher. But I'm not that dedicated yet and also don't have money for that kind of stuff right now...

[SoupDragon]

My therapy focused a lot on this. It is called a practice as that is what you need to do "practice". At times I found it really hard, but at other times beneficial. There is a lot of research supporting that it can actually change neural pathways in the brain.

It can be done as a sitting practice, but also through movement. Things like yoga can also have a mingdfulness link.

I have used an app called headspace which I found helpful.

Soup

Meditation has always been difficult for me. I think I've tried different techniques more than a few times and always came away feeling like a failure. I have been especially unsuccessful with anything that focuses on breath work. So after a while I changed my focus to very very simple mindfulness type exercises--doing a simple everyday task and being very focused on being in the moment. One of the most simple was washing dishes. It is something I do every night and I gritted my teeth and focused on being in the moment--concentrating on the physical sensations of the act. I was moderately successful but because I'm often rushed to finish because I want to watch the news or go for an after dinner walk, I easily fell out of mindfulness

Then I realized that I did a simple task every single day that would fit perfectly and I did it early in the morning before anyone else in the house was awake. I sweep my front and back patio (I live in the southwest and have two large trees on my patios and they are constantly dropping leaves and the birds leave seeds from the feeder galore). So I started to sweep mindfully. It was HARD! In the past, I'd start sweeping and before you know it my brain would be racing along; I'd be having conversations with people who I wanted to address something with or I'd be listing all the things I had to do that day. Each time, I'd purposefully and firmly bring myself back to the physical act of sweeping. Sound silly. It sure felt like it. But guess what? I've been doing it for 2 years, 4 months now and I've finally hit my stride. I can perform the task, which takes about 40 minutes without letting my brain take over and railroad me into crazy talk. I really enjoy sweeping now. It's my quiet time.

The other thing I've started is taking the last fifteen minutes of my daily power walk and concentrating solely on being mindful of the sounds around me. For the main part of my walk, I have headphones on blaring upbeat music in my ear to motivate the speed of my walk. But at the end of the walk, I take off the headphones and listen to the sounds of the birds (not identifying, "Oh, that's a Thrusher or that one is a Jay.") I simply concentrate on the sound.

Am I meditating? Not in the way a lot of books recommend, but I have achieved a place where my brain is silent and focused. There is a peacefulness to it. My mind isn't rushing ahead to what I'm going to do next and it's not delving into what happened last night or twenty years ago when I was upset or angry about something and want to somehow make it right. I am comfortably just in my body. I found that "sitting quietly" counting my breath was too taxing for me personally, but I can achieve a place of quiet in other ways. It does take a LOT of time and effort, but it's worth it!

[ThingWithFeathers]

I find guided meditation and mindfulness exercises to be incredibly helpful in assisting in learning 'how' to sit, focused for a period of time. There are some good free relaxation apps that use guided meditation to keep the listener focused, and to help them refocus when the mind wanders. I imagine it would be especially helpful to people who find it hard to 'let go', who find themselves distracted by physical sensations or external stimuli to a point where meditative practice is not possible. Many guided meditation techniques work with these distractions and incorporate the refocus of the mind into the practice. I'm not saying it's for everyone, but if you're interested in finding out if it works for you, and distractions are impeding your attempt, one of the guided apps might help.

[NowhereUSA]

I do DBT mindfulness. Basically, it brings awareness to one's thoughts and experiences. It's not about emptying your mind so much as becoming aware of what is there. Calling a thought a thought, a feeling a feeling. The description I've been given is that it's like a conveyer belt with boxes. You simply watch the boxes (your thoughts, feelings) go by without the need to stop and unpack it. The goal is to stay in the present moment with a mind that doesn't let anything stick on it. Another analogy is lying on a blanket and the clouds drift by. They are what they are and you don't have to hold onto them.

It does take practice, but there's no real failing it. I'll go for walks and listen to my music or notice the weather or notice that I'm feeling anxious. And sometimes my thoughts run off a bit, I hear a song and it makes me think of X and then I'm thinking about Y and I'm not *here* anymore, I'm *there*... and so I just bring it back. I take a deep breath and let the feeling, the thought pass me by.

In fact, I'm working on that as I'm typing here. I feel the keys. I smell my coffee. I hear my children. As I was getting my coffee I wasn't focused, I was off thinking about something else, and I poured my coffee almost mechanically instead of noticing the color as it went into my cup or how the aroma hit me for the first time this morning.

It takes practice and if I'm in high emotion or whatnot (or when I was first starting), I had to do a lot of bringing it back. Non-judgmental. It is what it is. I am what I am. I am where I am.

The only other thing I do is breathing exercises. I like to count "One in, one out, two in, two out." A new one that I was recently introduced to was focusing my breathing while imagining tracing my fingers. Breathe in, up the pinky, breathe out, down the pinky, breathe in, up the ring finger, breathe out, down the ring finger, etc through all ten fingers. It gives my brain something else to focus on while I'm doing my breathing.

[barbella]

Some days it is really hard to sit or lie there for 10 or 15 minutes. I think the valuable part is in just watching what your mind does. Some days it will be cooperative and calm down but other days it is all over the place. I agree with SoupDragon that it is a practice and that is what it requires - just keeping at it day after day. It can also be very helpful to find a sitting group/sangha to meditate with from time to time. They usually meet weekly and having the contact with others who do the same thing has been helpful for me.

One of the first things t taught me that was the beginnings of learning this skill, was getting down out of my head - the whole "find your feet" thing. She said something like travel down out of your head, down towards your feet, say hello to your shoulders, your arms, etc. (or something like that), check in as you go, see what feelings are there. That was like my 2nd or 3rd session I'd guess and I thought this woman is hokey but whatever I'll try it. The funny thing was it worked. I had already calmed down a lot before I even got to my feet. Subsequently when she sensed I was all up in my head, she'd just say "find your feet".

The mindfulness thing, for me anyway, is being aware of myself and recognizing when I'm starting to go all up in my head, and getting myself back down in my body. I have not figured it all out yet... as far as staying down in my body all the time. I don't know if that makes any sense.

I don't know if this can be called meditation or not, to me it is, but one of my hobbies is shamanic journeying to a consistent drumbeat. It's a way to access your deepest Self and the knowledge that is within you. It's very relaxing for me.

[Out There]

I use mindfulness and my psychologist also recommended the Calm Beat app. I've recently started Trauma Release Exercises ( TRE ) which I enjoy and find very helpful and relaxing and I have a session booked with a facilitator this Wednesday to learn more. I have a link posted to an article over in the Complex PTSD forum which talks about this with body sensing / mindful witnessing.

[Myrto]

Originally Posted by PinkFlamingo99

My psychologist recommended this one too.

I have downloaded Calm and found it helpful.
In the beginning you only "meditate" for about 6 minutes.
I've had trouble concentrating but the voice in the app reassures you that its all fine if you get distracted.
The first steps are free and then you have to pay a small fee (don't remember how much) if you want to use the next steps.

[BayBrony]

Its been almost a year since the OP. In that time mindfulness has become more and more a way of life for me and meditation has become a daily practice.

The central idea of mindfulness is awareness without judgment. I have found that best accessed through my senses. Say I am cold. Mindfulness says to experience the cold without labeling it as good or bad or planning what to do about it . so I will feel the cold air going into my lungs , the air stinging my cheeks, the tightening of my an muscles against the cold....I will experience those things and not judge them. The idea being a state of being is neither good nor bad ( here I reach my struggle with mindfulness BC eventually you'd better get yourself warm/fed/dry etc)

If I am experiencing emotion.I focus on what I feel in my body . we tend to get ourselves all worked up over what could happen, judging ourselves for our reactions etc. Instead I breathe and notice "my chest feels heavy" " my shoulders feel very tight " etc. I will scan my whole body with out judging the feelings and it usually calms me.

There is no need to sit to do this. I walk while I do it, or lie down, or sit in a comfy chair. The cross legged in an empty area idea comes from a more ascetic aspect of zen Buddhism.

I also use mantras timed to my breath . breath in "I am" breathe out "safe/peaceful/brave etc). I will simply repeat this to myself on every breath no matter what I am doing until I actually feel brave/calm/whatever. I find this much more effective than trying to sit still. For me the goal is tonempty my mind of the constant onslaught of criticism and judgment in my head so this works better for me than sitting and chanting etc.

[JJORANGE]

I was kind of like you in that the idea of just sitting there for 20 mins didn't sound all that exciting. Especially just on the floor trying to keep your back straight, hands on knees etc. .. but then I had a prof who explained that the way you do it isn't not all that strict.. it's what you get from is that's the commonality. So I made a few adjustments. I sat right next to a wall so my back would be straight but I could lean on the wall and truly relax, and I put my feet just out in front of my, not crossed as I have a hard time sitting like that for long periods of time, and my hands just relaxed however I feel like doing it at the time. And of course the first day start with 2 maybe 3 minutes and work your way up to 20 or 30. After about the 10th day I was sitting for 45 minutes completely in the zone.. and the time went by so quickly. Felt like i was only there for 5 minutes.

As well with your thoughts, I always thought to meditate properly you had to have no thoughts. Just a completely clear mind. Once I learned this is not true and its okay to let your mind wander, but as soon as you realize that's what you're doing.. bring your attention back to your breathing or a simple chant or saying etc the most common being "om". Another suggestion was to light a candle and focus on the flame ( yes you CAN mditate with your eye OPEN). I love doing that, it's just like sitting in front of a campfire.. so relaxing.

You wont see benefits right away either. . Took me a good week of doing it everyday before I really started looking foreward to my mediation sessions. There are a ton of apps for beginners using guided meditation if you have a hard time focusing. Sometimes I still use one if if having a hard time getting into the grove of it. Even just a noise app where you can listen to birds chirping or a waterfall etc.

I don't think it's possible to jump right into meditation. You must expose yourself to doing it in short increments of time.

I myself don't do very well becoming aware of my own body. It makes me more uncomfortable. I instead become aware of what is hapening around me. The feel of what I am laying or sitting upon, any smells in the room, the sounds of what comes through the window, the level of light doing the same.

I set up the space too. Aromatherapy sets my disired mood, I find something comfortable to curl up with, a sound of the day (I can pick up the spa, calm, nature music channels on the tv), and I even select something to hold (like a small stone, shell or feather).

As such I guess it is that which is external to me I am mediatating upon.

Sometimes I admit it only lasts 5min, other times I have fallen asleep. One thing I do is write a few words in my journal immediately afterwards.

But, please, something to note is that there is no right or wrong way. Don't go in with the expectation of success as you first start out.

I don't like to sit down to do mindfulness. I like to walk and do "mindful walking" instead. Started at my therapist's suggestion. Like others have said, I find it easier to focus on my 5 senses rather then my body.

[awkwardlyyours]

I'm not sure if this is useful but for what it's worth, this is my experience. I did a totally free 10-day silent meditation retreat (Vipassana Meditation) a few years ago -- the only way to learn this particular method is to do the course.

I did that a few years after dealing with severe depression (for which I'd been on meds). I know that I couldn't have done it when I was in the midst of that depression -- also, in the course application form, they specifically ask about mental health (including episodes, meds etc) and I'm guessing they filter based on it. That sort of makes sense since it was just incredibly intense -- a few people broke down and one of my room-mates who was a trained psychologist was pissed as heck that they were doing such intense stuff without much more screening for mental health or more importantly, having a psychologist or mental health professional on call.

So, it's a catch-22 off sorts -- meditating can help with mental health but there needs to be some baseline level of mental health I guess for it to work or at the very least, not make things noticeably worse. I've found this to be true even outside of the course boundaries (and the people running the course also advocate this) -- if one is too agitated or dealing with some seriously profound stuff (like severe depression or anxiety in my case), meditating is really really really not recommended. For instance, even now, when I'm in the throes of some intense bout of anxiety, I take a walk or do something else but the last thing I'll do is meditate.

This is because meditation, at least for me, makes me aware of all kinds of emotions that I'd otherwise successfully suppressed (or were very well compartmentalized as my therapist would say). So, sure, while meditation is supposed to give me the ability to observe this stuff, sometimes I just can't muster up enough of that strength to observe and instead I'm finding myself facing all this painful stuff in a way that feels overwhelming.

Having said all that though, doing that course and learning that technique has made all the difference to me. I don't consistently meditate for the stipulated 2 hours a day (and in fact, I sometimes deliberately take a break -- more on that below) but just having done that often enough, I know that things have shifted for me and I am aware of a process by which I can make profound mental / emotional shifts. That by itself is super helpful.

To answer your two specific questions --
1. The way in which I found that it makes a change is by just making me feel like I have a lot more space within me. That feeling of space opens up options, choices etc that I otherwise wouldn't notice. So, I don't as much feel that ragged, jagged, on-edge, constantly-intense feeling that I have otherwise (combination of anxiety, depression etc etc). But, again, the caveat, I can only do this or practice, when I have a baseline level of okay-ness.

2. Why not distract yourself? Sure, I do this often and I won't say that it doesn't work. The way though that meditation feels different to me is that it changes stuff for me at a deeper level than the distraction -- so, for instance, I could be relieved a bit of my anxiety about something by say surfing the web and at the end of it, I could even feel like I have a bit more space and can think more calmly. But, that feeling (both in terms of depth as well as the length of time it works) is likely to fade and also isn't as profoundly helpful to my ability to manage my emotions. I don't know how else to explain it -- it's not something I think can actually be explained (as frustrating as it is to use the cliche, it really feels like one of those things that has to be experienced for oneself).

To reiterate though, I'm one of those people who won't advocate meditation as a catch-all cure -- there's a New York Times article on it as well which argued that meditation, at times, can make things worse.

I've also found that it tends to add to my ability observe rather than feel stuff. When I started therapy then and was meditating pretty consistently, I realized that I couldn't actually summon up my emotions easily in therapy.

This was because as my therapist pointed out, one of the ways I'd dealt with stuff (what she called extreme abuse) growing up was to observe myself -- she said that most people do it at times but it had become my default mode of functioning (rather than feeling). And, in some ways, I think meditation strengthens this part of me -- super helpful a lot of the time but not always.

So, I actually quit meditating for a pretty long time (months) in order to show up and be emotionally present (at least to the extent I could) in therapy -- it was seriously a gawdawfully painful exercise but I think it has helped a great deal.

Also, my therapist had early on commented that I tended to use meditation to regulate my emotions -- for some reason, it stung me (mostly because it was true). So, I think that was another reason that I quit meditating for a while -- I wanted to figure out what was going on inside of me without sort of checking out of it, so to speak.

So, to sum up, I don't think meditation straight up makes a difference to my depression or anxiety -- as in, I can't say I'm cured of it by meditating. And, in fact sometimes, it actually makes it worse.

But, it does help in a lot of ways -- both broad and deep -- that have been truly beneficial.

Reading my post now, I'm not at all sure if this will give you the answers you were looking for

[NowhereUSA]

I do mindfulness a la DBT.

For me, it's about working to be present. You can meditate and be mindful while washing the dishes. For me, I like to go for a walk with music and practice letting my thoughts simply be what they are - like boxes on a conveyor belt that I don't have to unpack. If I'm walking, I'll notice the trees and the sky and the music. Perhaps I'll start to think on something I need to do and I'll note that I'm having a thought about something and then redirect my thoughts back to the trees. Other times I work on memorization. I'm religious so I'll memorize religious texts and consider the words and meditate on them, but other people do poetry or literary texts that matter to them.

[WrkNPrgress]

I particularly like the book "Full Catastrophe Living"