[SarahSweden]

I thought a bit more about T self-disclosure and I think there's a very fine line between self-disclosure that benefits therapy and self-disclosure that doesn´t. I have always been pro self-disclosure but in some cases I don´t think it´s exclusionary positive.

For me personally in my therapy I like getting to know a bit about my T but sometimes I can feel I don´t like what she has done, say during her teenage years. It´s nothing serious at all but it´s nothing I would do or recommend any other teenager to do. (I´m an adult now but anyway).

She tells me such things out of caring and to normalize things but values are something that can´t just be changed. I don´t think she needs me or demands me to approve of what she did, it´s not about that but about how I can keep a good image of her. For me it´s important that the T is a bit of a role model but I understand not many people are if you really scrutinize them.

I´m far away from feeling I have lost my faith in my T but I see the danger in self-disclosure.

Can self-disclosure be too much, has anyone in here lost faith in your T because of things she or he shared with you?

[stopdog]

What kind of faith are you talking about? For me, no. Mostly because I would not say I have faith in the woman to begin with.
Faith in that she actually went to school and got licensed - yes - I have that as I checked out her credentials.
Faith that she is better at life - never had that. I don't care what she does in her real life. It has no bearing on me at all.

[SarahSweden]

I mean faith both as in her credentials but also as in her living a fairly stable life, taking care of herself, having decent moral standards and so on. As I´m kind of a serious and strict person, I feel some of the things my T shared is a bit "outside my boundaries". They are not severe, criminal or anything like that but things I associate with immaturity, tomfoolishness, that´s not features I admire or like in people.

Everybody has their struggles and that´s a different thing I think, for example being divorced, feeling lonely and so on but acting against better judgment, playing silly and so on, self-disclosure about such stuff can make me think more than once about who this person "really is".

Originally Posted by stopdog

What kind of faith are you talking about? For me, no. Mostly because I would not say I have faith in the woman to begin with.
Faith in that she actually went to school and got licensed - yes - I have that as I checked out her credentials.
Faith that she is better at life - never had that.

[ScarletPimpernel]

It still sounds like you're looking for a reason to leave this T.

But... I also wouldn't like too much disclosure. A little is fine. I'd like to know she has a life outside her job. But I want/need her to remain the professional. For me, it's mostly due to my attachment. The less I know the better.

However, if I put my attachment issues aside, there's not a much a person can say to me that would make me judge them negatively. But... I saw one T btwn ex-T and current T for two weeks. She was talking to me about her hs reunion she was going to (I don't know why). She was bragging about how good she looks compared to her classmates and how she wanted to show off. That turned me off real quick. I told her she was being judgmental in my termination email.

So I guess I can understand.

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. No, I´m not looking for reasons to leave this T. I wouldn´t leave her for things she did when she was a teenager but I though feel her self-disclosure can make me see her partly differently.

Yes, this about bragging could be something you or others have specific values around and that may make you lose faith in a T because of that. I´m not saying this was the case for you but what I mean is that self-disclosure which shows a person´s values around issues like sex, money, politics and so on might make a client lose faith in their T.

I´m not there to judge her or to talk about her moral standards, I don´t know her that well to to that but if I get more courage, perhaps I´ll say something like "yes, I don´t judge you but I haven´t done something like that". But it depends on the situation, the things she have told me are fairly harmless, it´s more about having different moral standards.

Originally Posted by ScarletPimpernel

It still sounds like you're looking for a reason to leave this T.

But... I also wouldn't like too much disclosure. A little is fine. I'd like to know she has a life outside her job. But I want/need her to remain the professional. For me, it's mostly due to my attachment. The less I know the better.

However, if I put my attachment issues aside, there's not a much a person can say to me that would make me judge them negatively. But... I saw one T btwn ex-T and current T for two weeks. She was talking to me about her hs reunion she was going to (I don't know why). She was bragging about how good she looks compared to her classmates and how she wanted to show off. That turned me off real quick. I told her she was being judgmental in my termination email.

So I guess I can understand.

[Myrto]

Perhaps you feel that because she has done X in the past (since you've referred to stuff she did as a teenager), she can't possibly understand you because she's too different from you. Is that what you mean? Because that's what I thought about reading your posts. For instance, if my T told me that she had bullied people when she was a teenager, I would instantly lose my trust in her and start judging her because I hate bullies ( I was bullied as a teenager). But that would be quite a disclosure for her to make and I don't think it would be appropriate for her to do so. It would be too revealing, too personal. Do you think your therapist disclosed too much to the point that you just can't help but see her in a different light? I guess I want to know stuff about my T but not too much (such as: her political opinions).

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. I do think she can understand me even if we have had different kind of teenage times. What she told me is something a lot of people do when it comes to teenage love and it´s more that I feel she seemed to be childish and tomfoolish and that´s very far from how I was at the same age.

I won´t judge it but neither will I feel it was some kind of "cool thing" to do when being young. My T also said she regretted it in the very moment so it has more to do about character traits than low morals. As a T works with people with problems I think a T should be quite serious and humble before life. Not acting like a 20 year old when you´re in your 50s or older, wearing teenage clothes and so on. My T doesn´t do all those stuff, it´s more about how I generally look upon a T and what´s suitable self-disclosure and not.

I don´t think I now see my T in a different kind of light but more like a little less serious and less firm of character. At the same time, I know she have had "real" struggles as well and she hasn´t (yet) mentioned anything "low standard" when it comes to how she has lived her adult life.

Originally Posted by Myrto

Perhaps you feel that because she has done X in the past (since you've referred to stuff she did as a teenager), she can't possibly understand you because she's too different from you. Is that what you mean? Because that's what I thought about reading your posts. For instance, if my T told me that she had bullied people when she was a teenager, I would instantly lose my trust in her and start judging her because I hate bullies ( I was bullied as a teenager). But that would be quite a disclosure for her to make and I don't think it would be appropriate for her to do so. It would be too revealing, too personal. Do you think your therapist disclosed too much to the point that you just can't help but see her in a different light? I guess I want to know stuff about my T but not too much (such as: her political opinions).

[stopdog]

I am curious - why does it matter to you? How does it change how therapy is useful to you?

[atisketatasket]

I don't think any of mine have ever self-disclosed too much, though their levels of self-disclosure varied.

I think we'd have to know more context - what did you say that she responded to with this self-revelation? We were all young and foolish once.

[Lauliza]

I'm not sure what kinds of actions you're referring to since much of what teens do is immature and can be foolish. My opinion of people isn't affected much by knowing what they may have done as a teen, even professionals, since I know people often change dramatically from their teen to adult years. If it was something criminal or otherwise alarming, that might be different, however.

That said, I would not want my T to share much about themselves. I've never had a T share so much personal info that I've lost faith in them and I am glad for that. A T using their own behavior to "normalize" things isn't good therapy, in my opinion, since that assumes that because a T did something that makes it the norm, which it absolutely doesn't. It can absolutely change how a client sees them if it exposes very different set of values.

[Argonautomobile]

I get why that could be distressing. I'd be distressed if my T made disclosures that revealed him to be...just not my type of person, I guess. I'd have a hard time seeing him in the same light if, for instance, he told me he likes to shoot things in his spare time or doesn't think South Park is funny. Not that I go to him for his taste in television or opinion on hunting, so I guess it shouldn't matter, but I think the therapeutic relationship works best with (at least an assumption of) sameness.

I mean, if you've never really had a rapport with people who do/like/are X, why should that suddenly change the moment you walk into session?

Sorry your T's self-disclosures are getting you down.

[mostlylurking]

Hi Sarah, if I remember you can be very strict with yourself and kind of hard on yourself. Is it possible your T was revealing some things she did that were a little silly or foolish, and modeling what it looks like to forgive oneself for such things?

Edited to add: Not to imply that you have done silly or foolish things yourself. Just that if you did, it wouldn't be the end of the world; I thought that might be your T's message.

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. It´s quite spot on, "T not being my type of person", it´s sometimes how I feel about her even if I don´t know enough about her to say we´re totally different either. As you say, a feeling of sameness is important and my T has provided me with that too, telling me she lives by her own, she hasn´t got any kids and so on.

But as in many other cases, it´s the "bad stuff" that sticks, I think about the negative things she told me about her life. It´s a very interesting point you make, that you won´t have a report with a T who´s "too different" from you if you don´t hang out with, chat with such people in your ordinary life. That´s why I see the danger in self-disclosure by T:s, not just my T, that you get to know more and more about a T and finally you end up seeing someone with different moral standards, different values and so on.

My T has said several times that she kind of shows another way of being, as an example being less harsh, and it seems like she believes that her showing this will make me less harsh on myself. But that´s not the case, I don´t care about what she says, if being shown that other people are less harsh would be helpful end enough to be able to change, then I wouldn´t need therapy.

Originally Posted by Argonautomobile

I get why that could be distressing. I'd be distressed if my T made disclosures that revealed him to be...just not my type of person, I guess. I'd have a hard time seeing him in the same light if, for instance, he told me he likes to shoot things in his spare time or doesn't think South Park is funny. Not that I go to him for his taste in television or opinion on hunting, so I guess it shouldn't matter, but I think the therapeutic relationship works best with (at least an assumption of) sameness.

I mean, if you've never really had a rapport with people who do/like/are X, why should that suddenly change the moment you walk into session?

Sorry your T's self-disclosures are getting you down.

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. Interesting question. I don´t have a complete answer to that but spontaneously I have to like my T and trust her and if she presents things she has done or opinions she has that goes against mine, I lose respect of her. If self-disclosure is to be helpful it has to be about stuff the client can accept, not things that are far from the clients values. As an example that is.

By that I don´t mean I expect my T and I having the same values and opinions in everything but then it´s better for her not to self-disclose I think. It´s better not knowing like she had a lot of boyfriends when she was young (if she had, she hasn´t told me) as I look upon relationships in a different way and sees a person with a lot of short and unserious relationships as feeble-minded and childish. Two of the character traits I dislike the most in other people.

Originally Posted by stopdog

I am curious - why does it matter to you? How does it change how therapy is useful to you?

Originally Posted by stopdog

I am curious - why does it matter to you? How does it change how therapy is useful to you?

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. It has to do about things my T told me about relationships, nothing severe but it though tells me or gives me the impression that she has character traits I really don´t like. As you say, a T showing several different values I don´t comply to can make me see her differently and in another light. It also gets complicated when she tries to "transfer" traits she has on me to get me to for example get less anxiety. As an example - be less harsh as she is so I don´t have to be so hard om myself.

Such techniques don´t work at all on me!

Originally Posted by Lauliza

I'm not sure what kinds of actions you're referring to since much of what teens do is immature and can be foolish. My opinion of people isn't affected much by knowing what they may have done as a teen, even professionals, since I know people often change dramatically from their teen to adult years. If it was something criminal or otherwise alarming, that might be different, however.

That said, I would not want my T to share much about themselves. I've never had a T share so much personal info that I've lost faith in them and I am glad for that. A T using their own behavior to "normalize" things isn't good therapy, in my opinion, since that assumes that because a T did something that makes it the norm, which it absolutely doesn't. It can absolutely change how a client sees them if it exposes very different set of values.

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. Yes, absolutely, I think she thinks that´s what she does. The thing is is that I won´t listen to such things as listening won´t question my defenses. I mean, by hearing her telling a story of some mishap in her life won´t automatically make me feel that I should be less harsh on myself. As an example.

I don´t really understand this modelling thing, how that could help? I´m not being rude or anything, I just question this therapy technique.

Originally Posted by mostlylurking

Hi Sarah, if I remember you can be very strict with yourself and kind of hard on yourself. Is it possible your T was revealing some things she did that were a little silly or foolish, and modeling what it looks like to forgive oneself for such things?

Edited to add: Not to imply that you have done silly or foolish things yourself. Just that if you did, it wouldn't be the end of the world; I thought that might be your T's message.

[divine1966]

I don't understand judging adults by what they did as teens. Most teens do dumb crap. It's not atypical. What does it even matter what people do in teenage years?

[Waterbear]

I did a lot of things in my teens that are so far removed from me now as a person that I think someone would have difficulty seeing it was the same person if I told them. Does that mean that I am still that person, that the things I did define me? No it doesn't. I was just a troubled person who did some stupid and crazy things.

[divine1966]

I don't even think one needs to be troubled to do stupid stuff

[BayBrony]

I find this hard to understand as I very close to many people who think differently than me. My spouse for example is a gun person. I abhor guns. But my opinion is my opinion. My opinion of what is good or right is just that- my opinion, not an absolute.

Also everyone I know made at least one really bad choice as a teenager/young adult.. Most don't mind talking about them BC that was a long time ago and all young adults make bad choices..

[Waterbear]

I guess that depends on what it is really, but yeah, I see where you are coming from and I am inclined to agree, largely.

[Bipolarchic14]

I like Self disclosure because it makes her were human .