Couch 173: The Odiferous One

@Esme I agree with Echos. He posted using enough identifying information that you knew it was him and about you. For him to punish you for finding his untidy field work online is completely unethical. You crossed no boundaries by stumbling upon a public forum. I’m really sorry this happened. I’m pretty shocked by this story. Therapists tend to have supervisors and colleagues to bounce this stuff off of to avoid situations just like this one.

This 100%. I'm just very shocked that he would ask on a forum akin to wikipedia, instead of seeking supervision or consulting with other therapists.

In all honestly I would print screen the thread in case he later deletes it and denies it.

SE, it bums me out that your therapist did something that upset you and your immediate worry is that he will terminate you if you tell him that you're upset. You didn't do anything wrong. At all. I don't know if he would or he wouldn't terminate (although I certainly don't think he should). His ego and need for control seem quite formidable, so I don't know how he would respond if he felt embarrassed by your discovery. I just wonder how much that dynamic gets in the way of your therapy. I don't know how you can balance the fear and awe you seem to feel toward him with your need to be your true, complete self in therapy, with all the potential messiness that can entail.

Waking me up to tell me I smell bad in what I assume was an attempt to shame me into socially isolating myself. That felt really manipulative and even though I could see it, I still wondered if he was telling me the truth.

Yikes, NP, 2ex would tell me I smelled bad regularly. I drove myself nuts asking other people if this was right, even seeing a doctor, and every time someone looked at me funny I worried I smelled. Even now I worry about it, carry deodorant and body spray around, keep it in my purse and office and car, etc. At least he didn’t wake me up to tell me, though.

Seriously I am starting to think these people must have a textbook or share ideas online or something.

SE, wow. Wow at your T. WTF. He should be in supervision and in a local face to face peer consultation group. Not posting on an open public place like (I presume) Reddit.

Also I don't know your dx, but have long, long, long, long, felt his rigidity and withholding is so NOT helpful to you, a CSA survivor.

Thanks Jersey. Sometimes I worry that, in trying so hard to not be like my parents, I'm going too far in the other direction... I love my son with all my heart and so want the best for him....

Thank you for that. I guess I should talk w Lulabelle about this too but I think maybe it's hard on me particularly because at almost 20, he's a more independent person than I am at 56.

Or you could be proud of yourself for doing what parents are supposed to do - helping their children to become independent, letting him make his own mistakes without turning on him or interfering, letting him own his own life (both good and bad - there is no life without some bad unfortunately) without trying to make him feel guilty or incompetent.

I went to the session, and didn't say anything, but I am bewildered and disillusioned . He is very strict and sure-handed, and the reason I adore him anyway is that he presents himself as endlessly experienced with what I need. However, on Reddit it seemed more like he didn't know what to do with me not trusting him, and that his experience is actually with PTSD and prolonged exposure therapy , and that he is kind of winging it here reading papers and studying up. he talked about my trust in him disintegrating, and how reluctactant he was to depart from his training in any way. I don't dare post the whole thing here, bc I can just imagine a social media funhouse effect in which he reads abut me reading- it becomes kind of 21st century Shakespeare comedy at that point. I am so hurt. This T is such a North Star for me at this point, and I have overridden my own instincts 1000 times at his beckoning to trust him and tell him things I don't want to. I feel like I don't know who he is anymore, but I don't know if that is overreact due to CPTSD or if that is valid . I am close to 100 percent sure if I confront him with this, he will end the relationship bc he will feel like the T/client relationship is poisoned. I am really sure he would take responsibility and be very sad, but I can't overstate how tough he is on boundaries and following through- he is used to military and prison populations and he's decisive and welcomes the tough calls. What he isn't as good at is the nurturing supportive side, though he is very empathetic and sensitive to meaning. Somewhere down deep, I depend on him greatly. Not to be dramatic, but he definitely saved my life.

Thank you! I choose this!

His DX for me is CPTSD. The only other person I've seen is a psychiatrist who DX ocd, but I didn't tell him my background (just wanted ambien at that time).

Just leaving a bunch of hugs for all those who need them

Scarlet, Do you think that the DX of Wolff Parkinson White was super traumatic for him? It's athlete sudden death syndrome. I played a varsity sport in college, and they found heart patterns they didn't like and I had to wear a halter monitor for a few days. There DX was WPW at first, but thankfully it turned out to be AV Nodal entry - so not that risk of sudden death with no warning. I was in college so it didn't mess with my head as much as maybe it would have at an older age, but my mom was freaked.

I wonder if your husband got it in his head that feeling he could die any second, and now he can't put it aside? The other thing is not munchausen, but there's a syndrome in which you are REALLY scared, and being surrounded by the white coats is the only thing that stops the fear?

This is a really hard situation, and it can't go on and on. Something is going to happen that is bad, unless your husband takes a big risk to make something good happen by facing this in therapy, or with a cardiologist who can tell him he is really fine now etc?

I don't understand him trying to convince you to trust him. I don't have nearly the trauma background that you do, but overcoming childhood stuff for me has involved trying to hear my own voice and trust my own instincts. My T is consistently very warm and kind, and I still get the urge to run the other way sometimes. Instead of telling me to trust her, she waits, sits patiently, gives me a chance to doubt her, lets me run away and then come back if I need to. Over and over. Lots of flexibility and empathy and encouragement but never pressure. It's 99% show and 1% tell.

I also can't imagine my T ending the relationship over some kind of messiness that happens between us. I have said some things to my T that would probably cause your T to lose his mind (including calling her smug and implying she is a bad parent), and she's still right there. Deep healing demands deep trust with somebody who can demonstrate that they are worthy of trust and who is confident that they can use your trust in the service of your own improvement.

I don't think your hesitation here is a CPTSD overreaction, but even if it is, you deserve to be in a safe space where you can take apart that reaction and see which parts serve to keep you safe in your present life and which parts of the reaction you can start to set aside.

Part of me would LOVE to, but I am scared he will banish me.

He was the one in the wrong, not you

Is this a really recent/active thread? If it isn't and he used a throwaway account, there's a chance he wouldn't ever see your comment, which might be incredibly uncomfortable, knowing there's a ticking comment sitting there and not know when or if it will go off.

I agree with this. I have issues with trusting my T, particularly because of what happened with ex-MC (and a bit with ex-T). But my T seems patient with me and, particularly in the past few months, has been giving me the reassurance I need. Like, when we had the conflict about the stone a few months ago, and I worried he'd kick me out over that or for some things I said/reactions I had. He told me that even if I say something that bothers him or makes him uncomfortable, he'd never just get rid of me--that we'd talk about it and work through it (the one exception being if I physically threatened him, but I assured him that I'd never threatened anyone in my life). And letting me know that if anything gets close to bothering him (like, if I were to e-mail him too much), he'd tell me early on, not let it get to the point that he's angry or that it's the last straw, so to speak. He's vowed to be a "straight shooter" with me, which at times can be difficult because I'm not used to that from people, but which I also appreciate in some ways.

I feel like a T saying "trust me" puts it all on the client. Like, "Why can't you trust me?" Like it's something the client is doing wrong, a failing in them. When many of us who see T's have big trust issues and abandonment fears for various reasons. It's not easy for us to trust people, especially authority figures. It's like they need to show they're trustworthy and reassure us in other ways, not just say "trust me." (Pretty sure my T, for all of his faults, has never said those words to me, and I'd be bothered if he did.)

I don't think he will see it that way. I don't think he will believe either one of us is in the wrong, but just that the premise is compromised.

One thing that is eyeopening is the extent of how much I depend on M. I had not realized how much of a bearing wall his presence in my life has become. My boyfriend is perceptive, and he is increasing overprotective about therapy- he thinks it's way too much tough love and not enough love and I was better before I tried it. To me though, I have learned about myself and come to terms with the truth in a way I could not have without M, and he is my companion on a very dark journey. I don't want to be separated from him for any reason, and that right there doesn't seem healthy.

I wouldn't actually dare comment on there. Yes, it was from March, but I just saw it yesterday. I think it was about the time I put a thread about ghosting therapy on here . We really had a turbulent period, but it feels like a violation of some kind to find that on Reddit of all places. Part of me cherishes the name he used, bc it shows he does think of me and cared about me, but it seems like such a waste of energy. The irony is all I wanted to know was that he did still care when I left the room. Instead of admitting he did, he wrote on Reddit.

At least you got your answer there SE that his care does not stop when you close the door, like you were perceiving. I think he is wrong when he has not shown and told you that. Probably that could have avoided the whole need posting about it on Reddit. I can't believe still he did it though. I could not go on without addressing it with him. But I would first carefully think how to do it.

I do feel this way- just exactly what you wrote. Part of me is so relieved he is not as indifferent as he pretends. Another part of me feels like he has been dishonest with me about his authority- just basically not real with me. I have stretched myself to trust in him so far beyond my comfort level. Since the date of that post ironically, he has doubled down on the neutral stance and not disclosing much. I wish he could take off the mask and we could just have a conversation that's genuine, more genuine on his side.

SE, I feel for you in this horrible situation. Honestly, though, can you trust the judgement of a mh professional who turns to reddit for advice?


I totally understand your need to stay the course with him, despite these deep wounds to your therapy process. At the same time, I'm not so sure there's any way to come back from therapy with such a tight frame when that frame is obliterated in such a gross manner unless you talk to him about it.

My own therapy is nothing like yours in terms of the frame, but ever since the illusion was shattered, I have not been able to regain any footing. My therapist is holding things back, something changed, but she won't tell me what. If I came across something similar, I would totally take it to her and have it out. Holding this kind of thing in is toxic.


I almost wondered if someone close to you, not your therapist, had written that post, but since it was so long ago, maybe it really was him. That's just so sad and disturbing if it's the case.

Thanks Jersey I think it helps that I know what it's like to be a client.