Motivation

Also, because the scores/grades I get directly affect my independence, perspective, lifestyle and set limitations. If I get bad scores and my grants don't get funded, I won't be able to do the project I dreamed up and am so interested in, and won't be able to do as I please in my lifestyle because I don't have the money for it. That's pretty much about it for me, not very emotional, more practical.

For the students in general, I believe many get reassured and motivated by grades in a similar way people do in therapy. They associate self-worth with that feedback. Maybe, in some cases, because positive feedback was lacking in early life, and they can anticipate negative feedback (grades) because that is what they got mostly and so it feels more familiar.

I get the practical for the most part.
I am puzzled by the emotional.
I used grades as the example (there are many many more for me) because of the time of year - I am about to be a judge for students seeking grade change appeals in a month and I am already getting anxious inquiries.

I am not clearly describing what I have been trying to explain.

Xynesthesia, you describe many things in the plus column regarding your addictions and success in relationships. Your successes alone evade many people.

I divide the motivation issue in at least a couple of categories: the drudgery maintenance tasks and duties, paying bills, laundry, maintaining a family business. I often require outside cues and deadlines, like tax requirements or running low on clothes to wear.

Then there is my optional creative work. I do best when I find the hook for these projects, so passion drives me. The "shoulds," all the externals about my vanity, competitiveness, need for approval etc. are irrelevant on my best projects. The work recruits me.

Thanks missbella. I do realize that the way I talk about my challenges and dealing with them may not invite many people to relate/respond, but that is not a problem for me because I would not find more value in emphasizing pain more or complaining (and I don't often feel intense emotional pain other than anxiety) - I think this is just my authentic personality and how I also behave in everyday life. I do get more emotionally vulnerable with close friends and partners but that's about it, I don't have the desire to do that with anyone else. Again, part of why talk therapy did not (and would not) work for me in similar ways it does for many people. I did try to go at great length into my frustrations and struggles on another online forum in the past, in an addiction recovery community, and it was helpful back then but became excessive and people started to relate to me in ways that I did not find compatible and desired, so just stopped doing that style of communication.

On the "successes" - I really don't think my successes are above average by any means relative to my background, education, environment etc. I have been surrounded by people with very successful careers in my whole life and, if anything, that's exactly why I struggle with my motivation and patterns of getting things done, because many others around me seem way more consistent with it and I am in a system that pretty much expects it as well. That's exactly what I struggle to use as motivation, because I don't tend to feel inspired by external/conventional rewards to the extent I see from my peers. But, so far, I have chosen to still be part of those systems (e.g. academia) and so I keenly sense the discrepancies between that system and my own natural ways. I am well aware that many academics struggle in similar ways and many people actually leave academia for exactly this reason. I have considered that on/off throughout my career but am still in it. Just having a period currently when I am seriously evaluating, once again, how far I want to remain in all this. But then all the realistic and suitable work alternatives I can come up with, e.g. becoming 100% self-employed (I already have a part-time business) would not elude the motivation issue either, I think. I am also somewhat scared to give up my job security completely as well. So this is basically it. I am really fine with my personal life, relationships etc and don't think I should change anything significantly in those areas, have built a lifestyle for myself over the years that, I feel, is a very good fit, not overwhelming at all and can be quite rewarding. So it's basically a career dilemma. Perhaps I tend to have these intense dilemmas also because I have focused too much of my energies on my career. I actually use this message board to take short breaks from work most of the time. I have considered taking some time off work but it's not easy at this point because I have built up so many responsibilities in the past ~10 years.

As to regular self-care stuff, I actually tend to be quite good and consistent about that now (not so much when younger and especially while drinking heavily) and not obsessive/compulsive at all. I have a schedule for it but don't mind at all skipping non-essential parts at times when I don't feel like it. And don't have issues managing maintenance tasks like paying bills, taxes, keeping track of finances or other basic admin stuff, I am quite organized and don't wait for motivation to deal with that stuff, I just do it in a machine-like manner mostly.

So it is primarily around work/career for me and the existential angst I am prone to (not much about basics, more relating to my contributions and own satisfaction with what I do in my life). I guess it is because these have been the strongest focus of most of my life so far and sometimes borders on the addictive... no wonder I never feel it is enough, or good enough, and then I blame my motivation/effort when the outcome does not stand up to what I want it to be. I know very well this is a very ordinary problem for high-achiever types of people, as I said I have been surrounded by people like that in my whole life. Why I sometimes feel I should take a break, at least a sabbatical or something, not just from work but from my usual communities as well. This is also, in part, why I like a forum like this - so much more diversity than in my typical direct 3D life. I thing it would do some good for me to actually engage in other areas of society directly much more, e.g. do more volunteer work and socialize in different ways from what I am used to - to see it directly instead of just studying from a distance and participating in a wishy-washy way. I used to go to addiction recovery meetings but stopped even those a while ago.

I just realize that perhaps some members here talk about similar challenges to mine about communities, participation and contributions...

You mentioned having a schedule-is that for sleep too?

It's interesting that you may have already been using some of these strategies. I can really relate to the BP II stuff and am looking to create a schedule and consistency on my own. Right now I don't adhere to a schedule for sleep or work or eating or anything really. I work a lot too, and my hours revolve around my responsibilities and team based work rather than a schedule.

My psychiatrist mentioned one of those light boxes too. Have you ever tried one?

Psychotherapy for Bipolar II Disorder: The Role of Interpersonal and Social Rhythm Therapy

Ah, forget about bpII diagnosis. I learned to not care about them anymore (for me) when it comes to wellness. After therapy and meds and years of self-help, I think these life strategies as we are discussing here can make the difference. Too bad I learned to late.

Aloe Bud - self-care companion

Not sure if that app is doable. I would be interested in how you managed to implement more schedule and structure in your day to day life.

I don't know

Thanks, octoberful! I really relate to most of the article you posted, maybe not that much to the emotional dysregulation/reactivity part (perhaps because I am quite good at detaching at will and ignoring the fluctuations) but the rest is fairly accurate. Including the recommended strategies - I have indeed tried many of those things and more. The problem usually for me, like with most things that tend to be problematic in my life, is consistent discipline. I do think that the discipline issue is partially related to the inherent dynamic of this BP II-ish pattern, i.e. not wanting to follow the recommended treatment because those hypomanic type states with high energy, motivation and focus feel very pleasant and are often extremely productive without actually becoming too extreme and disruptive (like full-blown mania would be). I definitely agree it is not easy to convince me to follow a good routine in all areas of life.

I do try to schedule sleep and eating as well but I often mess up because I just give in to what I feel like doing in the moment. My sleep and eating schedule is not too bad these days though and I don't want to over-regulate because (1) I had an eating disorder in the past and (2) I got hooked on the darn alcohol in my early 30's exactly because I wanted to regulate my sleep consciously with alcohol while working very hectic and unhealthy schedules.

That mood tracking can be very useful as well because it is easy to lose a sense of reality among all the different states while in them - why I tried journaling in the past. Again, my issue is consistency and keeping it up. Actually even re-reading my posts on a thread like this can be quite helpful.

A good part of my discipline problems, in addiction to what comes from these internal states of motivation, is something else I wrote about at times on other people's threads. Not having learned a good discipline in childhood because there was no one who would enforce it or keep track of it, like many parents do with their kids. Mine mostly let me do whatever I wanted and when I wanted, very little control or checking on my school work, for example. My parents were pretty responsible people but I guess they did not feel a need because I was doing fine for the most part simply just following my own natural ways and I was a pretty well-behaved kid, no extremes or difficult behaviors that would have presented concern back then. Except the eating disorder maybe, but I don't think my parents had an understanding of that and I was still doing generally above average on most ordinary tasks and my parents were not really observant or versed in deeper psychology. So that's a childhood experience component for me. I really think the bipolar-ish pattern is biology/physiology for the most part - it runs in my family and I am still one of the luckiest cases.

You see, the discipline and consistency issues are exactly why I always say I would have liked to have a no-BS, challenging and reasonably tough therapist. I know those things work really well for me because it's what I was lacking as a kid and rarely found in relationships as an adult to the level of my liking. But it is not easy to find someone who does that really well and respectfully (and not out of insecurity-based aggression, which is more common and that I refuse to engage with), especially in the therapy biz. If I was convinced I found someone like that, I would maybe give it a try again. I expected my last T to be that way more but he turned out much more soft and laissez-faire. I do tend to really like collaborating with people who have stellar discipline and effort, are no-nonsense, BS-resistant, direct and goal-oriented - I think because I have those values as well but not enough of the consistency. That can serve as a very effective inspiring force for me. But perhaps it is also true that they represent my hypomanic ideals and those states are... well, not truly sustainable. I do know a bunch of people who kept up what seemed that level of discipline and effort for many years when younger and got very burned-out by middle age. I actually had a string of romantic partners (usually men 15-20+ years older than me) like that also in my 20s and 30s. In a large part, I know they got drawn to me and developed quite deep relationships with me because it was something different, a pleasant and refreshing break from the hamster wheel, and we had enough common basic values for the relationships to work well. I know that when I fantasize about finding a therapist with that style, I feel nostalgic about those times and wish them back. I now have a very nice romantic partner who is much more mature and balanced and sometimes I do find myself wishing it was more like one of those guys from my past, but I know he is more healthy for me at this stage of my life.

I can write more about schedule sometime later. I do agree that the diagnosis does not matter much - I don't mind it because I find the descriptions useful, but what matters truly is the strategy to deal with it and a lot of that is highly practical.

I guess I have a form of Bipolar which, for me, mostly manifests in hypomanic and mixed states... very rarely pure depression, unless I drink alcohol and am in acute withdrawal. Perhaps it is not bipolar at all.

Anyone tends to have static electricity when you touch a door knob or even your own chair or desk? I am a neuroscientist and even I, with all of my knowledge, don't understand well why I have this static skin or some of my cycles with being so static. It almost makes me avoid random touch with people.

Speaking of scheduling though - I am just breaking one, being up and posting after 2am. Most of the scheduling comes from deadlines outside of my control - being a professor plus having my private business helps as I need to prepare talks both locally and for conferences, need to submit grant applications to fund my research and part of my salary, need to maintain and improve my social media and other communications. I get private clients for my private business mostly via referrals and based on online activity (it is mostly consulting and other writing), and need to schedule basic self-care appointments like having my hair colored/cut, nails, waxes, you know... not because my clients expect it, but I expect it of myself. I need to schedule these otherwise I will not do them, will go on long breaks of self-neglect and then shame and avoidance.

Paying bills and other financial planning is somehow much easier and effortless for me, so that is good. But the physical self-care...

You would never tell my struggles by my appearance because I over-compensate. But it is a constant challenge and if I don't schedule those self-care appointments, they never happen. Same for doctors.

I feel like this too... and as stupid as it is, it's why when T was in my life, even if we didn't talk, I felt more motivated. Now I'm back to old patterns.... and just so hard to motivate for anything that I want out of life. I think it, dream it but I never can actually do it