Issue in my BPD group-- what do you guys think?

Trigger icon applied for mention of SI

As some of you may know, I go to a group for women with borderline personality disorder. It is run by a facilitator who is in recovery from the disorder. We meet every other week.

Well, before I started the group, I thought that a lot of the women would be self-injurers. Well, counting the facilitator (who counts herself as part of the group of course), there are NO active SI'ers except for me. Actually, no one is even a past SI'er besdies the facilitator and one or two of the woman tried it in the past, but it really wasn't their thing.

I have established a strong connection with the facilitator. We are alike in many ways and she has acknowledged a reciprocal connection. This is kinda weird for me cause... she's a woman! But it works. We have met individually on the weekend to discuss my SI and other things-- and I have called her on one occasion when I felt out of control. We keep in touch by email, too.

The group is aware that my main symptoms is SI and that is what have been struggling with to an overwhelming extent for a long time now. So I have spoken about my SI on several occasions.

I have noticed that within this group, everyone gets triggered by everything. That makes it difficult. I am not the type of person who gets easily triggered. Basically, I just trigger myself.

Well, last night in group, one member told us that she cut over the weekend. This is someone who never had cutting as a symptom-- she only tried it once or twice when she was younger, but never continued because she does not have a high tolerance for pain.

I immediately began to feel guilty because although I know that she is responsible for her own behavior, my accounts of cutting are possibly what drove her towards that decision of destructive behavior.

When I spoke with the facilitator about this afterwards, she agreed that it was the other member's responsibility for her own behaviors-- she also agreed that when I talk about SI that could fuel the ideas for other people because especially in BPD, people tend to mimick the behaviors of others.

The facilitator told me that she wants to keep everyone in group safe and that I should possibly hold off on talking to about my SI in group for awhile-- but she offered herself to me completely and said that I could call, email, and talk with any time I want about my SI.

What do you guys think about this?

I'm not sure what to do. I really like the facilitator and I connect with her very much. I don't think that it is fair to censor myself. This is why I didn't want to get into a group situation to begin with. I am very open and although I am sensitive to the needs of others, that's the point of group process-- you put something out there and then the group deals with out it made them feel. Like T said, "you are not their therapist-- why can't you say what you want?" (He said this yesterday in our session before group, so he doesn't know what happened yet."

I don't think I relate well to the women in the group. I mean, our connectionexists by the fact that we have many similar experiences.... however, I never feel as though I can fully relate. Maybe it doesn't even matter that I can't discuss my SI because no one in the group really gets it anyway? What is the point of discussing my SI in the group? What is the point of going to the group?

yeah, i dunno pink - if cutting is the thing you are there mainly to deal with and they can't even relate to that then maybe being in the group is not helpful if you have to censor yourserlf. maybe you can just stay in contact with the woman.

on the other hand, if the group offers you a sense of community even if you don't fully connect with the others, than maybe it is worth it?

=( ((((((((((pink))))))))))

Hmm....I don't know. It's possible that 'rubbed off' on that other person, but it's also possible that it had nothing to do with you. Hard to tell for sure.

It sounds like the group is helping somewhat, especially the facilitator. Does that facilitator have any other BPD groups you could attend?

Maybe hold off on talking about your SI at group for a few weeks, and just discuss that in your individual therapy sessions.

Hey Pink,

I attended a weekly DBT group for about a year. It was all females, and we were all cutters, some more obvious than others. I remember if anyone had "fresh" visible cuts, or someone commented openly about same, the therapist would boot said "person (s)" out for that session.

Wonder if its common to be treated this way in BPD/DBT groups? Hope we can find some answers!

The only thing is this is a support group-- not a therapy group-- so the "leader" is really like a member of the group because she has BPD herself. So we don't have any rules such as that. She is very understanding and I guess wants to keep all members safe, but I just don't think that is fair to be censored. If someone talks about drinking alcohol because that is their destructive behavior, it is my decision if I decide, "Oh that sounds great-- I'll try getting drunk now." I would expect that person to stop talking about the drinking just because I heard about it and then tried it.

Have you outright asked the other woman whether your talking helped lead to her behavior? You all are in the dark, talking to one another when neither of you know what the person with the "problem" thinks/feels.

I would discuss this issue with the group, not let the leader "decide" for you or even you decide for yourself without their being part of it. Group is group; with most groups I've been in there's a rule you're not supposed to have side relationships for this reason, it gets the group all unbalanced.

Wow Pink. This is intense stuff.

Well if it was a therapy group, I'd say definitely no on the censoring. I don't have any experience with support groups though. I would think it would be somewhat isolating to constantly censor yourself. I like Perna's suggestion that you just ask the group what they think. Hopefully they could handle at least addressing the issue.

Sidony

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pinksoil said:
The group is aware that my main symptoms is SI

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">Pinksoil, since your main symptom of BPD is SI, I wonder if a group for SI would be a better fit? Then you wouldn't have the ethical dilemma of whether to censor yourself or risk others being triggered. If you were in an SI group, you might get more support for dealing with that and not have to feel like tiptoeing around the issue.

I have not had group therapy but I know that when I have been in couples therapy with my H and in family therapy with my H and my girls, I cannot just say anything as I might in individual. There is a different dynamic and yes, some censorship must occur, but it is for the greater good. It is not all about "me" when I am with others in therapy.

I don't know how it works in a support group. It might be good to clarify with the group and its leader to see if it is OK to just let any thoughts and feelings out, as one might in individual therapy.

Really thought provoking question.

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sunrise said:
Pinksoil, since your main symptom of BPD is SI, I wonder if a group for SI would be a better fit?

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I wish there was one. That's part of the problem of SI-- since it is a symptom, a coping skill, but not an actual disorder, rarely do you find a group devoted solely to this issue. Such a program exists (The Safe Program) but I'm not traveling to Chicago or Texas, or whever they are, at this point! It is also a highly stigmatized issue that people tend ot be afraid to talk about openly. Because of this it is one of my personal endeavors to run self-injury therapy groups for self-injurers alone, and ones for SI'ers and their family members-- I hope to do this when I am a psychologist and (hopefully) not self-injurying anymore. There is a great need for this type of help.

Ok.

In the SAFE program which is specifically for SI, they are not allowed to talk about SI. They talk about the feelings, the needs, etc associated with the behavior, but they do not talk about the behavior.

Why? For a couple of reasons. (1) there is some literature showing that SI can be "learned" and that is how/why the majority of teens today are starting. Their friends SI, so they try. While the "learned" type of SI is still a mental health problem, it is not necessarily associated with a mental illness. (2) Some people talk about SI as "bragging" or as trying to "impress people with how much they are hurting." (3) Some believe that once the SI has occured, the only thing that should be discussed is the feelings associated with it, not the act. Because the act has occurred and it should not be reinforced.

Personally, I think if you are talking about your behavior, it is probably not appropiate in that group. If you are talking about your feelings, etc then it is appropiate.

I strictly talk about my feelings. I would never go in and say, "Look what I did last night!!" or describe a cutting episode, etc. The facilitator specifically told me that if I was talking about the actual behavior, then the conversation would have been redirected a long time ago. I'm not interested in talking about the behavior to anyone except my therapist and my journal. I still to talking about what the impulses are like, what the feelings are afterwards, etc.

(((Pinksoil)))

If this is a support group then I think that you should be able to discuss your feelings. Otherwise, what's the point?

Can you form a separate relationship with the group leader?

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hope to do this when I am a psychologist

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Why don't you start a group now?

Peace

Pink-

There is a group called Self Mutilaators Anonymous or SMA (I hate the name!)

They have an online group session on Monday nights @ http://selfmutilatorsanonymous.org/?page_id=7

They also have group meeting in different states @ http://selfmutilatorsanonymous.org/?page_id=8

I have attended the online meeting before because I also could not travel to the SAFE program even though my T really thought I need to.

Hope this helps! I have gone 8 weeks without cutting so far and am really happy about it. Best wishes.

insecurity

<font color="green">[b]Just a thought, Pink, but perhaps the other person have been cutting but secretly. Perhaps your words gave her the courage to speak out. You know as well as I that most cutters go to great extremes to hide their cutting. Until it is out in the open I don't think there is much chance for it to heal.

Pink, I think meetup.com has a self injury support group. Try looking there.

Also, I think you just found your career speciality and overcoming SI will enable you to help others. You can do it!

It is possible the discussion led the other woman to SI, but she needs to gain awareness on that so why not discuss the issue next time and see where it goes.