in terms of sexual attractiveness, just how horrible is it to be fat?

So D. invited me to spend several days in New England with him, to enjoy the Autumn. I have not been to New England for ages and would love to go. I even have a free ticket because my AmEx gives me Delta miles with every purchase. That is actually an important consideration since I am on a tight budget otherwise. I will post separately with a question on how to handle jet lag.

I think I have overblown the issue of how I look (fat). He tells me how much he misses me - why would he if he had a negative disposition towards me? I think Robert is right, D. does not care. He told me that if it is more convenient for me to pay for reservations with my credit card, he will just give me cash upon arrival, and did not mention my reserving TWO rooms, so I assume (a reasonable assumption?) that he plans for us to stay together - nor does he have money (I know it) for separate accommodations. I think he thinks it is beyond the obvious, and there is just one silly little hammy who questions everything and is unsure of herself. Right?

I do not want though to make it appear that the content of our correspondence and Skype communication is predominantly romantic. Quite the obvious, it is predominantly not. And, we email around 3AM in Europe and I always tell him that I worry that he is still not asleep, so he emails me right before going to bed. This clearly shows that he continues to live without his wife, not that I care.

bad feeling about this. if you can't be honest about your financial situation with him, should you be doing all this? it's not a trivial trip for you. it's not like he's paying for it. you wanna see trees, drive up to montecito. honestly, I am all for women's lib and equality - sister, I wrote the book - but I have had enough experience with reunions over the years that I would not invest this much in it. I keep hearing you make "i'm independent, it doesn't matter what his situation is" excuses for him. I am all too familiar with that stance. being in a r/s is about being vulnerable. who is this tough hamster-bamster? I don't believe her. I believe a smart gentle and caring h-b who had an H who wasn't the mate she deserved. you know the saying, think globally, but act l0cally. did you read scorpiosis's bit under r/s & communications? she met 25 online dates, only liked 3! but found a partner. it's do-able, but it's a job, not for the faint of heart. I rejoined mensa tonite, I don't even know if the local chapter is that active, but hopefully it's a filter. see you inspire me

Wow, Mensa! I would not pass the tests now. For some reasons, either the lack of mania or some slowness that (my p-doc tells me) Lithium brings about, but I no longer do well on intelligence-related tests. Like, a huge difference. I have a thread on it. See what you think.

neither could I, fortunately they saved my old scores! I figure now that i'm not as hyper, maybe I can show up at stuff and not act like such a dork.

I like this....Good post....

To the poster, I love how candid you are...If I were in this situation, I would probably tell him about my weight...Or I would show him on skype...I would only do that because for me personally, I would probably be hurt if he saw me and I saw disappointment on his face when he saw me up close....For me, the rejection, if there would be any, would be easier to take over skype versus in person...Tell him up front.... If your weight bothers you, work on loosing it. Or if you are working on it, continue to work on it. If your weight doesn't bother you, claim it...

I'm a big girl always have been. I have never had trouble dating or with sex. I will say that depending on your size there are certain positions that are not advised. I own my size. I leave it up to my hubby as to whether the lights are on/off. My hubby is a small guy and really never dated a big girl before so wasn't sure if he'd be ok. He now swears if anything ever happens to me he'll never give a skinny girl the time of day again. He loves every inch of me. There are times I'll wake up and he'll have pulled the covers off of me and he'll just be watching me sleep(that still creeps me out a little). He said a lot of his attraction to me is how confident I am. I'm not always asking "Am I pretty?" "How does this make me look?" I'm just me and I accept me! Anyone who doesn't can eat a d*** I've always accepted the fact that weight matters to some people. Those people don't need to bother with me. To those that care more about substance over style or find fat beautiful I'm their girl! I guess the point is you have to be comfortable with you. Know that you are beautiful no matter what. Anyone that tells you otherwise, well you just point them to me and I'll sort their hash.

What a terrific post! Thank you!

So he Skyped me when I was naked straight out of the shower. I positioned myself in front of the camera in such a way that only my naked shoulders were visible but not below. My shoulders are just a tad fat. My hair was wet. I started pushing my hair back saying out loud that it is in the way. He said: "No, the hair and everything are beautiful". At this point I think I will officially stop obsessing and accept that he will like me the way I am. Instead of obsessing, I will spend my energy working on self-acceptance and confidence along the lines you suggest. Thanks again .

A new round.

He skyped me and could not see my face well - it was too dark. I moved to another chair. He saw my waistline (which was at its best, in a BLACK top) and said that now he is noticing just how much weight I have gained. I pointed to Zyprexa, and he gave me a lecture about the importance of diet, diet, and nothing but diet. I am not annoyed, I am amused. But clearly I do have an issue here. Oh well. And I was gonna cook him such great food when he comes - not sure I remain equally motivated. Oh well. We will live through that.

So he saw my belly on Skype. So the situation is pretty bad - now he wants me to lose weight. I told him that I already do not eat cakes etc. and it still does not work. I am very cross at him. I see his point - he has his own 5-7 extra kilos and that is due to age - when he was young, he could eat any amount of food and remain basically weightless, but not anymore (slowed metabolism), so he limits himself by suppressing the feeling of hunger. I do not want to suppress my feeling of hunger, I think it is a physiological feeling that tells me to eat. He thinks that had he not been suppressing his feeling of hunger, he would have weighed WAY MORE. Of course, there is no way to test it. He is not read up on obesity research (like - nill). I told him that he is lucky he is not taking Zyprexa (half of my extra weight was piled up quickly while on Zyprexa) he prescribes it. He told me that I should understand that Zyprexa itself has no calories. It is the appetite that Zyprexa boosts and the appetite can be curbed by will power. If you are hungry, find some interesting, consuming work to do. I explained that I have to have lunch at work, I cannot work otherwise. He told me that if he waits for 15 minutes, the pangs of hunger subside and do not come back for another two hours. He basically eats some yogurt in the morning and then has a full meal at night, with virtually nothing in-between. I inquired whether he knows it that bp people are advised not just to sleep regularly, but to eat regularly, and not just regularly but at the same time each day. He dodged his answer. I wrote to him so that he would know (he was not aware of it) that I had an ED when I was young, that it was induced by my dad and his friend's encouraging me to diet whereas I looked perfectly fine at that time and did not need it, that I am in remission, and that I want to remain in remission and have a good relationship with food for the second half of my life. I thought that after receiving such a letter he would shut up. I was wrong. He was otherwise very nice, and I am more amused than cross, but still, what ignorance and insensitivity. Should I bombard him with research? I doubt. He mentions that he eat good things such as olive oil, salmon, green salad, etc., and I said that I already do that, and it DOES NOT HELP. I summed up that I ALREADY eat all the good thing he can even think of and not eat all the so called empty calories and it DOES NOT HELP. Instead of saying something reassuring he said "Well then it is probably a matter of quantity". He is probably right - I do not always apply portion control, but it is usually on foods that are low calorie to begin with. Further, I told him (I just got my blood test results) that obviously everything that I am doing is already right because my cholesterol is BELOW the norm, blood pressure below the norm, fasting glucose at the very bottom of the normal range, what else can I do? He still talks about abstaining from eating as the only way to burn fat. I wrote to him that I saw that I am offending his esthetic sensibilities (he mentioned how good I used to look) and therefore made an appointment with my endocrinologist who will probably put me on Metformin, which will help me lose weight. Instead of appreciating me, which I think would be appropriate, and instead of telling me something along the lines of how good I am in whatever shape and form I am and that I should not worry, he said that he does not believe in medication. Incidentally, he does not know what metformin is. Metformin, I checked on Wiki, was invented like in the 1920s, so I cannot believe he is so ignorant. Of course, he is the doctor of the psyche, but still. Well maybe they are more specialized in Europe... I dunno. That is the whole story.

I described how my dad and his wife and friend caused my eating disorder (ED) - http://forums.psychcentral.com/showthread.php?t=237902

D. showed knowledge of ED. He mentioned purging, laxatives, diuretics, eating a fridgeful of stuff (bulimia), distorted perception of fatness or lack thereof (anorexia). I told him how I saw anorexics being fed through the nose when I was inpatient. So it is not that he is completely ignorant of ED, he somehow does not realize that he should not be triggering me.

I have my endocrinologist appointment on Aug 1. I am just gonna tell her everything. I will also tell her that I think I have hypoglycemia because if I miss a meal I start feeling lightheaded. I wonder what she will say about his theory of skipping lunch or eating (this is verbatim) "one leaf of salad plus a few berries plus a glass of juice". And then I will relate to him my endocrinologist's advice as the final word.

At this point I am not interested in sleeping with him anymore, but this might change.

Oh, he does not exercise - he just runs around a lot living in a European city without a car. So he tells me that he was someplace without an elevator and how he all of a sudden easily climbed 5 floors. I told him that my office is on the 3rd floor and when I am alone, I always take the stairs and also do so easily, while my thin Asian American co-workers take the elevator, and I envy their genetics. Again he did not respond with anything reassuring. Yikes.

I um.. well... geez.... I'm trying to come up with something polite and educated to say about him .... The only words that keep swirling in my head are ....

Hes a complete JACKASS !

((( Hugs )))

I would say richard head. when I took metformin, I finally got normal weight loss results - ie, I actually GOT some results! My GP took me off it because I was getting bad test results - kidney or liver, I don't remember - but he mentioned recently that that's what the Doctors / Medical Weight Loss Centers give their clients.

I figure, as a first generation Italian-American, I'm only here today because my IMMEDIATE ancestors survived an uncertain food supply. I'm one heck of an efficient fat storer.

P.s. His comment about Zyprexa not having any calories? would have had me slamming down the phone at his demeaning hostility. Or shoving the phone up his patootie. Really? I mean, really? Oh I did not know that. A- sshat.

no, he was not hostile, he was condescending, it was like "sweetie (not he did not call me sweetie but it was like that) but you understand that Z does not..."

not that condescending is much better than hostile

I pity his patients who have to hear this crap. He is otherwise very empathetic, he helped a lot when I was depressed, he asked how I was feeling from the bottom of his heart, or at least I heard it this way, and I thought that his patients were lucky, but not on the point of weight gain/loss, no. I have only one desire vis-a-vis him: force-feed him Zyprexa . With Depakote as an accompaniment. And by the by, I shared with him my observations which I made sitting and waiting in my county's psych clinic: the staff, from doctors to secretaries, are significantly slimmer than the waiting patients. e.g. one of our front desk workers is really shapely despite being not so young, she is really nice to look at. He again rumbled something in place of a good response.

Yikes. I am getting a bad vibe from him.

Abstaining from eating for long periods of time can actually put weight on people because the body goes into a starvation mode and stores anything that you do eat as fat. People are much better off eating 6 small meals each day consisting of 40% protein, 40% complex carbohydrates and 20% fat. Believe it or not, the body needs fat to function at a healthy level. Good fats though, like salmon, olive oil, and natural peanut (nut) butter, etc. Complex carbs should come mostly from veggies and some fruits. A protein shake with some fruit and peanut butter makes a good meal/snack.

Even though your friend is a pdoc, if he is going to prescribe the meds that put on weight, he should do some research into eating right and tell his patients how to do it right. One yogurt and a dinner are not nearly enough for a person to eat in a day and the few lbs he has put on may be from his witholding food from himself.

Exercise is about 20% of the picture and nutrition, about 80%.

I am easing back into this style of eating and exercising, myself and I have hopes it will put a dent in the 70lbs I have gained over the course of my many med changes, and my current cocktail of Prozac, Depakote, Neurontin, Geodon, propanolol, trazodone, omeprazole, levothyroxine, (I think that's it, I forget right now).

yeah my T looks like a boxer, all chest and arms, no kidding, he eats every 2-3 hours, he is 67.

Hmmm I say yikes too. He might be in good physical shape but inner beauty or lack there of can quickly change someone's attractiveness.

And that's all I have to say about that. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Looks well .. Might be the first thing we notice, but someone who is very attractive physically can become very unattractive if their insides are not beautiful. Someone who isn't as physically attractive, by whoevers standards can become very very attractive if there insides are beautiful.

I'm finding what you are writing about him here, without seeing his physical appearance, not so attractive. There will be someone who sees you and gets to know you and thinks you are the bees knees just as you are. Keep that in mind Hamster.

I gained about 20lbs in three weeks, and I am very active, I was eating about 700 calories a day. I'd love someone to tell me I need to just diet more.

I happen to be a skinny girl because I've dealt with anorexia forever. However, one I thing I think that all posters in this thread should be able to agree on is that it isnt size that really matter, nor hair, nails, makeup or clothing. I am all for people feeling confident, but I don't see how being confident in yourself is ever a reason to say anything about others wether they are small or bigger. No need to say I am big and love myself and then say something about skinny people or vice versa. Sorry I picked up a hint of that in a post and think that's important.

Hmmm I say yikes too. He might be in good physical shape but inner beauty or lack there of can quickly change someone's attractiveness.

And that's all I have to say about that. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Looks well .. Might be the first thing we notice, but someone who is very attractive physically can become very unattractive if their insides are not beautiful. Someone who isn't as physically attractive, by whoevers standards can become very very attractive if there insides are beautiful.

I'm finding what you are writing about him here, without seeing his physical appearance, not so attractive. There will be someone who sees you and gets to know you and thinks you are the bees knees just as you are. Keep that in mind Hamster.

I gained about 20lbs in three weeks on Zyprexa, and I am very active, I was eating about 700 calories a day. I'd love someone to tell me I need to just diet more.

Best of luck, BNLsMOM, in this. I have a similar cocktail to yours btw - the stuff in bold I also take. Except for trazodone - it stopped working for me and I am on Temazepam now.

I think 20% fat is too little. Dark Heart?

I've been scanning this thread for some time now ....wondering just how to apply my curious mind to it and wondering do I really have any business bein' here at all but we are all buddies here and I have no motives apart from I think.....I think and feel I may have something to add!

I'm a guy so it might count.

first up I will eliminate the word horrible...what a horrible word that is!

I'm not gonna go all cheesy weird either...if the world was not obsessed with a certain shape we mostly would be dis-affected and concentrating on the real elements of intimacy!

yes?....yes! (not in any particular order)

first up...a person can do incredible things with confident eyes a smile.

second...same person can arouse anyone with the right touch and want.

third...throw in some nice perfumes and clothes and whatever

fourth...amazing!! but yes you do have a personality you would be surprised just how intensely how much!

....comfort and the love be comin right back.

I had an 'overweight' girlfriend a while back she was georgeous her face her skin was lovely her hair and she was kind to me she had a lovely smell...and when she felt ok she moved sexy...she didn't own a bikini and I didn't give a damn!

I stuffed it up.

borderline boy strikes again!

I just want to explain why I am not more pissed off than seems appropriate. When we were young, I treated D. really cruelly. I have (let us say I had - I hope it is in the past) a dark side that rejoiced when she made men who loved her suffer pain. This topic was somewhat covered in my last T and I think I made progress in that I do not want my ex to suffer anymore, but clearly much more T is still needed. At any rate, in one form or another but I have done it to every man who had the misfortune to love me. In the case of D., it was showcasing of my boyfriends. Three boyfriends in a row in front of his very eyes. The last one would become my first (short-lived) husband. And once I was spending time with D. at my place and the would-be husband arrived and I started kissing him or some such, I think even he was appalled at the inappropriateness of my actions in public. I knew that D. was still in love with me and still cared. That scene is in front of my mind's eye all the time, and I appreciate D. for perseverance and tolerance and for the fact that he is still my friend whereas many other people in his situation would have long abandoned me. So that is why I am going to tolerate his insensitivity for now. I figure what I was doing to him was worse than what he is doing to me now.

In an effort to educate him, sent him the following:
http://familyfood.hiddenvalley.com/s...-you-2014.html

While breakfast is given the reputation of being the most important meal of the day, eating lunch is just as essential to staying healthy. Going too long without food denies your body glucose, the sugar that supplies your brain with energy. Skipping lunch also slows down your metabolism, leads to overeating and makes it difficult to meet your nutrient needs for the day.

Reasons for Skipping Lunch

Time restraints are a common cause of skipping lunch. When you're busy getting yourself ready for work and the kids ready for school, packing a lunch may be the last thing on your mind. When you get to work, you realize that you don't have a lunch and you're too busy to go get one. If you're a stay-at-home mom, your kids' needs often come before your own. By the time you're finished preparing lunch for everyone else, there is no time left for you. Many dieters make the mistake of skipping meals because they think it will lower total calorie intake and promote weight loss. If this describes you, think again.

Effects of Skipping Lunch

When you skip lunch, your body slows down your metabolism. The purpose of this is to decrease calorie burn in an effort to conserve these calories for later use. This process hinders weight loss. Successful weight loss comes from supplying your body with the right nutrients by eating healthy meals regularly. When your body does not have access to glucose, which comes from the foods you eat, it turns to glycogen, the stored form of glucose in the liver. While glycogen serves as a backup source of energy, it only lasts for so long. Once glycogen stores are depleted, your brain does not have access to glucose. As a result, your ability to concentrate decreases, and you may have difficulty focusing.

He responded: "How about "miracle of fasting"? It was an American who wrote it."

I actually know about the "Miracle of fasting". Paul Bragg was the author. When I was my eating disorder in my youth, I was into everything distorted: rawfoodism, fasting, and what not. Later on, I browsed Wikipedia and found out that this guy, Paul Bragg, seriously exaggerated his age (by 14 years) to make people believe that his system allows maintaining good physical shape into old age. And that he died of a heart attack. The "miracle" did not work. I related it to D.

I also told my ex, who knows D. a bit (as my friend, not lover), and he immediately pronounced D's methods masochistic and suggested D go into therapy in regards to being mad at the body for stopping to burn food the way it used to. My ex also recommended 45 minutes of sweating using elliptical (for safety, unlike running). I am not sure yet whether I will convey those recommendations to D.

Much better advice from your ex................

Sweating to increase metabolism!

I think I'd tell Ex and D to take a flying leap But thats just my insomnia and crankiness talking/ typing ..Haaaaa !

((( Hugs )))

So to my point that Paul Bragg died of a heart attack (a fact taken from Wikipedia) he responded with "And who from among the deceased has not died?" I emailed "right, but it would have been becoming to someone who boasted that his approach (fasting) promises healthy aging to die of old age, not a heart attack". He also wrote that not eating clears his brain. I wrote that normally our brains need fluids and glucose so not eating would not clear them (and it does not for me, that is for sure), but maybe he is a lucky exception from the rule. I further wrote that if I skip meals, I can faint as my blood pressure is 85/52 and it falls further if I do not eat (he, otoh, takes bp-lowering meds). I think he will not respond, and it is OK, I will leave this topic then.

Monkey, you are like a brother to me. A brother I have never had and always dreamed of having.

Everyone, thanks!