[GrayNess]

I don't intend to offend anyone nor trigger anyone in typing this but hopefully nobody gets triggered nor offended.

Anyways, after meeting with 2 psychiatrists recently at a forensic psychology center (also had some prison inmates in cuffs come in a few times in random hallways), lots of tight security for pretty much every door to a hallway, I met with the 2 psychiatrists. 1 I met with before who is a senior resident, the other is a full-trained psychiatrist. I'll make the story short, sweet and simple, in saying that they wish for me to do some personality tests, one of them being the famous MMPI-2 test. I have no problem doing that, despite the fact that I'll get pretty bored with 567 questions.

They refused to give a concrete diagnosis until I do those tests which some psychologist has to call me and tell me when to come in to do them. I asked what they suspected or else I'm not doing any tests. So, they said they highly suspected I have anti-social personality disorder and possibly also narcissistic personality disorder. I've seen a total of about 7-8 psychiatrists and several therapists, and the therapists sometimes commented on more than one occasion that what I've said was along the lines of sociopathic.

My family has a history of mental disorders, ranging from my father being a narcissistic with a lousy temper to one of my aunts having depression and substance abuse (mostly alcohol) to my grandmother having body dysmorphic disorder. Those are just some examples, I'm not going to list all the disorders I know of that certain individuals in my family have.

I first got oppositional defiant and then conduct disorder, and now, at 19 years old, 2nd year university, possibly ASPD and NPD, as well as schizophrenia (as far as I know, nobody else in my family has schizophrenia). I'm not going to mention what damages I've done to people or property but I will say they started at a very young age. I think at around 10-11 years old I stole a decent amount of merchandise from some stores, and got caught doing so a few times. The other things I'm quite sure would trigger people so I'll refrain from saying them.

Anyways, I guess part of the reason for suspecting ASPD is what I lack, such as remorse, guilt, empathy, emotions (except for anger, that flares up a lot and when it does it tends to explode), etc... .

Part of what I find to be hard or annoying is that I just don't understand some of the stuff, such as feeling the emotions or why or how to properly understand how to react. I can certainly see the emotions in others, use them but feel none of it. Heck, sometimes for TV shows, I've had my mother try to explain some emotional things in it during the commercials and I'm still clueless. My therapist, who is leaving me soon but is quite good, tries to do some role-playing and get me to understand some stuff but it's not working at all. It's like being constantly isolated even though you're right next to a person, being expected to somehow know all of this. It's like somehow they all got the booklets explaining it and I got nothing. It's not for only very complex emotions, such as being in a group, it can also be for a 1-1 conversation. Someone says something and I know how I should act, what to do/say and how to say it, and I do that but don't feel it. Other times, I do the same things but it's not entirely appropriate or something and I get weird looks, feeling even more isolated, like you've found a small door in this glass wall and someone just kicks it shut on your face.

I think part of it may be due to it being passed down somewhat and due to a rather lousy childhood, where I wasn't able to connect with anyone without having them turn on me right away.

However, despite this, I do have some relationships with people, such as at university campus. Those people I don't really harm nor manipulate, but if someone else attempts to harm them in some way, their life will get rather miserable very soon.

I know that some of the things I like are power, control, money, getting what I want when I want from who I want. I sometimes also like having none of the human emotions (except for anger) because I see other people having them and they're swamped, flooded in grief or just plain overwhelmed and I don't want that. What I am makes me unique, above others, superior to them. But, a few times I do want to feel them even though I see how overwhelming they are.

It's not something of me suppressing them, if I see let's say a person sad I think "they're sad" and I get a reasonably good profile of them based on how they act and such. But no emotion clicks in me. I know that based on others I should feel sad also, so if I mimic looking sad, still, get nothing clicking.

On one hand, it does suck quite a lot but on the other hand, I do whatever I want with no remorse or anything. I've read around on the Internet of some things and they all seem quite accurate.

I forget the author's name but there was a book, Without Conscience, or something like that, and although I haven't read it yet, I've heard it's quite a good read.

Does anyone have any experience with ASPD, NPD? Any experience with learning emotions? I'm in the therapy attempting to learn them or sometimes get my mother to help but I feel like an infant, so confused with some big fancy gadget that nobody explains or their explanations are in some foreign language.

[Junerain]

You may be more in tune with your emotions, less narcisstic than you think and or believe yourself to be. The fact that you mimic the other's people's feelings when they are sad, no, you may not actually feel sad, but just the mimic-ing speaks for itself, you wish, as you have expressed here, that you did feel something at that point. Also a few times you wished you could feel more, those few times count for something, if not just that you are aware you 'lack' something.

I used to have a component of human intelligence missing in my psyche, an orientation to and understanding of reality. I knew I was missing it ans a few times desired it. Then I went to nursing school and that component of my intelligence TA DAH it was there, all of sudden I could sense reality, not live in my own world as much. I feel complete now.

I think over time, experiences, and loving, you may actually acquire what you feel you lack.

I wouldn't get caught up in diagnosis, just because that is simply an outer indication of something truly inner in nature.

If you are university age, you have your entire life ahead of you, and yes, your certain type of psyche DOES have its advantages! More advantages than a lack of orientation to reality, that's for sure!!

Time is the healer of all things I have found. There is no telling which parts of your personality will sway, bend, or break.

You write with candor and sincerity, I admire your willingness to discuss things, and responding to you has helped _me.

[Michah]

I was told that I had "psycopathic antisocial behavioural problems" 15 years ago along with BPD, schizoeffective and a touch of narcissism.........Recently, there has been slow talk with my T about Aspergers.........a slight case maybe.

As with all things, if there is a label, there is a reason/treatment/understanding...........we are more complex creatures than that. Dx is only a guideline.......we try not to make it a lifestyle.

I have also done horrendous things in my life that I did not have a conscience about until people started doing it to me......or trying and for once I understood the idea of "karma". Also the idea of jail did not appeal to me and I had come dangerously close.

Now I seek only the experience of learning to be human in a way that is spiritually fulfilling and the way I can pay back my karmic cost. I struggle everyday but I am starting to see some of the rewards........I hope the same for you.

You are very aware of how you are........maybe not how you feel?? Feeling is the hardest most complex thing I have ever had to do......but it gets easier, more comfortable and less frightening the more you practice it......

I like my anti-social, misanthropic, loving self.......and once I accepted that, the rage that had dictated my whole life is in better check.

By the way, that personality test that you are taking is incredible......really explained myself to me.

Good luck, babe. My thoughts, on this journey to stillness and acceptance, are with you. As with all of us..........

[GrayNess]

Thank you Junerain and Micah for the replies. I know it may sound somewhat odd but as Micah mentioned the rage that dictated their life, I like the rage, the power, etc... . Gives such a rush especially if there's another person/people around feeling it.

I'm not a believer in karma and am not going to pay back any karmatic cost or apologies because what I did I enjoyed and did it for a reason. Any apologies I give are empty and meaningless words that others like to hear (although I do tend to break them and promises a fair bit).

I suppose it would get easier although it's not frightening learning all of it, it's just confusing and many times I just want to quit the therapy because I'm getting nowhere.

Well, I'll do the MMPI-2 test, although how long did it take you to do? I assume 3-5 hours?

Junerain, yes, certain psyches do have their advantages, no arguement there. Time can also be a great healer, although much of the damage I've caused still hasn't worn off of some people yet. Who knows though, it may change for me a bit or a lot. I'm pretty sure I cant go into saying what I've done here but humans and animals have all been targets in the past and present.

[Michah]

Originally Posted by GrayNess

Thank you Junerain and Micah for the replies. I know it may sound somewhat odd but as Micah mentioned the rage that dictated their life, I like the rage, the power, etc... . Gives such a rush especially if there's another person/people around feeling it.

I'm not a believer in karma and am not going to pay back any karmatic cost or apologies because what I did I enjoyed and did it for a reason. Any apologies I give are empty and meaningless words that others like to hear (although I do tend to break them and promises a fair bit).

I suppose it would get easier although it's not frightening learning all of it, it's just confusing and many times I just want to quit the therapy because I'm getting nowhere.

Well, I'll do the MMPI-2 test, although how long did it take you to do? I assume 3-5 hours?

Junerain, yes, certain psyches do have their advantages, no arguement there. Time can also be a great healer, although much of the damage I've caused still hasn't worn off of some people yet. Who knows though, it may change for me a bit or a lot. I'm pretty sure I cant go into saying what I've done here but humans and animals have all been targets in the past and present.

Ah yes, the rage is addictive, is it not? Especially when you see the fear in others eyes, the humiliation........The reason why I entertained it for so long.......it was better than any drug I have ever taken........so much power...

Karma is not something that we choose, it is bestowed upon us whether we like it or not........but honour is. I am not sorry that I did what I did as I still believe that they deserved it.........what I choose to question is the way I dealt with it.......in order to grow one must accept responsibility, not contrition. Contrition is a spiritual quest of forgiveness......which I have also attempted to embark on in the last couple of years. I am 35.

I could either become a fully fledged psycopath and live on a knifes edge of power and destruction or I could accept that if I chose that path I would lose my son, and whatever seed of good that I have, which I know I am capable of.

I do not mean to be directly combative, but you remind me of me. I do not mean to patronise by implying that I "understand" you........but your experience strikes a homecoming chord in me that I cannot ignore.

I have lived with rage for 15 years and the rage attacks, I call "demon runs". I was calculating, cold and ruthless. I have also experienced flashes of divine love........human love has always left me hollow as I do not understand it in its entirety and am often mystified by how it leaves people.......but the more I practice it the better it becomes.

I refuse to believe, no matter how much of a sociopath you might be referred to as, you are not in my eyes and I don't even know you. I guess its because people looked at me the same way, and even though I immensely enjoyed their discomfort, I was also extremely isolated.....no one tried to understand......I was branded. Sorry, sound like i am trying to "save" you from yourself........I am self indulgent.

Please feel free to tell me to get nicked and I am sorry if I have made you angry, my motivations are pure........yes the test took a long time to do but it was the start of a terrifying, exhilarating journey. Give it a chance.

In stillness.........

[GrayNess]

No, you haven't made me angry in the slightest.

Yeah, the rage and power are addictive. Seeing the pain from emotional or physical or simply humiliation gives me this rush of excitement. I've watched (and continue to watch) numerous videos of various forms of pain and they all give this rush of excitement.

Unfortunately, I am not spiritual in the same sense you are (I think). The only "god" I believe in is myself; if I want to do something, I'm doing it irregardless of what others think or do.

I don't have any children as of yet and don't exactly plan to have them very soon, simply because young children tend to get on my nerves very fast.

Yes, the isolation is a real bother (I assume I cant swear on here). I've had few try to understand and those few tended to leave. The 1 that is currently staying but also soon to leave is the therapist (she's leaving me as there's a set amount of sessions anyone gets and I'm approaching that limit). I truly don't care about those that do or do not ignore me but I'd much rather have some people to attempt to be with me than none at all. Yes, branded describes it quite well.

I still get these rushes of rage or as you call them "demon runs", as part of the reason is I live with my father, who has NPD, is quite irritating and sometimes a bad temper. Sometimes I try to suppress the rage so I can continue doing whatever I was doing before but more often than not, it just explodes.

I cant say I've had true genuine love, I've had a collection of ex-girlfriends say the famous lines of "I love you" or such nonsense but they were always meaningless. Although human love is one of the many emotions or feelings or whatever you want to term it, that I still just get completely and utterly confused on.

I am willing to give it a chance although this utter confusion and sometimes annoyances from the confusion is something that constantly pushes me away.

But it is nice to talk with someone who has some experience in this, even though we may differ in age, lists of destruction caused, etc.... .

Although one thing that still confuses me about you is after all of this practice and karma, do you actually feel the emotions or is it still numbness or nothingness (with the exception of the anger)?

[Michah]

Although one thing that still confuses me about you is after all of this practice and karma, do you actually feel the emotions or is it still numbness or nothingness (with the exception of the anger)?[/QUOTE]

I am glad that you are not angry.........The idea of me joining a forum was foreign to me until 6 months ago and for some reason I was compelled......almost instructed to participate for once in my life. I sometimes struggle with what is appropriate, so I am glad that you took it for what I meant.

As for the quote above, it is meant for some and not for others.......it is a choice that you make when you don't have the natural, instinctive sense of what it is to be human and "suffer" the human condition. I chose the light. I had to work very hard and still do......my son was born to me for a reason. A reason that I understand now.......to teach me responsibility, cause and effect, compassion, love(of a sort), karma-if you like. Although I am very spiritual now, I try not to dictate to others, although with you, for some reason I am compelled to.

I am somewhat disturbed by my passion in this matter. I receive much love now from healthy, loving people but that does not mean I do not struggle with reciprocation. The point is, once I started to love all that was evil, angry and violent about me, I started to shift in a slow and painful way.......but shift nonetheless. It took many years and many hospital admissions and my poor, alert, afraid psychologist to nut it all out. They all take me just as I am.

I believe that no matter what I feel or what I am, as long as I am alive I have a responsibility to persue my humanity and live with honour........I feel that the same outcome is destined for you.........you may scoff at me and say I am ignorant but I have greater faith in you than you do in yourself at this point......You deserve love no matter who you are or what you feel.

That is my firm opinion.........I believe I have reached past impartiality with this and I am shocked at my impertinence........but it is good......it is all part of my lesson too.

Thanks for bringing this up.........you have inadvertantly raised an issue that I thought I had been more peaceful with.........I will do more work.

Lets do it together.........

[GrayNess]

Thank you Michah but I'm still not entirely sure I want to give up or change how or who I am. As I mentioned before, part of me wants to feel but another part wants to continue as I am. If I could feel half the time that'd be ideal but that's not looking like a very possible outcome.

No, you aren't dictating me, you're giving suggestions based on personal experiences. However, you are not the first one to try to in a sense, help me. I've had some others try, although all of them (exception of you) had very little understanding. I can however see where it could seem somewhat dictating, however, these pixels on a computer screen don't dictate me, so that's fine. I guess I went about the long, extravagant way of saying, you're not dictating, just giving experience and wanting to help change me to indirectly help you, a sort of 2 for 1 deal.

However, the idea of letting the power, pain, violence, and to an extent the numbness that I have all go away I'm not sure I'm willing to do. Feeling more I am wanting part of the time but also keeping all the power and everything else. I guess it's possible to keep it while feeling everything.

Well, I'm waiting for the psychiatrists or psychologist to phone me and tell me when to come in and do the personality tests, so after doing them, then after meeting with the psychiatrists once more, I'm assuming they'll give some sort of result or way to go. Although, I'll still be seeing my therapist but she isn't too good at all with getting me to understand the emotions/feelings, as really, no progress has been made.

[Michah]

Originally Posted by GrayNess

Thank you Michah but I'm still not entirely sure I want to give up or change how or who I am. As I mentioned before, part of me wants to feel but another part wants to continue as I am. If I could feel half the time that'd be ideal but that's not looking like a very possible outcome.

No, you aren't dictating me, you're giving suggestions based on personal experiences. However, you are not the first one to try to in a sense, help me. I've had some others try, although all of them (exception of you) had very little understanding. I can however see where it could seem somewhat dictating, however, these pixels on a computer screen don't dictate me, so that's fine. I guess I went about the long, extravagant way of saying, you're not dictating, just giving experience and wanting to help change me to indirectly help you, a sort of 2 for 1 deal.

However, the idea of letting the power, pain, violence, and to an extent the numbness that I have all go away I'm not sure I'm willing to do. Feeling more I am wanting part of the time but also keeping all the power and everything else. I guess it's possible to keep it while feeling everything.

Well, I'm waiting for the psychiatrists or psychologist to phone me and tell me when to come in and do the personality tests, so after doing them, then after meeting with the psychiatrists once more, I'm assuming they'll give some sort of result or way to go. Although, I'll still be seeing my therapist but she isn't too good at all with getting me to understand the emotions/feelings, as really, no progress has been made.

Short response for now.......please read a posting I put on this personality forum a while ago......its called "Let me howl"......it is a little story about my struggle.......I think you will like it.

I didn't want to give up the rage either........bit like my obsession with cocaine. Sometimes I miss it like the best friend I never had......its predictibility, safety and sweet nostalgia. I often find myself missing what I once was.........but a choice is a choice and when you are ready to make it, you will......for better or for worse. I think your intelligence will win.

Everything happens for a reason........beyond our powers of understanding.

[GrayNess]

I read the post you mentioned and I think I understood it after a few reads over and over again. Just a random question not meant to get offensive but do you have borderline or antisocial, or both or something else?

[Michah]

Originally Posted by GrayNess

I read the post you mentioned and I think I understood it after a few reads over and over again. Just a random question not meant to get offensive but do you have borderline or antisocial, or both or something else?

Not offensive at all. This is word for word - I was originally dx schizoeffective, borderline personality disorder with psycopathic anti social behavioral problems, narcissistic personality disorder traits and most recently in 2007 Bipolar type II.

I read in another post that you are studying pharmacology? I started my bachelor of science in Forensics/Microbiology in 2006 but had to defer in 2007 when I was admitted for a manic episode. I have since been diagnosed with thyroid disease. When I am better, I look forward to going back. I hope you are enjoying your studies.

I'm glad you read my little piece........and got it.

[GrayNess]

I'm studying double major biology and psychology, with interest in neuropsychology, neuroscience, forensic psychology and have done a course in medical pharmacology. Well, best of luck to you also.

[alyssa_angel]

I guess the ideal control would be to control your emotions, be able to feel, but able to control how much it effects you. Maybe thats the goal you could set yourself. Rather than being fearful of the emotions and thinking they will swamp you, I guess you have to look at it like this.

Right now you get enjoyment out of controlling others i assume, sorry if its a wrong assumption. But I fear you want to be able to control yourself deep down, and it gets shot out at other people instead. Maybe a goal for you could be to be able to control how much something will effect you in the long run.

A very very hard life goal, but a worth while one I think. Not sure I'm voicing my self amazingly. I can relate not personally, but from an out side viewer of a few people I know with the same problem.

In fact just a couple of years ago I went through learning what emotions are. Instead of naming them like others do, because this just confuses me, I used to draw them in colours or shapes as I sensed them. I understand if your not at the stage of sensing them yet. At first for me, I'm sure your different but just me 2 cents, I couldn't feel a certain emotion, infact I'd feel nothing most of the time until I got this huge mix of emotion, then itd go back to nothing again. I started picking apart the huge mix and assigning shapes and colours to each part of it, even if it wasn't the same way other people saw or distinguished them. Eventually as time went on i noticed flickers of each emotion, and could recognise the colour or shape i associated to it, eventually I learnt which colour or shape I saw when, and could work with it accordingly. I did this through art therapy.

Does that make any sense for you? I hope so, I don't know if it helps in the slightest, as everyone is so different in these circumstances, and as I wasn't exactly the same I can't say I can fully relate. Any way take care, I hope you make the right choice for you.

[GrayNess]

Drawing the colours and stuff may work to feel it, I'm not sure. I can try it out and see how it goes.

[alyssa_angel]

Originally Posted by GrayNess

Drawing the colours and stuff may work to feel it, I'm not sure. I can try it out and see how it goes.

yea not sure if it will work if you cant feel it but it just helped me to personalise emotions, i could see emotions in others, they didn't affect me but i could see them, and i could see how i should react, vs how i would react if i didnt particuarly care. but by drawing out these reactions to things i was able to see them as a tangeble thing, something i could relate to on a personal level rather than something that was just a reaction i chose to ignore or follow through without any real personalisation towards it. not sure it will work for you on the same level my problem was different, just saying perhaps there is a way to make ur feelings, even the feeling of being above others, as something that is an emotion, or an emotion, that you can work with.

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by GrayNess

Thank you Junerain and Micah for the replies. I know it may sound somewhat odd but as Micah mentioned the rage that dictated their life, I like the rage, the power, etc... . Gives such a rush especially if there's another person/people around feeling it.

I'm not a believer in karma and am not going to pay back any karmatic cost or apologies because what I did I enjoyed and did it for a reason. Any apologies I give are empty and meaningless words that others like to hear (although I do tend to break them and promises a fair bit).

I suppose it would get easier although it's not frightening learning all of it, it's just confusing and many times I just want to quit the therapy because I'm getting nowhere.

Well, I'll do the MMPI-2 test, although how long did it take you to do? I assume 3-5 hours?

Junerain, yes, certain psyches do have their advantages, no arguement there. Time can also be a great healer, although much of the damage I've caused still hasn't worn off of some people yet. Who knows though, it may change for me a bit or a lot. I'm pretty sure I cant go into saying what I've done here but humans and animals have all been targets in the past and present.

I took the abbreviated MMPI 2 in three hours. The abbreviated version is over 300 questions, they are all yes/no, or "I don't know".

I was distracted when I took it or it would have been around 1.5 to 2.0 hours max. I imagine the full MMPI 2 is quite a bit longer, and yes, it is very annoying, especially when you don't really know how to give a yes/no

You will not likely be able to answer all of the questions due to lack of understanding emotions. In that event, you choose the answer "don't know". Too many "don't know's" will invalidate the test.

There are several scales/subscales on the test, which means several different ways to "grade" it. It is only useful as an adjunct to traditional diagnosis by a psychologist. There is no right or wrong answer. Whatever the scales they use to measure your answers by will indicate what they were testing for. There over a hundred scales they could choose from.

Do not trust anyone who would not be open with you about what they are testing for.

I recommend a psychologist, as residents and psychiatrists are actually substandard to the real deal-- a psychologist actually has much more training in psychology and psychological diagnosis--- a psychiatrist usually has VERY little training in neuropsychological/psychological tests.

Psychiatrists are more trained in medication management. They are almost all purely biologically oriented ("biological" in the sense that they only treat things with medication). Medication is not the answer to everything, although it can be useful. However, medication is not a panacea.

I wanted to add that ASPD, and especially NPD, are VERY poorly understood. This is likely the reason you think that your therapy is getting nowhere. NPD is less than two percent of the world's population. Your therapist should recommend you to a specialist in NPD if at all possible, but they are likely somewhat able to help and I would continue with the therapy.

Please consider that being honest with your therapist is one of the steps to getting better. They will not likely be shocked by anything you say.

[GrayNess]

Originally Posted by Simcha

I took the abbreviated MMPI 2 in three hours. The abbreviated version is over 300 questions, they are all yes/no, or "I don't know".

I was distracted when I took it or it would have been around 1.5 to 2.0 hours max. I imagine the full MMPI 2 is quite a bit longer, and yes, it is very annoying, especially when you don't really know how to give a yes/no

You will not likely be able to answer all of the questions due to lack of understanding emotions. In that event, you choose the answer "don't know". Too many "don't know's" will invalidate the test.

There are several scales/subscales on the test, which means several different ways to "grade" it. It is only useful as an adjunct to traditional diagnosis by a psychologist. There is no right or wrong answer. Whatever the scales they use to measure your answers by will indicate what they were testing for. There over a hundred scales they could choose from.

Do not trust anyone who would not be open with you about what they are testing for.

I recommend a psychologist, as residents and psychiatrists are actually substandard to the real deal-- a psychologist actually has much more training in psychology and psychological diagnosis--- a psychiatrist usually has VERY little training in neuropsychological/psychological tests.

Psychiatrists are more trained in medication management. They are almost all purely biologically oriented ("biological" in the sense that they only treat things with medication). Medication is not the answer to everything, although it can be useful. However, medication is not a panacea.

I wanted to add that ASPD, and especially NPD, are VERY poorly understood. This is likely the reason you think that your therapy is getting nowhere. NPD is less than two percent of the world's population. Your therapist should recommend you to a specialist in NPD if at all possible, but they are likely somewhat able to help and I would continue with the therapy.

Please consider that being honest with your therapist is one of the steps to getting better. They will not likely be shocked by anything you say.

Hmm, well I won't make too many "i don't knows" but to prevent an invalidation, I'll probably guess or soemthing like that.

Well, so far it's been psychiatrists referring to psychiatrists. This test will be done by some psychologist who I'm still waiting for a phone call to come and do the test. I'm guessing it'd take a few weeks because it's a big facility and they'd have many other people to deal with.

I'm not worried about the therapist being shocked. I just don't want to get tossed in a psych ward or some other more secure place and screw up my academic career.

When I talked to the 2 psychiatrists before, they didn't tell me which scale would be used, but they said the MMPI-2 will be a long test, so I'm guessing the 567 questions. But they did keep on saying tests plural, but I only know MMPI-2 is one of them, so no idea what the others could be.

Oh well, if worst comes to worst, I'll see if the psychologist can help me answer the question (I doubt it) or I'll fake a few questions so I don't put too many "i don't know"s. It may not be 100% honest but I'm not planning to do a test for a few hours just to have them tell me it's invalid and may have to do it again or do more.

[Simcha]

Originally Posted by GrayNess

Hmm, well I won't make too many "i don't knows" but to prevent an invalidation, I'll probably guess or soemthing like that.

Well, so far it's been psychiatrists referring to psychiatrists. This test will be done by some psychologist who I'm still waiting for a phone call to come and do the test. I'm guessing it'd take a few weeks because it's a big facility and they'd have many other people to deal with.

I'm not worried about the therapist being shocked. I just don't want to get tossed in a psych ward or some other more secure place and screw up my academic career.

When I talked to the 2 psychiatrists before, they didn't tell me which scale would be used, but they said the MMPI-2 will be a long test, so I'm guessing the 567 questions. But they did keep on saying tests plural, but I only know MMPI-2 is one of them, so no idea what the others could be.

Oh well, if worst comes to worst, I'll see if the psychologist can help me answer the question (I doubt it) or I'll fake a few questions so I don't put too many "i don't know"s. It may not be 100% honest but I'm not planning to do a test for a few hours just to have them tell me it's invalid and may have to do it again or do more.

I apologize if I ever come off as offensive as it is not my intent. I can be rather direct at times and sometimes this comes off as too blunt for some people. It is one of my personal flaws. I'm sure you understand.

My best guess in your situation is that they need more data because they haven't spent enough time with you interviewing you and assessing you. That is likely why they feel the need for the MMPI-2, as you are too "complicated" for them (and/or they lean heavily on tests to make assessment go faster). Usually they will put you in a room by yourself to complete it to eliminate distractions, but it can still be valid if given in the presence of others. The test by itself is nothing, but can be an aid to assessment. I take issue with the overuse of tests by some in psychiatry/psychology, as they are not a replacement for the psychologist.

The MMPI-2 has it's flaws as all psychological/neuropsychological tests do, but in the hands of a skilled practitioner they can be really helpful in trying to get a full picture of the problem.

I took the full MMPI-2 a few years ago. At that point in time I was taking it as the part of a job process, so to expedite the matter I just filled in whatever I thought they wanted to hear. If I remember right about 2.5 -3 hours for me to get through it, which means I didn't go any faster than if I would have answered every question honestly. I took the "short" abbreviated MMPI-2 a year ago. The difference between the "short version" and the full MMPI-2 is 300 some questions vs. 500 some questions. I remember very specifically one question: "Is your father a good person?" I wish I remembered more questions, but don't always expect them to be measuring what you think they are measuring.

I took a real interest in your dilemmna because I have actually known people in my life with ASPD and/or NPD. It's tough to have and deal with either way. With the right professionals, it CAN be helped. I have seen it, but they are very difficult as our level of understanding of complex disorders in psychology/psychiatry is still quite poor compared to our understanding of other aspects of science (which is still quite poor, lol).

Good luck, come back and let us know how it went and all that. Did you get a date set for it yet?

[Simcha]

I forgot to add that the MMPI-2 "scales" are chosen by the examiner to answer the diagnostic questions they have.

If they think you might possibly have schizophrenia for example, there is a "scale", which is really a conglomeration of various questions on the test --not in order--that measures the given answers against what a schizophrenic dx'd person is MORE LIKELY (not DEFINITELY, just MORE LIKELY) to endorse, vs. the answers that a non-schizophrenic is MORE LIKELY to endorse.

There are literally hundreds of these scales, some with more validity than others (that's for another discussion). What they will likely choose as scales depends on what they are looking for, unless they have a standard set of scales they use on everybody.

Check this link out--it's the first 75 questions on the MMPI-2:
https://antipolygraph.org/cgi-bin/fo...num=1109032158

Here's a informational link about the MMPI-2 from one person's standpoint:
http://mike.writegood.org/?page_id=25

MMPI-2 points to consider: http://www.falseallegations.com/mmpi-bw.htm