[SallyBrown]

Hi everyone,

It's been tough for me to post lately, because things are not going well with T.

I'm so sad. We have had our occasional difficulties, but seem to work past them. Yet there seems to be this thing that he does that is really harmful, which is when I feel hurt by something he does, he avoids, or defends, or just generally doesn't listen to what I have to say around it, and seemingly pulls interpretations out of thin air. And explains. Oh, the explaining.

We seem to have about one of these a year, and it's getting to be too much for me. Months go by where we're just spinning our wheels, and I am saying the same thing over and over again, getting progressively worse, until I tell him I am going to find a new therapist -- and of course by that point I am emotionally checked out and have given everything I've got. It's at this point that he seems to start listening to me, and then for a good chunk of time, things are pretty ok -- sometimes up, sometimes down, but ok. It's a massive emotional feat, though, to try to go back to being engaged from having felt done.

I don't think I can do it anymore. It's like being with my husband back when he was behaving rather badly, and would refuse to make the smallest changes until I pretty much had one foot out the door. Thankfully, that has finally stopped. But it keeps going with T.

This time, it is something so ridiculous that I just can't wrap my head around it. It's a discussion that should have lasted several minutes, but instead has unfolded over the course of several weeks, as various bits of the truth and various semi-acknowledgements of my situation have slowly trickled out of him. Worse, it's about scheduling, so I can't even just try to set it aside for a while. I actually do need to know what's going on with our appointment schedule so I can, you know, have appointments.

He is showing signs of hearing what I have to say now, but it's been over two months. I'm totally drained and feel battered by his focus on and explanations of parts of the conversation that aren't actually bothering me.

I'm finding now that I need a therapist who can admit when he's wrong. Not so much because I'm interested in being right, because sometimes there is no "right". But it's very hard for me to be vulnerable with someone who isn't willing to focus on the things that are hurtful and significant to me if those things are coming from him.

He insists this isn't about his avoiding responsibility, but if that's not it, then I am completely and totally stuck. There's no unifying explanation that's going to make him look good, and I've yet to hear any unifying explanation from him at all -- just bits and pieces of things that he KNOWS are not the issue.

OK, well, this is a novel. I just wanted to write it here because I really have nowhere else to go with it. I am SO sad. This sucks SO much. I'm taking a couple weeks off of therapy (that is a long time for me, as someone in analysis who goes 3-4 times a wekk) -- I might go for a full month if necessary. I desperately need some space to think.

Thanks to any who have read this far

(((((SallyBrown)))))

Wow, I can really relate to how hard your situation is.

I am lucky that my T is very wiling to admit when he's wrong. It would be SO crazy-making if he wasn't...because I think I would constantly be questioning my own perceptions, or battling an uphill battle to feel heard, or wondering about HIS perception of what's going on, or...??? Probably a combination of all of that and more, and it would totally derail my therapy.

My own recent experience with taking a break during an impossible situation was that it REALLY helped. It was sad, and hard (especially because I thought it was the end of therapy, not a break)...but having some space helped me sort things out and gave me enough distance from T to let the intensity of my feelings (and probably his feelings) to calm down a bit. And it's so much better now.

I know it's sad and hard, though. Have you told T you're planning on taking a break??

Hi Sally :Hugs:,
Your T sounds completely unreasonable at the moment, perhaps something about this situation is triggering him but shouldn't he as the therapist be able to recognise this and work through it with you?
This is not your fault and if he would admit his mistakes maybe this rupture could be repaired. Its gone on too long now and needs to be sorted out, i am glad you are looking after yourself though Sally by removing yourself from the situation for a while. Perhaps you could write him an email to explain it all, or cope the above post and send it to him?

[unaluna]

so have you told him exactly that? that 1. you don't like having to threaten to leave to get him to straighten out his act 2. you get enough of that crap at home 3. flat out, why is he being defensive with YOU? in my case, I told T I love him more than anybody else in his life, he totally didn't need to be defensive with me. that might not apply to you. but it probably does at some level of trust. 4. so what is this really about for him??? wtf? i'm sorry this is happening.

[Chopin99]

I'm sorry Sally.

Sounds like your T has an unhealthy behavior pattern of his own. You shouldn't have to threaten to quit to have him listen to what is important to you. I have a working knowledge of analysis from my BA in psychology, but no experience with it. My own T told me that defensiveness is a block. That your T is defending himself sounds to me like he has a block somewhere. Most likely it has nothing to do with you per se, but I wonder if you've stumbled upon topics he doesn't want to deal within himself.

Then again, we can "what if" forever. I hope you find some resolution Sally.

[~EnlightenMe~]

I'm so sorry you are going through this. So, so sorry!

[healed84]

I am so sorry to here this sallybrown I am hoping you and your T can come to some kind of resolution soon!!

[adel34]

Hi Sally,
I'm really sorry this is happening! This totally sucks.
If it was me, this would make me crazy and feel totally unsafe in therapy. It's hard enough for me to tell someone I didn't like what they said or it upset me or whatever, and then to have the therapist just defend themselves would be too much. And I couldn't take having to go through the whole emotionally draining process of threatening to leave either!
I had a little bit of this go on with me with a previous t. I was going through so much with family issues, reporting emotional abuse to professionals in my sister's life, trying to figure out safe living options for myself for after college ETC. My t said time and time again when I would ask for help finding resources about all this," I'm not a social worker. What you're asking me to do is casework." The real kicker for me was when I applied to the state department of mental health for services, and she'd never heard of them and had no idea how to fill out the forms, or even how to write a five axis diagnosis! And her response when I was frustrated about this and even crying was, first to not even notice that I was crying, and second to say," Why would I know about this? I don't work in a clinic!" She was totally flustered about having to fill out the forms, and again kept saying she wasn't "set up" to do this kind of thing.
So I left her. We'd been working together for over a year, but I couldn't take that kind of attitude. If I were you I would leave and find someone who could admit when they were wrong and not play this stupid game, and actually take responsiblity for their own issues. But that's just me.
Please keep us posted!

Originally Posted by button30

Hi Sally :Hugs:,
Your T sounds completely unreasonable at the moment, perhaps something about this situation is triggering him but shouldn't he as the therapist be able to recognise this and work through it with you?
This is not your fault and if he would admit his mistakes maybe this rupture could be repaired. Its gone on too long now and needs to be sorted out, i am glad you are looking after yourself though Sally by removing yourself from the situation for a while. Perhaps you could write him an email to explain it all, or cope the above post and send it to him?

I agree with all that button has said. He sounds like kind of a jerk, actually. He needs to get his head together. Take a break, and if he doesn't come round, get yourself a new T. You deserve better than this.

Ah, Sally, I am so sorry this has been happening! How incredibly frustrating and sad. You and your T have done some great work together, and I hope that he can get his stuff together and address this with you.

[SallyBrown]

Originally Posted by nightsky

I am lucky that my T is very wiling to admit when he's wrong. It would be SO crazy-making if he wasn't...because I think I would constantly be questioning my own perceptions, or battling an uphill battle to feel heard, or wondering about HIS perception of what's going on, or...??? Probably a combination of all of that and more, and it would totally derail my therapy.

My own recent experience with taking a break during an impossible situation was that it REALLY helped. It was sad, and hard (especially because I thought it was the end of therapy, not a break)...but having some space helped me sort things out and gave me enough distance from T to let the intensity of my feelings (and probably his feelings) to calm down a bit. And it's so much better now.

I know it's sad and hard, though. Have you told T you're planning on taking a break??

Thank you, nightsky. I could definitely see sometimes when your T was not at his best, that there is something similar about him and my T when he is not at his best. It REALLY has a lot to do with making me crazy about my own perceptions, and it's pretty damaging. Now I'm a lot better than I was before about trusting what I perceive to be true and not true, but it's so upsetting when I don't see that reflected in T. It feels so distant.

I did tell him I wanted to take a break. I first said I was considering it, but didn't give an actual start date, a few weeks ago. I mentioned it a couple times, and then last week he said something that just made everything seem totally hopeless, and I said I would go in last Friday, but then I needed the break. I said, though, that I'd consider giving him a sort of "two weeks notice", then taking the break, rather than not coming in at all. Did we discuss the break on Friday? Of course not! We never agreed on anything. The first he even mentioned it to me was in an e-mail on Friday afternoon, saying that he was hoping to be "clearer" on Monday (our usual next day) about something he'd been saying that day, and that he wasn't trying to "trick" me into coming in Monday, just really wanted to talk. So I guess I am supposed to take from that the he assumed I wasn't coming in on Monday, even though we never talked about it. Thanks, T. Indirectness always makes these situations better.

Originally Posted by button30

Hi Sally :Hugs:,
Your T sounds completely unreasonable at the moment, perhaps something about this situation is triggering him but shouldn't he as the therapist be able to recognise this and work through it with you?
This is not your fault and if he would admit his mistakes maybe this rupture could be repaired. Its gone on too long now and needs to be sorted out, i am glad you are looking after yourself though Sally by removing yourself from the situation for a while. Perhaps you could write him an email to explain it all, or cope the above post and send it to him?

Thanks Button. I have tried talking to him about this over and over, in person, on the phone, via e-mail, even via poetry. He knows everything I've said above, although somehow it doesn't seem to go through -- last week, when I finally said, "I'm taking a break, and I'm starting pretty much now," he finally said, "I think I'm clearer on some of the things that are upsetting you. I guess in light of what you've been telling me, many of the things I have been bringing up around it are irrelevant to how you're feeling." Yes, T. Yes they are.

Originally Posted by hankster

so have you told him exactly that? that 1. you don't like having to threaten to leave to get him to straighten out his act 2. you get enough of that crap at home 3. flat out, why is he being defensive with YOU? in my case, I told T I love him more than anybody else in his life, he totally didn't need to be defensive with me. that might not apply to you. but it probably does at some level of trust. 4. so what is this really about for him??? wtf? i'm sorry this is happening.

Aw thanks hankster. Yeah, I have done everything but an interpretive dance. I told him the last time I had one foot out the door that I really hated having to get to the point where I'm pretty much checked out before he comes through, and that I hated doing it with my husband, too. At least H has come around to see that that's a bad way to operate! And then on the phone last week, when he said "I think I understand what's been bothering you now," I told him that it made me furious that it had to come to this before he really listened.

I've even found myself saying stuff I would really prefer not to say at all because it just sounds so mean. I told him that this kind of thing definitely adjusted the fantasies I have sometimes of us being together in an actual couple if the world had been different -- that considering that this keeps happening, he probably wouldn't actually make me very happy. That sounds so rough, but I am running out of things to say! My head has been scoured clean of every thought I've had around this. I even just wrote him an e-mail with copied quotes from other e-mails correcting him on the timing of the s*** that's been happening, which he keeps screwing up. That seemed irrelevant before, but right now it's like, hey, while I'm letting you know how wrong you are about this, I might as well add that you don't even have the dates right.

I know what you mean about feeling like, of all people to be defensive with, why me? A patient who genuinely loves him and has no real agenda surrounding him? I have a few ideas about where it's coming from...

Originally Posted by Chopin99

I'm sorry Sally.

Sounds like your T has an unhealthy behavior pattern of his own. You shouldn't have to threaten to quit to have him listen to what is important to you. I have a working knowledge of analysis from my BA in psychology, but no experience with it. My own T told me that defensiveness is a block. That your T is defending himself sounds to me like he has a block somewhere. Most likely it has nothing to do with you per se, but I wonder if you've stumbled upon topics he doesn't want to deal within himself.

Then again, we can "what if" forever. I hope you find some resolution Sally.

Thanks Chopin... it does seem like it's some kind of pattern of his, that I keep stumbling upon this thing that he doesn't want to address. You're right in saying we could speculate about it forever, only he can figure out it.

The best guess I have is that he's insecure about being a good therapist. He needs to be the good guy. And mostly, he is a very good therapist, and he CAN frequently admit when he's done something wrong... he just did that a couple weeks ago, and it was just a human mistake and so I had no problem just letting it pass. It's just every so often, especially when it comes to problems of being consistent, it's like he just stops dealing with it like a normal adult person. In the past, it has seemed to be about trying to stick to a plan that he has doubts about. For instance, for a while he was trying to do a more Freudian thing, being very distant and saying very little and having me lie on the couch -- but that approach was absolutely wrong for me. I made it clear that I was struggling, and I think he felt torn about it, where on one hand it seemed like something warmer and more dynamic would be better, but on the other, the whole Freud thing was supposed to work. So it was like he just clammed up about the whole thing.

I don't know, maybe something like that is happening now. Now that I think about it, that does add an extra dimension to it -- I wonder whether he feels guilty about having a less flexible schedule, and that's why he keeps acting like that fact is upsetting me (it doesn't), rather than the fact that he made certain promises a while ago and then suddenly stopped keeping them without any explanation. Hmm... I think I might owe you $150.

Originally Posted by Antimatter

I'm so sorry you are going through this. So, so sorry!

Originally Posted by healed84

I am so sorry to here this sallybrown I am hoping you and your T can come to some kind of resolution soon!!

Thanks guys!

Originally Posted by adel34

Hi Sally,
I'm really sorry this is happening! This totally sucks.
If it was me, this would make me crazy and feel totally unsafe in therapy. It's hard enough for me to tell someone I didn't like what they said or it upset me or whatever, and then to have the therapist just defend themselves would be too much. And I couldn't take having to go through the whole emotionally draining process of threatening to leave either!
I had a little bit of this go on with me with a previous t. I was going through so much with family issues, reporting emotional abuse to professionals in my sister's life, trying to figure out safe living options for myself for after college ETC. My t said time and time again when I would ask for help finding resources about all this," I'm not a social worker. What you're asking me to do is casework." The real kicker for me was when I applied to the state department of mental health for services, and she'd never heard of them and had no idea how to fill out the forms, or even how to write a five axis diagnosis! And her response when I was frustrated about this and even crying was, first to not even notice that I was crying, and second to say," Why would I know about this? I don't work in a clinic!" She was totally flustered about having to fill out the forms, and again kept saying she wasn't "set up" to do this kind of thing.
So I left her. We'd been working together for over a year, but I couldn't take that kind of attitude. If I were you I would leave and find someone who could admit when they were wrong and not play this stupid game, and actually take responsiblity for their own issues. But that's just me.
Please keep us posted!

Gosh, that sounds like such a nightmare! Thank you for relating, though -- it is, indeed, infuriating when it feels like someone's just not even trying to engage. Obviously your T had her own issues with venturing into any new territory at all... it seems even more insensitive to me that you were asking her for some pretty concrete things and she couldn't even bring herself to try. Ugh!

It might be time for a new T, I dunno. That's kinda why I want to take a break first and just not be talking about this 3-4 times a week with him. I'm also hoping the break gives him time to pull it together and think of something that might fix this, because I'm out of ideas. Not holding my breath, though.

Originally Posted by TheBunnyWithin

I agree with all that button has said. He sounds like kind of a jerk, actually. He needs to get his head together. Take a break, and if he doesn't come round, get yourself a new T. You deserve better than this.

Thanks Bunny! Yeah, he is usually a really nice guy actually. But this jerk side of him is really just... not fun to deal with. And I don't think I should have to deal with a jerk side at all.

Originally Posted by My kids are cool

Ah, Sally, I am so sorry this has been happening! How incredibly frustrating and sad. You and your T have done some great work together, and I hope that he can get his stuff together and address this with you.

Aw thanks MKAC. Yeah, we have done really good things together... I owe him a lot, really, for my getting to where I am now. When things are good, they are so good! But when things are bad... aaaaaagggh. I hope he can pull it together too. Right now I have no expectations, just looking for a reprieve and giving both of us a chance to rest up and see if we can give it one more try before I give up on him.

Thanks everyone for your responses and hugs. It's so therapeutic just to talk about it! We'll see what happens tomorrow... I sent him an e-mail (same one I mentioned in responding to hankster) saying that I was thinking about it earlier today, and I really wanted to ask him if he felt he'd done everything possible to heal the rift that has been developing between us. Then I realized that neither answer would make me feel better: "yes" would mean this is the best he thinks he can do, and this is just not good enough for me; "no" would mean he is holding off his best effort for some later time, when it already feels like it's too late. Ugh.

[unaluna]

That we will leave IS a fear of theirs. My T and I discussed this recently; what was interesting to me was that, he was acting on his mother issues, and I was acting on mine. But he was worried I would act on HIS mother issues, ie HE was experiencing plain old transference towards me. This realization has freed us both up.
I have complained from Day One that no T would ever be smart enough for me. But now I see how that is my major complaint about my parents actually not being competent to take care of me, and them not being able or willing to understand me. Now my sessions are more dialogue than (my) monologue, and it is becoming more important to me that I understand T, than that he understands me. For a while there, I was starting to question how, or if, anybody ever really understood anyone else.

[SallyBrown]

Originally Posted by hankster

That we will leave IS a fear of theirs. My T and I discussed this recently; what was interesting to me was that, he was acting on his mother issues, and I was acting on mine. But he was worried I would act on HIS mother issues, ie HE was experiencing plain old transference towards me. This realization has freed us both up.
I have complained from Day One that no T would ever be smart enough for me. But now I see how that is my major complaint about my parents actually not being competent to take care of me, and them not being able or willing to understand me. Now my sessions are more dialogue than (my) monologue, and it is becoming more important to me that I understand T, than that he understands me. For a while there, I was starting to question how, or if, anybody ever really understood anyone else.

Hankster, yes. Totally. I feel like a lot of traditional therapeutic stances (just like a lot of parenting baloney) does not give the client enough credit. We're not stupid. We aren't resisting improvement. You said something in another thread about tactics and I HATE tactics. Actually tactics were a source of the last one of these conflicts between me and T, where he was trying to adopt the "cold and distant" dogma of the Freudian camp, but did not tell me he was going to do that. Like I wasn't going to notice a difference. Understanding is absolutely a two-way street.

I like that for the most part, T DOES give me credit for being perceptive and having a good grasp of the theory behind a lot of this stuff, to the point of being able to tell the difference between something being difficult and something not working. But sometimes it just blows up.

Today was not good . Indeed, at the end there was a whole "tactic" thing that came up. By the end of the session (we went WAY over time), I was almost yelling, as close to yelling as I get with someone who isn't related or married to me. The slight Boston accent I had before college began to rear its head, as it is wont to do when I am really incensed.

Last night we talked on the phone, and we talked about what I'd said about wanting to ask him if he was really doing everything he could. He said yes, and I was just so disappointed and crushed. "No" would have made me really angry, but at least it would have given me a little hope. What do you do when someone's best isn't good enough?

And then this morning... well, we talked a lot, and he was again getting chronology mixed up. And the chronology is actually really important for this particular issue. One of the major events was one he didn't even really remember (which is ok in and of itself, I could see why it would have seemed small at the time), the other he had mixed up, and said something like, "I can't imagine myself saying something like that after already knowing X." Well YOU DID. And finally I just said that it didn't even seem like he had tried to go back and figure out what happened, and who said what when, and try to understand why he did what he did. I felt like he kept saying things like, "Well I don't remember, but I don't think I would mean X," or "That doesn't seem like it would have been my intention," when I suggest a possible reason for his behavior.

And he said, "You're right. I haven't gone back to my notes or e-mails about this."

My actual response: "WHAT THE F*** IS THAT??"

And then he went on to explain the stupid theory, that there was a reason why he was only going on my perception of events and correcting things when they seemed to be off, blah blah, and I said I GET IT. He asked me to explain, and of course I know why. Normally, he'd want to stick with the way I saw things, MY truth, in order to keep the focus on me and my thought process. But he wasn't really doing that. He was sort of half-correcting based on information he didn't even remember. I told him he couldn't have it both ways, and anyway now is not the time.

He said, "But this is the opposite of what you said, that you get tired of my explaining where I'm coming from." UGH. "I get tired of your explaining irrelevant aspects of where you're coming from that don't have to do with why I'm upset! Then you DON'T explain the things I keep saying I don't understand!"

And in the end, he started twisting my words around. Like I said, this has to do with scheduling, and in part that he said one thing at one time, then said the opposite without acknowledging that he'd even said the first thing. I can't deal with that s*** and will not have it in therapy. He keeps coming back to thinking that what I'm really upset about is that time that was available is no longer available, but I'm not: I am upset about feeling he's not trustworthy when he says that he will have a certain availability no matter what happens with my job or location.

He had tried to correct this somewhat before by saying that if I HAD changed location, he WOULD have made that time available again, so it's not accurate for me to think he'd have just said, "Oh well, guess we can't meet." I found this irritating because it's not what I'm upset about. He keeps insisting it's important I know that, and it probably is, but NOT NOW. I told him that even though that might be the case IF I had changed location, I haven't changed location, and what I did do was change jobs, and he has been a pain in the ***** about accomodating that. And he said "So it IS about the time!" My actual response: "NO. It's about your being an a**h*** about the time."

I left when I was about to really start ugly-crying. I was so upset, so distraught. I didn't even plan to write about all this but I'm just so frustrated. With a little time to calm down, I realize that I really can forgive all of this... if he were just sorry. None of it is a big deal. So he forgot to tell me that what he said he could do before, he could no longer do starting a few months ago. It happens. You just say, "I'm so sorry, I never told you, I can't make that time anymore. Let me look at my schedule and we'll see what we can do -- it will work out." But no.

I think what really bothers me from today, though, is his not looking back at old e-mails and his notes and seeing why he f***ed this up so badly. It means he doesn't really even feel the need to figure this out even just for himself. It means that even though he said he's doing everything he can, he didn't do this. I even asked him, "So if I just decided to stop coming back, and sometime a few months from now you found it in yourself to go back over this, and you saw that everything I said was true and made sense, what would you think? Would that be ok? Would you feel good about it?" He said no. AAAAAGGGHHHH.

Thus begins my time away. I've been avoiding just e-mailing him and saying that I have no real reason to wait, I may as well quit now. If it's at the breaking point and he doesn't even want to check his notes...

It's making me so sad, though. I got some referrals from my pdoc, who coincidentally I also had to see today, and as I look these people up I keep thinking of ways in which they are not T. T was a math major (yeah I don't know either) and gets all my lame math and science jokes. I am thoroughly spoiled with the amount of time I get from him. He knows everything about me. He saw me through some of the hardest years of my life. He can be really sweet. He is a vegetarian who like Pink Floyd and is well-read. WHY can't this just work. Sad

[unaluna]

I told my T that I think your T is trying to tell you that there is something your H isn't telling you, and my T said, well, why wouldn't her T just SAY that then? And I was like, oh, right...
Then my T though there might be something your T is not fully conscious of (in himself), as my T was. Hope this helps BTW, I only brought this up to T cos it helped me see something in my own situation, which I forget right now what that was...

[pbutton]

Originally Posted by SallyBrown

as I look these people up I keep thinking of ways in which they are not T.

I feel for you & can't really think of anything helpful to say to you. However, I SO SO SO SO SO SO can relate to the comment I quoted above. I STILL do this and it is painful. I'm even starting to dig T2 just ever so slightly a little bit - yet tonight I cried most of the way home from work because T1 waved me back into the office in a different way than T2 does. Seriously. I wouldn't WANT T2 to imitate T1. I just miss the stuff that made T1 uniquely T1. It hurts.

I so get you on this.

[SallyBrown]

Originally Posted by hankster

I told my T that I think your T is trying to tell you that there is something your H isn't telling you, and my T said, well, why wouldn't her T just SAY that then? And I was like, oh, right...
Then my T though there might be something your T is not fully conscious of (in himself), as my T was. Hope this helps BTW, I only brought this up to T cos it helped me see something in my own situation, which I forget right now what that was...

I've once or twice brought up stuff that I've read here in therapy -- like you say, if it brings up something else that's happening. I appreciate your T's insight, it's kind of good to hear that from someone on the other side too. I know I'm not crazy, but sometimes when things are so tough I question my most basic perceptions. I even started questioning the chronology of events because he seemed so sure things went differently. This is seriously making me nuts.

It's funny, he actually DID say during yesterday's session that he had felt guilty about not telling me when his availability changed (which I don't feel too bad about, that sounds like something I would do too), and about having less time (also which I don't feel bad about, it's inconvenient but it is what it is). So it was a great in for me to be like, "Well the last couple times you felt conflicted or guilty about something, we wound up in the same place as we are now." He didn't really go for it. But obviously something else is going on. I'm going to wait a week to calm down further and write to him to let him know that I think that instead of working on his guilt on his own time, he's passing it on to me as something I MUST be upset about no matter how much I say I'm not, and trying to work on that somehow. I'm aware I could be wrong but it fits the way things have been unfolding extremely well. Anyway he can chew on that (or, more likely, ignore it) for a week until I return.

I feel like it would take a miracle for this to work out.

[SallyBrown]

Originally Posted by pbutton

I feel for you & can't really think of anything helpful to say to you. However, I SO SO SO SO SO SO can relate to the comment I quoted above. I STILL do this and it is painful. I'm even starting to dig T2 just ever so slightly a little bit - yet tonight I cried most of the way home from work because T1 waved me back into the office in a different way than T2 does. Seriously. I wouldn't WANT T2 to imitate T1. I just miss the stuff that made T1 uniquely T1. It hurts.

I so get you on this.

Thanks so much pbutton, not much to say other than

[sittingatwatersedge]

SallyBrown, I totally get what you are saying.

how are you these days ?

[SallyBrown]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

SallyBrown, I totally get what you are saying.

how are you these days ?

Thank you for asking SAWE!

I am doing ok. Not good -- very very sad about T. But I am more productive at work when I don't get worked up into a confused rage 3-4 mornings out of the week, and I have more time.

I have pretty much decided this is it, though . Still can't quite bring myself to call a new T, but I do know I probably need one to at least walk me through the fallout.

He sent a couple messages last week -- one to just say he hoped I was doing ok and that I would reach out if I started doing really badly, the other to say he was going out of town but I should still reach out if things were bad. In the first one, he did say he had started going over his notes and e-mails. But... it didn't really make me feel better. It gave me a tiny amount of hope, but mostly it feels like it's way too late. I didn't respond to either, not really knowing what to say.

I'm going to send him an e-mail tonight letting him know where I'm at right now. Haven't decided whether to post it here. I so wish this wasn't happening.

Maybe he will have something hugely helpful to say after he reviews his notes? I'm crossing my fingers for you, Sally.

[SallyBrown]

Originally Posted by My kids are cool

Maybe he will have something hugely helpful to say after he reviews his notes? I'm crossing my fingers for you, Sally.

Thanks MKAC. I haven't ruled out the possibility that he might make some heroic effort and say something that restores enough faith for me to keep going. I wish I knew what he was thinking right now. BLAH. Going to go listen to November Rain again, then probably again.

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by SallyBrown

Thanks MKAC. I haven't ruled out the possibility that he might make some heroic effort and say something that restores enough faith for me to keep going. I wish I knew what he was thinking right now. BLAH. Going to go listen to November Rain again, then probably again.

November Rain is totally *****in'. I used to be able to play it on the piano when I was in high school, but I doubt I could anymore.

I'm so sorry this saga is still going on and I understand your sadness and anger. If faced with a similar situation, I probably would handle it much worse than you are. You're a strong woman!

[~EnlightenMe~]

((((Sally)))))),
You are a very strong person. It does sound like T is projecting somthing onto you that isn't yours, unfortunately. You said you might write him, just a thought, maybe giving him another week or so since he is now going through the emails will help him sort it out himself.

I just went through a similar incident with my therapist and we ended up giving up, terminating. Oddly, just like yours, my T turned from being a normal person to a clinical Freudian like therapist. Maybe aliens are swooping down and replacing our therapists? I swear, I just can't/couldn't figure it out and that mad hair-brained explanation sounds like the best one I could come up with, lol.

I hope that your outcome is the one that best suits you, whether it is to stay or go. I wish you the best of luck! Keep us posted.

[WikidPissah]

(((Sally))) I didn't see this the first time around, but I want to comment now.

I know the feeling, being there with my own t. Sometimes he is superT and a tremendous help and support. But he only gets that way when I have taken a break or am about to step off. Best wishes to you my friend. I hope things work out for the best.

[SallyBrown]

Originally Posted by Chopin99

November Rain is totally *****in'. I used to be able to play it on the piano when I was in high school, but I doubt I could anymore.

I'm so sorry this saga is still going on and I understand your sadness and anger. If faced with a similar situation, I probably would handle it much worse than you are. You're a strong woman!

Nice! I'll just call you Axl from now on

I like to think I'm a tough chick, but oh, if you saw the e-mail I sent him last week you might not think I'm handling it so well! I'd copy it here, but it would probably be hard to read through all the asterisks.

Originally Posted by Antimatter

((((Sally)))))),
You are a very strong person. It does sound like T is projecting somthing onto you that isn't yours, unfortunately. You said you might write him, just a thought, maybe giving him another week or so since he is now going through the emails will help him sort it out himself.

I just went through a similar incident with my therapist and we ended up giving up, terminating. Oddly, just like yours, my T turned from being a normal person to a clinical Freudian like therapist. Maybe aliens are swooping down and replacing our therapists? I swear, I just can't/couldn't figure it out and that mad hair-brained explanation sounds like the best one I could come up with, lol.

I hope that your outcome is the one that best suits you, whether it is to stay or go. I wish you the best of luck! Keep us posted.

Yeah, I read a little bit about your situation too . My T and I have definitely had moments like that, where suddenly a boundary pops out of nowhere, and he reacts differently than he normally would for reasons that I have no way of knowing about, until he discloses them. He's always been kind of Freud-y, and that's pretty much been the source of our other problems, too. But yeah, it's like he gets possessed by the spirit of Sigmund Freud from time to time and suddenly starts being inexplicably closed off and weird and defensive! Freudian pod-people... you may be on to something...

Thanks for your response I did send him a long e-mail last night (timed so he would hopefully get it after dealing with all his family stuff for the evening, but with enough time for him to set it aside before Monday morning), and told him that although I still think we need another week before we meet in person again, that it was ok if he didn't respond. Now I'm thinking that might have been a mistake, as I'm getting really anxious about his not responding. So if he doesn't write back by tomorrow morning I think I'll just ask him to confirm that he received it. For some reason that seems like it would help, even if I don't know what he's thinking about it.

Originally Posted by WikidPissah

(((Sally))) I didn't see this the first time around, but I want to comment now.

I know the feeling, being there with my own t. Sometimes he is superT and a tremendous help and support. But he only gets that way when I have taken a break or am about to step off. Best wishes to you my friend. I hope things work out for the best.

Yeah, that definitely a big part of what drives me CRAZY about it. Waiting until I say, "OK, I'm leaving," to really step it up. Thanks for the well wishes