[AllyIsHopeful]

I am struggling right now over boundaries with my Therapist.

But my problem is that there are not any. All of these realizations have been with me for a while, now; but they have become more apparent since joining this site and reading about other experiences.
I feel like I am in too deep at this point. I have seen her for about 10 months already, but it feels like a lifetime. We have been through a tremendous amount of life circumstances together. There have been moments where she realized she was one of the only people I could rely on and moments where she knew she was just a puzzle piece in my support system.

I am in my twenties and my T is the same age as my mom, who I've always had issues with and have even been estranged from a few times in my life. I feel like I instantly viewed my therapist as this mother-figure that I had been deprived of my whole life. I have had many women in my life but with her something just clicked ever since the first session.

It doesn't help that her approach is so humanistic. She gave me her personal # and said I could call when I felt I needed it. Somehow the texting communication came in to play as well. It started as strictly appointment scheduling changes/inquiries but moved eventually to talking about anything somehow.

There have been many other ways boundaries have been crossed from T/client relationship to some other uncategorized/unidentifiable relationship.
It's so confusing to me. The worst is now I'm too the point where I am so attached and used to the way things are that I think I would fall apart if things changed.

Our relationship has been healing but it has caused so many other problems for me.

Sorry this is all over the place but I needed to vent and talk about it. I feel so depressed right now and this is only making it worse.

Thanks for reading.

It's your choice. You're aware that the relationship isn't functioning as it should. I think you seem to have enought awareness to move on.

[Arha]

It does sound as though moving on might be a good thing, but it might be worth first trying to create some boundaries within the relationship. I suggest this for two reasons:
it may be possible to improve the therapeutic relationship, and still get what you need (note: not want ) from it
it may make the process of withdrawing and changing to another T easier

I could be wrong, but I don't know that it will hurt to try pulling back a bit.

Whenever you go to call on the phone or email, ask yourself whether it can wait till the next session. Really try to do this.
Also ask yourself, is this therapeutic or friendship based? It is trickier to answer, but worth trying.
If the T notices and asks you about you pulling back, tell them you were concerned about turning the relationship into something other than a therapeutic one. If they are a good T, they will be understanding and supportive, and encourage independence.

[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by _Mouse

It's your choice. You're aware that the relationship isn't functioning as it should. I think you seem to have enought awareness to move on.

It's not that easy. Maybe you missed the part about the attachment and how far it has gotten before arriving to this realization?

I'm really hear for guidance and support and really looking to relate to people who are in the same boat or have possibly experienced something similar.

If it were as easy as "hmm this doesn't feel right, I think I need to move on..." I would never have stumbled upon this site or initiated discussion.

[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by _Mouse

It's your choice. You're aware that the relationship isn't functioning as it should. I think you seem to have enought awareness to move on.

Originally Posted by Hawkspur

It does sound as though moving on might be a good thing, but it might be worth first trying to create some boundaries within the relationship. I suggest this for two reasons:
it may be possible to improve the therapeutic relationship, and still get what you need (note: not want ) from it
it may make the process of withdrawing and changing to another T easier

I could be wrong, but I don't know that it will hurt to try pulling back a bit.

Whenever you go to call on the phone or email, ask yourself whether it can wait till the next session. Really try to do this.
Also ask yourself, is this therapeutic or friendship based? It is trickier to answer, but worth trying.
If the T notices and asks you about you pulling back, tell them you were concerned about turning the relationship into something other than a therapeutic one. If they are a good T, they will be understanding and supportive, and encourage independence.

Thanks for this response, it offers good insight. I will begin to use some of these methods in the future before contacting her.
It's just hard because now I almost feel as if she is a part of my life and not just a therapist. So I don't know how to cope with losing that or moving on from it.
I feel as if my world will fall apart without her. It would probably make more sense if I could give details of stuff that has happened this year but I don't think anyone would care to read all of that so I left it out.
Honestly it's exhausting.

[brillskep]

Do you feel safe enough in your relationship with her that you can trust talking about what you've told us here, without necessarily having to change something right away? It might help to bring this awareness into the relationship and decide together what (if anything) to do about it for now.

Originally Posted by Hopelessly Hopeful

I am struggling right now over boundaries with my Therapist.

But my problem is that there are not any. All of these realizations have been with me for a while, now; but they have become more apparent since joining this site and reading about other experiences.
I feel like I am in too deep at this point. I have seen her for about 10 months already, but it feels like a lifetime. We have been through a tremendous amount of life circumstances together. There have been moments where she realized she was one of the only people I could rely on and moments where she knew she was just a puzzle piece in my support system.

I am in my twenties and my T is the same age as my mom, who I've always had issues with and have even been estranged from a few times in my life. I feel like I instantly viewed my therapist as this mother-figure that I had been deprived of my whole life. I have had many women in my life but with her something just clicked ever since the first session.

It doesn't help that her approach is so humanistic. She gave me her personal # and said I could call when I felt I needed it. Somehow the texting communication came in to play as well. It started as strictly appointment scheduling changes/inquiries but moved eventually to talking about anything somehow.

There have been many other ways boundaries have been crossed from T/client relationship to some other uncategorized/unidentifiable relationship.
It's so confusing to me. The worst is now I'm too the point where I am so attached and used to the way things are that I think I would fall apart if things changed.

Our relationship has been healing but it has caused so many other problems for me.

Sorry this is all over the place but I needed to vent and talk about it. I feel so depressed right now and this is only making it worse.

Thanks for reading.

[healingme4me]

No, it's not easy, when transference reaches such a level. The T in hindsight, allowed for this boundary violation in giving you her personal #. And now, you are feeling your whole world would crash without her. Are you part of her life crisis', or was she just there for yours?

Message to T's...stop the madness, with allowing your personal time to be infringed upon. Don't know who or even where, but this is damaging.

No, it's not easy now, to walk away. You've bonded to her. Sounds like a frightening place to be. How hard, to get a new one? , remember, we can't buy friendship. Which is how to look at this.



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[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by brillskep

Do you feel safe enough in your relationship with her that you can trust talking about what you've told us here, without necessarily having to change something right away? It might help to bring this awareness into the relationship and decide together what (if anything) to do about it for now.

I feel safe enough in the sense that she won't leave or terminate me if I bring up this issue...but I also feel like she may be offended after all she's done for me. Like maybe a "why are you complaining?" type of response. That may be irrational though.

I'm just nervous it will change our whole dynamic.
Thanks for your response, it's much appreciated.

-Hope

[Asiablue]

Our relationship has been healing but it has caused so many other problems for me.

Can you expand on this? What problems is it causing you? Is it the worry that comes with the attachment?

When you contact her out of session, is it always conversation focussed on you or does she contact you first for general chat?

[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by healingme4me

No, it's not easy, when transference reaches such a level. The T in hindsight, allowed for this boundary violation in giving you her personal #. And now, you are feeling your whole world would crash without her. Are you part of her life crisis', or was she just there for yours?

Message to T's...stop the madness, with allowing your personal time to be infringed upon. Don't know who or even where, but this is damaging.

No, it's not easy now, to walk away. You've bonded to her. Sounds like a frightening place to be. How hard, to get a new one? , remember, we can't buy friendship. Which is how to look at this.



Sent from my LG-MS910 using Tapatalk 2

I agree. I do feel bitter that she allowed this because in the end, it is their responsibility to do everything possible to avoid unhealthy attachment and codependency.
I'm not sure if you're asking me if she has involved me with her personal issues or if that was a rhetorical question? Like maybe she is doing this to fill her own void?
She's been helping me through major crisis all year long. There has been so much help and so much of her time that was not paid for.
And now I'm not going to have insurance until next month and she offered to see me no charge until then. (And I go twice a week. She even has to stay way later than she would like to accommodate my work schedule)
So it does help to think in the context of "you can't buy friendship" but at the same time all of the boundary crossing really hasn't been paid for. She has even went out to eat with me after a session and paid for me.

This situation is super painful and tricky!

Thanks for the support.

-Hope

[AllyIsHopeful]

Originally Posted by Asiablue

Our relationship has been healing but it has caused so many other problems for me.

Can you expand on this? What problems is it causing you? Is it the worry that comes with the attachment?

When you contact her out of session, is it always conversation focussed on you or does she contact you first for general chat?

Yes, the problem is the attachment. She is the one who diagnosed me with an attachment disorder, yet she is harboring an attachment. It had gotten to the point where it literally makes me sick at times.

She has never actually contacted me first but in sessions she always mentioned that she thought about checking up on me but wanted me to initiate contact since I have issues reaching out to people. There was one weekend she lost her phone and she panicked about losing phone numbers so she accessed her contacts through the cloud on her computer and she saved her son's number, her friend's number, and mine...she said "that's all I needed".
Her reasoning was she wanted to be accessible if I needed her. She works 12 hour days pretty much Monday through Friday I'm just one out of so many clients.

It's just confusing.

-Hope

[Asiablue]

Hmmm this is a hard one to advise on and really i think you need to speak to her to find out what her treatment plan is for you.

Because if you have an attachment disorder, then supporting you and teaching you how to become attached appropriately is important work and it does require a far more involved approach than traditional therapy relationships would allow for. So the boundaries will be more flexible for you. So maybe she isn't doing anything wrong.

Are you worried that the amount of time she is spending with you will burn her out?

[Syra]

Originally Posted by Hopelessly Hopeful

It's not that easy. Maybe you missed the part about the attachment and how far it has gotten before arriving to this realization?

I'm really hear for guidance and support and really looking to relate to people who are in the same boat or have possibly experienced something similar.

If it were as easy as "hmm this doesn't feel right, I think I need to move on..." I would never have stumbled upon this site or initiated discussion.

I get this, I think. I had the same issue. It isn't easy to put up boundaries that the T doesn't set up.
If I had to do it over, I would ask her if we could talk about the boundaries and how I feel inside when this or that happens.

As an example - I LOVE being able to email you and that you respond. it makes me feel like you'll always be there. I wonder if this is good for me.

or
When I'm allowed to do "x" sometimes I get physically sick. I don't undertsand why. I love my work with you. But something I'm not sure of.


would that help you? I don't know if it would help everyone. I don't even know if it would help me. I didn't try it. In thinking about it, it's what I decided I would do next time.

This is so difficult for you and it is not as easy as just moving in because there are many complication here, you are attached to her which is perhaps the most difficult thing to walk away of. Also you are healing but also being harmed unintentionally by a well meaning and kind therapist.
The question is I suppose is this keeping you stuck in this space or is it helping you with your relationships in real life and is she your only support still?
Has transference ever been brought up by either of you?

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[ScarletPimpernel]

If I get this wrong, I apologize. I can only relate to the details mentioned and comparing to my own experiences.

I have/had a lot of attachment issues in my life: over-attached, under-attached, sometimes both. It's like you want it so bad, but it's really not what you need.

My best advice is this: if your T really cares about you, your health, your goals...then she will be more than happy to work with you on your attachment too. I know the fear and the risk behind being that open. But at some point we have to take risks for ourselves. T's are our "doctors". We are their "patients". If you want a legitimate friendship with your T, the relationship will have to move outside the "zones" of professional, and it has to be mutual. Otherwise, if you want her to be your T, she needs to understand that.

I have recently had to open up to my T about issues I have in our own relationship. It's scary. My situation was actually opposite of yours, and I need my T to take down some boundaries (but there were more complicated issues mixed in with it). In the end, I'm glad I talked to her. We are back on the same page.

Just weigh everything out. Go through the possible pro's and con's of each decision. Then try to make a decision. If you still can't, then it's best to talk to your T anyways. That is her job whether or not it deals with her, whether or not she has her own attachment issues, and whether or not you're paying her.

It's a tough situation. I wish you the best of luck!

[Leah123]

I hear you feeling uncomfortable, but like Asia Blue, I wonder if you could explain the actual harm that has been done? I do not see where you have been harmed in this relationship.

I wanted to share a different perspective, that allowing attachment can be a very healing experience. Some therapists do recognize and encourage it knowing that certain clients can benefit from the reparative experience of finally expressing their neediness and not being rejected or forced into strict boundaries of only one 50 minute session per week. Extra, even frequent contact in and of itself is not necessarily negative, certainly not for all clients. In psychoanalysis, for example, clients are encouraged to have sessions three times a week.

Personally, I've seen tremendous benefits and progress with my current therapist who encourages in-between session contact. Yes, it is agitating sometimes to deal with the intensity level of such therapy, but very rewarding, and the attachment does lessen over time if the relationship is strong and the therapy effective, but how much time can vary, again, as each of us has unique needs.

[IndestructibleGirl]

I too would be interested in the details of the harm that you are referring too? How has the therapeutic relationship impinged upon your other relationships, and life in general?

I have old attachment injuries. Deep and crazy-making at times. My therapist has taken an approach that allows in between session contact, whenever I like, and she responds when she is able. That has been magic for me - done me the world of good to slowly, painstakingly, start believing on an instinctual level that someone is actually steadfastly emotionally available to me in an appropriate way. She is also seeing me for no fee at the moment. Words can't describe how much I appreciate this.

I think appropriate boundaries differ in each different client-therapist relationship. Is it worth considering that your anxiety around your boundaries may be a defense? Perhaps you can't quite believe yet that you have a relationship this precious, and so are looking for holes in it and 'proof' it is not what it seems?

Please do forgive me if I'm way off the mark - I'm in no way saying this is true for you and your situation, just playing devil's avocado

[Syra]

I don't know what it's like for HOpelessly HOpeful, but for me I don't think I could show you an injury. I know my thoughts drive me crazy all day long. I know I question my judgment when connecting with my T - did I do too much, am I not taking full advantage. And I worry worry worry whether what is happening is healthy. And this is with a T that maintains good boundaries. I didn't worry so much with the T that didn't keep good boundaries. Then I just felt really lucky - until it didn't work anymore.

I can't show you an injury. I'm functioning okay. most people wouldn't recognize the constant anxiety I experience, but it hurts to not even be able to trust myself.

[Lauliza]

I actually understand the pain this kind of attachment can foster, and I question the helpfulness of it if something in the relationship doesn't change. I think the goal is the generalize the attachment with your T to other people in your life, but I don't see how that can realistically happen. I have a hard time understanding how you can attach so intensely with someone when it is in the confines of a therapeutic or "professional" relationship (for lack of a better term).

I had this with my child psychiatrist who I saw from age 12 to 22. I never felt fully attached with my own mom. There was no emotion there. So she became a mother figure to me, teaching me about makeup, talking to me about friends and boys. I was very attached. I didn't even contact her between session, but she would see me on demand if needed.

When she left the state for a new job after I graduated from college, I was devastated. I called her office for an appointment and they told me she was gone. I never had a closure session with her felt abandoned. Her secretary assured me that she had gone over this with me but that it is common for patients to forget these details. She also said it was normal for me to be upset. I didn't forget the details, I was sure of that, we just never talked about her leaving.

So in the end, I just felt hurt again, and abandoned. She helped me through different incidents in my childhood and teens but the relationshop did nothing to help with building future attachments with other people. This I really had to learn on my own. I really never wanted to get involved with another psychiatrist or therapist again. I did see some but never bonded again until now, many years later. Even now I worry about the stregnth of the bond and dependence and wonder how helpful it really is to patients?

[Leah123]

Originally Posted by amee200

I actually understand the pain this kind of attachment can foster, and I question the helpfulness of it if something in the relationship doesn't change. I think the goal is the generalize the attachment with your T to other people in your life, but I don't see how that can realistically happen. I have a hard time understanding how you can attach so intensely with someone when it is in the confines of a therapeutic or "professional" relationship (for lack of a better term).

I had this with my child psychiatrist who I saw from age 12 to 22. I never felt fully attached with my own mom. There was no emotion there. So she became a mother figure to me, teaching me about makeup, talking to me about friends and boys. I was very attached. I didn't even contact her between session, but she would see me on demand if needed.

When she left the state for a new job after I graduated from college, I was devastated. I called her office for an appointment and they told me she was gone. I never had a closure session with her felt abandoned. Her secretary assured me that she had gone over this with me but that it is common for patients to forget these details. She also said it was normal for me to be upset. I didn't forget the details, I was sure of that, we just never talked about her leaving.

So in the end, I just felt hurt again, and abandoned. She helped me through different incidents in my childhood and teens but the relationshop did nothing to help with building future attachments with other people. This I really had to learn on my own. I really never wanted to get involved with another psychiatrist or therapist again. I did see some but never bonded again until now, many years later. Even now I worry about the stregnth of the bond and dependence and wonder how helpful it really is to patients?

The red flag here was that you two didn't apparently discuss or work through termination? That's a key phase of healing attachment issues, so it's no wonder you feel as you do. Properly handled termination, often where the door is always open for the client to return, can really ease the closure process, make it healing instead of off-putting as it was for you.

[Lauliza]

You're definitely right on that. I have never seen or spoken to my psychiatrist since. It was so poorly handled that I was hurt and insulted. She and her staff made me feel as if I was imagining things because they insisted that we HAD talked about termination. It was not a good experience.

[RTerroni]

I am struggling with boundary issues myself, I am still debating if I should mention that at my Intake on Monday.

[wotchermuggle]

To the original poster, I wanted to suggest a few things to you.

If you are feeling that there are not enough boundaries or they aren't clear, I'd suggest:

1. That you ask your therapist for clearer boundaries(ex. contact between sessions). If she doesn't provide clearer boundaries, ask her to explain the rationale for having such open boundaries.
2. Decide for yourself what you think you need and come up with a plan of action (eg. Do you want to cut out texting for any random reason? Perhaps you can limit yourself to a specific number of texts a week and then scale it back to only texting for appointment scheduling.)
   

[looking4polaris]

Hi,

This sounds like a really hard situation. Not that you shouldn't bring this up with your T, but have you considered consulting another T as an objective, professional sounding board? Even just for a single consultation? That way you wouldn't be giving up your attachment to your T, but you would have another T that could process this with you. Not that you can't do it here. Of course, you are welcome to do that, too. Good luck.

[growlithing]

I have basically the same issue. It's gotten better though because I haven't seen her in almost two weeks. I was seeing her for probably like 3 hours a day five days a week for 9 weeks. Not all of it was individual I should add. But even still, that is a LOT of contact and boundaries were blurred.

T and I set very strict rules on outside contact. It is for emergencies or scheduling only. However, if T is worrying too much about me being in my abusive parents house and wants a quick update, she may just shoot me a "are you still breathing" email. She never responds to me when I email her unless she wants to just say a line of general support.

T said she doesn't actually believe that me feeling like she is my mom is bad. She thinks I need to experience being mothered and that's why she plays the role with me. She also is naturally maternal to me. The problem arises when I start asking for more than she can give. She says no mother can fill the shoes I want her to and when she lays down that boundary, I feel rejected.

So I'm not the best person to answer this, but do you think you could try discussing with her having no outside contact unless it is a crisis? That might help.

Also, T is a part of your life. Just because I can't be a part of my T's personal life doesn't mean she isn't part of mine. I know a lot of you will passionately disagree with this, but if I am actively working on accepting/learning how to keep healthy boundaries with people, what is so wrong with me literally thinking my T is my mother? "Because she isn't actually your mother". So? My biological mother didn't even start to fill the role. How am I supposed to know what the role even looks like? T does fill parts of it. I want to tell her when I do things right, she comforts me when I'm sad, she helps me take care of myself. I just need to work on accepting that no one, not even if my biological mother completely changed, can totally play the role I want her to. No one can actually be there 24/7 whenever I need her.