[PeeJay]

The thread discussing drama and therapy seems to have been deleted. I guess all the infighting caused that. So be nice this time guys.

Dang it. I really liked my response to that old thread, which could be summed up as, "I love drama. I dislike unintelligent drama."

Anyway, I came across this in my readings today and I wanted to share. I am so tempted to just terminate on my T because T made a mistake.

But this helps me to be brave and go to the session:

... Some clients try to make psychotherapy into a sort of melodrama: “I took an overdose, and my therapist came to my apartment with the police, broke the door down, and rescued me!” It’s all quite similar to a heroine who, after being bound, gagged, and tied to railroad tracks by the dark villain, is rescued just in time by the hero.

... The psychological appeal of such theatricality derives from the preverbal stage of infancy. At this stage of life, an infant is completely helpless and depends on a parent to rescue it from its basic physiological needs. At first, the mother assumes the most importance—especially for feeding and emotional bonding—and then, as the infant develops socially, the father takes on more importance as a protector who can guide the child into the social world.

If the parents perform their tasks adequately, the child will develop the verbal communication skills necessary for proper social functioning.

For many persons, however, because of the family dysfunction in which they grew up as children, communication wasn’t so much communication as an entangled mass of innuendoes, lies, secrets, and betrayals. And underneath all those innuendoes, lies, secrets, and betrayals that have bound and gagged you psychologically can be found an unspoken desire to be understood without having to say anything. It’s a desire to be rescued from the dark villain—who symbolizes the missing father—by a fantasy heroic father who, in his intuitive perception of your needs, will make you feel loved—that is, special.

Therefore, having suffered from family dysfunction as a child, you now seek healing from your emotional pain through psychotherapy. Yes, the healing process of psychotherapy is a sort of rescue from dysfunction, but it is an unpretentious process based on learning the honest communication you failed to learn as a child.

In fact, your seeing the fantasy you created about your psychotherapist is genuine progress, because it makes things more simple and less melodramatic. Once you let go of the desire to be “special,” you allow simple, honest, non-dramatic human communication to develop. But as long as you cling to the hope of being special, you actually obstruct the psychotherapy and prevent any real psychological change. Why? Because your fantasy of being special only hides your emotional pain—the pain of a child trying to rescue a father from his alcoholism—behind a dream of recovering the mentor, the real father, who never was.

More: Melodrama: Feeling special in psychotherapy

[winter4me]

This is interesting. ...I came to the conclusion, years ago, that some people suffer from what I call "Terminal Specialness", or "Toxic Specialness"----and I always felt in danger of falling into that------Guess I thought much of my mother who clearly had a, usually unspoken, belief that "no one" could understand her, no one had suffered what she had suffered...even as a kid, I remember wishing she would make some friends with the other moms on the block, (she had friends, but no one, till much later, to just have coffee with in the am...)---and as I got older, I realized she may have avoided them because they actually had related experiences growing up...in many ways she had been more "successful", but didn't really believe it, and feared being connected to others---(her friends generally had had worse experiences, surviving the holocaust for instance..----or totally different lives with privilege and money and she couldn't imagine they had problems....and when they did why they couldn't just "take care of it")---------
In fact, most of us have to grow up through some kind of dysfunction/difficulty. I think the problem really comes when, as noted, the communication is perverted, indirect, full of riddles/innuendoes and the feeling that there is something going on that no one is acknowledging, and you had better not try to say anything about it...
(so, of course as a child I did like stories of abandoned orphans whose father rescued them in the end--------but, then, I really wanted to be Gretel, and save my brother by pushing the wicked witch into the fire--but I Never understood how their Father could be less responsible for the situation than the "evil" stepmother---HE was the one that abandoned them in the forest after all-------------I do have a problem with the central figure of the evil female...
I am rambling, not enough coffee, not enough thought given to the subject.
So, why stop.
Years ago, during therapy, I had a brief but potent vision of my therapist and I sitting inside the shell of a giant egg, this office distorted, as it would be, around us, he sat in the smaller end of the egg, I sat in the larger end, the light was lovely.
Afraid the egg didn't hatch though.

[stopdog]

I am not much into drama as a concept - I am not a movie or theatre goer usually. I like comedy and opera - but there I just listen and don't follow the libretto.
I can be overwhelmed by too much punctuation (exclamation points, for example, are way over the top for almost everything in my opinion). The idea of being rescued by anyone is distressing (why would I need to be rescued? Am I such an idiot I can't get myself out of something? What is the cost of being rescued - what obligation to the rescuer exists? etc). I find the therapist to be over the top dramatic sometimes but I generally put it down to her trying to get a reaction from me.
So I don't find therapy all that dramatic for me.

[Asiablue]

"Terminal Specialness", or "Toxic Specialness"

hahhaa i love these terms. I find that trait completely obnoxious and avoid people like that both online and in real life, although i've come across them far more online than in real life. I wonder why that is?

I totally get the wanting to be rescued by your therapist and it makes sense in a lot of ways but actually acting it out over and over is one way to get people real sick of you, real fast! I know these types of people need help too, despite their undesirable "toxic specialness" but i personally cannot abide it. Which is why i won't indulge them. I'm glad others can feel like they can support them because they do need help, but on this forum and in real life i feel like some people try to become rescuers or enablers and are really wasting their time.

[Asiablue]

Originally Posted by stopdog

The idea of being rescued by anyone is distressing (why would I need to be rescued? Am I such an idiot I can't get myself out of something? What is the cost of being rescued - what obligation to the rescuer exists? etc). I find the therapist to be over the top dramatic sometimes but I generally put it down to her trying to get a reaction from me.
So I don't find therapy all that dramatic for me.

The fantasy of being rescued isn't a reality, the person who wishes this is more than capable of rescuing themselves and in fact in psychotherapy that is the desired outcome. The desire comes from a learned helplessness, that people will swoop in and do the uncomfortable work for them, it allows them to stay in a childlike place for longer. Sometimes it is sheer manipulation of wish for attention or proof that someone really cares about them, a test if you like. Or sometimes it's a passive aggressive way of getting needs met.

[PeeJay]

Originally Posted by winter4me

I am rambling, not enough coffee, not enough thought given to the subject.
So, why stop.

That made me laugh out loud.

I'm told (by media) that the entire generation of now-20-somethings is convinced of its own above-average specialness.

Personally, I like the formula for success recently highlighted in the New York Times. You need three things.

1) A superiority complex — a deep-seated belief in their exceptionality.
2) Insecurity, a feeling that you or what you’ve done is not good enough.
3) And impulse control.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/26/op...s-success.html

I am simultaneously convinced of my own superiority and my own inferiority. The formula worked well for me until crippling anxiety made me suicidal. Thus, here I am posting to a psychotherapy forum in the morning.

One way I got through the hardships of childhood and early adulthood was to stick to this mantra: "Nobody cares. Nobody cares about me. Everyone has their own problems. I need to take care of me."

And that worked until I hit my mid-30s. Then I began to think, "If nobody cares about me, well then neither do I. I'm out of here."

And since then, I've gone in the direction of, say, winter4me's mother. I'm convinced that nobody could understand what I went through. Nobody understands my problems. I'm special in that I suffered. And the born-privileged can't really be suffering because they've always been rich.

My biggest aversion to melodramatic behavior, however, is that life isn't that hard. It is often an unintelligent way to look at life, lacking creativity about problem solving.

Stopdog, I thought of this article when I read your post on exclamation points:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/03/fa...anted=all&_r=0

[Freewilled]

So what's the difference between the average client who goes to therapy and the attention-seeking client? How do you differentiate? Sometimes I feel like the very act of going to therapy is in and of itself, very attention-seeking and hate myself for it /:

[Asiablue]

I love exclamation marks!!!!!!!!!!

[Yearning0723]

I think most people (ideally) have parents who a) think they're special and b) want to protect them. When we're kids, if we have that safe home base we can always go back to and know there are people there who love us, then we feel comfortable exploring the world on our own and learning self-reliance. If we don't have that need met, we will be constantly looking for it. I don't think it's necessarily learned helplessness; I think it just feels a lot better to have someone else comfort you after a panic attack than to comfort yourself. Sure, you might feel good about yourself for being independent, but other than that, it feels much nicer to have someone else be there for you.

I used to do that melodramatic thing with my former ED T when I was about sixteen. The funny thing was, I never cared if I was her FAVORITE client but I definitely wanted to be the client she felt most sorry for because then she would protect me and stand up for me to my dad. (Which she did.) Which was a lovely arrangement because I couldn't stand up to him myself and tell him that I need him to pay even a little bit of attention to me, so I just acted really pathetic and attention starved with ED T and she would write my dad emails commending him on taking me out for lunch one day this week and reminding him that what I really needed was for him to spend more time with me because I felt ignored and neglected. Also, because I acted so pathetic, she would give me hugs and tell me she really cared about me.

She drove all the way to my house (45 minutes from her office, which was in her house) to see me because my dad didn't want to take me and she would sit beside me on the couch and she would compliment me on my dolls that were always sitting in the living room and how pretty their hair ribbons were and how their dresses all matched and we would talk about my week and she would tell me she was proud of me for eating better and she would hug me. The kind of care she showed me filled that hole inside me a little bit, but it could never be enough, because she wasn't my mom and I knew it. I was always hungry for more.

In hindsight, it's probably good that my father terminated our sessions well before ED had been cured, after maybe eight or nine sessions, because he thought I didn't actually have an ED; I was just too lazy to cook for myself. (????????? How about the fifteen hours a week or so I spent planning meals and meticulously measuring portions, reading ingredients, shopping for food, and so on?) If I'd kept seeing her, the obsession would have gotten worse and worse. When she left I relapsed and I was miserable, but eventually (two years later) I learned that she couldn't cure me of my ED; I was the only one who could do that, and I did.

I had similar situations with a teacher when I was thirteen and my mother had just abandoned me and I needed someone to latch onto. I wanted to be the most pathetic kid ever so Ms. B would love me like a daughter and take care of me like I needed to be taken care of. She did take care of me (A LOT) and fed into the desire to feel special. I think I actually was really special to her though; she told me at the end of the year that I was her best student. She actually said it when she was giving me a hug; she whispered it in my ear and I melted. I told her she wasn't supposed to say that (because I didn't know how to accept a compliment like that) and she just gave me the sweetest smile and said, "It's okay; it's just between us. You won't tell anyone." (This became the blueprint for my most recent teacher debacle, although that one ended quite amicably.)

I used to act out situations over and over where Ms. B would have to take care of me, maybe because I was testing her or maybe because I needed attention. One time I went to my mother's house at lunch time when my mother wasn't there to see my brother, and I told a classmate to tell Ms. B where I was going. It was fine, but I KNEW that her knowing that was going to worry her, and sure enough, when I came back, she was in the main office pacing around and she ran to me and gave me a big hug and said, "I was so worried about you! You must promise to never, ever do that again." And I felt completely seen and cared for and loved in that moment. How could I not want more of that, especially at age thirteen after my mother had just left me?

I always had this fantasy that Ms. B or ED T or a million other mother figures that came and went would adopt me, that they would whisk me away from my life of a father who ignored me, a stepmother who hated me, a mother who refused to admit she had hurt me and tried to get me institutionalized just so no one would believe me when I said that. (This fantasy stemmed from watching Matilda way too many times. I had that movie memorized word for word. It was pathetic.)

But age thirteen is much too late for that. So, I learned. And I'm still learning how to take care of myself, but definitely doing a lot better with that. And I don't have those fantasies anymore, or that need for specialness, or that need to act this stuff out to get attention. I don't need to exaggerate to get my needs met; I'm learning how to just state them and be honest with other people. It feels much better that way, anyway.

[PeeJay]

Originally Posted by Freewilled

So what's the difference between the average client who goes to therapy and the attention-seeking client? How do you differentiate? Sometimes I feel like the very act of going to therapy is in and of itself, very attention-seeking and hate myself for it /:

YES! I get this!

Is talking about myself for an entire hour attention-seeking?

I think the difference is that the so-called attention seeking clients are not the ones asking this question.

If you're trying to be respectful of your therapist's boundaries and all that stuff, I think you're ok.

I mean, if it weren't for people wanting to focus on themselves for an hour, therapists would be out of business.

We can argue that therapy:
1) helps one live one's best life

2) helps one to be a better spouse, parent, friend, boss, teacher, or human being,

3) allows one to outsource a function (trusted listener) that used to be filled by parents, communities and churches

In other words, lots of cultures the world over have trusted others to talk to. I grew up blue collar working class and the trusted listeners that the adults talked to were the hairdresser and aunts and uncles!

I also think of Wayan Nuriasih, from Eat Pray Love, who was a traditional Balinese medicine woman. People go to her, talk about their problems, and receive some herbs.

Chinese culture has similar things.

Therapy is just our version. Dang expensive, too. And we assign labels and education to the therapist, so they can feel more legit in our western society.

But you and I are not alone in needing and wanting someone to listen.

[Yearning0723]

Originally Posted by PeeJay

YES! I get this!

Is talking about myself for an entire hour attention-seeking?
I think the difference is that the so-called attention seeking clients are not the ones asking this question.

If you're trying to be respectful of your therapist's boundaries and all that stuff, I think you're ok.

I mean, if it weren't for people wanting to focus on themselves for an hour, therapists would be out of business.

We can argue that therapy:
1) helps one live one's best life

2) helps one to be a better spouse, parent, friend, boss, teacher, or human being,

3) allows one to outsource a function (trusted listener) that used to be filled by parents, communities and churches

In other words, lots of cultures the world over have trusted others to talk to. I grew up blue collar working class and the trusted listeners that the adults talked to were the hairdresser and aunts and uncles!

I also think of Wayan Nuriasih, from Eat Pray Love, who was a traditional Balinese medicine woman. People go to her, talk about their problems, and receive some herbs.

Chinese culture has similar things.

Therapy is just our version. Dang expensive, too. And we assign labels and education to the therapist, so they can feel more legit in our western society.

But you and I are not alone in needing and wanting someone to listen.

Well, let me ask you, is going to a doctor and telling him/her about chronic back pain and explaining your medical history and what's been going on for you this week, that your back hurt when you were bending down for this and when you were lying down at night, but it didn't hurt when you were sitting in your ergonomic chair, attention seeking? Or are you trying to get help for a very real problem that is the doctor's job to help you with?

Ts are exactly the same as doctors in this case. You have an issue. They have the expertise to help you work through the issue. You pay them for it. Both parties are happy.

[PeeJay]

Originally Posted by Yearning0723

But age thirteen is much too late for that. So, I learned. And I'm still learning how to take care of myself, but definitely doing a lot better with that. And I don't have those fantasies anymore, or that need for specialness, or that need to act this stuff out to get attention. I don't need to exaggerate to get my needs met; I'm learning how to just state them and be honest with other people. It feels much better that way, anyway.

I can totally relate to your obsession with teachers. I did this, too. So much so that when I graduated from high school, I cried for a straight week and kept in touch with those same teachers all through college.

Then in college, I latched onto my professors.

Then at my first jobs, I latched onto my bosses.

I was mothered and fathered by so many different people over the years.

I'm learning self-soothe skills now. "Parts work" really helps with that. Where some enlightened grown up part of you comforts and talks lovingly to the childlike parts that are stuck in the past.

[peaches100]

I found this information thought-provoking. And I agree with it, to a point.

The part I agree with is that if a person has been rejected in childhood by parents who didn't take care of them, then they often do enter therapy with that wish for the t to be the parent they never had who would love and protect them.

What I don't agree with is the viewpoint that those of us who struggle with the wish to be special to our t, or to be rescued when we are in pain, are purposely being helpless, manipulative, and passive agressive. I find these statements repugnant:

The desire comes from a learned helplessness, that people will swoop in and do the uncomfortable work for them, it allows them to stay in a childlike place for longer. Sometimes it is sheer manipulation of wish for attention or proof that someone really cares about them, a test if you like. Or sometimes it's a passive aggressive way of getting needs met.

There is much more behind the scenes than a selfish desire to be adored by our t's. Many of us have come from homes where we were treated like dirt, worthless, unloved, etc. Many of us also underwent some horrific events where we were in need of protection and didn't get it - such as being physically or se*ually abused. Naturally, we are going to enter therapy with some pretty deep needs to know that somebody in our life finally gives a crap about us, cares what happens to us, and will help us if we need it.

Obviously, over time, we learn (usually painfully!) that our t can't give us everything we missed out on as a child. That realization can feel devastating. The idea of having to deal with our own pain, and resolve our own traumas, can feel terrifying. After all, it brings back memories of having to do that as a child -- being in dire straits, alone, so afraid, and with nobody to gave a damn or help us.

It takes time to learn how to face these traumas and learn how to be our own parent and rescuer. For some of us, it's the hardest thing we will ever learn.

To characterize those of us who struggle in this way as "manipulative" or 'passive agressive" is not only simplistic, but very judgemental.

[Asiablue]

I think in your case yearning, that was all childhood yearnings, that is a very natural way for a kid to think, especially when they've been taught that their needs shouldn't exist. You've explained it very well, what your thinking was, the needs behind it etc. You learned from the experiences that it isn't realistic and you're now teaching yourself how to get you needs met in a healthy way.

Some people never learn that, and stay in that childlike place/fantasy into adulthood and i think that's when it becomes a bit obnoxious. (my word, my view of it, not everyone's) i think it's that refusal to grow, that total blindness of how their actions affects others, that complete disregard of the emotional roller-coaster they send people on that makes it very difficult to deal with.
Everyone would rather not grow-up, everyone has a child-like part in them that just wishes someone else could take care of everything, that in itself isn't unusual but when people force others to look after them by creating dramatic situations that a responsible person can't ignore, then the other person can feel very manipulated and resentful. They feel resentful that they are being made into something they don't want to be ie sole friend, sole parent, sole rescuer, they are put into a role they never asked for and eventually they get compassion fatigue and i think that's why people who create very dramatic situations constantly end up being "abandoned". Because the person they were using just caves in and can't do it anymore. It really quite sad actually.

[Yearning0723]

Originally Posted by PeeJay

I can totally relate to your obsession with teachers. I did this, too. So much so that when I graduated from high school, I cried for a straight week and kept in touch with those same teachers all through college.

Then in college, I latched onto my professors.

Then at my first jobs, I latched onto my bosses.

I was mothered and fathered by so many different people over the years.

I'm learning self-soothe skills now. "Parts work" really helps with that. Where some enlightened grown up part of you comforts and talks lovingly to the childlike parts that are stuck in the past.

My issue now is learning how to differentiate "unhealthy attachment" from "normal healthy relationship with an adult". T says the difference is that with the former, I can only see things from my perspective and am not respecting the other person's boundaries, but with the latter, I am transparent with them and try to see things from their point of view and respect their boundaries.

If only it was that simple!

T feels like my relationship with current mentor-figure (who happens to be an instructor at my school) is healthy because I'm respecting her boundaries and being honest with her, but I think it's unhealthy because it feels like the same sort of relationship with former teachers or ED T or Trauma T from when I was fourteen. Probably not for any rational reason, but simply because I feel just as good around her as I felt with all those people, and she thinks I'm special (and has said so) just like all those other people did. So, it's tough. I'm still learning.

[peaches100]

More quotes. . .

"hahahaha". . .

"I find that trait completely obnoxious and avoid people like that both online and in real life. . ."

and. . .

"personally cannot abide it. . ."

Wow, Asiablue, until now, I liked reading your posts. But now that you've shown such a critical, disdainful viewpoint of people with issues like mine, I see a different side to you.

[PeeJay]

Originally Posted by Yearning0723

T feels like my relationship with current mentor-figure (who happens to be an instructor at my school) is healthy because I'm respecting her boundaries and being honest with her, but I think it's unhealthy because it feels like the same sort of relationship with former teachers or ED T or Trauma T from when I was fourteen. Probably not for any rational reason, but simply because I feel just as good around her as I felt with all those people, and she thinks I'm special (and has said so) just like all those other people did. So, it's tough. I'm still learning.

I'm a big fan of relying upon professors as mentors. It's wonderful that you have found a professor who sees you as special. Because you are, in many ways, and we all deserve to have someone view our uniqueness and cultivate us into adults.

Nobody does it all alone.

Also, with professor mentors, both sides do get something out of it. I think it can be healthy and apprentice-like.

Pop culture is rife with examples of how normal this is.
--Mr. Miyagi in Karate Kid
--Yoda in Star Wars
--Master Splinter in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles

I've also mentored younger people as well. It can be wonderful from the mentor side. And a deeper relationship than one can have with a therapist, too.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by Asiablue

The fantasy of being rescued isn't a reality, the person who wishes this is more than capable of rescuing themselves and in fact in psychotherapy that is the desired outcome. The desire comes from a learned helplessness, that people will swoop in and do the uncomfortable work for them, it allows them to stay in a childlike place for longer. Sometimes it is sheer manipulation of wish for attention or proof that someone really cares about them, a test if you like. Or sometimes it's a passive aggressive way of getting needs met.

I understood it was a fantasy - I was just giving how I viewed the idea of me being rescued.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by Yearning0723

Ts are exactly the same as doctors in this case. You have an issue. They have the expertise to help you work through the issue. You pay them for it. Both parties are happy.

I don't think that it is automatic that a therapist or a doctor do have the expertise. They may or may not have some useful information.

[PeeJay]

Originally Posted by peaches100

More quotes. . .

"hahahaha". . .

"I find that trait completely obnoxious and avoid people like that both online and in real life. . ."

and. . .

"personally cannot abide it. . ."

Wow, Asiablue, until now, I liked reading your posts. But now that you've shown such a critical, disdainful viewpoint of people with issues like mine, I see a different side to you.

Aww Peaches.

She may not have been referring exactly to what you're struggling with.

I don't know your story but many of us struggle with not knowing just how special we are supposed to feel or act.

One person sticking up for himself might be described as another person as selfish.

The bar is different for everyone. I think Asia meant people who demand to be the center of attention at all times. And of course those kinds of people end up with few friends.

Also, Asia might have someone specific in mind who behaves obnoxiously (to her). And that may or may not describe how you act, too.

I'm trying to build a healthy tolerance for points of view that are convicting and make me feel self-conscious. Maybe I need to change my behavior or maybe that person is wrong, or maybe that person is dealing with a different set of circumstances.

"Drama" is such a touchy subject just because we all have different definitions for what is dramatic.

I mean, Stopdog hates exclamation points.

But I love them!!!!

[Yearning0723]

Originally Posted by Asiablue

I think in your case yearning, that was all childhood yearnings, that is a very natural way for a kid to think, especially when they've been taught that their needs shouldn't exist. You've explained it very well, what your thinking was, the needs behind it etc. You learned from the experiences that it isn't realistic and you're now teaching yourself how to get you needs met in a healthy way.

Some people never learn that, and stay in that childlike place/fantasy into adulthood and i think that's when it becomes a bit obnoxious. (my word, my view of it, not everyone's) i think it's that refusal to grow, that total blindness of how their actions affects others, that complete disregard of the emotional roller-coaster they send people on that makes it very difficult to deal with.
Everyone would rather not grow-up, everyone has a child-like part in them that just wishes someone else could take care of everything, that in itself isn't unusual but when people force others to look after them by creating dramatic situations that a responsible person can't ignore, then the other person can feel very manipulated and resentful. They feel resentful that they are being made into something they don't want to be ie sole friend, sole parent, sole rescuer, they are put into a role they never asked for and eventually they get compassion fatigue and i think that's why people who create very dramatic situations constantly end up being "abandoned". Because the person they were using just caves in and can't do it anymore. It really quite sad actually.

What I learned (the hard way) is that one single person can't be everything to you. I used to think my former teacher was the only reason I had to be alive; she was the only person who loved me and cared about me and understood me. (The scary thing is that she WAS.) But now I have lots of people in my life who fill different roles.

I have a wonderful, amazing, one in a million friend who is my age and can't fill my attachment needs but can fill my need for support, belonging, caring, understanding, etc. He is always there for me and we have formed a really healthy relationship where we can forgive each other when the other one does something stupid and where we can be open and honest about our feelings and not project things onto one another.

I have T, whose boundaries I am learning to respect (which is probably good for me), but who is supportive and empathetic and willing to listen and support me through all the crappy stuff from childhood that is still affecting me now, and who provides lots of validation and is willing to teach me the skills to do things myself, then sit back and watch me grow.

I have my mom, who up until recently I was realizing can fill SOME needs; not all maternal needs by a longshot, but she can be a person for me to call when I just had a great day and want to talk about it.

I have my dad, who I've found that the less contact I have with him, the more fulfilling our conversations can be.

I'm learning how to use these resources in ways that work for me; instead of fighting with my parents all the time, I'm learning to be realistic about what they can and can't do for me and use them to get my needs met and remove myself from the situation when I'm being mistreated.

I have my current mentor-figure whom I love, but whom I also know won't be there forever - I think she's leaving at the beginning of April, and I am absolutely fine with that. I will enjoy her while I can and we can talk about our mutual favorite academic superstar together.

I have a mentoring program that T hooked me up with that looks very promising; they match you with a mentor from the LGBT community who is literally your special adult who gets to spend time with you at least once a week and support you and care for you and teach you. I was worried about this at first, but T thinks I'm ready to form a healthy relationship with an adult in this way, and I think it'll be a challenge, but I can do it.

I think when some people really only do have that one person in their life, like I did for so long, it can be difficult to NOT attach to that one person. I don't think it's a refusal to change so much as the person is in too much pain to see past the one person in their life who can alleviate that pain. I know that was the case for me. I NEEDED my teachers. If I hadn't had my most recent teacher, I literally would have killed myself. I wanted to so often, but I knew that I couldn't do that to her. I knew it would destroy her, so I found the will to live. When I was in that bad a place, I was literally incapable of doing anything BUT cling to her.

I think when people's needs are so big like that, they're so overwhelming that people literally can't see past their own needs to look at the situation from someone else's point of view and figure out how not to use them that way. I mean, I knew I was using this teacher in a way she wasn't super comfortable with, but my needs felt so big that I didn't know what else to do. I knew I was hurting her, but if I didn't hurt her like that, I truly believe that I would have just lost the will to live, because I didn't have the skills or the tools to be that person for myself, and I didn't have any way to build another support system. She was all I had, and I was in such a dark place that my needs just had to take precedence over hers. And it sucked for her. But it sucked even more for me.

I feel incredibly guilty about the way I treated her sometimes, but T says I need to look back at myself with compassion and see that as a sixteen year old, she was really all I had, and I felt like I didn't have a choice. So I can't really blame myself for it. It was a bad situation all around.

[peaches100]

Asiablue,

You stated:

. . .that total blindness of how their actions affects others

Can you see that you have also shown blindness by not considering how your statements in this thread affect others?

We all make mistakes and err. But when we choose to point the finger at somebody else as having traits that we find obnoxious and can't abide, we often lose sight of the fact that we too can be thoughtless and affect other people in a negative way.

[Asiablue]

Peaches... obviously this touched a nerve for you. I wasn't being judgemental. I don't see calling someone's behaviour manipulative or passive aggressive as a judgement, just a fact. There are some behaviours that ARE passive aggressive and there are some behaviours that are either consciously manipulative ie a person knows they are doing something to illicit a response in another or unconsciously manipulative ie they are unaware that the way they are acting is forcing another person to act in a certain way.

I know there is reasons behind why people do it, i also said that those people need help with it and deserve help with it. But just as those people need support and understanding, i think it's fair to say that it's ok for others to admit to hating feeling manipulated, and put in a role they never asked for. I personally hate it because i have a parent who does these things and it has caused me much anguish and it has given me my own mental health issues because of it, i am in therapy because of some of that type behaviour, so it triggers me and i now refuse to be part of it for anyone else. That behaviour kind of triggers a reaction in me which is why online i stay away from it because i have nothing constructive to say.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by PeeJay

Aww Peaches.

I mean, Stopdog hates exclamation points.

But I love them!!!!

Exclamation points are like a drama gateway drug.

[peaches100]

Yearning,

Thank you so much for sharing some of the things you are actively doing to help deal with your attachment needs. I plan to keep a copy and see if some of these activities could benefit me in learning to grow emotionally and take care of my own need for comfort, support, and a feeling of emotional safety.