[KitKatKazoo]

My story is a long and convoluted one and, while I do have some perspective on the situation, I welcome input from anyone who may have found themselves similarly situated.

In a nutshell, I crossed a boundary, my therapist caught me, I lied and I can’t bear to come clean about it. I’m trying to sort out my options and—preferably—find one that helps me save face, as I’m absolutely mortified by my behavior.

So . . . here goes:

I’ve been seeing my T off and on for 4-5 years. I believe she’s competent and has made a sincere effort to help me with my anxiety and other issues (she thinks depression, too—I’m less convinced of that), but we have a very ambivalent relationship and I have great difficulty trusting her. Now she no longer trusts me, either (and with good reason).

In my mind, the problems between us arose because she’s very blank slate-ish, which makes me completely nuts. For example, she might say she was going to be away the next week and I’d ask, “Oh where are you going?,” she’d tell me (in vague terms, like “to the beach” or "Florida"), but then turn it back on me and make a big to-do about how it was important for me to “know” her and what that said about me, blah, blah, blah. I felt like she was deliberately baiting me. After all, if, say, my dentist mentioned that he was going on vacation, I think it would be entirely normal to say, “Oh, where are you going?” and he would answer and that would be that.

Because she always found a way to turn it back on me, I came to feel that it was inappropriate to ask any question of her, ever. I come from a family that’s very private, perhaps even secretive, so this triggered me in a huge way. I did want to know more about her. But I didn’t want her to know I wanted to know because she twisted the most innocuous questions into having some deep meaning about me. This dynamic prompted me to stop asking questions and start snooping around online.

And I found out more than I bargained for! For example, I know her age and birthday, where she lives, that she’s divorced, who her significant other and kids are, who her ex-husband is and that he’s trolling the internet for young male sex buddies(!), loads of stuff. I also know what gym she used to go to because it’s right next to the yoga studio I go to and I’d see her car there regularly. Before she moved to another town recently, I’d see her at the grocery store, the bank, the eye doctor.

Knowing all this stuff made me feel I had some power over her. I totally understand that it has to do with my feeling powerless in her presence and that this was a way for me gain some power over her. Wrong as it is, it felt good.

But it wasn’t enough for me to know these things. I wanted her to feel as scared and powerless as I did sitting on her couch. So I started dropping breadcrumbs to make her squirm a bit. I do some creative writing as a hobby, and I began mentioning odds and ends about what I wrote. And they had just enough to do with her personal life to stir her up and make her wonder what I knew and how I knew it.

But I went too far—on some level I'm sure I wanted to get caught--and hit too close to home with some characters and plots. Last week, the second I walked in, she confronted me and said that my plot lines were worrisome to her, that there were unsettling parallels to her personal life, and she demanded to know how I knew these things about her. She’s aware that I spend a lot of time online, so she could pretty well guess.

I denied researching her—who could possibly admit to such a thing?!—and she continued to badger me for the entire session. I told her I didn't want to discuss it on my dime and my time--and she said I didn’t have to pay for the session. I truthfully told her that I’d looked her up when I first started seeing her—sanctions, client ratings, where she went to school and so forth. But she continued to demand to know how I knew these other, more intimate details about her life.

Her strong reaction—and I understand that she felt violated—made it very clear that she's pretty freaked out about the situation. I'm sure she's not keen on me knowing about the gay ex trolling as a sugar daddy. Of course, I fully understand that it’s none of my business.

That session was eight days ago and I’m still reeling. Thank goodness she’s on vacation this week and I’ll be away next week. But at some point I have to make a decision: Do I go back and continue to lie/evade/refuse to discuss? Go back and admit my guilt, knowing that she may well terminate me because she can’t be effective with me knowing these things about her? Cancel my September 1 appointment and never return? (That feels like admitting my guilt...and I just *can't.*) Find another T and try to work through the issue with her because I simply cannot face T1 and admit any of this? If I worked it through with T2, I might consider going back to T1 at some point, even for a single session, to clear the air. Of course, if I tell a new T what I did, she’s going to think I’ll do the same thing to her. (Believe me, I’ve learned my lesson! But I’d definitely look for one who’s less of a blank slate to begin with.) Or terminate, leave this ugliness unresolved and be finished with therapy permanently?

Thanks for sticking with my long-winded-ness. Anyone else find out Big Things about their therapist? How did it turn out?

[JaneTennison1]

If you go and see your current T she may well terminate. Whether you agree or not (and I don't agree as I think online is public domain) she may be very upset or angry. The key to working through this might be to see a new T. If the antidote to shame is empathy then this T may not be the one to show you the empathy you need. It is likely she will get too caught up in her feelings to help you appropriately. Try contacting another T, you don't have to decide today what to do. You can take a minute, talk it out, deal with your feelings and then plan from there.

[atisketatasket]

Two thoughts: 1) from the tone of your post, I'm not sure you can just walk away from therapy, and 2) since you're facing a tough choice, why not give one more session a try, being honest - yes, I looked this stuff up, because I wanted to know more about you as I tell you my deepest secrets, etc. I mean, she doesn't believe your denials already, why not see what the direct approach gets you? If it doesn't go well, you can leave, and you'll have clarified the situation.

Oh, and 3) I don't see why she can't be effective knowing these things. I don't see that you crossed a boundary in looking stuff up - it's the baiting her with your knowledge that's the issue. Anything on the internet is fair game, and therapists should take more precautions if they don't want clients to see their laundry, dirty or clean.

I don't really have a similar experience - I don't want to know anything about my therapists because I need that blank wall - but I did find out something very surprising with No. 3. She was easily the most private of the three I've seen - I basically knew she was married and why she became a therapist. But then one day I ran into her at the locker room at the gym, and realized she had at least one kid (spotted a C-section scar) and you could have knocked me over with a feather. It impressed me with her level of professionalism in session (not so much the gym locker room), since most people can't avoid mentioning their kids. We never discussed that she had a kid, btw - I didn't see the point.

I guess I mention that because I wonder if learning this information had a positive impact on your view of your therapist. Do you admire what she's done with her personal life? If your relationship is already ambivalent and you don't trust her, and knowing about gay ex sugar daddy doesn't make you empathize with her, I think then it is time to find a new person.

[ThisWayOut]

I think the life about knowing that stuff about her might be more disturbing than actually knowing it, though if she's more guarded than the average t,even you knowing that stuff would be disturbing if she's trying to keep her private life out of the office...
I think it's fairly common for clients to be curious about t's who share nothing about themselves. I think likely even for t's who share moderate amounts about themselves, some clients will feel the need to find out more...
I've looked up t's to a certain degree, though I am cautious to find out too much for fear of it negatively impacting my therapy (I've experienced some pretty distressing dual-relationships).
Current t is relatively open about things if asked. I've actually asked her to refrain from telling me too much since I worry about t if I know potentially distressing info (like minor health issues)...

[Salmon77]

Based on your post--I think "leaving this ugliness unresolved" would be very, well, ugly, and unresolved. If it were me, at least, this would eat at me. It may be very difficult to tell her everything you've discovered, and yes, to admit guilt... but maybe it would feel good in a way, to be honest about it, and get it off your back.

So, I guess I would say: go back (or to another T) and be honest (even if only eventually). Because at some point you will need to deal with whatever drove you to researching her so much. Good luck.

I know a lot about her. she tells me.

[awkwardlyyours]

I agree with those who said that you should consider telling her....for *your* sake. And, that walking away is likely not going to work.....again for *you*.

So, do you think you could just email (or drop a note at her office) her your "confession"? That way you have some space / distance to deal with it yourself (and the effort of writing with the ultimate goal of letting her know might help clarify some stuff for you)? And, also you're not stuck with trying to deal with whatever stuff she comes up with in session?

And, after that, you could figure out what you'd like to do? If you want to go in and speak to her, tell her in the email (or however you make an appointment) that you'd like to do so. Or, if you want to just terminate and would like a last session, say that beforehand as well?

[growlycat]

I really believe that a therapist has to lock down their online info orherwise it is fair game. It doesn't sound like she has been a spectacular therapist just a so so therapist. Walking away at is a valid option. I don't think she will let this go based on what you describe.

[KitKatKazoo]

Originally Posted by JaneTennison1

If you go and see your current T she may well terminate. Whether you agree or not (and I don't agree as I think online is public domain) she may be very upset or angry. The key to working through this might be to see a new T. If the antidote to shame is empathy then this T may not be the one to show you the empathy you need. It is likely she will get too caught up in her feelings to help you appropriately. Try contacting another T, you don't have to decide today what to do. You can take a minute, talk it out, deal with your feelings and then plan from there.

Thank you. I guess that's what I'm afraid of--that she'll terminate me. You're right--I don't have to decide right now.

[KitKatKazoo]

Originally Posted by growlycat

I really believe that a therapist has to lock down their online info orherwise it is fair game. It doesn't sound like she has been a spectacular therapist just a so so therapist. Walking away at is a valid option. I don't think she will let this go based on what you describe.

She actually does have her online info locked down pretty well--it took some intrepid digging to find out all I did, lol. I'm sure she's not going to let this go. She has been a pretty good therapist, but I've been challenging . . . Maybe it's time to move on, but I don't feel ready to let her go.

[growlycat]

Digging or hacking? Digging I think all clients do to some extent. Hacking would be another level altogether

[KitKatKazoo]

Originally Posted by awkwardlyyours

I agree with those who said that you should consider telling her....for *your* sake. And, that walking away is likely not going to work.....again for *you*.

So, do you think you could just email (or drop a note at her office) her your "confession"? That way you have some space / distance to deal with it yourself (and the effort of writing with the ultimate goal of letting her know might help clarify some stuff for you)? And, also you're not stuck with trying to deal with whatever stuff she comes up with in session?

And, after that, you could figure out what you'd like to do? If you want to go in and speak to her, tell her in the email (or however you make an appointment) that you'd like to do so. Or, if you want to just terminate and would like a last session, say that beforehand as well?

Thanks. Yes, I have thought about potentially writing out my whole confession and sending it to her before going back--but I'm afraid that will give her a chance to prepare her "rebuttal." And then there I'll be once again struggling to respond, feeling, as always, like I'm at a disadvantage. And if I don't go back, is there really any point in confessing? I suppose it would clear my conscience to some extent . . . maybe that's the answer--confess and run! Not sure I could face her once I admitted what I did (even though she already knows). I don't know if she wants me to tell her WHAT I know or HOW I know it or just admit that I sought out the info on her.

[KitKatKazoo]

Originally Posted by growlycat

Digging or hacking? Digging I think all clients do to some extent. Hacking would be another level altogether

Definitely not hacking, lol! No, I just followed one online thread to another, searched names and made connections, saw pictures on Facebook and Instagram, that kind of thing.

[KitKatKazoo]

Originally Posted by atisketatasket

Two thoughts: 1) from the tone of your post, I'm not sure you can just walk away from therapy, and 2) since you're facing a tough choice, why not give one more session a try, being honest - yes, I looked this stuff up, because I wanted to know more about you as I tell you my deepest secrets, etc. I mean, she doesn't believe your denials already, why not see what the direct approach gets you? If it doesn't go well, you can leave, and you'll have clarified the situation.

Oh, and 3) I don't see why she can't be effective knowing these things. I don't see that you crossed a boundary in looking stuff up - it's the baiting her with your knowledge that's the issue. Anything on the internet is fair game, and therapists should take more precautions if they don't want clients to see their laundry, dirty or clean.

I don't really have a similar experience - I don't want to know anything about my therapists because I need that blank wall - but I did find out something very surprising with No. 3. She was easily the most private of the three I've seen - I basically knew she was married and why she became a therapist. But then one day I ran into her at the locker room at the gym, and realized she had at least one kid (spotted a C-section scar) and you could have knocked me over with a feather. It impressed me with her level of professionalism in session (not so much the gym locker room), since most people can't avoid mentioning their kids. We never discussed that she had a kid, btw - I didn't see the point.

I guess I mention that because I wonder if learning this information had a positive impact on your view of your therapist. Do you admire what she's done with her personal life? If your relationship is already ambivalent and you don't trust her, and knowing about gay ex sugar daddy doesn't make you empathize with her, I think then it is time to find a new person.

You're right! I thought I had some perspective, but I hadn't considered that it's the baiting her with the knowledge that's the issue. I'm sure I did that because I feel like she baits me. I'm so ashamed of my behavior, I can't imagine how I can go confess. But I think I know that that's probably the only mature way out of this.

OMG, I could not bear to run into my therapist in the locker room--ewww!

[KitKatKazoo]

Originally Posted by Salmon77

Based on your post--I think "leaving this ugliness unresolved" would be very, well, ugly, and unresolved. If it were me, at least, this would eat at me. It may be very difficult to tell her everything you've discovered, and yes, to admit guilt... but maybe it would feel good in a way, to be honest about it, and get it off your back.

So, I guess I would say: go back (or to another T) and be honest (even if only eventually). Because at some point you will need to deal with whatever drove you to researching her so much. Good luck.

Yes, it has been eating at me nonstop. I'm ashamed and I feel cowardly and I'm afraid she's going to terminate me. Can't go wrong with honesty, right? I just don't know if I have the wherewithal to do it. I'm sure the whole situation stems from feeling baited by her, from the power differential between us, from issues with secrecy in my past, etc.

[KitKatKazoo]

Originally Posted by Starry_Night

I know a lot about her. she tells me.

I want your therapist! Or one like her, who shares!

[Bipolarchic14]

For me, it makes her "human". I could not go to someone who feels the need to hide their life from me.

It does sound like you went a bit too far, particularly since you went so far as to bait her with the information and admit you got pleasure out of making her squirm. I wouldn't be surprised if she decides to terminate as that starts bordering on rather inappropriate behavior that spills into her personal life. I don't think therapists have to necessarily sit back and tolerate that kind of intrusion into their personal life.

[songofthesea]

Originally Posted by KitKatKazoo

Thanks. Yes, I have thought about potentially writing out my whole confession and sending it to her before going back--but I'm afraid that will give her a chance to prepare her "rebuttal." And then there I'll be once again struggling to respond, feeling, as always, like I'm at a disadvantage.

Could you prepare it, in written form, and give it to her to read or something while you're in the room? It saves the discomfort of speech and doesn't give time. Also, I'm actually kinda impressed with your gall. I was super embarrassed when I admitted to my therapist that I 'd read one of his papers. I could never drop hints that I know a details about other parts of his life.

My first therapist was very bizarre when it came to self-disclosure. She repeatedly told me in her first session that it wasn't about her and I shouldn't be asking her things (I was at that point unfamiliar with therapy and it's in my nature to ask questions). When I checked back at her directory page a couple of weeks ago she's written a bunch of stuff about infertility and her new house, which was a little odd, given her 'no self-disclosure whatsoever' attitude at the beginning. But she didn't really pique my interest.

My second one - I didn't ask anything because the first had trained me out of it - but I told him after I looked him up, and he didn't seem too disturbed by it. If he is away for a short while, he will tell me where. He says "we" when he goes away, and I never push him for who the "we" is because that's his business. We both know that I probably know though.

[growlycat]

Originally Posted by KitKatKazoo

Definitely not hacking, lol! No, I just followed one online thread to another, searched names and made connections, saw pictures on Facebook and Instagram, that kind of thing.

Not mr robot huh? 😀 then it is all fair game

[Rive.]

That depends on what you want.

You know you crossed a boundary but won’t admit it to ‘save face’. If you want to save the relationship: come clean, start again with the clear intent-decision *not* to violate her boundaries or attempt to scare her. Also, speak up re your powerlessness or how the non-reciprocity of the relationship bothers you etc.

If her trust is gone and you keep evading or being defensive, do you really see a future to this relationship?

Therapy is not the same as a relationship with one’s dentist - there is less frequency, intensity or emotional implication. Some Ts are blank slates (nothing wrong with that as it is how they work). She won’t change her method of working, or at least, she doesn’t have to if she is not comfortable in doing so. Therefore, IF her style doesn’t suit you then why not interview other Ts who would be more forthcoming?

I don't think it is the knowing stuff that is 'bad' but what you are doing with this information. I find it scary and manipulative that you would want T “I wanted her to feel as scared and powerless as I did sitting on her couch”. She’s not out to hurt you. A T’s job is to try and help people mostly by delving into one’s inner workings. That’s why there will inevitably be some power imbalance. They are also not required to divulge anything about them. Why not be honest re you feeling powerless due to this unequal relationship (where one discloses and the other less so) or move on to someone who could accommodate you?

Open communication would be preferable to trying to bully or scare Ts. She might not be able to work (nor want to) with you under the present circumstances. I think she would even be justified in referring you out.

[Merecat]

I think you crossed a line. It's ine thing to want to vet your T, check her registration, or to be curious about easily available info. It's another when you start crossing checking and making links to other people in her life and following them up. For you then to use what you knew as sources for your fictional writing and to use this to bait her is awful. Imagine if it happened to you, that someone found out intimate details of your life and used them in fictional writing. The other thing for me is that she is the person you have a relationship so some might say her online presence is fair game, but the other people in her life deserve privacy, her ex partner certainly didn't sign up for someone digging about in the intimate details of his life and certainly not for you to use his challenges for your own ends.

It's one thing to have a bit of information but I can imagine she's questioning how you know such very personal stuff, not just about her but people who are close to her. You wanted her to feel as powerless as you in the therapy room, I'm guessing she actually feels unsafe in every area of her life because she doesn't know what you know or how you know it. If you wanted to sabotage your therapy, you've done a good job of it.

I can understand you wanting to even up the power dynamic in therapy but to want her to feel powerless isn't ok, she's just doing the job you asked her to do when you started seeing her. Therapy doesn't always feel comfortable, we do feel vulnerable and sometimes powerless. The way to resolve this is to talk about it in therapy with your therapist. If I were you, hard as it will be, is return to the next session and explain all of it - your opening post would be a good way of starting - clear the air and see what can be salvaged. I don't judge you for doing it, I know you were trying to keep yourself safe, but my goodness if you want to continue in therapy with her you'll need to own your part in undermining the relationship.

[stopdog]

I don't think OP did nything wrong by looking up the information and I think therapists should be able to handle it. I don't even see the baiting as a big deal.
And I don't believe one can know whether therapists, as a whole, are not out to hurt a client-I don't know one would know if therapists are or are not out to do such a thing.

[Merecat]

The T offered a service and the OP felt disempowered so rather than talking to her about that they trawl through the Internet not just for information about her but people in her life and previously associated with her. By your reasoning, if I were a therapist I should be ok with someone looking up my info (which I get, it's my job to keep my stuff secure, knowing what I do for a job) but also everyone who knows me lest a client think it's ok to have a bit more information about me and decides they're fair game too. And I should be ok with someone looking up people who aren't even in my life anymore and use that information against me. Seriously?

Being a T entitles someone to search for information about every area of my present and past life and use that against me, and I should be ok with that, because I decided to be a T. I think that's unreasonable in the extreme - yes a T should be able to work through it with a client and deal with it professionally but I don't expect them to be fine with it or not have feelings about it.

[stopdog]

Yes, seriously. If it is openly available, then any information is fair game in my opinion.

I expect them to keep their feelings far away from me.