D-Day Description

Soliaree, I know you've had a really rough time lately and you are very angry at T... but I'm wondering too if you've looked at all this from T's point of view and his staff's point of view.

I think T, like every one of us, has the right to feel angry. You and he could talk more about that. I know you feel defensive at the moment, but it might help to talk about T's anger as well as his defense of his staff. This is what's happening now and it's always good to make therapy about what's happening now.

I hope you are feeling much better.

I guess I am so hurt that I am unable to see things from anyone else's perspective. He knows that one of my weak points is knowing when I make someone else angry. He had already told me that he did not like what I did, which I totally understood. He took a huge chance by telling me that so soon after what I had done. I am still extremely fragile at this point. He also said something to the affect of that I didn't have to do that just because I didn't get my own way. I had just told him how much it hurt that I cared so much for him but he didn't care back. And he put it in terms of me throwing a fit because I didn't get my own way? That's ********. I'm not fighting over a piece of candy. I'm in massive pain.

Although I joke with the thing about the hippo, it really hurt. I wanted to take it so I could feel safe like I used to in his office and he turned it into a cold contract. I %#@&#! hate that.

So after already telling me that he did not like what I did, he told me he was angry with me because of where I chose to do it. He didn't say he was angry because I might have killed myself, but how it affected his staff. %#@&#! his staff. I am so self-centered, I know. The whole thing has reinforced my feelings of being worthless and unloveable. I guess I'm fighting that feeling but should just give in to it.

I understand that he does not care for me as much, but I wish he could at least respect my feelings. I feel like he takes them and discards them as he wishes. I am dying inside right now and am just sitting with it. I have no hope for the future but I'm sitting with it. Am I being rational? Probably not. But my emotions are flooding me and taking over. I am so tired of fighting this. I thought he was the one person who would understand, but instead he reframed it into me being selfish and threw it back in my face. This whole situation just sucks. I slept all day yesterday and today because it's the only way I can escape.

I appreciate your replies and totally understand what you are saying and know that you care. Unfortunately, I am stuck under this wave of emotions and can't see it from anyone else's point of view. Love y'all. Thanks for caring.

HI Sol.

I don't think you are self-centered. I think that he should not have even mentioned how it affected his staff. That was for him and his staff to deal with. Not to make you shamed for what you did.

I feel for you, because if I were in your shoes, I would probably feel exactly like you and probably even worse (like winding up in the hospital)...because I think in this instance, your T was not dealing with counter-transferance correctly.

I am not saying he should not have been angry. But I am saying, he did not handle it correctly.

Also, as far as the hippo. I would be %$@$ too, because obviously you needed the "transitional object" and instead of focusing on it, he should have been focusing on helping you not need it and the strength of your relationship.

Maybe others disagree with me......but I totally understand you and your response. Hang in there.

(((((((((((((( sol ))))))))))))))!!!

> I am stuck under this wave of emotions...

What is it with these emotions? What are they? Why do we have them when being calm would be so much more useful?

get a new therapist and keep the hippo!!!

or u could send it back to him piece by piece... like a ransom. DEMAND AN APOLOGY!

Unfortunately, I already gave him back the hippo. However, I absolutely love your idea! I'm honestly really confused about this whole thing. My next appointment is Tuesday. I feel so desperate just going there. I think that my therapist would like it if I left him.

Soliaree, I think it goes back to his replying "No" to whether he loves you. I think you should have discussed you idea of love and found a different word. Your T does care for you but not in the way you are putting it.

No one can care for you more than you care for yourself. That's just the way it is; because you are your own self, and no one can "top" that. The rest of us in the world are just actors on your stage (like you are an actor on each of ours). You are living your life and it is all about you, it has to be. No one else can make you feel a certain way or respond a certain way (or your T would have had you respond differently, yes?). Our feelings aren't 100% chosen but they are 100% ours and how we respond to them is 100% our choice.

Were I you, I would discuss with your T your choice of words, ask him to discuss with you why he works with you. He has to "care" in order to work with you, any money you pay him is not enough to cover being upset. Did it surprise you that he didn't terminate with you, isn't leaving you/throwing you out? Why wouldn't he if he doesn't care about you?

Out of obligation. I don't feel that he cares, I feel that he despises me. I'm just confused and overwhelmed with emotions. In my opinion, it was a poor choice for him to disclose his feelings at that time when I was still vulnerable. I still can't get over it, it continues to thrash about in my head. Why do I stay? Because I'm attached and don't know how to leave. Maybe things will change, maybe they won't. But for now I am absolutely beside myself with misery.

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Riptide said:
Also, as far as the hippo. I would be %$@$ too, because obviously you needed the "transitional object" and instead of focusing on it, he should have been focusing on helping you not need it and the strength of your relationship.

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I apologize if this because too psychoanalytical, but I'm just thinking of your situation in terms of this--

A transitional object only becomes transitional once the receiver of the object assigns meaning to it.

For example, when my T went on vacation, he gave me some jazz CDs and a book. I assigned the book as my 'little girl' item and ended up sleeping with it more than actually reading it. I assigned the CDs as the 'I hate you for leaving' objects and ended up not being able to listen to them because they represented the hate that I felt towards T. By ignoring the CDs I felt as though I was ignoring him and giving him a piece of my mind. By sleeping with the book, I felt as though I was holding him.

I don't think the issue is about the hippo. It is about the meaning you assigned to the hippo. I think by taking the hippo to the ER, you were taking a piece of your T. By him asking for the hippo back, in a sense, he was asking for a piece of himself back from you. I don't necessarily think that your T is a jackass for asking for it back, as he did put out this guideline when you first took it-- but I don't think that is the issue-- I think it might be important to discuss the underlying meaning of what happened there.

As far as how your T handled the whole thing, as far as the dialogue that you wrote out-- Well, I understand why he would be angry. I don't think he necessarily think he went about it in the right way. By talking about he staff, it is possible that he was trying to get you to consider the implications of your actions on others, but I don't think it was the time or the correct way to go about that.

Like my T would say, "It's not good, it's not bad, it just is..." And I urge you to forge on to therapy on Tuesday and begin to deal with things with your T as they are. What happened was part of therapy. I think it is important to treat it like that instead of focusing on who wants to terminate who.

Good luck with your session on Tuesday. Please try to keep yourself safe.

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I think by taking the hippo to the ER, you were taking a piece of your T. By him asking for the hippo back, in a sense, he was asking for a piece of himself back from you.

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Exactly. We talked about that a little but not much. I told him I used it to help me feel his presence. I will mention it again on Tuesday but I don't think I want it now. It just doesn't have the same meaning to me anymore.

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I don't necessarily think that your T is a jackass

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You sound like you're teetering here. Like he may NOT be a jackass, but he may. (LOL) I'm going to pick the may because I'm planning on buying him a donkey to go with his hippo. I wish I had thought about it before I gave it back, though. I liked the idea written above about using him for ransom. I could have sent him a picture and said, "Apologize or else." If no apology came, I could send him first an ear, then a tooth, etc. Now that would have been therapeutical. What a great idea, LOL.

I definitely think he had a right to be angry. He at first told me that he did not like what I did. The next session, he told me about how angry he was that I did it there and that it affected his staff. I'm having so much difficulty expressing how I feel and getting it across. And that day it happened I was so impulsive and devastated, but I still could have handled it differently. I felt horrible after it happened for many reasons. T just made me feel more guilty and more ashamed. As far as his staff goes, I felt totally jealous when he "protected" them. He noticed this and asked if I felt he cared for them more than for me. I absolutely felt that way and still do. As far as I'm concerned at this point, the staff are equivalent to other clients of his. But, at least I don't have to see their assprint on the couch, LOL. I'm trying to stay positive here

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Like my T would say, "It's not good, it's not bad, it just is..."

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And as mine would say, "It's just grist for the mill." (I think he was the one who said that.)

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And I urge you to forge on to therapy on Tuesday and begin to deal with things with your T as they are.

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And forge on I shall, with a donkey in hand.

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I think it is important to treat it like that instead of focusing on who wants to terminate who.

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I didn't realize I was doing this. Point well taken BUT if any terminating is to be done I will be THE TERMINATOR.

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Good luck with your session on Tuesday. Please try to keep yourself safe.

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Thanks! I shall do my best.

Donkey!

Pink said: " Like my T would say, "It's not good, it's not bad, it just is..."
that is what my former Dean said (in my former life when I was going to be a minister).

Sol - maybe you can just start from scratch - like go in tuesday and say "let's start over". and then from that perspective go over the rules, the timing, and the hurtful things....?
hope things go alright!!
kiya

Sol....I was watching Animal Planet today and saw a hippo. I immediately thought of you! I'm not sure if this will please you or not, but I don't think I will ever see a hippo again without thinking of you. Couldn't you have grabbed a kitty or a puppy?

tulips

Thanks guys. I think things will go fine. Tulips, LOL! I know what you mean. I can't see a hippo and not think of this thread, LOL I'm flattered that you thought about me, thanks

Just and update, I called my T today because I just couldn't stand it. I rarely call him, so it wasn't a problem.

I told him that I had been devastated when he told me he was angry. He said that this is something I need to work on, because it is a part of every relationship. People get angry and then move on. I told him that I had difficulty moving on like others (OCD). He said that he can see the pattern of someone getting angry at me and me launching an attack at them because I think it is the end of the relationship. So I push them away before they can do it to me. Wow. I wonder how I made it this far without knowing that I had to correct this.

I did tell him that I thought it was poor timing for him to say what he did. He said, "When isn't it poor timing?" I guess that's true. I didn't mention the hippo, yet. I'll deal with that tomorrow. How interesting, huh?

How did he sound on the phone? Was his voice kind? I hope so. I'm sure that was a tough phone call to make, but it sounds like the waiting was harder. I will be so happy for you when you have a really good session with him and your heart stops aching.

tulips

((((((((Tulips)))))))))
Yes, he was very kind and empathic. I spoke to the T I used to know and love. I feel so much better now The amazing power of T. I'll see him tomorrow at 3:00, and now I know we'll have a good session Thanks so much for caring! I'll post after our session. Take care.

yeah, soli, i think i am seeing threads of that in my current situation, and it raises the same questions.... i spoke out against bad verbal treatment in a group setting and now i am feeling like i'm being attacked by all the poeple who are supporting the one who did the verbal abuse. i've been crying for about 12 hours over this and trying to maintain a cool head when really i want to rip everyone to shreads and never go back EVER!!! But i have to see these ppl tomorrow and am really nervous.... something between humiliation, fear, anxiety, rejection, protecting myself... and wanting to run away.
I am seeing that I do end up in these situations frequently and then i am an emotional wreck. not good patterns. i could work on it in T if there were not already a gazillion things on the docket for wed. i just want to curl up like a porkypine and go away and let my quills speak for themselves.

((((Kiya)))))
I am so sorry that you are in so much pain.

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i've been crying for about 12 hours over this

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I totally understand. Of course, I have no advice for you as I'm totally clueless in this area. I'll let you know what my T says about it since this is supposed to be a main topic of conversation. Hopefully that will help.

I have learned that my communication skills when it comes to disagreements suck! I had a whole conversation with another teacher where I kept trying to tell her that I was on her side. When I told T what I said, about everything I said was something I shouldn't have said. I think I speak swahili or something. Then it goes downhill from there. Then the power struggle and so on. I hope I learn how to deal with this. However, I kind of like what I did three years ago when I was just fed up and told everyone just to %#@&#! off.

Can you tell us more? (If you want) LOL, maybe I can help you. I'll give you advice and you do the EXACT opposite of what I say, Okay? LOL

Please take care of yourself!

yeah you said "He said that he can see the pattern of someone getting angry at me and me launching an attack at them because I think it is the end of the relationship. So I push them away before they can do it to me. "

i think that is what is happening. this guy in choir was leading a rehearsal for the director and used caustic humor to degrade us. i sent him an email saying this is not ok to do. he sent my email and his reply to everyone in the rehearsal and the director ***shame, shame!!! shame on my head*** and then ppl wrote back to everyone in support of the guy. here i though i was standing up for people ...turns out they must *like* being treated in caustic ways. well fine. goodie for them. I told them this doesn't work for me and maybe i should quit. so now even the guy's wife writes me to get me to stay. i can't figure out - am i the bad guy or not?! i think i am supposed to just *be* in the happenings without judging them.... but i am angry and anxious and GRRRRRRRRRRRR. i don't want to go back.

Kiya,
It would be great if you could confront him, look him in the eye and tell him that you know what he did but that you still hold the same belief as you did before. What an @#$@#$@#$!
Ughhhhhhhhh.