[hangingon]

Title is supposed to say, Just when I started to feel connected, the you was a slip....

Ugh.....I have such a hard time with all this therapy stuff....things were just starting to feel better between my T and I and then this....

The first anniversary of my moms death is tomorrow. Last night, I had just fallen asleep and awoke not to long after and was flooded, I mean flooded with really hurtful memories of my mom......I was balling, had total anxiety....like I hadn't had in years.

I decided to email my T at that time......what I was feeling because of the things my mom did ect... the hurt I felt because of her lack of care, abandonment and all that comes with that...

In the email, I included, I know your busy, but can you maybe call tomorrow and leave a little message, I purposely won't answer, it can be anything.

I got a response from her tonight that said some really good things but also said something that really hit hard.....She said, I'm thinking about you, I'm sorry I can't call at the moment.....I couldn't absorb all the other stuff in the email because that line was so hard to hear.....

I have never asked her to call me before and I have been seeing her for 8 months.....in fact I told her I can't do the phone thing because it makes me too nervous......It pretty much settles the whole phone issue for me that I may not really be able to trust her for that, especially if it can't be done at a time like this....

Two thoughts come to mind, the intellectual one that she is busy and really can't leave a message....

The other is that it's some psychological nonsense where she can't leave a message, because God forbid she sound like she is rescuing me, maybe they learn that.....maybe she wanted to leave me feeling abandoned to tick me off (cause transference)........I don't want to be rescued, I just want to know that I can trust her when in a real time of need......maybe it was a test on my part....

I needed to know that she would really be there before I really start to express to her about how I feel about my mom.....now I want to pull back really bad....

I know she's not my mother believe me I know that......but that doesn't mean that there are not times when I need her to be there, especially for something as little as a simple message to show she's really there.....I could see her doing that if I did this all the time but this is the first ever asking her that

I have a session with her tomorrow night, the night of the anniversary, and I know she is going to bring this up because I just emailed her a response and told her I was sorry that I asked her if she could leave me a message, that I know she's busy, that that was what I felt I needed in that moment but I'm fine now. That I felt completely rediculous not long after sending that email.....that she has no idea ...ugh...

I'm sorry for rambling, it just makes me really need to close myself back up, take care of myself like I am sooooo use to doing.....like I've done my whole life because it keeps me safe. I've been trying really hard to move away from that, trying to allow myself to be vulnerable with her....and then this....
I so need to go into my I don't care mode right now....

((((((((hanging on)))))))))

i'm so sorry your t didn't call when you really needed her to. i do think it's good that you two will talk about this in your next session. it will be helpful for you to know when you can expect to hear from her and when not to. i know you said you won't ever call her again, but maybe you can work something out so it will be safe for you to do so in the future. take gentle care of yourself at this rough time.

[hangingon]

Originally Posted by reflection

((((((((hanging on)))))))))

i'm so sorry your t didn't call when you really needed her to. i do think it's good that you two will talk about this in your next session. it will be helpful for you to know when you can expect to hear from her and when not to. i know you said you won't ever call her again, but maybe you can work something out so it will be safe for you to do so in the future. take gentle care of yourself at this rough time.

omg...no way.....I don't even want to talk about this with her, it will probably just make me ball and feel completely rediculous.
As far as working out a phone thing, I have never called her for anything before. Even though she told me right up front that I could call her if I ever needed to.
Thanks for your suggestions, if I got the nerve to do so it would be a miracle.

((hangingon)) I do not post here much , but your post got to me. I want you to know my parents are gone too. I had some surgery on friday. When i came home I called my moms old #. mind you they have been gone 8 years. The # said as always no further info given.
Your T to you is like your mom figure to you?
with the Anv coming up its important to you.
try to stay safe and know i care ...and know that i know its hard...

[MissCharlotte]

((Hanginon))

Even though she couldn't call, it does sounds like she really cares.

I'm so sorry this is such a difficult time, and you are holding all those conflicting emotions about your Mom.

[Seabirdanne]

My mother died almost eleven years ago. I suppose she wasn't the greatest mom who ever was, but she was my mom, and I still miss her to this day, even though half the time I still want to yell (scream) at her for stuff that happened decades ago.

So I can relate to at least some of what you feel. But I know that you have strengths that you don't even know you have yet. You'll find them. Quit stressing, and be good to yourself. This, too, shall pass.

(((((((((((((((hangingon))))))))))))))

Okay, first you need some of these:

I do agree with Miss C....for whatever reason she couldn't call, her e-mail did sound very caring, even though I know it wasn't exactly what you needed.

Sometimes when I am in a really tough spot, when part of me wants so badly to reach out to T and to be supported and cared for, another part of me is looking for *proof* that he doesn't really care, that I can't really depend on him, that I'm going to get hurt. The times when I need him the most are the times I'm most likely to push him away. Maybe because I feel SO vulnerable, and I'm so scared of being hurt again, I almost expect the hurt, and I look and look until I can find it. Because things just wouldn't make sense any other way, you know??

I was just thinking tonight about the connect/disconnect dance that goes on with T. I remember a while ago in therapy, there was a point where I was feeling really connected to T after a disconnect and I was telling him what a relief it was. And he said "just expect to go through it again". And I was like "huh?"...and oh my gosh, he was so right. More disconnect did come up, and more connection, and more disconnect and connection and on and on and on. I think it's part of how we learn to trust and to be cared for...and sometimes we just think we need to back off and protect ourselves...and then we're ready to connect again.

So, your post makes PERFECT SENSE to me.

I hope when you see her tomorrow, you can allow yourself to say whatever you need to say about the phone call (or not, if you don't want to) and allow yourself to experience the support and caring that are really there in the room, with you, at that moment. I know it will be hard. But you deserve it.

Be extra gentle with you.

[skeksi]

I'm thinking about you, I'm sorry I can't call at the moment.

I know you feel disconnected right now. I think it's important to focus on her saying, "I'm sorry I can't call at the moment"--although you feel so alone and disconnected right now, it's not because she doesn't want to connect, and it's not because you aren't worth connecting to.

The anniversary of my dad's death is this week, too, and it's so, so, so hard and lonely. The first anniversary is brutal. And when you add all the mixed feelings about being hurt, but still loving her...oh, it's a real recipe for pain, isn't it?

I have found a bit of relief in being able to tie things with an "and"--as in, "I love my dad, and he was sometimes hurtful to me." One doesn't cancel the other out.

I hope your T is able to get back to you before you see her, but if not, I hope you are able to feel some comfort when you do see her again.

[hangingon]

Muffy,
Thank you for your kind words. It's really hard losing someone, especially if there are alot of conflicting thoughts. I have called my moms number as well as her voice was still on the answering machine at my dads, who by the way has not talked to me but once since my mom passed, so it's really both of them that I lost. He pretty much went off the deep end when she passed, back into his old lifestyle....

As far as T being like my mother, she really is not. I don't feel that way at all but she has been someone who is starting to show she cares and that is something that I know I need. I still don't allow myself to trust her enough to really open up yet though.

Miss C,
I think she cares.....i'm just confused with why it was not possible for her to take a moment for a quick message, I told her I wouldn't even answer, just to leave a quick message.
In her email response, she said she couldn't at the moment, it could have been any moment but I guess she didn't have a free moment.
And here is the confusing part.... she emailed me and I responded, then she just responded to my email again, that takes just as long as a quick message.....maybe she just didn't want to do it for whatever reason.

Her response to my second email was........
Not ridiculous! You were honest! And that's a very good thing.
See you tomorrow!

A good thing, it doesn't feel like a good thing that I asked for that because she didn't do it.....now I am left feeling like I did something wrong in asking that.

That really hurts alot......but I didn't tell her that, even if I were tempted to.....because the word transference would probably pop up, and honeslty, I think anyone would feel terrible if they reached out at a really low time and got that response.

She told me in the beginning that I could email her, because I find that easier, but then said however, I respond to phone calls quickly, so sometimes with an email I may not get back to you the same day.
That didn't turn out to be so.....

I would rather her just be honest with me about the whole thing and say, well I couldn't interfer ect.....that you need to figure this out....I don't know.....

Seabirdanne,
I loved my mom tons, which is why I am having a hard time with all of this. I feel really, really guilty for having these thoughts flood me now.
If it were that easy, I'd quit stressing at this moment.....but there is alot to all of this....
I understand where you are coming from

Tree,
I finally took to plunge and reached out.......and now feel horrible for doing that.
I really didn't ask for much......I mean I don't think I did...and it was a first...
I really, really, needed to know that I could trust her.....that doesn't come easy...
I don't even know how I am going to walk in there tomorrow night. I almost want to send her and email about how I really feel about all of this......but I won't....

[coconut64]

(((((((((((((((hangingon))))))))))))))))) I would be hurt too.

Please take good care of yourself and know that I'm thinking about you. Let us know how your session goes.

[BlueMoon6]

Hangingon- From the sound of your emails it seems like she really cares and has a good sense of what it is going on with you. Im sure she will bring it up and you will feel better. From her response it sounds like she wants you to tell her what you think/feel. That is a very good thing!

I know that feeling when they dont give us what we need from them at the moment. Your t knows you took the plunge- you were honest and you even somehow communicated to her what you needed in your response back to her. That is very brave.

I hope your session goes well- I think it will. She sounds good.

Im thinking about you, too.

[hangingon]

Originally Posted by skeksi

I know you feel disconnected right now. I think it's important to focus on her saying, "I'm sorry I can't call at the moment"--although you feel so alone and disconnected right now, it's not because she doesn't want to connect, and it's not because you aren't worth connecting to.

The anniversary of my dad's death is this week, too, and it's so, so, so hard and lonely. The first anniversary is brutal. And when you add all the mixed feelings about being hurt, but still loving her...oh, it's a real recipe for pain, isn't it?

I have found a bit of relief in being able to tie things with an "and"--as in, "I love my dad, and he was sometimes hurtful to me." One doesn't cancel the other out.

I hope your T is able to get back to you before you see her, but if not, I hope you are able to feel some comfort when you do see her again.

Skeski,
I wish I could focus on the I can't call at the moment in the way you are thinking. But it wasn't I can't call at the moment but will as soon as I can type of thing. It was I can't call you at the moment (and won't be today), I will see you tomorrow.....
Which interests me that she even used the word moment at all.....instead of I'm sorry I can't call you today.....

The word moment made it sound worse, you know, that I am not even worth a moment, out of a whole day, at a time when I was and am really struggling.

I really do love my mom (even if she didn't believe me), its the guilt of feeling the way I do about things that is getting to me.

[hangingon]

CLK,

Thanks, I am sure this is going to come up in session but honestly, I don't think I can even talk about this with her. I know it's just building and festering inside, which I know is not good, in time it will just be something in the back of my mind until the next time a need comes around and is not met.....and the cycle continues...

The last time I addressed something she did that really bothered me, the session turned out really bad, and I'm so worried the same thing will happen if this is addressed....

I believe she cares....I mean I think she does......guess I haven't quite grasped that or internalized it yet....

[hangingon]

This is crazy.....I have let this thing get to me so bad...........something that really seems so very little intellectually.............but feeling wise is a giant to me.

I can't believe the disconnect I am really feeling right now...
It was such a tiny, tiny, tiny, little thing I asked for......just a moment out of a WHOLE day.....but would have meant a ton to me.....would have expressed to me that she does really care, and was really there for me in a time of NEED...

She'll be there tonight, I know that......I just needed her to be there yesterday......this was so different....

I am going to try to hand her a letter tonight......if I can do it......but right now feel that if I do, no words will come, that I will just cry and that she will react the way she did last time I addressed something......it scared me to death....felt like she was pushing me away......and I need to steer clear of those feelings....
(addressed that situation with my school counselor who said my counselor was very wrong in the way she dealt with that situation, that she herself would have said to me that she was so sorry that I sat in pain that long and was afraid to tell her....that my feelings would have been the first thing she addressed...that my T wasn't having a bad day to leave that out of it, that she probably had someone in life who nagged her about something similar and it came out on you.......I never told my T that my school counselor said this...My T was away on vacation for 3 weeks when I visited my school counselor (I was having a hard time), which I did inform my regular T about.....I didn't tell her what my school counselor said though, because I wouldn't want her to feel bad...)

Here is the letter I am going to try to give her tonight in reference to my feelings to her not being able to call....
About my email…
I was not completely honest with you in my response to your email.
I said I was sorry that I asked you to leave me a message and that I was fine. The truth is I was not fine. I felt horrible all day. I think #### sensed I was sad because he came over to me, sat high on the couch and laid his head on mine but didn’t say a word. I reached over and rubbed his arm in acknowledgment of him being there. It was really sweet that he did that because he tries to act all cool and tough, even though he is only 10.
I guess it hurt some that I reached out and asked for something I had never asked for before only to hear it couldn’t be done. I haven’t done the phone thing because I am really nervous about doing it, but last night was so bad, that I did need that.
This was not my little hey are you there, emails help a lot with that, it was a HEY, I NEED you to be there this time. A….I’m going to allow myself to be a little vulnerable; can I trust you to be there? Maybe it didn’t come across that way because I didn’t call crying. In 8 months I have never asked for that before, so it really did hit me some. I know it was such a little thing that may not have seemed important but it was huge for me.
I know I should acknowledge that the rest of the email was really nice, that you did that for me, but it was hard getting past the first line…….
It made me feel like you weren’t really there, that you didn’t really truly care. That I wasn’t even worth a moment….a one minute message, something…

Sorry this post was so long.....why in the world do I let something so simple cause such agony???????

(((((((((((((((((((hangingon))))))))))))))))))))))

I hate when something that "seems" small FEELS so big in therapy....I have been there so many times

I don't know what you should do...whether you should give her the letter, or just talk about your mom today. Both things seem to be pushing at you.

For me, I usually address that kind of thing with my T, and it takes us where we need to go. If his response isn't helpful, I TELL HIM, and we go from there. It totally sucks, and things don't always get resolved during that session, and it's hard. But for me, if the relationship and the connection aren't totally secure and solid, I can't really work on anything else anyway.

I keep thinking that maybe she has never left a message like that before...maybe no one has asked for that...so perhaps it's outside of her experience, and she didn't "get" that it would feel different from an e-mail. My guess is that she felt like an e-mail would give you the same sort of thing that a phone message would (obviously, she was wrong). Maybe she's not comfortable leaving messages, and it's something she won't do (like so many Ts who don't do e-mails). I know my T HATES doing e-mails, and will often respond to an e-mail with a phone message (when I really prefer writing and reading, and would rather have an e-mail in some of those moments). He strongly prefers talking over writing. I wonder if you can somehow back up and look at the possibility that it's not personal...just something she doesn't DO?

I really, really hope your session gives you what you need today. Will you let us know how it goes??

[Confused_1982]

Oh, it sounds like things are really difficult at the mo, but I thought your letter to T was great. I often write things down and take to T when they are difficult for me say, and we usually go through each thought/feeling. T will take responsibility for the way he said/wrote something and will understand where I am coming from and how it made me feel to rejected/vulnerable/abandoned etc.

It gives T a chance to give his version of events, and I usually find that I've read too much into something, and have catastrophised it or thought it meant something negative about me/how he feels about me.

If you do give the letter to her, I am sure she will understand how you feel and will want work with you so that you have a better understanding between you in future. As the others have said, she sounds like she really does care. Good luck

[hangingon]

Coconut,
Thank you...I will try to post after session this evening, if I am not a mess

Tree,
I am really feeling like I should talk to her about this issue because if I don't I probably won't be able to hear anything she says in reference dealing with my mom's death.

I'm just really afraid to, afraid of her reaction, last time we had an issue there was no reassurance or recognition of my feelings until later down the road, but at that point, I had a hard time excepting it. You know that old saying what comes out of the mouth must be in the heart. She must of felt what she told me that evening to come out and say what she did, and react the way she did. Even if she later recanted some of it.
I figured I would let it slide....and had, or at least thought I had, but obviously not completely because this present issue brings me right back to that old issue.

I have a hard time dealing with this stuff and trusting.....
It's good that your T helps you through all of that, I think the biggest thing is because he is very accepting of your feelings.....that makes a huge difference...He realizes they come from somewhere and he doesn't get defensive about them, even if you tell him he did something wrong...that makes for a great T because in the end therapy is not about them....it's working on figuring out what we need and leading us to insight...

Confused,
What your T does is what I need. Thats what I desire in it, acceptance and looking at it. Also hearing the words sorry if need be ect...

I'm certainly good at creating catastrophy in my mind but I am also sure there are good explanations as to why.
If I get the courage to give her the letter, I hope it goes well.

Thank you all for your responses......the time is getting closer and I feel like I have nothing to say.....sort of numb, as opposed to being really upset about the whole thing earlier.....

Wow. I am so sorry. I really don't understand why your T would not make the phone call, I really don't. It was not like she was "initiating" it, because you made the first contact. And it did not have to be a lengthy report. I really don't get it.

I think your letter is great and I hope you give it to your T, so that you can figure this out.

Who knows, maybe it is "her stuff" because if she emails with you, I don't get the problem with leaving a brief message.

I just don't get T's..... I really don't.

Good luck when you see T.

[hangingon]

I went to session.....

We talked about lots of stuff, mom stuff, feelings, I started to cry some but shut myself down as usual....good old coping mechanism...

I shared a memory that recently came back to me, something from when I was little....it was strange that and 8 year old would do such a thing......I worried whether or not I should tell my T, because I didn't want her to think I would try that now......(involved taking too many meds, but not being enough to do damage) but I did tell her.....that was pretty embarrassing to share...She asked if I knew why I did it. I didn't really know. I said, I knew it was wrong because I counted them first, then took them, and awhile later got scared and went and told my mom.....

She talked about the email and non-call issue as soon as I walked in, I figured she would. I didn't talk much about it then.
I felt really horrible, numb, something....
She said how are you feeling right now, I said I don't know.....she said aggitated, she had the right word, I was I know it was because of feeling let down.....but I didn't tell her that.

After talking about all different things, pretty much at the end of the session, I said, I wasn't honest with you about something. She said what? I said the email and phone issue. She wanted me to explain, I tried but I couldn't really make sense, so I said I have a letter that may explain it... she said would you pull it out so we can talk about it as session closes. I said ok...took it out. She said will you read it. I said NO....she said you won't even try, I said no...
So I gave it to her. She said, will you stay here with me as I read it, I would really like if you would stay with me when I do. I said ok.....don't read it out loud. So she didn't...
I also said, please don't get mad at me. It was what I was feeling and just put it down like that.

She read it.....she said she was sorry. That she went to a meeting right after opening the email and did not have time and did not want to risk compromising my confidentiality (haha, ok "little me" was like please, you could have did it on your way home...not buying it and confidentiaty, no one even knows me where you were) I wouldn't tell her that though, never......never, it was just my past speaking hahaha, guess thats what T would say.

She said it was the "little girl" speaking, that was what she needed, and that I need to recognize that....that that will be the start of some healing....

I said, I read it again today and in the email you recognized I felt abandoned by my mom.....but then I felt like you did the same thing by not calling me, that it felt the same....(started crying a tad here but only for a second...)

Here it comes lol.........She said you are projecting on to me what happened with your mom, something like that.....I was like yep, knew that was coming, in my head of course.

(still have a hard time with that one to, because sure I felt abandoned many times in the past, but this was now. I was having a rough time with my mom's anniversary and needed a message....so not getting that...hmm....was it really projection?????? Or would most people feel that way when reaching out and not recieving.) I mean I did receive, shoot, I need to remember that, she knew I needed the email and sent it, just didn't call.

She said, you have to remember the times that I am here, that I am here weekly, things like that......I blank out again...I hate that, wish I could just record sessions....

She said she was really happy that I gave her that letter. That it lets her see how sensitive this issue really is to me....that it's good for her to know....ok that was nice....

At one point I said, Intellectually, I know you can't rescue me, that you don't have to call me, that its not your job to do that .......that thats not why we are here. I think I had a little attitude when saying this....you know, did the quotation thing with the fingers and all.....

Can't remember what she said lol......dissociation......she did say something at one point about her not being able to call me in the middle of a crisis at times.....sensed a little bit of not so nice emotion from her at that point.....but maybe that was just me.....

She said, I care about you, I know your probably thinking whatever, that it might be hard to hear, something like that, but she said I really do care.

Really wants me to be able to bring stuff into the room with her.......but it still freaks me out......

All in all, it went ok.....she gave me a hug at the end, asked what I was going to do to help me sleep tonight because I had a hard time the last two nights....I said tylenol PM
Guess I'm glad I gave her the letter. But at the same time feel like it was a bad thing to do, shows I am too needy and all that. But its done, hope it turns out to be a good thing.

Sorry this was a long one......

[velcro003]

hangingon, you have come SUCH A LONG WAY in the times i've seen you post. i'm still in the same position! you have been able to talk about things that are bothering you. Sure, it makes you nervous--but you did it! That is an accomplishment in itself So, congrats.

Also, i'm glad she apologized and explained. Considering all you're going through right now, you're doing fantastic. I wish I could be as brave as you.

[hangingon]

Tollhouse
Thanks....I didn't get it either......who knows what they are thinking her reason was good for her. I think it's good I brought it up though.
I think I shock her with my crap sometimes.....maybe alot of client's really don't speak up about things like that, at least I get that impression when confrontation is involved.....
I feel like i am a pain in her you know what I certainly don't mean to be but if I don't tell her how I feel about things like that, then whats the point.....

Velcro,
Thanks for your encouragement, I don't feel like I have come very far, but I guess looking back, yeah, I would never have addressed things like this with my T. It's good but also scary.....Like I am becoming too much for her, somehow I have this fear that she is not going to be able to handle me and ship me off...

[Confused_1982]

Im so glad you gave her the letter- I do the same (i.e cant bring myself to read it to T so get him to read it in his head - NOT OUT LOUD-NO WAY- could not handle that !!!).

I hate it when they come out with oh, its the transference...you're projecting...etc. No, these are my REAL feelings, why can't you see that ???!!! But it sounds as though she really does care about you. I think that now she knows about some of the feelings you have been hiding, it will help her to help you. You might have written things in the letter that she was unaware of, and it can help her to adjust her approach and to be more sensitive to you.

Well done for having the courage to let her know

[FooZe]

Originally Posted by hangingon

Guess I'm glad I gave her the letter. But at the same time feel like it was a bad thing to do, shows I am too needy and all that.

Too needy for what?

Sorry this was a long one......

Hey, I'm not complaining -- I like hearing from you!