[sunrise]

I feel like I work hard at therapy. Between sessions, I do a lot of "work." I think about the sessions, process what happened there, write in my journal, come to new insights, have dreams that tell me more, experience emotions surrounding certain events that I haven't before, etc. This lets me move forward (even though it may not be obvious that I am), and I feel that at my next session I can start the process all over again both with whatever growth (or the opposite) I have experienced since the last session and with whatever happens between me and T, face to face.

However..... what happens when you haven't done this sort of work between sessions? Should you go to your next session anyway if you haven't worked at it between times? What would happen if you went under such circumstances--would you just present yourself and say I haven't done/thought about a f**king thing? Or should you put off the session until the following week until you have done some "work"?

[SecretGarden]

Hi Sunrise...

I like to think that like you I work between sessions to move forward and often assign myself "homework" or things just come up for me to work on...in relation to what has gone on or preparing how to present or if I should present in the next session.

I think though that sometimes life is present outside and that therapy is not always able to be on the front burner. I think that sometimes seeing what happens while there is important. Sometimes I am inspired when I get there or there are things that pdoc wishes to bring up.

I do not think that cancellation for lack of work or attention during the week is a good thing....as could there be something that you/I are avoiding or something that might happen within the session. Those sessions can be quite productive.

Perhaps you might see what your T would think but particularly now when you have so much going on and are actively percolating (my favorite word sometimes about therapy functioning) I would not cancel... and I would not regardless.

Also, I wonder about how people talk of being connected...that this sudden stop and go would not facilitate a connection...at this juncture.

[sunrise]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
I do not think that cancellation for lack of work or attention during the week is a good thing....as could there be something that you/I are avoiding or something that might happen within the session. Those sessions can be quite productive.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
Thanks, SG, for your thoughtful response. ((((hugs)))) I'm not much of a "homework" person, but I do work on therapy in the off time in my own haphazard way, and usually make progress. And I am working on stuff myself and definitely want to see T individually about that. (I have both individual and couples sessions scheduled for next week.)

But I feel like my husband and I haven't worked on stuff for our upcoming couples session, and it seems stupid to go to that when we haven't done a thing, which is partly due to our being busy with other stuff (life goes on at its typical crazy pace when you have 2 kids, work, out of town absences, etc.), and perhaps partly due to avoidance. Maybe I don't actually want the couples session to be "productive" until I know what I want to be the outcome? And more processing on my own and discussion with my husband is needed to know the desired outcome, rather than time in therapy with husband and T? So it seems like maybe it would be more fruitful to have the session later? I don't know. It seems so much, to have these two types of sessions, but both are needed. Sigh... Man, I am mixed up. I feel like I can't begin to make sense of the couples session when I have so much stuff about the relationship happening on my own and need to see T individually to help get unmixed up so I can then do more couples work.... Our couples session is scheduled one day next week and my individual the following day. Wish it were reversed. But even if it were, that still doesn't mean the couples work has been done.... Bleah.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Also, I wonder about how people talk of being connected...that this sudden stop and go would not facilitate a connection...at this juncture.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
My connection would probably not be affected since I will see T on my own. But my husband has seen T with me only twice, and I guess it would be wrong of me to do something that might impede his own growing connection with T, wouldn't it?

[SecretGarden]

I think that I process much of the session throughout the week but sometimes I make a mental note of something I need to work on specifically and that is what I deem my homework.

I suppose if you wish to cancel your couples session that you could but it would need to be a mutual agreement with your husband. However, your husband may have some thihgs he wishes to talk about in there and ..... why is it that you are not working on what you need to for there. Avoidance, no time, anxiety, change of heart, uncertainty. What is going on? Maybe fodder for conversation. However I do not have couples experience.

Although your T seems to have too many clients at times he has planned time in his schedule for you and is depending on your attendance and your monies for his practice. If you cancel it would be nice if he had time to replace you in his schedule. That is just my financial consideration side. OTOH... being that busy he might like some free time...lol...

(Maybe I don't actually want the couples session to be "productive" until I know what I want to be the outcome? And more processing on my own and discussion with my husband is needed to know the desired outcome, rather than time in therapy with husband and T? So it seems like maybe it would be more fruitful to have the session later?)

Well, that is indeed significant. Can your T assist you with any of this or do you wish to handle it on your own?

I think all of these are good questions for your T.... and what he may wish... Each T may do it differently. Couples might run a bit significantly different.

[MissCharlotte]

Sunny,

In between sessions I do think about what transpired. I also journal and reflect, etc. I don't think of it as working. I think of it as internalizing. When it's time for my next session I don't go in with an agenda...although i used to think I should. I try to relax and see what my unconscious tells me is where I need to go. I think that when I try to direct things too deliberately then I am masking something that needs to happen.

However, it seems that in your particular situation, couples work is very different than individual work and the goals and direction are more important--particularly there is a more immediate time frame attached to the outcome. So, if you could frame your agenda for your couples session maybe it would feel a little better.

I wonder if you might find this week that the individual session afterward is a good way to "debrief, and unload" and that by having this opportunity you may not feel this burdened before next week's couples session. Just a thought.....

I know this is a difficult time. Take gentle care and be good to yourself.

[Perna]

For me, a lot of the work gets done whether I consciously do it or not. I think you've been thinking about your couples therapy or you wouldn't have "noticed" that you don't feel that you've done any work. Can you discuss any of it with your husband while you all are driving somewhere? My husband and I do a lot of talking while we're on our way to/from chores/engagements. Maybe he feels like he has been working or has some questions, etc.

As sister said, some just gets internalized and maybe you've done more "thinking" than you think you have :-) I would always go to the sessions though because you learn stuff during that time especially? And it's not cumulative or anything so you can learn new stuff or go over old in a different way, etc. during the sessions.

[Lemon]

I can relate to this issue Sunrise. I see my T for individual and couples. Because couples therapy always seems more tactical to me than individual it always seems like I should have accomplished/practiced/processed more in between sessions. But like you've experienced, that is not always possible. With two people involved there is even more chance that life is going to interfere in progress. I have a couples session in 1 1/2 weeks and I also feel like I won't have accomplished anything we talked about last time before I go. But, I have been in couples for 1 1/2 years so this has happened before and I know that even if we haven't made progress from last time we can still go and work with our t. She'll help keep the momentum going so that maybe next time things will have moved forward. Or maybe it is important to understand why we haven't made "progress" a priority since our last session (I think I'm avoiding issues and T will pick up on that).

I can also relate to your comment about feeling like you need to work through things individually before you can make progress in couples. This has happened to both my husband and I because we have individual issues that we work on privately with our T's. Right now I wish I could just put couples on hold for a couple months and work on myself. But, I don't think that would be fair to my husband. I think that even if we aren't visibly making progress in couples, it is probably important to him that we at least still go and take baby steps forward.

Sorry, don't have any great answers for you Sunrise, but I really can relate to what you're going through.

[sunrise]

Thanks, SG, sister, perna, and Lemon for your comments--all very helpful to me. I've been thinking a lot about this even since I made the post and go back and forth on what I would like to do.

SG, rest assured, I would not short my T out of any money that is coming to him. I am very respectful of his need to make a living. I would pay him for 2 sessions even if I only did one, if I canceled too late. That is partly why I am thinking about this in advance, so I have time to cancel so he can fill his schedule. But I would definitely "pay up" for 2 sessions if I had to.

Also, I will definitely discuss with my husband about my desire to cancel, if I decide I really want to. I would not make any unilateral decision. Also, my husband would be free to use our couples session for individual if he wanted. He may need some time alone with T too. I think partly I need to slow things down and I guess one way I thought of doing that was to skip a couples session so I can catch up and my husband and I can catch up as well. But it may not be the best way.

Right now I don't know what to do, but all of your comments add to the mix, and help me consider different ways to handle this. I've only had 2 couples sessions, so I am a real novice at this. I find the dynamics of a couples session really different from individual, as Lemon wrote. Sister, you wrote about letting your unconscious choose what comes up for session. I do that in my individual, but somehow, in couples, it seems different. There are two people there for therapy (as well as a "couple"), and our separate unconsciusnesses are not in sync. Plus my husband doesn't even know how to do that, as he's not been in therapy. It seems like in couples therapy, there is a need to have topics to cover that are of relevance and interest to both people. Although I very much like to choose the direction of my individual therapy session, so far in the 2 couples sessions, I have let T be much more directive--guide the flow and discussion. For how can I (or my unconscious) be the one to determine the session when my husband is there too? Thank goodness, my T has stepped up to the plate, and of course, he has worked with hundreds of couples, so he is an expert at this. So I have pretty much sat back and let him run the show. I am more quiet in our couples sessions than individual, and T notices this. He makes a strong effort to include me and not just let me be a bystander.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
SecretGarden wrote:</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
sunrise wrote:
Maybe I don't actually want the couples session to be "productive" until I know what I want to be the outcome? And more processing on my own and discussion with my husband is needed to know the desired outcome, rather than time in therapy with husband and T?

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Well, that is indeed significant. Can your T assist you with any of this or do you wish to handle it on your own?

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
SG, I think it is very significant, and really the heart of my current concerns about the sessions. I think one of my main motivations for doing some couples work with T was to break the logjam between my husband and myself, to get us talking. That was accomplished in our first session together. In the following week, we talked more than we had in the last decade. And we have a lot more to talk about, and maybe we don't need T around for this. We have a lot to do on our own, and our talking will help me move forward to the next step. And there is a lot of husband to wife stuff to discuss and T just doesn't need to be a part of all that (it would take years if he had to be!). So maybe T doesn't have a role right now, but in the (near) future when we have resolved some things between us, we will need him again.

Perna, I think you are right on when you suggest I need to talk with my husband. In the last week, I have definitely done a lot of thinking on the therapy and relationship issues on my own. But no discussion together with my husband this week, and we need that. We don't drive anywhere together without our kids, so talking while driving won't work, but maybe we need to make an "appointment" to actually spend some time together to talk. We've been so busy this week that it probably won't happen otherwise.

Thanks again to all for your comments. They've got me thinking.

[SecretGarden]

I was not making accusations about your T's time.... I suppose I think in these terms due to no shows where I work. Just wished to bring it up. Given your recent exchange with him last time, you are quite aware of these things.

Maybe you need to go to couples as needed if you feel like things are going well in your communication or in doing the work you (both) feel you need to do.

How does your hubby feel about all of this....? All and this being the major words....

[Direction]

I guess I've never really thought of doing much work in between sessions.

Thanks you've given me something to think about...

[Lemon]

" maybe we need to make an "appointment" to actually spend some time together to talk."

My husband and I make appointments to talk. If we don't life just gets in the way, or we avoid actually talking about issues and instead talk about everyday things. We schedule the date and time. At first we were a little to aggressive with it - something like twice a week for long periods of time. Then my T reminded us that an hour is a really long time and to try once a week for 1/2 hr to one hour. It works because you know that the conversation will be contained to one or two topics. Emotionally I can handle that much intensity and conscentration anything more would be to overwhelming.

wow. you have made me notice that i avoid thinking about stuff. or at least i keep it to myself when i have. not good

sunny,

go anyway. i think it will be helpful. you're just getting started with thinking about the divorce issues so i think it's understandable that there's reisistance/avoidance going on; it's hard and we naturally want to avoid hard stuff.

can you call and reverse the session set up? ask to make the first one for you and the second one couples? (could also check to make sure there aren't 6 other people scheduled at the same time... )

yeah, go. he'll help you work on working on it.

ECHOES

[MissCharlotte]

Hey Sunny,

Just a couple of thoughts that popped up while reading the thread....

Does couples therapy have to be every week? It seems like it's just too much right now, particularly given the amount of processsing you have to do in between. How about every other week for couples but every week for individual?

Can T help you set the outcome goals in session?

Yes I understand the unconscious thing doesn't work for couples.

Best....

[sunrise]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
ECHOES said:
can you call and reverse the session set up? ask to make the first one for you and the second one couples? (could also check to make sure there aren't 6 other people scheduled at the same time... )

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
Thanks for the ideas, ECHOES. Unfortunately, my husband can't make it to the second appointment so we have to either take the first one together or nada. Ha, ha about the 6 other people scheduled. So true! I'm actually a little excited to see who we meet in the waiting room tomorrow. Of course, one small problem with calling--my T doesn't answer phone calls!

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
yeah, go. he'll help you work on working on it.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
I think you're right. Maybe I can go and just curl in a corner on the couch and let them talk. Maybe that would be better than nothing.... I think.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
sister said:
Does couples therapy have to be every week? It seems like it's just too much right now...

Can T help you set the outcome goals in session?

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
Thanks for the suggestions, sister. Couples sessions not so frequently sounds good to me, at least this week. A problem is being able to predict when we'll want a session or need one, because my T is so booked up you have to plan well in advance. I like the idea of T helping us to set the session goals. A problem I foresee is that my husband and I will have different goals. And I find it hard to go against him. So if T asks him what is your goal for this session, and he answers, I would just agree with whatever he says. Sigh...

I guess we are indeed going to the session tomorrow, because through inertia, I have done nothing to make alternative plans, such as calling T to cancel. I feel swept along by this. Kind of like bobbing around in a vortex of water, being drawn inexorably down the drain. Maybe my husband won't show up at the session tomorrow. [/fingerscrossed] It's kind of like whenever he goes away on business, I hope he never returns. That would just be so much easier.

sunny, how are you feeling about having to "share" your T with your husband?


ECHOES

[sunrise]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
ECHOES said:
sunny, how are you feeling about having to "share" your T with your husband?

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
It's been OK and has not been a problem! This is one thing that really worried me back some time ago when there was no way I was going to bring my husband to couples therapy with me. As my T had said to me, "some people don't tolerate it well," and I had practically interrupted him to respond, "I would not tolerate it well!" lol. Back then, I felt intensely but I guess unstably attached to T, and I would feel this wave of jealousy stir when I even considered bringing my husband in to see T for couples. Plus, I felt the marriage stuff is so d**m painful and it's one thing to have learned to share that pain with T, but I didn't want to share it with my husband, no way. I didn't know how I could be in the same room with these two guys and my different ways of "being" with them and be expected to work on this problem. I truly felt like the room might explode if we all came together, like a matter/anti-matter explosion. Then as time passed I became even closer to T, if possible, and something happened in our therapy and we moved to a new level of trust (and we'd had pretty good trust before), and I just was able to say let's do this. I just trusted him so much to be able to help. And I trusted the strength of our bond so much that I knew it would hold no matter who else was in the room. I was not going to be jealous of my husband and T, because I knew no matter what went on between them, my bond with T would not be altered or diminished or broken. I just had such strong faith in our bond. T and I definitely did talk about this potential problem more than once. I remember once telling him very earnestly, looking him in the eyes and reassuring him, "we can handle this, don't worry." I think it pleased him immensely to hear me express my profound faith in our bond. Just drew us closer, big imaginary hug, so real you could feel it. And now that the couples sessions are happening, sharing my T with my husband has not been a problem. I feel no jealousy at all. I like seeing T talk to and work with my husband. I like seeing him "in action" with someone else, working on forging a bond. I like seeing what he does with the both of us and how he guides the session. He's great with couples. My big problem with the couples therapy is the speed at which things are happening and my inability/unwillingness to move forward so quickly. I need more time to process on my own and talk things through with my husband.

[MissCharlotte]

((((Sunny))))

Sunrise,

Well, then regarding goals, please call your T and leave a message that he must ask you first what the goals are for the session. You can even tell him it's because you are unable to articulate your goals after your husband has first say. At least address this in your individual session

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
I guess we are indeed going to the session tomorrow, because through inertia, I have done nothing to make alternative plans, such as calling T to cancel. I feel swept along by this. Kind of like bobbing around in a vortex of water, being drawn inexorably down the drain. Maybe my husband won't show up at the session tomorrow. [/fingerscrossed] It's kind of like whenever he goes away on business, I hope he never returns. That would just be so much easier.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Awww Sunrise, you are in a lot of pain. ((((hugs Sunrise))) I don't think you should have to feel like you are diving into the pool with your eyes closed. This is something that you can do with your eyes opened and your T's help. Hang in there Sunrise, you have prepared for this and you are strong.

[sidony]

I went to therapy today feeling like I hadn't done much work or thinking about anything. It's still really helpful. I just talked some about when I was a little kid and told him a little more about myself, and I ended up being glad I'd given him a little more background information. I do like it better when I have some thought in mind -- something I've been processing since the last session or something -- but it's still good even when I don't have a goal. Don't punish yourself for not having done homework! I don't always, but I feel I still benefit.

Sidony