Seems I am always reassessing past relationships with significant "others" that have come and gone in my life...

I try to understand why it is I pick men that are just like my Father. My Father as you know, was a very emotionally ill, malignantly narcissistic man. Yet he was successful and handsome and charming - As narcissists most generally are. This works for them because they are so good a "Hyding" who they truly are to anyone and everyone outside of their "comfort zones".

Having the sort of troubled past that I have had - I am always re-evaluating, reassessing, trying to find and understand all the "whys" of things. Sometimes I am successful, sometimes not.

But this is the biggie question that I am grappling with at the moment. Knowing everything I know about NPD and how destructive it is, for the life of me I can not draw any rational conclusions as to why I always end up in relationships the mimic the type of relationship I had with dear ol dad. Trust me, it's not intentional. Sometimes I don't even realize it on the onset and it's not until later when they have "unmasked" themselves that I see the true dynamic of the situation.

So why??? Why can't I break this pattern? Why am I such a dork magnet with men? Why do I attract these sick, twisted abusive types of people? After the last relationship, I have since decided that I am absolutely petrified to seek out another "partner" for fear that they are just another wolf in sheep's clothing....

It gives me a sickening feeling to think I have never been touched by hands that truly love me.

J

[pgrundy]

I know what you mean, but it isn't hopeless at all, it just takes time.

After my divorce in 2001 I had a bad bout of depression and expressed the desire to quit picking toxic relationships as one of my therapy goals. In 2005 I met my current husband and we are very happy. He's like my dad in some positive ways but not like him in the negative ways. We have a wonderful relationship and are best friends. But before that, I had nothing but dysfunctional abusive relationships, one after the other, just as you describe.

I think it just takes awhile to get to the point where you have the energy to even work on relationships. I mean, for me, it took years to just sort out my own stuff, then I was left with the depression and PTSD physical effects to sort out with meds, and THEN, after all THAT, I had the capacity to deal with guys with the help of a therapist. It took years.

Don't be too hard on yourself. There is someone out there for you for sure, someone nice. Keep taking good care of yourself and he will eventually show up. So much of it is just learning who to say 'no' to. (No small task!)

Hang in there!

That is tremendously good advice P... It has only been within the last five years or so that I began to even see (and I mean that in the literal sense) that there had been so much that was wrong with the people in my life and my relationship to them. So in reality it hasn't been all that long that all of the twisted lies and dirty little family secrets began to unravel and I could see them for what they truly were - and there is one thing that I do know and that is once you learn narcissism, there is absolutely no unlearning it. The problem has been, in being raised that way - I always thought I was the one with problems. Everything was my fault, something was wrong with me, I was worthless, undeserving etc, etc...it's taken me half a lifetime to understand that simply is not the case. I guess I have sought love the only way I knew how.

I appreciate the response. I'm doing the best I can, but sometime it just feels like my life is a broken record and I am doomed to keep repeating the same mistakes.

I'm happy you finally found contentment. I don't expect a relationship to make me whole, I'm not looking for that - I would just like to find one that is not "sick"

xo

J

[pgrundy]

I can totally relate. I'm glad you shared and I know it will all sort out of for you in time. Also, you are so right--it can take years just to even realize a relationship is bad! I can really identify with that myself.

Originally Posted by pgrundy

I can totally relate. I'm glad you shared and I know it will all sort out of for you in time. Also, you are so right--it can take years just to even realize a relationship is bad! I can really identify with that myself.

Thanks again for the response P.

I do feel like I may be growing cold in many ways and cynical. It won't be long and I will be fifty years old - I feel like it's just too late sometimes P and that that ship sailed long ago. Most of the time I feel as if it doesn't really matter anymore.

I hope and pray that I don't end up old and alone with a house full of cats!!

but in all honesty - my biggest fear is that my heart will grow hard.

[VoNPD]

Originally Posted by VoidofCourse

... The problem has been, in being raised that way - I always thought I was the one with problems. Everything was my fault, something was wrong with me, I was worthless, undeserving etc, etc...

I think you are very close to the answer with this.

I am coming to learn that from the earliest age I was taught to NOT think. to always defer to others. always. and everyone in the family deferred all decisions to dad. When you think like this, it's easy to become convinced that you don't know anything - that you are stupid and surely everyone else is smarter than you.

So when the charming N. comes your way and shows the slightest interest, you are attracted. The N. detects the signals you give off, recognizes a victim, and takes advantage of a ready-made rag-doll that he can use or set aside at will. A thing, not a person.

It's the "Over Value/Devalue" tactic that hurts me the most. They make you feel like they cant live without you, like you are vital to their existence. Once you start to feel really loved and valued, they callously toss you to the side, or fail to remember having ever needed you at all. As though you have imagined it. It keeps you off-balance and ready to leap at their next generously dropped litle crumb of kindness.

Any of this ring a bell with anyone?

VoN

Amazing VoP, your words are like a mirror to my thoughts. I realize at the deepest level that the past is not indicative of the future...so I don't get why I can't spot these types a mile off before I'm sucked into another black hole.

What's worse is that with their being varying degrees of NPD there have been one or two of these relationships that I actually thought that I could make work. I thought I could tolerate the bad behavior, the poutiness, the standoffishness - the lack of trust you that you feel...etc etc etc But that's not possible in reality because they are not real men. Their psyche can range from everything and anything from sadistic to childlike. You want to believe that they can have real feelings for you but that is an impossibility. There is no pleasing them, no appeasing them...the more you give the more they take until you have nothing left of yourself. They can do nothing but use and abuse.

It's just so damn hard for me to come up with a reason why these types are so attracted to me or is it that I am to them? Like it has been my chosen lot in life to be deprived of love. That my lot is only to give and not to receive>?<

J

[VoNPD]

Interesting that you share the "Mirror Five" image. I compare a relationship with the severe N. to a mirror:

Have you ever walked into a restaurant that had mirrors on all the walls? When you first walk in, the place seems larger than it really is. If you are busy paying attention to the fancy decor, you might not notice the mirrors. Then when you reach out to pull up a chair, you BASH your hand against hard, cold glass. It hurts. Then you realize these aren't real chairs - just reflections of real fancy chairs.

The restaurant is much smaller than it appears. And if you bash your hand there enough, you don't want to eat in a restaurant with mirrored walls ever again.



OK, we have established that we like to eat fancy. This is why we are attracted to the N. It's just a matter of developing the ability to detect mirrors in a room. If it seems too good to be true, or too coincidental that you and the N. like so many similar things, if you sense a red flag and immediately disregard it by thinking "surely I am imagining" or "I MUST be wrong"... these are big warnings. And if we heed the warnings, the N. sees us react or pull away and it gives him the clue that you aren't a pushover. He'll move along to an easier target.

OK, we have established that we like to eat fancy.

You are too much and yes I do so love fancy restaurants!! LOL!!! I also understand about the hand-bashing all too well. I do recognize that with the passing of each Narcissistic relationship I have become less and less tolerable of the inappropriate behavior. Each one has been a "learning" experience for me. They have been a looking glass into my past and have brought about significant change in me and understanding about what my life has been about up until now. I could have won the "codependent" of the year award for what I put up in a couple of instances - but the last one, I was able to let it go without a fight. Huge progress for me....even still, I was unable to recognize it for what it was on the onset...That was what I struggled with the most - I was so angry with myself knowing what I know about all of it and yet I was still duped!!! I couldn't believe it...

Currently, I am being given an opportunity to start a new relationship. I am petrified out of my wits. I don't know how to have a "normal" relationship. This man is the President of a Bank for gosh sakes - and what if VoP - what if the same thing happens???? Narcs are everywhere....and you find them in the most unsuspecting places!!!

I am conversing with this man, he was introduced to me by a mutual friend. On one hand I get excited at the thought that this time may actually be the time for something good and right and real to happen for me...

then the broken record plays again over and over in my mind and I start going through all the "what ifs"

I do know one thing - one more narcissistic relationship would kill me...especially and unsuspecting one. It's like a cruel joke...the universe dangles this lovely carrot in front of you and says here have a nibble - this one is just right for you!! and as soon as you do WHAMO!!! Off comes the mask of the predator!!! The wolf in sheep's clothing emerges and you are left cowering in a corner, sniffling and licking your wounds...

I can't do that again...

and I won't - nor will I be a a codependent martyr I don't care how fancy the restaurant is!!! I would much rather eat at the nearest gag n puke!!

XO

J

[madisgram]

this article may help you avoid that type of man...click on title, paragraph 3, particularly. it may help you spot one.
How to Spot a Narcissist
At the core of extreme narcissism is egotistical preoccupation with self, personal preferences, aspirations, needs, success, and how he/she is perceived by others....

Thanks for the link Mad but I'm sorry - I have read all there is on this subject until I'm just repeating the same information but in a different format until I'm blue in the face.

Narcissists are very good at what they do because they are very practiced at the art of being a Narcissist. You can not spot them in a crowd. Some women (or men) can be married for years to a Narcissist, even a lifetime (my Mother) before they realize their spouses are skewed or damaged emotionally....

It can be an extremely "stealth" disorder. It most cases it's not until you have spent time with them "intimately" before they are comfortable enough in showing their true colors...

They are constantly "morphing" into the person you want them to be until they have you where they want you....

J

Just a quick example in that my last relationship was with a man who treated me like a Queen for the first year of our relationship, he was my knight in shinning armor - He had some "quirks" as we all do but he was handsome, successful and charming. Took me places, wined me, dined me, brought me flowers and jewelry - did all those "little" things that we women want our men to do...

Narcissists are great listeners so they find out what it is that truly moves you - then they move you with it when you least expect it so you are so overtly pleased you shower them in adoration...

then little by little the facade fell away bit by bit, piece by piece until there was absolutely no denying that I had indeed been giving my heart, my soul and my love to a man who had no true emotion.

Narcissists begin to "covertly" undermine your sense of value and self esteem then feed you mere crumbs of attention because they know that they "have you" on a hook so to "keep you" all they must do now is give a pittance of their attention to you. Narcissists feel that their presence alone in your life is reward enough for you....

One by one your hopes and dreams fade to black..........until their is complete and total catastrophic annihilation of the "relationship"

It does NOT happen overnight and it is not something that is easily detected - these people do not want to call attention to themselves, they want to appear as normal as they can so they mimic every human emotion known to man - only deep in the recesses of their mind they know....they know that they are damaged, but their life purpose is to make YOU feel damaged so they don't have to.

J...

It's not easy Madi....the "Hyde"

[madisgram]

i was physically and emotionally abused in my marriage. your description of your experiences with a narcissistic boyfriend greatly resembles what happened to me too. i lost SELF in the process of his breaking me down. took the aid of therapy to undo the damage my ex had done. i hope you can rediscover what you have lost too and find the peace in your own life that you deserve.

The problem is that my entire lifetime has consisted of emotional and physical abuse that began with my Father. He is the Patriarch Narcissist of my life and the Grand Daddy of them all. That's why it is so difficult for me to understand why I continue to attract these sorts of relationships...

I am getting better and I am healing more and more everyday - the scars you're left with from being raised by someone with the sort of extreme emotional deficits that my Father has runs very deep - It will take the rest of my life no doubt to work out some things and there are some things that may not ever be worked out.

I have decided I am going to try to get to know this gentleman, I know there are some good ones left out there and I would like an opportunity to know one.

I worry though because there are so many emotional variables in situations like mine - and I am well aware of that. I also know that there is a tendency for Survivors of Narcissistic abuse to become addicted to the drama and chaos that they have become so accustomed to. That’s the only way we feel "normal" so with the absence of drama and chaos we can become stale and complacent, sort of a kin to “adrenaline junkies” Survivors of NPD become “chaos junkies”. That is not to say that being a “chaos junkie” is voluntary thing, not by any stretch, much to the contrary - it’s something that has become programmed in us.

I do want to clarify that though my Father was not only abusive mentally but he is / was an extremely physically abusive Narcissist, I have not been physically violated by any other man even though they have been completely and totally Narcissistic beyond all reasonable doubt. I have only been tormented by them emotionally. On a different note, one very odd thing about Narcissistic relationships is that the “breaking up” period lasts much longer than the actual “relationship” period itself. These folks view you as a possession to which they are the rightful owner of. They harass, stalk and torment you emotionally for a long, long time before they disappear from your life completely. It’s like getting gum stuck to the bottom of your shoe. No matter how hard you try, you can’t scrape it off.

J

[madisgram]

can totally agree with your description of shaking them loose and the impact it has to our own self worth. please keep us posted on how you are progressing in your own life to change those feelings you've acquired thru living with your father and the damage he caused to you.

[embracinglife]

I don't know what the answer is to that question, but I think it is good that you are asking it! You are becoming aware of the pattern you have had with men...and that awareness will help you to change things. good luck

[VoNPD]

Hi VoidofCourse, just wondering how you are doing, what came of the Bank President and how you are coping with the childhood issues?

I start focusing on my childhood in Therapy soon. Have been writing down memories, worries, etc. in an attempt to rid my life of all the WRONG things I learned as a child. It's a really uncomfortable place, but I feel like, at last, I have some hope of normalcy.

VoN

[tattoogirl33]

WOW.. never until now have I realized this may be what I'm dealing with!! The more I read of your experiences the more and more I see my boyfriend. Off and on for 10 years.. Me trying to pull away to find me again only for him to pull me back in! He's always called himself 'Mr. Wonderful' LOL. He's completely emotionless, I have to beg for attention. I even married 2 other men in hopes of being done with this man and here I am 4 years after my last divorce still with him... Thanks for writing this.. I need to look further into it!